GM Tim Murray - Time for a serious conversation

[qwksndmonster]

I'm not sure this is true.

They're both centers that play on the wings of awesome centers, McDavid and Eichel. The difference is that Draisaitl is huge and his game is shrugging dudes off the puck. His skillset transfers to the wing so much better than Samson's. I'd probably still take Samson, but it's close.

[SwampD]

They're both centers that play on the wings of awesome centers, McDavid and Eichel. The difference is that Draisaitl is huge and his game is shrugging dudes off the puck. His skillset transfers to the wing so much better than Samson's. I'd probably still take Samson, but it's close.

Absolutely. I just don't think you can call Draisaitl significantly better.

[Huckleberry]

Let me state this again, there is no bad contract with Moulson.   His buy out is the best in the league.  

 

https://www.capfriendly.com/buyout_calculator/matt-moulson

 

This seems off, capgeek had a much lower buyout caphit.

Edited April 15, 2017 by Huckleberry

[I-90 W]

I always call it the Thruway. Maybe more of a Rochester thing?

Here in the capital region we also call it the thruway. And 87 is the northway, noone calls it the 87.

[nfreeman]

Draisaitl had 29-48-77 this year, including 19 even-strength goals.

 

Reino had 17-30-47 this year, including 8 even-strength goals.  He had a stretch this year of something like 25 games without an even-strength goal.

 

Draisaitl is bigger and faster.

 

That is a significant difference.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Draisaitl had 29-48-77 this year, including 19 even-strength goals.

 

Reino had 17-30-47 this year, including 8 even-strength goals.  He had a stretch this year of something like 25 games without an even-strength goal.

 

Draisaitl is bigger and faster.

 

That is a significant difference.

Leon is the better player and if you go back to that draft rankings, not everyone was sold on Reinhart over Draisaitl or even Bennett. That doesn't mean that Sam won't be an excellent player for us, but he isn't a franchise player.

[SwampD]

Draisaitl had 29-48-77 this year, including 19 even-strength goals.

 

Reino had 17-30-47 this year, including 8 even-strength goals.  He had a stretch this year of something like 25 games without an even-strength goal.

 

Draisaitl is bigger and faster.

 

That is a significant difference.

It is. I just think that if they traded places, their numbers would probably swap, as well.

[bunomatic]

Draisaitls game transfers better to the playoffs whereas Sam would maybe wilt under the intense physicality

[Randall Flagg]

I don't have the details, but Drai's number fall off a cliff when he's not with McDavid. I can look up the numbers in a second

In his 670 minutes with the best player on the planet, Draisaitl's GF% is 59.4%, his CF% is 53.8%. In his 500 minutes without McDavid, his GF% is 44.2% and his CF% is 47.9%. Sam with Jack: GF% = 45.7, Sam without Jack: GF% = 50% 

 

Sam's CF% without Jack is 47.8% and Jack's without Sam is 44%, but together they're at 50%. 

 

Draisaitl is likely the better player than Samson, and is according to my eye test, though Sam's vision and passing is better. But McDavid makes the gap look like the Grand Canyon, where Sam is actually helping to pull Jack along a little bit. The difference is not the Grand Canyon, it's just some smaller Canyon if we're on an earth-sized scale. 

[nfreeman]

I too would like Reinhart to be better than Draisaitl, but I don't see how anyone can think that at this point.

 

Draisaitl had 60% more assists then Reino, so I don't see how one could claim that Reino is a better passer.

 

Draisaitl is clearly much better than Reino at the role of winger on a superstar center's line.

 

I suppose there is still hope that Reino will turn out to be a better center than Draisaitl, but we'll need a new coach to find that out.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

It's way too early to compare Sam and anyone at this point, especially Leon.

 

Very different players in very different situations.

[Iron Crotch]

I too would like Reinhart to be better than Draisaitl, but I don't see how anyone can think that at this point.

 

Draisaitl had 60% more assists then Reino, so I don't see how one could claim that Reino is a better passer.

 

Draisaitl is clearly much better than Reino at the role of winger on a superstar center's line.

 

I suppose there is still hope that Reino will turn out to be a better center than Draisaitl, but we'll need a new coach to find that out.

 

Samson has good hands and vision, but otherwise is pretty invisible most games. He certainly doesn't play with reckless abandon... doesn't leave it all out on the ice on every shift. Physically he isn't anywhere close to the player Draisaitl is. Leon is bigger, faster, much more physical, is stronger on the puck, etc. than Samson. I'd take a Draisaitl for Reinhardt trade in a second. Skill-wise they're probably comparable, but Leon plays with a lot more attitude and determination than Samson who has a tendency to drift a bit. At this point (and I concede that both guys are still very early in their careers), GMTM picked the wrong guy at #2 IMHO.

[qwksndmonster]

Sam has better vision and is better in the defensive zone. Stylistically I'd compare Sam to Bergeron. Draisaitl is magic in the offensive zone, the way he holds the puck reminds me of Jack a little bit. I think it's likely that Sam becomes a more valuable player to his team than Draisaitl is to Edmonton.

[Randall Flagg]

I too would like Reinhart to be better than Draisaitl, but I don't see how anyone can think that at this point.

 

Draisaitl had 60% more assists then Reino, so I don't see how one could claim that Reino is a better passer.

 

Draisaitl is clearly much better than Reino at the role of winger on a superstar center's line.

 

I suppose there is still hope that Reino will turn out to be a better center than Draisaitl, but we'll need a new coach to find that out.

I have no evidence at the moment - when I watch Sam I just see him make passes that I haven't seen Leon make, though that sample size is obviously smaller. The numbers - they play with a 4th liner that McDavid turned into a 30 goal player, so I do think McDavid helps a little in that regard too.

[TrueBlueGED]

Draisaitl had a better season, that's for damn sure. I don't think he was better last season though. In fact, I remember he started hot and fell off a cliff...around the time McDavid went down. His low production away from McDavid can't be ignored. I also think he's a much better winger than Sam, and his board work is a great complement to McDavid (and would be for Jack).

 

Unfortunately we're left to play the "what if" game with what Reinhart's production would have been as a full time center, to say nothing of playing in a better system. Right now, gun to my head, I take Draisaitl. But I don't think it's that clear cut when everything is taken into account.

[French Collection]

From what I've seen Draisaitl is not faster than Sam.

A full year with McDavid pads your stats more than 2/3 of a year with Jack.

 

Let's give this comparison more time. They are different players and I think Sam develops into a good 200 foot player that makes people around him better.

[kas23]

I too would like Reinhart to be better than Draisaitl, but I don't see how anyone can think that at this point.

 

Draisaitl had 60% more assists then Reino, so I don't see how one could claim that Reino is a better passer.

 

Do we know what proportion of those assists were to McJesus? I don't follow the Oilers, so wonder how stable Draisaitl's line was.

[7+6=13]

I can't understand how anyone can think the rebuild should be done already.

 

I get the we should be further along but I don't think 10 more points this year would make me feel better.  I see where we are in terms of personnel.  I'm satisfied with having a reasonable optimistic view of our future.   I see no difference in where we are now vs having 10 more points and staying there for another year with Bylsma.  He has to go - it's a matter of time but with this defense we're not ready to win playoff series anyway. 

 

We've got so much to look forward to.  I'm just going to enjoy the journey.

[WildCard]

We should have made the playoffs. Our coach, players, and GM have explicitly said so.

[TrueBlueGED]

I can't understand how anyone can think the rebuild should be done already.

 

I get the we should be further along but I don't think 10 more points this year would make me feel better. I see where we are in terms of personnel. I'm satisfied with having a reasonable optimistic view of our future. I see no difference in where we are now vs having 10 more points and staying there for another year with Bylsma. He has to go - it's a matter of time but with this defense we're not ready to win playoff series anyway.

 

We've got so much to look forward to. I'm just going to enjoy the journey.

Understandable. After all, it's hard to understand how people think something they actually don't. Rebuild being over means we're a Cup contender. Most around here expected bubble team. Those two things are quite different.

[PASabreFan]

Understandable. After all, it's hard to understand how people think something they actually don't. Rebuild being over means we're a Cup contender. Most around here expected bubble team. Those two things are quite different.

I think this is cutting it way too fine. We could be rebuilding for decades then? Along with many other teams? The term has to be defined more narrowly. I'd say the rebuild is over when the Sabres are an NHL team again. It should have been over by now.

[TrueBlueGED]

I think this is cutting it way too fine. We could be rebuilding for decades then? Along with many other teams? The term has to be defined more narrowly. I'd say the rebuild is over when the Sabres are an NHL team again. It should have been over by now.

By this definition, it is over. We weren't the Avs or the Coyotes. We were a normal bad team.

[LGR4GM]

They're both centers that play on the wings of awesome centers, McDavid and Eichel. The difference is that Draisaitl is huge and his game is shrugging dudes off the puck. His skillset transfers to the wing so much better than Samson's. I'd probably still take Samson, but it's close.

Samson shouldn't be a winger. He's best asset is puck distribution. He's wasted at wing.

From what I've seen Draisaitl is not faster than Sam.

A full year with McDavid pads your stats more than 2/3 of a year with Jack.

 

Let's give this comparison more time. They are different players and I think Sam develops into a good 200 foot player that makes people around him better.

Especially with the 10-15 games it took Jack to get even near full speed.

 

Statistically I believe Reinhart was better compared to last season. But his overall game took a sophomore slump according to my eye test. He's got some searching to do this summer in my book.

[7+6=13]

By this definition, it is over. We weren't the Avs or the Coyotes. We were a normal bad team.

 

We're not just a normal bad team because we have plausible upside. 

[PASabreFan]

Colorado Avalanche: Four exciting developments in the wings

 

https://milehighsticking.com/2017/04/15/colorado-avalanche-four-exciting-developments-wings/