Alex Tuch, a key piece in the Eichel trade

[Thorny]

57 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Don't you want guys like Power and Krebs playing in the playoff run, if we're in one?

Maybe, but it's not based on a hard-line principle. Simply depends of if they were to represent upgrades on the players they are replacing. It's been so long since we've been in that position that it's almost hard to honestly remember: but I think when you are a "good" team, and sitting in/near a playoff spot at that point, as a fan your thinking isn't really in "getting the prospects some action" mode. 

Shoot me, if that's ever my mentality. We should be enjoying the wins. The focus should be winning. I think fans in that stage would want young players in if they felt the guys they were replacing were inferior. 

Really probably just comes down to that 

Edited November 16, 2021 by Thorny

[LabattBlue]

Stop with the playoff talk, and take a look at this roster.  If the Sabres are within 15 points of the last EC playoff spot at the TDL, I will resurrect this post, and declare myself to be the village idiot...for at least a day or two. 😂

[jsb]

7 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

Stop with the playoff talk, and take a look at this roster.  If the Sabres are within 15 points of the last EC playoff spot at the TDL, I will resurrect this post, and declare myself to be the village idiot...for at least a day or two. 😂

Dude I'm with you, is it against the law to mail across state lines whatever these guys are smoking because if it isn't PLEASE send me some. Playoffs, OMG I just want to be entertained and see the guys that will matter in a couple of years get a great development year in. Isn't it a bit early in the day to be smoking that stuff anyway except for maybe @inkman 😀??

[dudacek]

Can someone please calculate the odds of:

A) the Sabres being in a playoff race;

B) None of Power, Quinn, Krebs, Peterka or Samuelsson being good enough to help that team; and

C) Eakin, Hagg, Butcher, Hinostroza and the rest of the Legion of JAG being indispensable parts?

[LGR4GM]

17 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Can someone please calculate the odds of:

A) the Sabres being in a playoff race;

B) None of Power, Quinn, Krebs, Peterka or Samuelsson being good enough to help that team; and

C) Eakin, Hagg, Butcher, Hinostroza and the rest of the Legion of JAG being indispensable parts?

Somewhere between 0 and laughable. 

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

The Sabres players know what Adams is doing. He's had the "honest conversations"

Their job is to get better every day. That same mandate will apply pre- and post-deadline, to both the Legion of JAG and the Blinding Light Brigade.

Selling off JAGs to make space for core prospects who are ready doesn't send the wrong message. This isn't Jason Botterill ignoring centre ice as the season slips away. If Adams can get a 3rd-rounder for Eakin and in the process create a spot for Krebs to get into a playoff run, he is also staying true to that mandate.

He's certainly making making the team better in the long run, and very likely making it better in the now.

 

[jsb]

13 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Can someone please calculate the odds of:

A) the Sabres being in a playoff race;

Well according to this guy in The Athletic, we have a 1% chance of the playoffs and an 88% chance of being bottom 3 in the division as of today

[Thorny]

27 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Can someone please calculate the odds of:

A) the Sabres being in a playoff race;

B) None of Power, Quinn, Krebs, Peterka or Samuelsson being good enough to help that team; and

C) Eakin, Hagg, Butcher, Hinostroza and the rest of the Legion of JAG being indispensable parts?

It's low, man. 

But in a world where this roster is in a playoff spot, a world where, undoubtedly then, unicorns and pots of gold at the of rainbows exist, things like one, or a couple, of those JAGS positively contributing doesn't seem so outlandish anymore. 

When you realize you are in the matrix you are in the matrix. Everything working in zany like fashion means *nothing* is, in fact, zany anymore. It's relative. 

The mentality we are viewing these players and prospects in would be wildly different at that point than it is now - it's almost like your hypothetical exists in two distinct frames of existence

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, Thorny said:

Right, I'm not advocating for Adams to go after additions in that case. Just merely to avoid taking apart what is working at the time. I'll take the continued playoff push for what that could mean mentally (and for the fanbase? isn't this what Adams is talking about? Winning back the fans?) over a few later draft picks being added to our already bursting draft pick allotment 

I don't think he is going to take things apart.  Olofsson is really the only big question.  Is KA committed to him being part of the core long-term?  If KA is then it's unlikely KA trades VO.  However, as an RFA, he'd probably bring a pretty penny at the deadline. 

Everyone else ranges from no value to being replaceable internally except maybe Miller.  Trade Hinostroza and R2 slides into his role with probably better results.  Hagg can be replaced by Samuelsson.  When VO, Mitts and Tuch gets healthy, that probably the end of the road for Hayden, Caggiula and probably Hinostroza.  I don't see Eakin or Pysyk being traded because of our lack of depth at center and RHD.  

Once everyone gets healthy up front, most of the JAGs will be gone

VO Mitts Tuch

Skinner Thompson Asplund

Girgensons Eakin KO

R2 Cozens Bjork

Add Krebs to the mix and Bjork is gone as well.  I really like that forward group.  

On defense you have 4 core guys once Samuelsson gets elevated and Joki gets healthy in Dahlin, Joki, Samuelsson and Bryson.  If Pysyk is retained, that leaves one maybe two slots.  Moving on from Butcher (as if someone would take him) and Wolanin wouldn't hurt us and giving Miller's slot to Power makes sense.   

 

 

[Thorny]

Just now, GASabresIUFAN said:

I don't think he is going to take things apart.  Olofsson is really the only big question.  Is KA committed to him being part of the core long-term?  If KA is then it's unlikely KA trades VO.  However, as an RFA, he'd probably bring a pretty penny at the deadline. 

Everyone else ranges from no value to being replaceable internally except maybe Miller.  Trade Hinostroza and R2 slides into his role with probably better results.  Hagg can be replaced by Samuelsson.  When VO, Mitts and Tuch gets healthy, that probably the end of the road for Hayden, Caggiula and probably Hinostroza.  I don't see Eakin or Pysyk being traded because of our lack of depth at center and RHD.  

Once everyone gets healthy up front, most of the JAGs will be gone

VO Mitts Tuch

Skinner Thompson Asplund

Girgensons Eakin KO

R2 Cozens Bjork

Add Krebs to the mix and Bjork is gone as well.  I really like that forward group.  

On defense you have 4 core guys once Samuelsson gets elevated and Joki gets healthy in Dahlin, Joki, Samuelsson and Bryson.  If Pysyk is retained, that leaves one maybe two slots.  Moving on from Butcher (as if someone would take him) and Wolanin wouldn't hurt us and giving Miller's slot to Power makes sense.   

 

 

Not that I really disagree with anything here but we do kinda do this thing where we say things like "when so and so gets healthy, this will be the end of the line for the replacements". 

NHL teams just don't really...get healthy. There being *no one* out of the lineup is more less a pipedream. The fringe players aren't really that - they are active components of the roster because you never just need 20 guys. It's why "oh injuries" is never is a good excuse, unless in the extreme, because it should be EXPECTED that you'll need contributions from some of the players not in your ideal top 20. 

The Caggiulas and Hinostozas of the world will continue to see time because these are the players Adams brought in to do so 

[Curt]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Wouldn't it then also a bad course not to re-sign these guys in the off-season?

"Cody and Robert were in the trenches with me during our glorious run to a 1st-round knockout. I can't believe Adams isn't bringing the band back. What's this Power kid ever done? Our GM clearly doesn't want to win."

So, this is all based around the assumption that Hagg and Eakin are contributing members of a team that looks like it’s going to make the playoffs at the trade deadline.

I think there is a definite distinction between trade deadline sell offs and offseason moves.  Specifically in the minds and hearts of the other guys on that team.  Every season is a journey unto itself, as if they are on that journey together.

[Thorny]

Ya. Fatty Bolger would have been a fine companion for Frodo, Sam and Merry had he been there from the start but if you tried to swap him out with Pippin half way to Mordor, I think the group would object 

[dudacek]

3 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Ya. Fatty Bolger would have been a fine companion for Frodo, Sam and Merry had he been there from the start but if you tried to swap him out with Pippin half way to Mordor, I think the group would object 

Fatty's game was never built for playoff marches.

[Taro T]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

The Sabres players know what Adams is doing. He's had the "honest conversations"

Their job is to get better every day. That same mandate will apply pre- and post-deadline, to both the Legion of JAG and the Blinding Light Brigade.

Selling off JAGs to make space for core prospects who are ready doesn't send the wrong message. This isn't Jason Botterill ignoring centre ice as the season slips away. If Adams can get a 3rd-rounder for Eakin and in the process create a spot for Krebs to get into a playoff run, he is also staying true to that mandate.

He's certainly making making the team better in the long run, and very likely making it better in the now.

No selling off of JAGs to create space required.  After the trade deadline roster size is only limited by the salary cap.  The JAGS don't have to go anywhere to see what the baby Amerks / NCAAers can do.

But before we worry about deadline moves, this team needs to be better than 0.250 on the road.  Hopefully they can be, but until they are, they aren't.

And of they can get close to the hunt, or even in it, wouldn't give up anything more than a single 2nd on one rental.  Would show management believes in the kids, but even more so that they believe the future is bright & don't want to short circuit it.

[Doohickie]

2 hours ago, jsb said:

Well according to this guy in The Athletic, we have a 1% chance of the playoffs and an 88% chance of being bottom 3 in the division as of today

Haters.  Come on, Sabres PROVE THEM WRONG!!!  😄

[LabattBlue]

37 minutes ago, Taro T said:

And of they can get close to the hunt, or even in it, wouldn't give up anything more than a single 2nd on one rental.  Would show management believes in the kids, but even more so that they believe the future is bright & don't want to short circuit it.

…and you know what the kids care about?  Losing their roster spot to a TDL acquisition. 😂

[pi2000]

5 hours ago, Thorny said:

The Sabres find themselves right at the top of the bottom 4th of the league through 14 games, they'd need to move into the upper half to qualify. Are we thinking the Sabres are likely to improve upon their start, from here on out? Can't see it happening - schedule isn't going to get any easier and neither are the rosters of the teams we are playing 

It's a hypothetical.   

What happens if Terry tells KA to go after player X to nudge them into the playoffs? 

[woods-racer]

15 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

It's a hypothetical.   

What happens if Terry tells KA to go after player X to nudge them into the playoffs? 

It's a hypothetical.

 

KA slaps Terry's PP.

[Thorny]

19 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

It's a hypothetical.   

What happens if Terry tells KA to go after player X to nudge them into the playoffs? 

Well as much as I'm against selling off guys if we are still in a chase, I don't really expect Adams to add in that situation. To your point though, if he does, my preference would be to give up prospects rather than pics, if possible - Adams seems to be a pretty shrewd drafter at this stage (I know, we don't actually know) so I'd sooner trust him to convert those picks, and determine which prospects might be easiest to part with. 

As I'd like his chances with that other determination, as well. 

[mjd1001]

5 hours ago, dudacek said:

Can someone please calculate the odds of:

A) the Sabres being in a playoff race;

B) None of Power, Quinn, Krebs, Peterka or Samuelsson being good enough to help that team; and

C) Eakin, Hagg, Butcher, Hinostroza and the rest of the Legion of JAG being indispensable parts?

A)  Not likely, only if the young guys on this roster go though a LOT of in season development and there are major injuries to teams above them in the standings.  It isn't a zero percent chance, but I'd say that happening and this team being in a playoff race down tot he last week are in the 20-1 odds range.

B)  Other than getting that 3-4 game (1-2 week) taste of the NHL later in the year, I see no reason for them to be called up, even if some think they are slightly better than players on the current roster.

[Doohickie]

23 hours ago, pi2000 said:

It's a hypothetical.   

What happens if Terry tells KA to go after player X to nudge them into the playoffs? 

I think KA tells Terry what he will be sacrificing- a prospect, picks, whatever... and explain that yes, maybe they can get into the playoffs (no guarantees) but also explain how losing those future assets for a happy clappy first round playoff exit will set the build back.  And then he will ask, "Is it really worth it, Terry?"  I would say that even if they are close, there is value in being in a playoff race but narrowly missing out, in terms of stoking the hunger of the players.  I think it would also convey that you're not looking for a savior:  The talent is already here and coming in from Rochester.  Get the young men to own it.

Edited November 17, 2021 by The Ghost of Yuri

[LGR4GM]

23 hours ago, pi2000 said:

It's a hypothetical.   

What happens if Terry tells KA to go after player X to nudge them into the playoffs? 

What happens if Terry tells KA nothing and already understands the plan going forward?

22 hours ago, Thorny said:

Well as much as I'm against selling off guys if we are still in a chase, I don't really expect Adams to add in that situation. To your point though, if he does, my preference would be to give up prospects rather than pics, if possible - Adams seems to be a pretty shrewd drafter at this stage (I know, we don't actually know) so I'd sooner trust him to convert those picks, and determine which prospects might be easiest to part with. 

As I'd like his chances with that other determination, as well. 

Name a prospect you would be willing to part with. 

[jsb]

23 hours ago, woods-racer said:

It's a hypothetical.

 

KA slaps Terry's PP.

Well that PP has gone soft the past few games

[PromoTheRobot]

On 11/16/2021 at 11:13 AM, jsb said:

Well according to this guy in The Athletic, we have a 1% chance of the playoffs and an 88% chance of being bottom 3 in the division as of today

What are they basing this on? Their preseason prognostication that the Sabres would win only five games? I'd say based on 15 games and the fact the roster should improve significantly once players come off injury I expect the Sabres to be within 6-8 points of a playoff spot in March. We are currently on an 89.6-point pace right now.

Edited November 17, 2021 by PromoTheRobot

[Cityo'Rasmii]

Can't wait for Alex!

Happiness that he has #89

Edited November 17, 2021 by Cityo'Rasmii