Is Don Granato the best coach the Sabres have had since Lindy Ruff?

[kas23]

5 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

What coach post lindy is better then

I didn’t quite understand who was better either. Then I thought about Teddy Nolan. Not his 2nd stint, but maybe based on his 1st time around (which was before Ruff). Of course Nolan had Hasek and won many playoff games with him, but I think he could’ve had this team humming as well. 

[WildCard]

18 minutes ago, French Collection said:

Are you advocating bringing back Eakin? LoL

[GASabresIUFAN]

5 minutes ago, kas23 said:

I didn’t quite understand who was better either. Then I thought about Teddy Nolan. Not his 2nd stint, but maybe based on his 1st time around (which was before Ruff). Of course Nolan had Hasek and won many playoff games with him, but I think he could’ve had this team humming as well. 

I think coaching is a matter of degrees at the pro level.  A bad coach can sink any amount of talent (see RK).  However a good coach can make decent talent good and excellent talent great.  Scotty Bowman would not have succeeded with the rosters given to Housley, Disco Dan, Donnie Meatballs or even RK.  To many bad players.

However find the right coach for the right roster and you can win a Cup like Washington did when they hired Barry Trotz.  He took a perennial lethal offensive machine gave them defensive structure and they finally won a Cup.  Of course his message got stale there quickly and they fired him and haven't played for a Cup since.

[LGR4GM]

1 minute ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

I think coaching is a matter of degrees at the pro level.  A bad coach can sink any amount of talent (see RK).  However a good coach can make decent talent good and excellent talent great.  Scotty Bowman would not have succeeded with the rosters given to Housley, Disco Dan, Donnie Meatballs or even RK.  To many bad players.

However find the right coach for the right roster and you can win a Cup like Washington did when they hired Barry Trotz.  He took a perennial lethal offensive machine gave them defensive structure and they finally won a Cup.  Of course his message got stale there quickly and they fired him and haven't played for a Cup since.

I thought they just refused to pay him

[Sabres Fan in NS]

52 minutes ago, French Collection said:

Are you advocating bringing back Eakin? LoL

Maybe ?????

Depends who else is ready to take his place.  I think there will be someone, but maybe not.

Eaksie is under contract for one more year after this one. No?  If he us UFA on July 1 ... then definately no.

[LGR4GM]

7 minutes ago, The Ghost of Doohickie said:

Maybe ?????

Depends who else is ready to take his place.  I think there will be someone, but maybe not.

Eaksie is under contract for one more year after this one. No?  If he us UFA on July 1 ... then definately no.

You have internet...

https://www.capfriendly.com/

[Stads]

Eakin is a UFA at the end of this year. If that mulleted "where possession goes to die" son of a gun is on this team next year, I will be perturbed, ornery, and downright miffed

[French Collection]

37 minutes ago, Stads said:

Eakin is a UFA at the end of this year. If that mulleted "where possession goes to die" son of a gun is on this team next year, I will be perturbed, ornery, and downright miffed

I have a long fuse but it may push me over the edge to have to watch him for another year.

Surely one of Thompson, Cozens, Krebs, Mittelstadt, Asplund, Girgensons, Jankowski can work hard this off season and get to 50% on draws.

[FogBat]

18 minutes ago, French Collection said:

I have a long fuse but it may push me over the edge to have to watch him for another year.

Surely one of Thompson, Cozens, Krebs, Mittelstadt, Asplund, Girgensons, Jankowski can work hard this off season and get to 50% on draws.

How much longer do we have Lynyrd (Skinner) under contract?

[Doohickie]

3 hours ago, FogBat said:

How much longer do we have Lynyrd (Skinner) under contract?

A long time.  2027.

[LGR4GM]

5 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

You have internet...

https://www.capfriendly.com/

 

3 hours ago, FogBat said:

How much longer do we have Lynyrd (Skinner) under contract?

3 posts away

[PASabreFan]

Dollars to donuts there's a huge playoff OT goal in that mullet. It is fate!

Be careful broskis.

[Doohickie]

48 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Dollars to donuts there's a huge playoff OT goal in that mullet. It is fate!

Be careful broskis.

I think I said something similar in a "favorite Sabre" thread the year we signed him.  I quipped that he would be my fave Sabre due to the Cup winning goal he would score for the team or something along those lines.

[Randall Flagg]

This is because of his R1b superpowers. Keen observers can sense it

[That Aud Smell]

I have a favour to ask: I’d love to have 2 or 3 YouTube links of Granato pressers to send to a coach I’ve recently met who presumably knows nothing about Don Granato, but is nonetheless cut from the same cloth, working on a similar vibe and path. If there’s one (or more) Granato pressers that stick out in your mind, please post ‘em here.

[Doohickie]

Keepin' it fresh:

 

[WhenWillItEnd66]

Ok, so i am late to the thread, but IMHO, best as being the smartest and getting the most from what he has been handed...... absolutely.... hands down! He does not hamstring himself to one general way of doing things, but has a progressive positive approach where he seems to get the best of anyone that he is given and maybe even a bit more. He has resurged the careers of almost half the team since our last idiot almost destroyed them. He handles players like actual people and gets them to elevate not only themselves but other players around them. Do not think you can ask for anything else from a coach at this time!! The real test to this will be when they eventually get into a playoff hunt or playoff game. How does he get the team to play then..... then you will know.

[PerreaultForever]

I'm not convinced Granato is the great coach many think he is. When this team learns to play team defense I might change my mind, not before. 

The two big names we discussed when the job was open, Boudreau and Gallant, have both done pretty darn good with their teams and not hiring one of them might still be a mistake. (Don't know if Gallant would have considered it, but the talk was Boudreau was very interested)

In many ways it's all relative, and almost anybody with any level of competence would have looked better than Kreuger but right now it's more about the young talent emerging than the coaching imo. Everything on the defensive side, and face offs, is all still pretty bad. Thompson to center is the one genius move that he will get credit for but idk was it genius or just luck because at the time we basically had no one to play a top center role so maybe it was just try anything and this one worked. 

get us in the playoffs next year, or at least competing for them in the last week like Vancouver is this year and I will give him the accolades then. Until then, undecided. 

[Taro T]

2 things that Granato did, to a degree out of necessity & to a degree because he believed in them, that seemed reckless that worked in the LT of a single season were 

1. He allowed Skinner to stay on the ice in close games at the end and even though it burned them in the ST (they lost at least 2 & possibly 4 points directly) it helped bring Skinner's game to another level.  He'll never been mistaken for Craig Ramsay, but he isn't a tire fire in his own zone any more.  Really expect a lot of that was Granato being able to say "hey, you ended up in a situation we knew would come up, & you did it your way and it went exactly as you were told it would; next time you're there, and you'll be in that situation again, try this; pretty sure it'll work."

Skinner has displayed far more character this season than this kid thought he had.  Mia culpa.

And 2, that 1st Euler game, when he turned Cozens loose against McDavid, it worked.  He spoke to him before the game & after that decided he was ready for the chance.  Granato read that darn near flawlessly.

Another he's been doing post 3/1 that wasn't noticeable prior to that is: he both regularly makes in game adjustments & he actually matches lines on a regular basis.  Will be looking for both to continue this fall.

Can't say he's the guy, way too short a sample size.  But there's hope he might be.  And this team is fun to watch for the 1st time in a long time.  Would be a great story if this cancer survivor ends up exactly what this team needed (and this opportunity ends up exactly what he needed).

[JohnC]

6 minutes ago, Taro T said:

2 things that Granato did, to a degree out of necessity & to a degree because he believed in them, that seemed reckless that worked in the LT of a single season were 

1. He allowed Skinner to stay on the ice in close games at the end and even though it burned them in the ST (they lost at least 2 & possibly 4 points directly) it helped bring Skinner's game to another level.  He'll never been mistaken for Craig Ramsay, but he isn't a tire fire in his own zone any more.  Really expect a lot of that was Granato being able to say "hey, you ended up in a situation we knew would come up, & you did it your way and it went exactly as you were told it would; next time you're there, and you'll be in that situation again, try this; pretty sure it'll work."

Skinner has displayed far more character this season than this kid thought he had.  Mia culpa.

And 2, that 1st Euler game, when he turned Cozens loose against McDavid, it worked.  He spoke to him before the game & after that decided he was ready for the chance.  Granato read that darn near flawlessly.

Another he's been doing post 3/1 that wasn't noticeable prior to that is: he both regularly makes in game adjustments & he actually matches lines on a regular basis.  Will be looking for both to continue this fall.

Can't say he's the guy, way too short a sample size.  But there's hope he might be.  And this team is fun to watch for the 1st time in a long time.  Would be a great story if this cancer survivor ends up exactly what this team needed (and this opportunity ends up exactly what he needed).

As you well know I'm an avid fan of DG. It's indisputable that he has a talent working with young players in order for them to advance as players. What I find encouraging when judging DG as a coach is that the veteran players also improved under him as like the younger players. Veteran players such Okposo, Skinner (you noted) and to a lesser extent a player such as Tuch who was given a greater role all increased their production under him. Skinner is a dramatic example of his deft touch with an individual player. The coach with the cool blue framed glasses worked on improving this free floating veteran player whose psyche was badly wounded due to the bashing from his former coach. I personally thought that Okposo was a punched out veteran player who was rapidly fading to the end of his career. I was stupendously wrong about this prideful player. 

The central issue now when evaluating Granato becomes how does he handle a more robust and finished roster and competes for a playoff spot. As you have spoken about before there is a difference when coaching and playing when there is nothing at stake compared to when each game means something when seriously vying for the playoffs. Playing/coaching with little expectation and little to lose in every game is not a pressurized situation. When he and the team are under the stress of battling for a playoff spot that's when we can give a more encompassing and meaningful view of him as a coach. 

[Doohickie]

46 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

right now it's more about the young talent emerging than the coaching imo

I think coaching has a lot to do with that emergence.

[pi2000]

1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:

I'm not convinced Granato is the great coach many think he is. When this team learns to play team defense I might change my mind, not before. 

This was my concern as well.

That said, since March 1st they're allowing 4 fewer shots against per game, which has moved them up from 24th to 13th in league wide CorsiFor percentage.

[Zamboni]

I wanted to give DG a full season pretty much to evaluate this question… So my answer now is… Yes he has the best coach since Lindy Ruff the Sabres have had.

I like the way he thinks the game, I like the way he makes adjustments especially period to period. I like the way he mixes up the lines if a certain line has become stagnant or ineffective. Even if it’s a temporary mix up. And lastly I like his demeanor on the bench and off the ice.

[SwampD]

2 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

I'm not convinced Granato is the great coach many think he is. When this team learns to play team defense I might change my mind, not before. 

Team defense. You’ve been saying this over and over. I would love to see some examples of what you are talking about, cuz I have no idea what you mean. They look like every other team now. Something I have not been able to say for ten years.

Sometimes they get hemmed in, sometimes they don’t, just like every other team at times during games. I have found that it’s most often a function of who is on the ice, not the D system.

 

50 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

This was my concern as well.

That said, since March 1st they're allowing 4 fewer shots against per game, which has moved them up from 24th to 13th in league wide CorsiFor percentage.

Again, I would love some examples where you think it is the defensive system and not the personnel.

Sell it to me, cuz I’m just not buying it, yet. Sorry.

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, pi2000 said:

This was my concern as well.

That said, since March 1st they're allowing 4 fewer shots against per game, which has moved them up from 24th to 13th in league wide CorsiFor percentage.

It was always a process of letting them learn from their own mistakes this year for Donnie.

So I don’t think it’s as much about improving/implementing the system as the players getting better at hockey.

I have noticed, as Taro points out, more tactical bench coaching. I wonder how much of that is finally having the roster to make moves?

Too little being made about the fact the Sabres best hockey has also happened to coincide with their healthiest roster.