Adams And Granato Media Availability Wednesday: What Do You Want To hear?

[matter2003]

1 hour ago, Contempt said:

So is the experience not valuable for everyone else? So next year most of them have at least a series under their belts? Or are we off the train that experience in big situations matters?

 

Did it matter to New Jersey who improved 47 points?

I expect the Sabres will have a 2 year point improvement of the same ilk(probably closer to 35 points)...probably will end next year around where Jersey ended this year.

[Buffalonill]

I don't get how it's not playoffs or bust next year.

  

 And Organization mindset pisses me off It shouldn't be playoffs it should be championships .

 

[matter2003]

2 minutes ago, Buffalonill said:

I don't get how it's not playoffs or bust next year.

  

 And Organization mindset pisses me off It shouldn't be playoffs it should be championships .

 

How many teams win a Stanley Cup the first time in the playoffs as a group? Almost never. It even took the great Oiler teams 3 or 4 cracks at it to get their first one and they were nearly dismantled due to this.

If you expect them to win the Stanley Cup next year you are likely to be unhappy due to having unrealistic expectations.

Edited April 19, 2023 by matter2003

[Cascade Youth]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

If you watched that presser and think Adams and Granato have zero expectations... you didn't listen. 

I'll add, we've only finished year 2 of this rebuild. This was Tuchs first full season and krebs

I never said they don’t have expectations for themselves - I’m sure they want to win.  I’m responding to the posters expressing frustration that they won’t just admit it’s “playoffs or bust” next season - the reason is that they haven’t been given that mandate by their bosses and so why would they publicly measure themselves?

[Contempt]

17 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

Did it matter to New Jersey who improved 47 points?

I expect the Sabres will have a 2 year point improvement of the same ilk(probably closer to 35 points)...probably will end next year around where Jersey ended this year.

Well, new jersey lost pretty bad last night so maybe it did. Lets see if they pull it together or if they crash out like a ln inexperienced team might.

[Malazan]

2 hours ago, LabattBlue said:

Maybe by saying it, it makes them more accountable versus…”we tried hard, maybe next year”.

So them saying it changes the 'accountability' how? If they said and it fell short then you'd be ok with it? 

[SDS]

Fans have a way of turning even the most innocuous statement against people. Terry said some things in his first press conference and people have done nothing, but have used it against him since. 
 

If I’m a GM in this situation, I would never say it’s playoffs or bust. That backs you into bad decisions. are you making the best decision for the franchise moving forward or are you making a decision to be one of 16 teams in a tournament that may be against your best interest in the future? This is a Fool’s game. 

Adams wants to build long-term success. The playoffs come for free doing this and without boxing himself in with fan friendly phrases.

[LGR4GM]

24 minutes ago, Buffalonill said:

I don't get how it's not playoffs or bust next year.

  

 And Organization mindset pisses me off It shouldn't be playoffs it should be championships .

 

You bet 100 bucks this team would finish bottom 4 and now you're mad they aren't talking about winning the cup next year?

If you have to say publicly you're trying to win and repeat it... well to quote game of thrones:

 

[Randall Flagg]

11 minutes ago, SDS said:

Fans have a way of turning even the most innocuous statement against people. Teri said some things in his first press conference and people have done nothing but use it against him cents.

 

fans have a way of turning even the most innocuous statement against people. Teri said some things in his first press conference and people have done nothing but use it against him cents.

If I’m a GM in this situation, I would never say it’s playoffs or bust. That backs you into bad decisions. I are you making the best decision for the franchise moving forward or are you making a decision to be one of 16 teams in a tournament that may be against your best interest in the future? This is a Fool’s game. 

Adams wants to build long-term success. The playoffs come for free doing this and without boxing himself in with fan friendly phrases.

I know you're just playing but it reminds me, everyone on WGR under the age of 35 says "sense" instead of "since." I've heard Joe, Nate, and two different producers (Ryan Gates and his replacement) do this. "Sense when do we blah blah blah"

 

"Ever sense Krueger left, Skinner blah blah "

Edited April 19, 2023 by Randall Flagg

[Buffalonill]

52 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

How many teams win a Stanley Cup the first time in the playoffs as a group? Almost never. It even took the great Oiler teams 3 or 4 cracks at it to get their first one and they were nearly dismantled due to this.

If you expect them to win the Stanley Cup next year you are likely to be unhappy due to having unrealistic expectations.

Its the mindset

sure they will most likely not win but you need to put the belive in the looker room ( why not us) 

 

[Taro T]

36 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

How many teams win a Stanley Cup the first time in the playoffs as a group? Almost never. It even took the great Oiler teams 3 or 4 cracks at it to get their first one and they were nearly dismantled due to this.

If you expect them to win the Stanley Cup next year you are likely to be unhappy due to having unrealistic expectations.

Not many, but the list includes the '05-'06 Canes squad.  

And the GM's experiences with that team seem to have greatly shaped his views towards team building and trying to sustain success long term.  That team was unable to sustain the success long term.  Everything the GM has said and done indicates that he expects the best way to be the one team in any given year that hoists Lord Stanley's Chalice is to be one of the handful of teams every year that has an opportunity to catch lightning in a bottle and you need a lot of luck to go with the skill and plan to be that 1 team that does actually win so he likely isn't EVER going to go ALL IN on any 1 given season.  (The exception possibly being when Dahlin is getting too long in the tooth to be a top player for more than just 1 or 2 more years.)

[rickshaw]

I’m not sure why the gm or coach would guarantee playoffs. There are no guarantees in this life. They believe they’ll get there but to guarantee it is stupid.

So much can happen to derail the best laid plans. Those expecting playoffs and/or railing on them for not saying it’s expected, I think are kind of silly. We all want them to make it but no team can guarantee playoffs. No team. Humans should never expect anything. That’s when the trouble starts. 

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, matter2003 said:

Did it matter to New Jersey who improved 47 points?

I expect the Sabres will have a 2 year point improvement of the same ilk(probably closer to 35 points)...probably will end next year around where Jersey ended this year.

NJ went out and got a goalie. That was the main difference they had from the Sabres.

If Levi is the real deal and plays most of next year we might get that point total. 

It looks like NJ might be a quick out though. I'm hoping we build a team that will be a little tougher to beat if and when we get in. 

18 minutes ago, rickshaw said:

I’m not sure why the gm or coach would guarantee playoffs. There are no guarantees in this life. They believe they’ll get there but to guarantee it is stupid.

So much can happen to derail the best laid plans. Those expecting playoffs and/or railing on them for not saying it’s expected, I think are kind of silly. We all want them to make it but no team can guarantee playoffs. No team. Humans should never expect anything. That’s when the trouble starts. 

You don't "guarantee" it, but you can say it's your goal and set that bar. If you don't make it you make changes. 

[matter2003]

43 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Not many, but the list includes the '05-'06 Canes squad.  

And the GM's experiences with that team seem to have greatly shaped his views towards team building and trying to sustain success long term.  That team was unable to sustain the success long term.  Everything the GM has said and done indicates that he expects the best way to be the one team in any given year that hoists Lord Stanley's Chalice is to be one of the handful of teams every year that has an opportunity to catch lightning in a bottle and you need a lot of luck to go with the skill and plan to be that 1 team that does actually win so he likely isn't EVER going to go ALL IN on any 1 given season.  (The exception possibly being when Dahlin is getting too long in the tooth to be a top player for more than just 1 or 2 more years.)

 

That will always be the Cup we got screwed out of with defenseman dropping like flies...if McKee even plays and didn't have a crazy infection prior to game 7 they likely win that game taking a lead into the 3rd.

[PerreaultForever]

After listening to this it's all just different ways of saying "stay the course". The plan is still future based and not next season based. There will be no major trades and nothing overly significant in free agency. 

If things go extremely well (injury wise, luck, scheduling etc) they might be slightly better and make the playoffs.

If things go badly they'll be on the outside looking in again. 

Not what I wanted to hear but kind of what I expected. 

I will be more content if Dahlin signs a long term deal. But what if he is getting tired of the pace, sees a lack of improvement being made by management, and decides to maybe test free agency. What happens to "the plan" then? 

[dudacek]

18 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

After listening to this it's all just different ways of saying "stay the course". The plan is still future based and not next season based. There will be no major trades and nothing overly significant in free agency. 

If things go extremely well (injury wise, luck, scheduling etc) they might be slightly better and make the playoffs.

If things go badly they'll be on the outside looking in again. 

Not what I wanted to hear but kind of what I expected. 

I will be more content if Dahlin signs a long term deal. But what if he is getting tired of the pace, sees a lack of improvement being made by management, and decides to maybe test free agency. What happens to "the plan" then? 

Why do you say that?

They traded away their entire core two years ago, acquiring just one veteran of any significance (who missed nearly half the year) and improved by (a prorated) 21 points through internal development.

They made no significant trades or free agent signings last year and improved by 16 points through internal development.

They are bringing back 4 rookies, 2 more near-rookies and adding Levi. Why cant there be more internal development?

 

[Carmel Corn]

22 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Why do you say that?

They traded away their entire core two years ago, acquiring just one veteran of any significance (who missed nearly half the year) and improved by (a prorated) 21 points through internal development.

They made no significant trades or free agent signings last year and improved by 16 points through internal development.

They are bringing back 4 rookies, 2 more near-rookies and adding Levi. Why cant there be more internal development?

 

IMHO, my only concern with your point is that of the defense (both in terms of personnel and scheme).  As far as personnel, who comes to mind as internal development from the bottom 3 defense corp?  I don't see Joki, Boosh or Stillman developing as a legit top 4 defender.  As far as scheme, I question whether our organization has the right coaching to tighten up coverage in our zone.  Stronger goaltending will help for sure, but I'd like to see the team improve in front of him.

[Flashsabre]

3 hours ago, Buffalonill said:

I don't get how it's not playoffs or bust next year.

  

 And Organization mindset pisses me off It shouldn't be playoffs it should be championships .

 

Can you send me the link you watched because the one I watched they literally said the goal is to win the Stanley Cup.

[K-9]

1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:

After listening to this it's all just different ways of saying "stay the course". The plan is still future based and not next season based. There will be no major trades and nothing overly significant in free agency. 

If things go extremely well (injury wise, luck, scheduling etc) they might be slightly better and make the playoffs.

If things go badly they'll be on the outside looking in again. 

Not what I wanted to hear but kind of what I expected. 

I will be more content if Dahlin signs a long term deal. But what if he is getting tired of the pace, sees a lack of improvement being made by management, and decides to maybe test free agency. What happens to "the plan" then? 

Next season is in the future, no? 

KA has stated on several occasions that the goal is to build a perennial contender, which means they are always “future based.” He would be remiss if he wasn’t concentrating on the long term. It’s the definition of a fluid situation. 

[dudacek]

29 minutes ago, Carmel Corn said:

IMHO, my only concern with your point is that of the defense (both in terms of personnel and scheme).  As far as personnel, who comes to mind as internal development from the bottom 3 defense corp?  I don't see Joki, Boosh or Stillman developing as a legit top 4 defender.  As far as scheme, I question whether our organization has the right coaching to tighten up coverage in our zone.  Stronger goaltending will help for sure, but I'd like to see the team improve in front of him.

So that's a valid concern, but he said things had to go extremely well just to make the playoffs

We missed the playoffs by a point with that bottom 3. Levi can't give us few more points on his own, let alone what we might get from the rest who can improve?

Also, he said "no significant' additions,. Now maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think upgrading the bottom 3 constitutes "significant".

I'm not sure what does is his mind, but I'll bet good money that they will bring in new players in the off-season and that will include additions to the defence.

The entire implication of his post was that we can't improve next year by "staying the course."

Pretty sure that's what people said last year too.

 

Edited April 20, 2023 by dudacek

[Randall Flagg]

5 hours ago, matter2003 said:

Did it matter to New Jersey who improved 47 points?

I expect the Sabres will have a 2 year point improvement of the same ilk(probably closer to 35 points)...probably will end next year around where Jersey ended this year.

This is an interesting point. 

The Devils looked like a bunch of middle schoolers playing in the playoffs for the first time against a team of guys who've done it many times before - even though 82 games would tell you that the Devils were a step above the Rangers between the creases, including the ability to take 7 of 8 points from them this year. It is the first time many of their players have seen the playoffs, and many of their important players. I bet that right now, they wish they would have gotten a 4 game sweep out of the way last season, but they didn't make the playoffs. Sometimes, especially for particularly young players, it takes that first time through to understand what you need to do to get to and win a playoff series, so that you have a year of true preparation for it. 

When Tampa reset their group after making the playoffs twice with Stamkos and Hedman, but then missing a few years, they started to build the core we know today in 2013-14. This was the creation of the TKO line, Tyler Johnson, Nikita Kucherov, Ondrej Palat. That year was the first time I remember people talking about Tampa becoming a force, having the potential to dominate year in and year out. They made the playoffs and got swept by Montreal. I would say the experience served them well and wasn't a waste, and I'm sure it was appreciated the next season when they were able to make the Stanley Cup finals. 

The same thing happened with Colorado after bottoming out in 2016-17. Their first season back into the playoffs was dismissed in 6 games, but they had a bunch of young guys who learned a lot and would go on to help them win 4 years later

The Kings were dispatched quickly after their first trip to the playoffs in years before eventually winning 2 cups.

There are teams that build and are able to jump into deep runs right away, but those teams tend to have a lot of players of a kind our GM warns that he won't pursue unless the opportunity is perfect.  The Blackhawks had Campbell, Sharp, Havlat, the Canes had Justin Williams, Justin Faulk, Nino Niederreiter, Staal, Hamilton, Teravainen, all guys who are either old/experienced or with significant playoff minutes. The Sabres had Briere, Drury, Numminen, Lydman etc. Those teams were able to jump to the Eastern Conference Finals right away after playoff droughts, didn't need to get spanked first. Our Sabre team reminds me more of Tampa/Colorado/New Jersey. 

As such, I think getting in and getting spanked this year would have been a tremendous value. Our players learned what it took to have must win games each night at the end of March...against teams that were sometimes also in must-win games, sometimes at the bottom of the standings, sometimes looking forward to a different game in the future, none focused on the Sabres quite like the Bruins would be this week.

There IS an opportunity that was lost. I won't argue that it will hold us back long-term, keep us from winning a cup, whatever. But Jersey might have to spend a 52 win, 112 point season getting that sweep out of the way, which is probably pretty ***** annoying. Home ice is hard to get. I hope that we won't have to get blitzed next year to "learn" like we could have done this year, if we manage to put together a season like they did

Edited April 20, 2023 by Randall Flagg

[bunomatic]

37 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Next season is in the future, no? 

KA has stated on several occasions that the goal is to build a perennial contender, which means they are always “future based.” He would be remiss if he wasn’t concentrating on the long term. It’s the definition of a fluid situation. 

Perennial contender is a good talking point but nothing is guaranteed and has there ever been one ? At some point in the next couple years it has to be about ‘now’ or he runs the risk of missing players prime years for some future shangra la that may never materialize. And I’m pretty sure no team has ever won the cup exclusively with homegrown talent. That sounds a little pie in the sky. Guys are always brought in at some point to get over the top.

[B-U-F-F-A-L-O]

On 4/18/2023 at 12:34 PM, PerreaultForever said:

Although they will say it, I don't want to hear about how proud they are of this year, how bright the future is, how the plan is working. I don't want to hear about 3-5 years, or the word development, or anything about steps and progress. 

I want to hear one simple sentence, Our goal next season is to make the playoffs. 

Anything less should be considered failure. That's the spot to set the bar and they need to make the moves needed to make that happen. 

It's time for this team to make losing unacceptable. 

 

 

Our goal next season is to win the cup as it should every season.

That’s what I want to hear. Get us the right #4 D-man while keeping our top six from this year so that Stillman is #7.

I’ll let KA call the goalie situation as I’m not sure what the best path is.

Definitely get a really rough & tumble fourth liner that can play.

Possibly get a third line center that is excellent at face offs, is a vet leader and has won a cup…. This player will also give us excellent depth. But I could see the Sabres go with last year’s squad at center and use the Rochester boys for depth…. 
 

The draft: BPA purely in first two rounds (ignoring tiny players)  then draft size and toughness….(if it’s there….) Let’s get some bangers in the system.

 

Go Sabres!

[Porous Five Hole]

1 minute ago, bunomatic said:

Perennial contender is a good talking point but nothing is guaranteed and has there ever been one ? At some point in the next couple years it has to be about ‘now’ or he runs the risk of missing players prime years for some future shangra la that may never materialize. And I’m pretty sure no team has ever won the cup exclusively with homegrown talent. That sounds a little pie in the sky. Guys are always brought in at some point to get over the top.

I agree with this. 

Someone stated that it has only been 1.5 seasons since the Sabres jettisoned Jack. That really hit home with me.  If the tear down and rebuild is based off of that moment (which is arguable, but if you accept that as fact for the moment), the Sabres are still laying the foundation of a rebuild.  It might have been too early to expect the GM to accelerate the rebuild GMTM style prior to this off-season, but the window is opening. I hope aggressive action is coming.

Lock up the D core of Dahlin & Power, bring in another top four D, get the upcoming goaltending decision correct (Levi and a vet?), maybe supplement the top nine, and away we go!

[PromoTheRobot]

When the Sabres finally win a cup, people will be mad it didn't happen sooner.