GDT - Sabres @ Vegas - December 19, 2022 - 10:00 PM (EST) - MSG and WGR

[pi2000]

1 minute ago, grinreaper said:

Starting with the premise that all teams are at least somewhat different in makeup and style, opposing teams utilize different game plans to give them the best chance to earn a victory. In addition, in-game adjustments are necessary and situational adjustments usually become more important as the game progresses. There's been much talk in this thread regarding third goal leads and "Alamo" type defenses. Teams with multiple goal deficits, especially in the 3rd period are going to put on a push to tie or take the lead. In order to do so they will take chances and leave themselves vulnerable to the other team increasing their lead. This approach isn't new nor should it be some kind of revelation to the knowledgeable fans frequenting this site. The team that holds the lead has to choose how they are going to handle the onslaught that they know is coming.

Obviously it's the head coach's job to determine the way in which his team is going to respond to the other team's push. I would imagine that his late game approach will take into account the makeup and style of the other team, their ability to score, both goaltender's game that day, a sense of his team's energy and a myriad of other conditions that only he and his staff use to make these kind of decisions. With the above in mind, there is no one correct way for a team to closeout a win. The Sabres have had several wins this year in which they took advantage of the other team's desperation or offensive ineptitude and just poured it on in the 3rd period. They've had a couple games in which they beat teams higher in the standings by relying on good goaltending and the "Alamo" approach.

On a different note, isn't it amazing that 2 weeks ago the biggest complaint or maybe just the people with the loudest microphone here were giving themselves wedgies over the Sabre's defense and goaltending while lamenting that they'd never make the playoffs this year because of it. Now, after a few wins in a row the complaint has turned to a belief that the Sabres and their style of play will never win in the playoffs. Patience guys, management is building this team in the right way. The quest for the Stanley Cup is like the pursuit of the Holy Grail, and we know what happened when Elsa decided to take a shortcut. 

[grinreaper]

23 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Your so called "true story" is false. Where do you and @PerreaultForevercome up with this hooligan mentality BS? Anyone who watches a lot of Sabre games knows very well that they hold up well and adequately respond to the physical play of other teams. The reality is that the Sabres give as much as they receive. You are responding to a myth of your own creation. It is utter nonsense! 

 

You are a good poster John and I normally enjoy and agree with your comments. You might want to get new batteries for your sarcasm meter though since Zamboni's remarks were nothing like his sentiments that he has previously posted here.  

[Sabres Fan in NS]

31 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Your so called "true story" is false. Where do you and @PerreaultForevercome up with this hooligan mentality BS? Anyone who watches a lot of Sabre games knows very well that they hold up well and adequately respond to the physical play of other teams. The reality is that the Sabres give as much as they receive. You are responding to a myth of your own creation. It is utter nonsense! 

 

He got you.

[Zamboni]

5 minutes ago, grinreaper said:

You are a good poster John and I normally enjoy and agree with your comments. You might want to get new batteries for your sarcasm meter though since Zamboni's remarks were nothing like his sentiments that he has previously posted here.  

 

1 minute ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

He got you.

I’m glad to see at least a few posters know when I’m joking or give lighthearted jabs like almost every poster here does 😂

[Sidc3000]

30 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Yes, they can.  So why kill it?  

Maybe they will, maybe they’ll go on another losing streak. Both are possible 

[JohnC]

8 minutes ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

He got you.

I have been gotten!

13 minutes ago, grinreaper said:

You are a good poster John and I normally enjoy and agree with your comments. You might want to get new batteries for your sarcasm meter though since Zamboni's remarks were nothing like his sentiments that he has previously posted here.  

We need a sarcasm emoje so gullible people like me don't get bitten. 

[grinreaper]

28 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

Give me a break. It's a difficult cross to bear when I inadvertently make other posters so hot. 

[SABRES 0311]

15 hours ago, SABRES 0311 said:

Who gave that lazy backhand giveaway?

 

15 hours ago, Mustache of God said:

JJ

That was brutal. Wave at it then pivot the opposite direction. I get what he tried to do but wrong place, wrong time.

[Mustache of God]

2 minutes ago, SABRES 0311 said:

 

That was brutal. Wave at it then pivot the opposite direction. I get what he tried to do but wrong place, wrong time.

It's what they call in the business, a "rookie mistake".

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

Your so called "true story" is false. Where do you and @PerreaultForevercome up with this hooligan mentality BS? Anyone who watches a lot of Sabre games knows very well that they hold up well and adequately respond to the physical play of other teams. The reality is that the Sabres give as much as they receive. You are responding to a myth of your own creation. It is utter nonsense! 

 

Yup @JohnC, I knew he was joking.  The Reeves comment is a trap.  

[LabattBlue]

I believe Fitz-Pilut were on the ice for 2 or 3 breakaways. Not acceptable.  They are clearly not on the ice to generate offense as the 3rd pairing, so there is no excuse for getting caught up ice and allowing breakaways or odd man rushes the other way. 

[LGR4GM]

3 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

More on score effects

https://hockey-graphs.com/tag/score-effects/

 

2 hours ago, Sidc3000 said:

Can you post this info? It’s not that I don’t believe you, I’ve tried to research the overall SA per period (league-wide) and I can’t find anything that breaks it down that much. I’m curious

 

yes  the best teams get out shot but they don’t get out shot as much as say the Sabres on a regular basis. The Sabres are eight worse in SA. 

Here is a link for you. 

I think you might be focusing in on something that isn't all that relevant and that is straight up shots on goal. If you look at cf% the Sabres are 9th overall in the league so they are attempting more shots than not. That said in hd cf% they are 22 so they have given up a lot of high danger chances which we know. Score effects though matter as does shooting talent. 

[PerreaultForever]

6 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Since you like to emphasize the rough stuff, note that the Sabres were not afraid of their big guys like Kolesar and Carrier.   You like to talk about the rough stuff.  One of the few teams that is actually bigger on average than Buffalo (and everyone else) is Vegas.  Kolesar blasted one of our tougher guys, who in turn blasted a few of their players.  We were never pushed around and in the 2nd period we showed them a younger and faster team that is on the rise.  In the 3rd we hung on and had to rely on great goaltending but given the circumstances (end of road trip, depleted roster on D, win streak intact) it was a good game for us.  

Splitting with Vegas is good.  They were missing players but so were we.  

Well as I said, that win impressed me more than some previous ones where they lit it up. 

I might seem to focus on the "rough stuff" but only because I feel it has been an area not well addressed by the Sabres. I don't want to become the Leafs plain and simple. There was progress here. Soon we will start facing first string goalies instead of back ups and teams will prep harder for us. It's the next phase as we get taken seriously. We shall see how that unfolds. 

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

Your so called "true story" is false. Where do you and @PerreaultForevercome up with this hooligan mentality BS? Anyone who watches a lot of Sabre games knows very well that they hold up well and adequately respond to the physical play of other teams. The reality is that the Sabres give as much as they receive. You are responding to a myth of your own creation. It is utter nonsense! 

 

lol, umm, no, they don't. 

There's improvement, and there is more team unity, but we have quite a way to go still to play up against physical hockey. "hooligan" that's so funny. Is it Sweet and Tender too? 

🙂

 

[MattPie]

1 hour ago, grinreaper said:

On a different note, isn't it amazing that 2 weeks ago the biggest complaint or maybe just the people with the loudest microphone here were giving themselves wedgies over the Sabre's defense and goaltending while lamenting that they'd never make the playoffs this year because of it. Now, after a few wins in a row the complaint has turned to a belief that the Sabres and their style of play will never win in the playoffs. Patience guys, management is building this team in the right way. The quest for the Stanley Cup is like the pursuit of the Holy Grail, and we know what happened when Elsa decided to take a shortcut. 

Don't worry, the Sabres still have a long way to go before they're even on the bubble.

[Doohickie]

1 hour ago, grinreaper said:

Now, after a few wins in a row the complaint has turned to a belief that the Sabres and their style of play will never win in the playoffs. Patience guys, management is building this team in the right way.

There's a key concept buried in there:  building this team.  This team isn't a finished product, nor is it as good as it likely will be in a month, or two, or three.  This is readily apparent to me in how the team looks with half our regular Dmen out.  A month a go it was a disaster.  Now it's a winning streak.  If you don't think Pilut, Clague and Fitzy haven't grown as part of this team since November you're not paying attention.  Are they studs?  No.  Can they hold down the fort?  A month ago, no.  Now?  Eh.... almost, with good goaltending.  By the end of January, will they know what Granato wants out of them and come closer to giving it to him?  I would say yes.

Can the forward ranks grow to produce more consistently while being more responsible defensively?  Again, I say yes. 

Some teams are all they'll ever be already.  They're constituted similarly to the way they were last year and the year before.  They have the same coach and are playing the same system.  The Sabres are still developing and growing and will be a better team by the end of the season than they are now.  They will be playing a system closer to Granato's vision, and more consistently.  Cup contenders?  Doubtful.  But will they manage to win a series?  I wouldn't count them out.

[Doohickie]

1 hour ago, pi2000 said:

Oh @pi2000 you have the attention span of a gnat hockey player.  😉

[Doohickie]

27 minutes ago, MattPie said:

Don't worry, the Sabres still have a long way to go before they're even on the bubble.

4 points out with a game in hand?  Bubble territory.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

I don't know for sure, but it seems like we have not had a 30 page GDT in a very long time.

Scary good !!

[SwampD]

3 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

PA checks his calendar.

I think you forgot about my Vanek injury take.

[grinreaper]

16 minutes ago, MattPie said:

Don't worry, the Sabres still have a long way to go before they're even on the bubble.

I don't disagree with you at all. My reference was about the posters who two weeks ago were basically in hysterics because GMKA hadn't anticipated that we'd be down to 2-3 defensemen that started the season and didn't have enough NHL capable spares to make it no big deal. They claimed that dereliction of duty would make the playoffs out of reach. After the Sabres won a few games in a row that tune changed to the Sabres weren't built to win in the playoffs. They are a developing team that will have ups and downs. No need to live or die with every nice goal they have or bad pass they give up. 

[grinreaper]

2 minutes ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

I don't know for sure, but it seems like we have not had a 30 page GDT in a very long time.

Scary good !!

Do the amount of pages count as much as hits when determining the outcome of games?

[Sidc3000]

13 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

 

Here is a link for you. 

I think you might be focusing in on something that isn't all that relevant and that is straight up shots on goal. If you look at cf% the Sabres are 9th overall in the league so they are attempting more shots than not. That said in hd cf% they are 22 so they have given up a lot of high danger chances which we know. Score effects though matter as does shooting talent. 

They may be going into a defensive shell but they are not good at playing defense so it doesn’t fair well. I’m just looking at the basic shots against stat. They are 8th in the league on shots against. 
 

anyway, we can obviously see that they are not playing well defensively. 21-1 SOG in one period is bad and IMO that isn’t the Sabres just going into a defensive shell. They’re  lucky that UPL has played very well the last couple outings.

[K-9]

45 minutes ago, Sidc3000 said:

They may be going into a defensive shell but they are not good at playing defense so it doesn’t fair well. I’m just looking at the basic shots against stat. They are 8th in the league on shots against. 
 

anyway, we can obviously see that they are not playing well defensively. 21-1 SOG in one period is bad and IMO that isn’t the Sabres just going into a defensive shell. They’re  lucky that UPL has played very well the last couple outings.

The NHL Game Center stats show we were outshot 17-1 vs. Colorado and 23-5 vs. Vegas in those third periods, for a total of 40-6 in both games. I’ve seen different numbers posted in this thread. Are you guys getting stats from a different source? Are the NHL game stats not reliable? Thanks.

[Taro T]

8 hours ago, JohnC said:

The biggest takeaway from this game is the play of UPL. If he can sustain the play he has shown over the past few games, our expectations for the season should be elevated. At least for me, my expectation goes beyond merely staying in the playoff race until the end of the season to actually making the playoffs. There is still a long way to go. But if one looks back a week or so ago, and consider what the perception of UPL was then, and then seeing what it is now, that's a dramatic swing for the most important position on the ice. It's amazing how perceptions can change in a short period of time. The remedy is to have patience.  

Right now he's making a case to be Noronnen.  Which is significantly better than he was playing.  You still want better, but it's good enough as the 2nd half of a platoon.  Can he take it higher than that?  We shall see.