Is Don Granato the best coach the Sabres have had since Lindy Ruff?

[Weave]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

No one can deny that even with the mounting losses this is a more entertaining team than from the past. 

 

Yeah, I’ve been waiting a little longer before turning off the games this season.

Edited November 24, 2021 by Weave

[JohnC]

47 minutes ago, Weave said:

Yeah, I’ve been waiting a little longer before turning off the games this season.

What was even worse than the mounting losses under Krueger were the steady stream of blah games. It just sucked the life out of the audience. At least under Granato not are the players more energized after the life had been sucked out of them but watching them has become more than palatable. For now that might be acceptable but the wins need to follow soon.  

[Doohickie]

When the Sabres have Tuch, Mitts, JJ, Krebs & Quin (and possibly Weissbach) into the lineup, this team will be competitive and able to win most nights with even mediocre goaltending.

[Sabel79]

2 hours ago, Weave said:

Yeah, I’ve been waiting a little longer before turning off the games this season.

Baby steps...

[Rasmus_]

I think you can see, that when there is more skill and a few more bona fide top end guys, that he has the plan to push up.

[CallawaySabres]

20 hours ago, woods-racer said:

Let me paint you a picture of @CallawaySabres.

 

Callaway looks like Andre the Giant in fishnet stockings with 20 golf balls in one hand and a hockey stick in the other. He yells,  *run weave run!*. Right then he starts bouncing the golf balls off the ground then slaps them with the hockey stick in your direction. All you here is Andre laughing while your running.

 

Welcome to my imagination.

Nailed it

[calti]

On 11/24/2021 at 10:55 AM, The Ghost of Yuri said:

When the Sabres have Tuch, Mitts, JJ, Krebs & Quin (and possibly Weissbach) into the lineup, this team will be competitive and able to win most nights with even mediocre goaltending.

I would exchange 'win' for 'be competitive'..  To me Krebs has the highest ceiling. Tuch is really solid. Mitts---I hope so but not sure what people see in him.

[dudacek]

52 minutes ago, calti said:

I would exchange 'win' for 'be competitive'..  To me Krebs has the highest ceiling. Tuch is really solid. Mitts---I hope so but not sure what people see in him.

I have no idea where either player will settle, but if ceiling is based on talent, Mitts has a higher ceiling than Krebs.

[calti]

On 11/26/2021 at 10:29 AM, dudacek said:

I have no idea where either player will settle, but if ceiling is based on talent, Mitts has a higher ceiling than Krebs.

I see Mitts as a 15 20 man. Skilled but not very athletic.

[LabattBlue]

Maybe it’s time to stop the “let the kids play, go fast, and have fun”, and teach them the basics of defensive zone play.  I’ve noticed less “…at least I was entertained” comments in the GDT’s over the last two weeks. 
 

Getting abused in their own zone is no fun and is not a plus in terms of player development. 

Edited December 5, 2021 by LabattBlue

[LabattBlue]

I am a little puzzled by Granato.  I guess only time will tell, but he does reaize that 2-1 games are winning playoff hockey? What do you tell the players when they eventually make the playoffs?  Umm…you know all that stuff you have been doing for the last 2-3 years?  Don’t do it anymore!!!

 

From yesterday’s Athletic article…

“Giving up a lot of goals, the reflex is to get really conservative,” Granato said Tuesday. “I’m just not going to do it.”

Granato wants to win as much as anyone, but he refuses to change his long-term focus. This is not the Sabres’ year. It was never going to be.

And if the coach changes his offense-first philosophy, it’ll never be the Sabres’ year.

“I said it when I took the job: If we try to play to 2-1 or 1-0, we’re going to be a very boring team and develop nobody,” Granato said at KeyBank Center. “I don’t want guys that are conservative. I want guys that ride the edge, and with that, you’ve got to have confidence because you’re going to take hits. It’s going to bring attention to what you really need to pay attention to — some details.

“I’m not throwing defense out, by any means. I demand it, and I’m fine winning a game 1-0, but not at the sacrifice of developing.”

 

Edited December 9, 2021 by LabattBlue

[Zamboni]

[Taro T]

21 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

I am a little puzzled by Granato.  I guess only time will tell, but he does reaize that 2-1 games are winning playoff hockey? What do you tell the players when they eventually make the playoffs?  Umm…you know all that stuff you have been doing for the last 2-3 years?  Don’t do it anymore!!!

 

From yesterday’s Athletic article…

“Giving up a lot of goals, the reflex is to get really conservative,” Granato said Tuesday. “I’m just not going to do it.”

Granato wants to win as much as anyone, but he refuses to change his long-term focus. This is not the Sabres’ year. It was never going to be.

And if the coach changes his offense-first philosophy, it’ll never be the Sabres’ year.

“I said it when I took the job: If we try to play to 2-1 or 1-0, we’re going to be a very boring team and develop nobody,” Granato said at KeyBank Center. “I don’t want guys that are conservative. I want guys that ride the edge, and with that, you’ve got to have confidence because you’re going to take hits. It’s going to bring attention to what you really need to pay attention to — some details.

“I’m not throwing defense out, by any means. I demand it, and I’m fine winning a game 1-0, but not at the sacrifice of developing.”

 

Not sure what's puzzling.  Management has 2 goals he's in charge of achieving: development the kids while remaining in the Wright derby.  The goals he's been tasked with are pretty much mutually exclusive.

His plan to reach both are by playing a fairly wide open style most games.  The kids get to work on their offensive skills and the losses pile up as goals in this sport are very often the fruit of a mistake by the other team.  The "fun" teams get burned on their high events especially when they don't even have replacement level goaltending.

It was a mild surprise, though it shouldn't have been, that when they had the 1 goalie amongst their 50 (47, whatever) signed players that they actually want to develop, that they played a more low event style.  (Or seemed to have; only got to watch the very low event 1st period, so don't know for certain that continued, but it seems to have.)  You don't develop a goalie prospect by throwing him to the wolves in his 1st opportunity in over 1/2 a calendar year.  He needs to have support (so do the other 4 throw away guys they used to date, but they're the "red shirts" from ST TOS and Kirk & Spock don't really give a rat's behind about any of them but Scotty & Uhura; but we digress 😉 ) and Granato had them give him the support he needed to not have to stand on his head.  At least not for much beyond 1 shot that was illegal.

So, apparently, Granato CAN have the kids & JAGs play D.  There just isn't enough talent on the roster for him to get them to also play O apparently.  Which shouldn't be a surprise either - they're kids & JAGs & 2/3's of the top line are currently on IR & the likely other guy for that line hasn't been himself since missing a couple of weeks either.

Am expecting if UPL gets another start this weekend, we see that same low event hockey they played Tuesday.  Doubt it will be as "successful" but that's why they play.

 

[LabattBlue]

45 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Not sure what's puzzling.  Management has 2 goals he's in charge of achieving: development the kids while remaining in the Wright derby.  The goals he's been tasked with are pretty much mutually exclusive.

His plan to reach both are by playing a fairly wide open style most games.  The kids get to work on their offensive skills and the losses pile up as goals in this sport are very often the fruit of a mistake by the other team.  The "fun" teams get burned on their high events especially when they don't even have replacement level goaltending.

It was a mild surprise, though it shouldn't have been, that when they had the 1 goalie amongst their 50 (47, whatever) signed players that they actually want to develop, that they played a more low event style.  (Or seemed to have; only got to watch the very low event 1st period, so don't know for certain that continued, but it seems to have.)  You don't develop a goalie prospect by throwing him to the wolves in his 1st opportunity in over 1/2 a calendar year.  He needs to have support (so do the other 4 throw away guys they used to date, but they're the "red shirts" from ST TOS and Kirk & Spock don't really give a rat's behind about any of them but Scotty & Uhura; but we digress 😉 ) and Granato had them give him the support he needed to not have to stand on his head.  At least not for much beyond 1 shot that was illegal.

So, apparently, Granato CAN have the kids & JAGs play D.  There just isn't enough talent on the roster for him to get them to also play O apparently.  Which shouldn't be a surprise either - they're kids & JAGs & 2/3's of the top line are currently on IR & the likely other guy for that line hasn't been himself since missing a couple of weeks either.

Am expecting if UPL gets another start this weekend, we see that same low event hockey they played Tuesday.  Doubt it will be as "successful" but that's why they play.

 

Not sure I agree with Granato playing a wide open style, in order to better their draft chances.  You really don’t believe that is what Adams is telling him?  Also, isn’t it a possibility that the kids develop bad habits defensively that then become tough to break going forward?

 

I guess at this point it is wait and see, since my crystal ball won’t tell me if he will still be the coach in a couple of seasons, or how all these kids and prospects will look at that point. 

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, LabattBlue said:

Not sure I agree with Granato playing a wide open style, in order to better their draft chances.  You really don’t believe that is what Adams is telling him?  Also, isn’t it a possibility that the kids develop bad habits defensively that then become tough to break going forward?

 

I guess at this point it is wait and see, since my crystal ball won’t tell me if he will still be the coach in a couple of seasons, or how all these kids and prospects will look at that point. 

IMHO he is doing about the best he can knowing that his bosses want the kids to develop but also aren't real interested in winning games THIS season.

He wants them testing their limits and finding out what they can get away with at this level & what they can't.  That that necessarily will result in plays that blow up in their faces like a Wile E. Coyote ACME purchase is something that he's willing to live with.  There's no way he's been told to lose.  But he's been told to put the kids in as many different situations as he can and let them try to work through it & figure it out.  Would explain keeping the goalie pulled until a 2nd EN goal gets scored.  Let them try again, & if it doesn't work, well, they were likely going to lose any way and now a guy like Asplund who likely wouldn't normally get that chance has gotten some experience I that situation.  Good for him.  Good, hopefully, for us LT.  Bad for us ST.  Especially for those of us still wasting time & money on them at present.

And that that experimentation & gaining of experience still leads to losses more often than not; well, when getting high draft picks is an unspoken but obvious goal ...

Really don't see Granato as a dumb guy.  (Actually expect he might be the smartest coach they've had since they moved into the MMArena.  (Though brightest doesn't necessarily equal best.)  Pretty sure he realizes that allowing Skinner to be on the ice in the last minute of a tied game has a tremendous chance to be an ACME Rocket Roller Skate set.  If he's not dumb & he does know that, well, pretty sure he wasn't going 100% with making sure the team got the maximum points out of those games.

The Anaheim game showed these guys can play responsibly when asked to do so.  Not too worried that they'll completely forget how to play defense.  Though, as stated far too often the past few days, do have concerns that running w/ sub-replacement level goaltending will wind up creating bad habits that might need to get broken at some point.  (Yeah, it's slightly contradictory, but this post is already long enough, not going to turn it into a thesis to clarify how they aren't completely contradictory.)

Long story short.  He isn't playing wide open just to better the draft chances.  He's doing it to better the draft chances, let the kids find out where their limits are & hopefully push them out further than they'd've been without stretching past them, & to play entertaining hockey & not necessarily in that order.  (And all w/ throw away goaltending.)  They don't see UPL as a throw away yet.  So, they had to tweak the game plan a bit when he' between the pipes.  MHO.

[nfreeman]

I like Donnie too, but we can't pretend that the Sabres haven't lost 17 out of 20, and then there's this:

 

[woods-racer]

This video was released on Youtube in September 2020. Don explains how he coaches and what he needs to teach in order to have a successful team.  Offense is hard to learn at advanced levels is his main point. They need to learn it and they will make mistakes trying. He's walking his talk this year...

@Gatorman0519 found this video shortly after he was named Head Coach. 

[dudacek]

Granato’s like a high school coach with some athletic Grade 10s and a handful of misfit seniors who has decided to coach with the Grade 10s grad year in mind.

[Buffalonill]

 

[bunomatic]

7 hours ago, nfreeman said:

I like Donnie too, but we can't pretend that the Sabres haven't lost 17 out of 20, and then there's this:

 

Thought that was Alfred Hitchcock.

[Gatorman0519]

16 hours ago, woods-racer said:

This video was released on Youtube in September 2020. Don explains how he coaches and what he needs to teach in order to have a successful team.  Offense is hard to learn at advanced levels is his main point. They need to learn it and they will make mistakes trying. He's walking his talk this year...

@Gatorman0519 found this video shortly after he was named Head Coach. 

I’ll tell you this: Donny is an another planet vs RK. That guy was clueless. 

[SabresVet]

Listening to the interview on GR this morning, one would think Sabres aren't all that bad.  It was player health updates and talking up players like Okposo and UPL.  

Can't expect fire and brimstone every time, but they've lost 7 straight.  I guess that doesn't warrant talking about a schedule against Winnipeg, Minnesota, Pittsburgh, Columbus, Colorado, and Columbus these next 2 weeks.  

 

 

 

[Thorny]

Like him more all the time. 

[Norcal]

 

[That Aud Smell]

I saw the talk in the Kings GDT about how Granato was a cheap-ass budget option as HC, that no legitimate NHL coach wanted the job anyway, and HC DG is so deficient that he's holding the team back (or will hold them back, maybe?). So I dug around and found this thread.

I'm not really objective when it comes to DG. I just like him. I really like him. I like how he carries himself. I like what he says when he's interviewed. I like his "vibe." I like what appears to be his core philosophy as an NHL HC - in terms of how you develop players and how you build a team (positive reinforcement, play to your strengths, don't play scared, develop an open and fast pace of play). I like that he was instrumental in turning around Dahlin's stalled/failing development. I like that he helped turn Tage Thompson into a good top-6 NHL forward.

But there are others who think he's not enough. @PASabreFan, for one. So, what gives?