Who would you trade for Stamkos

[Hoss]

I think the more fun question is, would you trade Eichel for Stamkos, straight up, right now?

I don't think that's a fun question at all because I don't think more than 5% of Sabres fans would say yes.

 

 

This would likely be an extremely difficult trade to match up on... Possibly even a three-team deal if it were to ever get to that point (which I think most of us understand it's highly unlikely to).

To make the money work more immediately I think Moulson, Bogosian or Gionta would be in the conversation as moderate at-best pieces to the deal. Reinhart is probably a lock to be in any such deal along with one of Ennis/Girgensons (immediate-impact forwards).

So maybe Moulson, Reinhart, Ennis and a 2016 first gets the conversation going. Beyond that you might ask Tampa to add some value that you'll match with a similar piece (which Murray seems to have done in other deals).

 

It's definitely an interesting discussion as to what you would give, what it would take and why it would or wouldn't make sense.

Edited October 24, 2015 by Hoss

[inkman]

I think the Lightning are stacked with young talent and could contend for several years with or without Stamkos. Stamkos is also signed with Terry Pegula's former sports agency (Newport Sports Agency) which also represents Ryan O'Reilly and Evander Kane so that could sway things slightly towards the Sabres.

That's huge! :lol: Edited October 24, 2015 by inkman

[Weave]

Low 70's was 5th worst last year. This team isn't low 70's bad by any stretch.

 

I will be mildly surprised if there are no in season trades. I'd expect a D-man that helps LT is brought in. Combine him w/ Bogo & the return of Lehner and this team is close to a playoff team. Low 90's would be 10th in either conference and that is how I see this team. They are better than TO, NJ, Carolina, & C-bus (surprising all but TB). When all is said & done I expect them to be better than Boston & Filly as well.

 

Still think they are better than Jersey?  :P

[LGR4GM]

The price would be insane, but if any team has the assets to do it, it's the Sabres. I'm betting the Lightning would want two firsts and two young players who have already proven that they are likely to meet their potential, such as Ristolainen and Girgensons. I think Reinhart and Pysyk are still a little too questionable in that regard, but maybe Stevie Y could get talked down.

 

The 'Ning are good enough now to continue winning with that trade, and they should still be winners for a few years - they are in a great position to start stocking the cupbards for 3-4 years down the road.

 

All that said, I still think the price would be too high for just about anyone.

 

I think the more fun question is, would you trade Eichel for Stamkos, straight up, right now?

Did you just put Samson Reinhart on the same level as Mark Pysyk?

 

I will bet you money that Jack Eichel within 3 years from this moment in time will be considered a better NHL player than Steven Stamkos.

I definitely think GMTM is in talks with Tampa because its free to talk, but at this point what team isnt. I think if a trade happens it will be later rather than sooner. Tampa isnt going to give up on negotiations with stamkos until they know for a fact they have no other options. I dont think it will cost as much as people think if its later. At that point its going to come down to the quality of the trade not quantity. Im thinking 2016 1st, 2017 1st, Girgenson and a quality prospect

Steve Yzerman just hung up the phone on your and isn't taking your calls ever again.  You aren't even in the ballpark.

Patience kids. Let the first part of the season play out. 

Edited October 25, 2015 by LGR4GM

[Taro T]

Still think they are better than Jersey?  :P

Absolutely.

There's no way they have that much leverage to command those 4 players and they know it.  They're the one's in a bad spot not the Sabres.

They aren't in a bad spot until the trade deadline. IF they can't re-sign him, there are 28 teams besides the Sabres that will kick the tires. He's not going for as little as it took to get Thornton out of Boston.

 

And I said they'd be looking for 3 for sure. The 4th could probably get talked down to a prospect/pick.

They're on pace for 47 points. There's basically zero chance that keeps up, but they'd have to double their current pace to get to the 90s. I don't see that happening. I see them finishing in the 70s unless something big changes.

IF Kane's injury isn't LT, barring other major injury, they aren't falling below 80. Assuming they lose 8-10 in OT/SO, 80 points is 10-12 games below 0.500. This team is not that bad. They need to get the lines dialed in and learn their linemates. Once they do, they'll start winning their share.

[PotentPowerPlay22]

Tim Murray

[nfreeman]

Here's my 2 cents:

 

- At this point, with Stamkos not having re-signed, I think the operating assumption has to be that he isn't going to re-sign.  So he's either going to get traded or leave as a UFA.

 

- He has a NTC, so he can veto any trade and just ride this out into UFA.  Now, would he do that, even though it would royally screw the Lightning?  We certainly don't know much, but what we do know (leaving a good team in a low-tax, warm-weather city with good fan support that made the finals last year and that has paid him millions of $$ over the years; complained last year about a minor reduction in his role as the triplets line emerged) indicates that yes, he would screw them.

 

- From Stamkos' perspective, he can veto any trade, not disrupt his family life, go on another deep playoff run and then sign with the highest bidder.  He negotiated the NTC so that he could control any possible trade, which is what he would be doing in this scenario.  There is no reason for him to agree to a trade other than the putative desire to be nice to the Lightning.

 

- Accordingly, I think the most likely outcome is that there is no trade and he leaves as a UFA this summer. 

 

- However, it's certainly possible that there will be a trade.  If so, there will be plenty of interest, but no one is going to give up assets like Reinhart or Risto unless an extension is agreed to as part of the trade.

 

- What if an extension is part of the trade?  How many teams would Stamkos be willing to sign an extension with?  And how many of those teams will be able to both pay him, say, $12MM per year and pay a high price to the Lightning in trade?  Even with those conditions, there will probably be around a half-dozen teams in the mix.  I could see the Sabres being included in the mix, but I could also see them not making the cut.

 

- So IF all that happens (which is now about 4 or 5 big ifs) -- what would the Sabres have to give up to put together the winning bid?  I think we're looking at something like Reinhart and McCabe plus a draft pick, or Ennis and Risto plus a draft pick (but the pick in any scenario is not next year's #1).

 

My bottom line is that because of the NTC I don't think it will happen, but it might, and it sure is interesting.

[sicknfla]

Here's my 2 cents:

 

- At this point, with Stamkos not having re-signed, I think the operating assumption has to be that he isn't going to re-sign. So he's either going to get traded or leave as a UFA.

 

- He has a NTC, so he can veto any trade and just ride this out into UFA. Now, would he do that, even though it would royally screw the Lightning? We certainly don't know much, but what we do know (leaving a good team in a low-tax, warm-weather city with good fan support that made the finals last year and that has paid him millions of $$ over the years; complained last year about a minor reduction in his role as the triplets line emerged) indicates that yes, he would screw them.

 

- From Stamkos' perspective, he can veto any trade, not disrupt his family life, go on another deep playoff run and then sign with the highest bidder. He negotiated the NTC so that he could control any possible trade, which is what he would be doing in this scenario. There is no reason for him to agree to a trade other than the putative desire to be nice to the Lightning.

 

- Accordingly, I think the most likely outcome is that there is no trade and he leaves as a UFA this summer.

 

- However, it's certainly possible that there will be a trade. If so, there will be plenty of interest, but no one is going to give up assets like Reinhart or Risto unless an extension is agreed to as part of the trade.

 

- What if an extension is part of the trade? How many teams would Stamkos be willing to sign an extension with? And how many of those teams will be able to both pay him, say, $12MM per year and pay a high price to the Lightning in trade? Even with those conditions, there will probably be around a half-dozen teams in the mix. I could see the Sabres being included in the mix, but I could also see them not making the cut.

 

- So IF all that happens (which is now about 4 or 5 big ifs) -- what would the Sabres have to give up to put together the winning bid? I think we're looking at something like Reinhart and McCabe plus a draft pick, or Ennis and Risto plus a draft pick (but the pick in any scenario is not next year's #1).

 

My bottom line is that because of the NTC I don't think it will happen, but it might, and it sure is interesting.

Per all the talk down here there are 3 teams in the mix for Stamkos. Tampa, Toronto, and Detroit. Any other team has no chance at him. Now Toronto and Detroit might get into a bidding war to get him into town and have some negotiating power but no team is going to trade everything needed to get him as a rental. The talk also is unless a huge offer comes at them Tampa is willing to keep Stamkos and make another run at the Cup at the expense of dealing him as a rental.

 

So, IMO he stays in Tampa until UFA. Then Toronto and Detroit battle for him. Toronto will get him. I also think Babcock knew this when he was deciding.

 

IMO, Buffalo is out in this.

[Randall Flagg]

Per all the talk down here there are 3 teams in the mix for Stamkos. Tampa, Toronto, and Detroit. Any other team has no chance at him. Now Toronto and Detroit might get into a bidding war to get him into town and have some negotiating power but no team is going to trade everything needed to get him as a rental. The talk also is unless a huge offer comes at them Tampa is willing to keep Stamkos and make another run at the Cup at the expense of dealing him as a rental.

 

So, IMO he stays in Tampa until UFA. Then Toronto and Detroit battle for him. Toronto will get him. I also think Babcock knew this when he was deciding.

 

IMO, Buffalo is out in this.

All in our division too. Sigh.

[Rasmus_]

Did you just put Samson Reinhart on the same level as Mark Pysyk?

 

I will bet you money that Jack Eichel within 3 years from this moment in time will be considered a better NHL player than Steven Stamkos.

Steve Yzerman just hung up the phone on your and isn't taking your calls ever again.  You aren't even in the ballpark.

Patience kids. Let the first part of the season play out. 

 

+1 On Eichel.  Pysyk is NOT on the same level of talent as Reinhart.

[TrueBlueGED]

Here's my 2 cents:

 

- At this point, with Stamkos not having re-signed, I think the operating assumption has to be that he isn't going to re-sign.  So he's either going to get traded or leave as a UFA.

 

- He has a NTC, so he can veto any trade and just ride this out into UFA.  Now, would he do that, even though it would royally screw the Lightning?  We certainly don't know much, but what we do know (leaving a good team in a low-tax, warm-weather city with good fan support that made the finals last year and that has paid him millions of $$ over the years; complained last year about a minor reduction in his role as the triplets line emerged) indicates that yes, he would screw them.

 

- From Stamkos' perspective, he can veto any trade, not disrupt his family life, go on another deep playoff run and then sign with the highest bidder.  He negotiated the NTC so that he could control any possible trade, which is what he would be doing in this scenario.  There is no reason for him to agree to a trade other than the putative desire to be nice to the Lightning.

 

- Accordingly, I think the most likely outcome is that there is no trade and he leaves as a UFA this summer. 

 

- However, it's certainly possible that there will be a trade.  If so, there will be plenty of interest, but no one is going to give up assets like Reinhart or Risto unless an extension is agreed to as part of the trade.

 

- What if an extension is part of the trade?  How many teams would Stamkos be willing to sign an extension with?  And how many of those teams will be able to both pay him, say, $12MM per year and pay a high price to the Lightning in trade?  Even with those conditions, there will probably be around a half-dozen teams in the mix.  I could see the Sabres being included in the mix, but I could also see them not making the cut.

 

- So IF all that happens (which is now about 4 or 5 big ifs) -- what would the Sabres have to give up to put together the winning bid?  I think we're looking at something like Reinhart and McCabe plus a draft pick, or Ennis and Risto plus a draft pick (but the pick in any scenario is not next year's #1).

 

My bottom line is that because of the NTC I don't think it will happen, but it might, and it sure is interesting.

 

Why does this have to be the assumption? I'm fairly certain both Getzlaf and Perry re-signed with the Ducks mid-season. 

[sicknfla]

Why does this have to be the assumption? I'm fairly certain both Getzlaf and Perry re-signed with the Ducks mid-season.

Again, i am only going by what i hear on talk radio but Jeffrey Vinnik has damn near Pegula money. He went to Yzerman and gave him an open check. Right now they are at Toews/Kane numbers. The owner will pay more - Yzerman must not think he is worth more.

[DR HOLLIDAY]

I would not trade for him........I would like to see this team play together for a year before we make another big move

[7+6=13]

I think the Lightning can afford to take less because of their embarrassment of riches they already possess, doesn't mean they will but i feel Yzerman is very confident and trusts his coach as well. Stamkos has a no movement or limited no movement this year correct? If so then that eliminates the pretenders right away.

 

No one takes less because they can afford to.  They can't afford everything and that's the point. 

[deluca67]

I would not trade for him........I would like to see this team play together for a year before we make another big move

The problem with that is a Stamkos level player won't likely be available next season. It's one of those situations where opportunity can out weigh patience.    

[Marvelo]

Kane, Bogosian and Lehner.

[Doohickie]

Kane, Bogosian and Lehner.

 

The New Rotten Core?  :flirt:

 

Seriously, that's why a trade for Samkos won't happen.  When GMTM was wheeling and dealing last year he had assets that were "toxic" to this organization but not to others.  He wanted no part of Myers, Staff, Grigo.  Zads was turning into an attitude problem as was Lemieux.  They still had value to the rest of the league, but Murray was done with them.  Might as well package them up and get players you actually want for them (GMTM pursued Kane even when he was at Ottawa). 

 

Because of the injuries, the three you named seem expendable but at this point they wouldn't bring the value necessary.  We had "positive equity" on the players he traded away last year, but we're "under water" on Kane, Bogo and Lehner.  They will have more value after they're healthy and playing in the system.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Just about anyone not named Eich.

[sicknfla]

The New Rotten Core? :flirt:

 

Seriously, that's why a trade for Samkos won't happen. When GMTM was wheeling and dealing last year he had assets that were "toxic" to this organization but not to others. He wanted no part of Myers, Staff, Grigo. Zads was turning into an attitude problem as was Lemieux. They still had value to the rest of the league, but Murray was done with them. Might as well package them up and get players you actually want for them (GMTM pursued Kane even when he was at Ottawa).

 

Because of the injuries, the three you named seem expendable but at this point they wouldn't bring the value necessary. We had "positive equity" on the players he traded away last year, but we're "under water" on Kane, Bogo and Lehner. They will have more value after they're healthy and playing in the system.

Armia, Lemieux, and the 1st rounder could never play an NHL game and when the dust settles Winnipeg could still win this trade. Murray got absolutely hosed. I felt that Myers needed a change of scenery and wasn't against moving him. I will eat crow and say I was wrong. Trading him set this franchise back.

[North Buffalo]

Stamkos, at the rate the Sabres are going no one, unless tampa willing to part with top 4 D too, then contigent on sign and would then part with '16 top pick.

Edited October 27, 2015 by North Buffalo

[inkman]

Armia, Lemieux, and the 1st rounder could never play an NHL game and when the dust settles Winnipeg could still win this trade. Murray got absolutely hosed. I felt that Myers needed a change of scenery and wasn't against moving him. I will eat crow and say I was wrong. Trading him set this franchise back.

It's a little early for this type of analysis. I refuse to include stafford in the deal. He was a pending UFA. We see his type dealt for 2nd round picks every year. So maybe lemieux could be considered his trade value. Myers needed to go in the worst way. He was never going to live up to the hype in Buffalo. He seemed to wilt under the pressure. In Winnipeg, he can just go play without any pressure. If and it's a big if Evander and Bogo get healthy, the Sabres will have more than enough value to offset a kid who was never going to cut it in Buffalo.

[sicknfla]

It's a little early for this type of analysis. I refuse to include stafford in the deal. He was a pending UFA. We see his type dealt for 2nd round picks every year. So maybe lemieux could be considered his trade value. Myers needed to go in the worst way. He was never going to live up to the hype in Buffalo. He seemed to wilt under the pressure. In Winnipeg, he can just go play without any pressure. If and it's a big if Evander and Bogo get healthy, the Sabres will have more than enough value to offset a kid who was never going to cut it in Buffalo.

Myers did have to go. Just think he could have fetched players with a lot less of those IFS. Just gets tiring that every freaking move we make always has IFS. There are no IFS in Winnipeg right now. Myers is rock solid and Stafford has been one of their best players since he got off the plane.

[thewookie1]

I want Stamkos anywhere but Toronto, I like when Toronto suffers. I'm hoping he ends up in Calgary to be honest, I'm not all that interested in acquiring him based on his price and our present prospects coming up.

 

 

Myers did have to go. Just think he could have fetched players with a lot less of those IFS. Just gets tiring that every freaking move we make always has IFS. There are no IFS in Winnipeg right now. Myers is rock solid and Stafford has been one of their best players since he got off the plane.

 

Technically both were IFS for Winnipeg, there was no assurance that Myers or Stafford would reawaken. Bogosian before his injury problems was rather effective and when he returns I'd guess he'd still be. As for Kane, did we overpay, probably; but unlike Stafford he's the right age for this group.  

Edited October 27, 2015 by thewookie1

[MattPie]

I want Stamkos anywhere but Toronto, I like when Toronto suffers. I'm hoping he ends up in Calgary to be honest, I'm not all that interested in acquiring him based on his price and our present prospects coming up.

 

Philosophical question: is it better for Toronto to suffer, or have them think they're going to be good (like trading for Stamkos) and then suffering for other reasons?

[sicknfla]

Philosophical question: is it better for Toronto to suffer, or have them think they're going to be good (like trading for Stamkos) and then suffering for other reasons?

They are going to suffer and get the #1 pick and draft Matthews. Then they will sign Stamkos and add him to Marner and Nylander. Suddenly they aren't suffering anymore. Good chance their rebuild is one we envy in 2 years.