jsb Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 (edited) All of this is true, but none of it absolves Bogosian of his own poor play. The guy is a 7 year pro making $5 million, and he has as many blown coverages and poor decisions as the rookies. For his pedigree and contract he's supposed to be a rock back there, and he just isn't. Most of the year he's provided 3rd pairing caliber play, which is well below what we need him to be. Love your passion but I disagree with your scouting report. He hasn't played as badly as you state, he's by far our best Dman in front of the net and the past 6-8 weeks he's played well. On top of that he's only 25 and he's got a bit of nasty to him. NBC had a spot where it showed we were the 3rd youngest team in the league at 26.5, you take off Legwand, Gionta, Moulson and Colaiacovo and McCormick and it drops down to 24.0. Trading him for picks or prospects sounds like you want the rebuild to continue forever. I'm with Taro..... big haul, go for it. Otherwise give it time. As for WildC, I'm with you, I'd love Fowler but I just don't know what it would realistically take to haul him in. Edited February 22, 2016 by jsb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 BOGO WILL BE FINE. Lets all remember that it is his first year in a new system (?) and with a new coach and new players ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 Love your passion but I disagree with your scouting report. He hasn't played as badly as you state, he's by far our best Dman in front of the net and the past 6-8 weeks he's played well. On top of that he's only 25 and he's got a bit of nasty to him. NBC had a spot where it showed we were the 3rd youngest team in the league at 26.5, you take off Legwand, Gionta, Moulson and Colaiacovo and McCormick and it drops down to 24.0. Trading him for picks or prospects sounds like you want the rebuild to continue forever. I'm with Taro..... big haul, go for it. Otherwise give it time. As for WildC, I'm with you, I'd love Fowler but I just don't know what it would realistically take to haul him in. I can see how you'd get that from my "get out from under his contract" phrasing, but it's definitely not what I meant. I want him involved in a hockey trade, not a firesale...or at the very least, a sale for assets that are used in a subsequent hockey trade. Not that this is his actual value (who knows what that is), but two 2nds and a B-level prospect that we end up sitting on isn't the type of move I'm envisioning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 Yes that's the ticket, we have a 21 year old who has blown 3 games recently with mindless passing, 2 Dmen playing in their 1st year and the rest of the guys couldn't beat an opposing forward to a loose puck even if they were wearing snow shoes instead of skates...... and we want to rid ourselves of this guy :wallbash: As if anyone we could get of equal value in free agency wouldn't cost as much or more and we have no-one on the near horizon in the AHL ready to play up and we want to rid ourselves of Bogosian??? Our blue line is a mess and Bogosian's play this season has been part of the problem. I think unloading his contract and getting some value for it can be part of the solution going forward. I don't think it's smart to pay $5.1 million to a defenseman you're unsure will play as a #4 or a #6, all while missing a quarter of every season. As True pointed out, Bogo is signed for four more years and his play would put him at a #4 or bottom pairing D. Paying him 5.1 million for that role when Reinhart, Risto and Eichel will be off of their ELCs is not the best idea. I agree with you that Risto has been a mess at times this season, but I also expect him to continue to improve. In terms of free agency, I would use the savings and go after Keith Yandle, who actually is a Top 4 D and a Lefty, something this team sorely lacks and something worthwhile overpaying for. Its common knowledge that the Ducks have been heavily scouting the Sabres and they also are heavy on LHD. Fowler or if Lindholm's Contract demands are too high,could be trade targets. These two options would add two Top 4 LHD to the mix. Would the D Corps suffer the rest of this season, absolutely. But it would also put the. In a much stronger position moving forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 All of this is true, but none of it absolves Bogosian of his own poor play. The guy is a 7 year pro making $5 million, and he has as many blown coverages and poor decisions as the rookies. For his pedigree and contract he's supposed to be a rock back there, and he just isn't. Most of the year he's provided 3rd pairing caliber play, which is well below what we need him to be. He has definitely been disappointing but IMHO a fair amount of that disappointment is people looking at the pedigree rather than the player. I'm ok w/ him being traded, but I expect him to be better next year and would prefer him back. The only thing I expect they'll lose if they trade him next year relative to this year is the opportunity to gel w/ his teammates for a year. They might gain him being the player they thought they were getting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 Friedman: "I'm kind of being told to back away from (notion of #NHLDucks' interest in Ladd.) Anaheim is probably not the team here."#NHLJets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 I really hope Murray trades our lottery pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norcal Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 Bogo is a moose. Hes a tough, physical, mean SOB who is a beast to play against. The Sabres need him and more like him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 I really hope Murray trades our lottery pick. Why? Bogo is a moose. Hes a tough, physical, mean SOB who is a beast to play against. The Sabres need him and more like him. Agreed and I don't get all the talk of getting rid of him. Just think of who he replaced and that should make you happy enough to have him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 Why? Agreed and I don't get all the talk of getting rid of him. Just think of who he replaced and that should make you happy enough to have him. We don't need it. We need roster players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 We don't need it. We need roster players.I guess the question is, what would you want for it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 He has definitely been disappointing but IMHO a fair amount of that disappointment is people looking at the pedigree rather than the player. I'm ok w/ him being traded, but I expect him to be better next year and would prefer him back. The only thing I expect they'll lose if they trade him next year relative to this year is the opportunity to gel w/ his teammates for a year. They might gain him being the player they thought they were getting. Quite fair. I really hope Murray trades our lottery pick. I hope you suffer a chemical accident that prevents you from ever growing a beard again :devil: Why? Agreed and I don't get all the talk of getting rid of him. Just think of who he replaced and that should make you happy enough to have him. To be honest, I get the sense that I'm in a distinct minority when it comes to dealing Bogosian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 We don't need it. We need roster players. We don't? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 We don't? Depending on the pick and the potential trade, I could be all for it or all against it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 Depending on the pick and the potential trade, I could be all for it or all against it. If it's a top 3 pick it's almost untouchable. A 4-7 pick and it better be a damn good roster player coming back. Even the 4-7 picks have a relatively high likelihood of being top 6 forwards/top 4 D within a years time and come relatively cost controlled for 7 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 We don't? When do we want to win? I think the answer is ASAP. Trade the pick and get someone you don't have to wait to develop. I don't want to be Edmonton. I want to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#freejame Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 (edited) We don't need it. We need roster players. To be fair there are probably 2-3 players this draft who could be on NHL rosters next season. I'm fine with moving the pick, but not until I know where it is*. It's too much of a gamble. *Unless the return was substantial Edited February 22, 2016 by IrwinNelson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 When do we want to win? I think the answer is ASAP. Trade the pick and get someone you don't have to wait to develop. I don't want to be Edmonton. I want to win. Huh? Edmonton has won 4 of the last 6 years! .... Oh. ;) :p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 I guess the question is, what would you want for it? I don't know. To be fair there are probably 2-3 players this draft who could be on NHL rosters next season. I'm fine with moving the pick, but not until I know where it is*. It's too much of a gamble. *Unless the return was substantial I'm not requesting we give it away. I'll take the pick. But I think we can get a player for it. Someone has to want a potential top 3 pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 I'm with d4rk, even if it's Matthews, I hope we look to move the pick, with the obvious condition that the return is fair value that helps us next season and beyond, not starting 2-3 seasons from now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustache of God Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 To be fair there are probably 2-3 players this draft who could be on NHL rosters next season. I'm fine with moving the pick, but not until I know where it is*. It's too much of a gamble. *Unless the return was substantial Based off of my skewed misunderstanding of statistics, we're due for a lottery win this draft*. 3rd time's a charm, right? If I'm Murray I'm not moving that pick until I know whether or not it will be Austin Matthews. IF we win the lottery, I wouldn't mind Murray dealing for that pick if it brings in an elite player who can perform now and into the foreseeable future. Or just draft Matthews. I don't think it's be a savvy hockey move to deal the pick before the lottery order is established because only then will you be able to judge it's true value. *my advanced knowledge of statistics also lets me know that Buffalo will never, ever win the lottery because that's just how it is for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 I'm with d4rk, even if it's Matthews, I hope we look to move the pick, with the obvious condition that the return is fair value that helps us next season and beyond, not starting 2-3 seasons from now. Here's an example. Let's say the Sabs win the lottery and Arizona is 6th or something. Eager to have their local boy as the face of the franchise, and positively desperate to sell tickets, Arizona offers OEL and that 6th for Buffalo's 1st. Gotta do it, right? And I don't think it's unreasonable from either side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 (edited) I'm with d4rk, even if it's Matthews, I hope we look to move the pick, with the obvious condition that the return is fair value that helps us next season and beyond, not starting 2-3 seasons from now. Oh man that leaves so few options to anyone who fits that description. Mathews is in the Eichel realm of potential talent and would be an immediate contributor beginning next season. It's not as if Mathews is a guy that needs a year or two in Rochester. I guess I would take a look at it if we're talking about OEL and a 1st from Zona. But I doubt Arizona has the depth on D to move OEL. Maybe a Tyler Seguin from Dallas? There aren't very many names I'd be interested in enough to move Mathews for. Here's an example. Let's say the Sabs win the lottery and Arizona is 6th or something. Eager to have their local boy as the face of the franchise, and positively desperate to sell tickets, Arizona offers OEL and that 6th for Buffalo's 1st. Gotta do it, right? And I don't think it's unreasonable from either side. And you post this at the same time as me. Nice. I just can't see Arizona making that move. But yes, I would probably make that deal. Edited February 22, 2016 by Derrico Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkard Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 (edited) When do we want to win? I think the answer is ASAP. Trade the pick and get someone you don't have to wait to develop. I don't want to be Edmonton. I want to win. It hurts more if you fight it. Just relax and let the losses shower over you. Only 22 games left. Unless we lose somebody important in camp, then just one more season after this one. But wait, I heard there's this 15 year old phenom just tearing ###### up. If we get him in 2 years, we'll really be set. Tank Forever! Edited February 22, 2016 by Drunkard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 When do we want to win? I think the answer is ASAP. Trade the pick and get someone you don't have to wait to develop. I don't want to be Edmonton. I want to win. I understand the sentiment, but I think there are risks with taking the ASAP approach as well. A different set of risks than those seen in the Edmonton Syndrome, but equally problematic, I think. I'm not in favour of GM TM trading away that pick, unless he knows where that pick is and unless he's getting excellent value in return. It will be interesting to see what develops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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