Jack Eichel: Trade rumors and speculation

[kas23]

14 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said:

This could be good from the perspective of asset-handling perspective and a resolution, but it has one glaring issue: If the worst fears of those who opposed ADR are realised and he gets permanently injured, would the Sabres still be on the hook?  I don't think it matters if the arbitrator forced their hand.

Lawyers of SabreSpace, what say you?

Caveat: ADR for a hockey player scares the daylights out of me.

I think it depends on whether the insurance company has to comply with the arbitrator’s decision. We know the Sabres will have to, but why would a 3rd party insurer have to? I don’t know, but I’m sure it’s in the fine print of the policy. A grievance would certainly help the Sabres, regardless of the decision. But, they can’t file it, Jack has to and the odds are heavily stacked against him.  

[PromoTheRobot]

32 minutes ago, kas23 said:

I think it depends on whether the insurance company has to comply with the arbitrator’s decision. We know the Sabres will have to, but why would a 3rd party insurer have to? I don’t know, but I’m sure it’s in the fine print of the policy. A grievance would certainly help the Sabres, regardless of the decision. But, they can’t file it, Jack has to and the odds are heavily stacked against him.  

But does a grievance win for Jack nullify the CBA? I don't think so. This is another reason why I don't get the "Sabres are worried about Jack filing a grievance" thing. The arbitrator that would hear a grievance doesn't have the standing or authority to suspend the entire CBA. They also can't force the Sabres to grant Jack's wish. That would have to go into the courts. Perhaps all the way to the Supreme Court. And Jack's contract would have ended by that time.

I think this grievance thing is more theater. Just another pressure move on Kevyn Adams.

Edited October 27, 2021 by PromoTheRobot

[K-9]

15 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

But does a grievance win for Jack nullify the CBA? I don't think so. This is another reason why I don't get the "Sabres are worried about Jack filing a grievance" thing. The arbitrator that would hear a grievance doesn't have the standing or authority to suspend the entire CBA. They also can't force the Sabres to grant Jack's wish. That would have to go into the courts. Perhaps all the way to the Supreme Court. And Jack's contract would have ended by that time.

I think this grievance thing is more theater. Just another pressure move on Kevyn Adams.

Given his apparent stance on the matter to date, I don’t think KA feels any pressure at all; not one iota. Really, the only person who can exert any pressure on Adams is his boss. And if Terry grows tired of paying Eichel to do nothing, then I can see him pressuring KA to make a deal happen but, given how long this saga has gone on, I get the impression Pegula isn’t about to start. 

Edited October 27, 2021 by K-9

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Pot meet kettle. Let me remind you of the post you made moments before:

So that comment is okay but mine isn't? I get that I'm a huge buzzkill for the people who want the Pegulas to crash and burn. But as someone here once said, I'm just trying to be balanced. It's far to easy to crank people up into a frenzy over perceived misdeeds and lose track of what's actually going on. There's also a massive case of blue balls waiting for the Eichel deal to come to a conclusion. We want to keep blaming this team for everything when nothing is the same.

 

And there’s the false agenda thing again. Save your heroics for someone who actually wants the Pegulas to fail.

Did you, or did you not dismiss @bob_sauve28’s post as basically unimportant?

Do you or do you not have a track record of posts that similarly attack the poster’s motivation or dismiss the poster’s content without ever addressing the actual meat of the post?

Am I misreading these, because they don’t look like sincere attempts to better understand your fellow poster.

19 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

And I'm sure there will be all kinds of unkind metrics for every game we win.

 

21 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Why would the Sabres be worried about Jack filing a grievance?

 

On 10/26/2021 at 9:29 AM, PromoTheRobot said:

I always thought winning fixes everything. Now it's not enough to win, make an effort every night and play as a team. Now we need memory wipes.

 

On 10/26/2021 at 9:13 AM, PromoTheRobot said:

So, in all sincerity, why are you here? If your heart was broken, why keep hanging out with your exes friends? I totally don't get it. We have a group here at SabreSpace, a number of which don't seem to watch the team or care how they play. Are they here for the apocalypse that hasn't yet materialized?

 

On 10/26/2021 at 7:12 AM, PromoTheRobot said:

But how can you give an opinion when you don't "watch them lose" as you put it? I've seen every second of every game and all but one preseason game that I couldn't find a stream for. I just assumed everyone here did the same because, you know, it's a Sabres board and you'd want to offer first-hand opinions. Wow, I'm stunned.

 

On 10/26/2021 at 7:00 AM, PromoTheRobot said:

I totally do not get that. Commenting on a team you don't even watch.

 

On 10/26/2021 at 6:49 AM, PromoTheRobot said:

What's the matter? People too happy? Gotta nip that in the bud? Thankfully we still have the Eichel thing to bring us down. Here's something we can read at bedtime. @Hoss will love it.

 

Edited October 27, 2021 by dudacek

[drnkirishone]

this entire thread bores me

[Sabres Fan in NS]

What in the blazes is still going on in here.

This whole damn place needs a hug.

Someone tell me where I can find John so that I can drive him to the airport and get him on the next flight to anywhere just so this misery can end.

1 minute ago, drnkirishone said:

this entire thread bores me

Not the word I would use, but I'll take it.

 

[drnkirishone]

I heard John is going to retire from pro hockey and become a professional variety streamer on twitch.

[PromoTheRobot]

22 minutes ago, dudacek said:

And there’s the false agenda thing again. Save your heroics for someone who actually wants the Pegulas to fail.

Did you, or did you not dismiss @bob_sauve28’s post as basically unimportant?

Do you or do you not have a track record of posts that similarly attack the poster’s motivation or dismiss the poster’s content without ever addressing the actual meat of the post?

Am I misreading these, because they don’t look like sincere attempts to better understand your fellow poster.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So I guess I'm on trial now? I'm reading those selected posts and I don't get what you're trying to prove. That I disagree with people? That I don't understand a forum where posters don't watch the team but still post about them? That I don't want to join in the tar and feathering parties? Guilty as charged.

Edited October 27, 2021 by PromoTheRobot

[nfreeman]

49 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

But does a grievance win for Jack nullify the CBA? I don't think so. This is another reason why I don't get the "Sabres are worried about Jack filing a grievance" thing. The arbitrator that would hear a grievance doesn't have the standing or authority to suspend the entire CBA. They also can't force the Sabres to grant Jack's wish. That would have to go into the courts. Perhaps all the way to the Supreme Court. And Jack's contract would have ended by that time.

I think this grievance thing is more theater. Just another pressure move on Kevyn Adams.

I don't think the Sabres are too worried about a grievance, as I think they're pretty confident they would win, but if Jack were to win the grievance, there would be no nullification of the CBA or lengthy litigation.  The grievance process is part of the CBA, which almost certainly says that if the player wins the grievance, he gets his preferred outcome.  The teams have agreed to this up front, so any lawsuit the Sabres would file would have to establish that Jack's grievance somehow departed from the grievance process agreed on in the CBA.

 

8 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

So I guess I'm on trial now? I'm reading those selected posts and I don't get what you're trying to prove. That I disagree with people? That I don't understand a forum where posters don't watch the team but still post about them? That I don't want to join in the tar and feathering parties? Guilty as charged.

FFS man.  No one has a problem with you disagreeing with other people.  The problem is your nasty edge, which is unnecessary and is ticking off more people by the day.

Lighten up or keep quiet.

 

[steveoath]

33 minutes ago, The Ghost of Doohickie said:

What in the blazes is still going on in here.

This whole damn place needs a hug.

Went downhill fast after that NS guy changed his name IMHO 😅

 

#jk

[Drag0nDan]

1 hour ago, Hoss said:

I’ve definitely fallen into just being told he’s a great prospect because I was never a fan … and now he’s someone I really want. Getting a big fast bust for Jack wouldn’t feel wonderful.

I think its basically because he's considered the #1 prospect there and vegas has been connected to Eichel multiple times.  It'll look like a loss if all they get out of it is mid to late first round picks.  

I'm good with Krebs, or brisson or whatever as the big piece, and picks.  But what salary are they sending back, or is buffalo almost forced to retain salary?  Are they going to just LTIR him and activate him if they make the playoffs like Kucherov?  Or is it Reilly smith (Alternate captain, and pretty solid playoff performer)?  Tuch?  Some combination of other pieces - maybe Brossoit and stevenson?  Who does buffalo package with Eichel at a cheaper cost to actually play while he's hurt?  Hino maybe?

I look at it like, if i have to eat some salary - I'm wanting a top prospect, tuch, picks, and probably brossoit (Selfishly, this would be insurance as to never having to see aaron dell play hockey with Buffalo)

Edited October 27, 2021 by Drag0nDan

[Sabres Fan in NS]

23 minutes ago, steveoath said:

Went downhill fast after that NS guy changed his name IMHO 😅

 

#jk

The Ghost of NS is here now, so maybe that will help get us back on track.

[Curt]

2 hours ago, inkman said:

I don’t get the Krebs hype. He doesn’t seem special in any way.  

 

2 hours ago, Hoss said:

I’ve definitely fallen into just being told he’s a great prospect because I was never a fan … and now he’s someone I really want. Getting a big fast bust for Jack wouldn’t feel wonderful.

I liked him at draft time, I still like him.  Not as an elite prospect or even as a potential 1C, but as a potential top-9 C who you can play in all situations.  

[dudacek]

5 minutes ago, Curt said:

 

I liked him at draft time, I still like him.  Not as an elite prospect or even as a potential 1C, but as a potential top-9 C who you can play in all situations.  

He plays hard and smart, good passer, can play C or W and be used in all situations.

He not going to dangle or blow shots by people or blow people up.

He projects as just a good, useful Sam Reinhart-level player.

I find the idea they don't want to give him up for Eichel odd. I'd do that in a second if I was Vegas.

Edited October 27, 2021 by dudacek

[GASabresIUFAN]

The Forbes articles adds nothing, but shows how unlikely Jack is to prevail.  The Sabres have consulted a real expert who has performed both surgeries and he is advising the Sabres to request fusion.  Legally Jack has a Everest size hurdle to overcome.  

Right now the only way forward is either for Jack to get the surgery he wants and assume all the risk or the NHL, NHLPA, the Sabres and Jack's representatives reach some kind of trade agreement that allows the Sabres to get good assets, but protects the acquiring team.  Not sure what that looks like or how it gets done.  Maybe the NHL acts as an insurer for the contract or part of the contract for the acquiring team.  

[mjd1001]

8 minutes ago, Curt said:

 

I liked him at draft time, I still like him.  Not as an elite prospect or even as a potential 1C, but as a potential top-9 C who you can play in all situations.  

On a somewhat related note, the fanbase might have to deal with this being a different type of team going forward than what we all though we were getting years ago.  After Eichel is dealt, this may be a team with no superstar, no guy who will compete for MVP...no one in the top 10 in scoring.  It looks like the prospect pool of forwards now may have some really good players in it, but a lot of them might be the hard working/two way guys with talent to put in 20-30 goals, not 40-50.  And your 'elite' talent is on the Blue line (Dahlin, Power).

[steveoath]

3 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

On a somewhat related note, the fanbase might have to deal with this being a different type of team going forward than what we all though we were getting years ago.  After Eichel is dealt, this may be a team with no superstar, no guy who will compete for MVP...no one in the top 10 in scoring.  It looks like the prospect pool of forwards now may have some really good players in it, but a lot of them might be the hard working/two way guys with talent to put in 20-30 goals, not 40-50.  And your 'elite' talent is on the Blue line (Dahlin, Power).

100% on board with this. 

If you have an ever improving Dahlin on 1 pair and Power on another could have two potentially elite dmen on the ice for 40mins a night. Great prospect to look forward to.

Edited October 27, 2021 by steveoath

[K-9]

24 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

On a somewhat related note, the fanbase might have to deal with this being a different type of team going forward than what we all though we were getting years ago.  After Eichel is dealt, this may be a team with no superstar, no guy who will compete for MVP...no one in the top 10 in scoring.  It looks like the prospect pool of forwards now may have some really good players in it, but a lot of them might be the hard working/two way guys with talent to put in 20-30 goals, not 40-50.  And your 'elite' talent is on the Blue line (Dahlin, Power).

Shades of the ‘05/‘06 squad. 

Roll four, Donny!

[Weave]

12 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Shades of the ‘05/‘06 squad. 

Roll four, Donny!

4 lines and a Norris class defenseman.  After picking 2 at 1OAL we better have at least 1 Norris candidate out of it.

[Doohickie]

2 hours ago, drnkirishone said:

this entire thread bores me

I like to just scan past all the bashing and look for tweets and subsequent discussion... until it devolves into head bashing until the next tweet comes out.

[Marvin]

1 minute ago, The Ghost of Yuri said:

I like to just scan past all the bashing and look for tweets and subsequent discussion... until it devolves into head bashing until the next tweet comes out.

Good man.  Preserve your sanity.

[dudacek]

8 minutes ago, Weave said:

4 lines and a Norris class defenseman.  After picking 2 at 1OAL we better have at least 1 Norris candidate out of it.

Don't you have to go all the way back to Denis Potvin to find a Norris-caliber D from the top of the draft?

Sorry, Doughty, Pronger, Neidermayer, Hedman — I guess I'm exaggerating.

There are a lot of good to very good D picked high, like Ekblad and Hanifan, but just three of the past 20 winners were top picks. 13 weren't even picked in the first round.

[inkman]

3 hours ago, Hoss said:

 Getting a big bust to Jack to would feel wonderful.

FIFY

[Weave]

10 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Don't you have to go all the way back to Denis Potvin to find a Norris-caliber D from the top of the draft?

Sorry, Doughty, Pronger, Neidermayer, Hedman — I guess I'm exaggerating.

There are a lot of good to very good D picked high, like Ekblad and Hanifan, but just three of the past 20 winners were top picks. 13 weren't even picked in the first round.

It was a good thought, man.  A positive one.  Don't harsh what little buzz I have.

[kas23]

4 hours ago, Drag0nDan said:

I think its basically because he's considered the #1 prospect there and vegas has been connected to Eichel multiple times.  It'll look like a loss if all they get out of it is mid to late first round picks.  

I'm good with Krebs, or brisson or whatever as the big piece, and picks.  But what salary are they sending back, or is buffalo almost forced to retain salary?  Are they going to just LTIR him and activate him if they make the playoffs like Kucherov?  Or is it Reilly smith (Alternate captain, and pretty solid playoff performer)?  Tuch?  Some combination of other pieces - maybe Brossoit and stevenson?  Who does buffalo package with Eichel at a cheaper cost to actually play while he's hurt?  Hino maybe?

I look at it like, if i have to eat some salary - I'm wanting a top prospect, tuch, picks, and probably brossoit (Selfishly, this would be insurance as to never having to see aaron dell play hockey with Buffalo)

I would think it would be poetic justice if Brisson helped facilitate a trade involving his own son going to the Sabres and we ended up winning the Cup before Jack does. Seriously, the Knight’s window is closing more quickly than we previously though. 

Edited October 28, 2021 by kas23