Kane traded to San Jose for a Cond. ‘19 1st, Dan O’ Regan and Conditional 4th

[7+6=13]

They are rumored to be all in on Tavares. If they thought he was valuable long term and were going to make an offer we probably would have gotten a  better deal.  

 

It matters not how they value Kane long term.

[GrassValleyGreg]

If Dan O'Regan becomes the equivalent of Jake Guentzal or Conor Sheary are you all as upset about the deal?

 

He's basically the same size as those two.

 

Love these comps. 

 

LOL at the "I'm done with Botts" crowd. See ya.

[darksabre]

The small return on Kane, the fact that there wasn't any interest in Lehner, and the Sabres still being stuck with Bogo and Moulson just illustrates how disastrous Murray was as GM.

 

GMJB has his work cut out for him. Hopefully we can make some hockey trades this summer and get some lottery luck because we're in the middle of nowhere right now.

Yup. I'm disappointed we weren't able to get anything else done today, but I'm also wholly unsurprised. 

[nfreeman]

I think it really comes down to this, Kane was called a "greedy selfish player" and Botterill blew it as a greedy GM, over valued him, missed the timing and basically got nothing in a face saving deal. 

 

We did NOTHING at the deadline. We should have moved Gorges, Pouliot, Nolan, Josefson, all the UFAs and we should have moved them for anything. 

We still have Lehner, we still have Moulson (I know), all we had to look forward to this year before the lottery was a glimmer of hope for the future with a good deadline house cleaning and we got a big bag of nothing. 

 

Well I guess we find out now if Kane was a cancer but that's about it. 

 

As to the first bolded:  it is impossible to know this.

 

As to the 2nd bolded:  why would any other NHL team give up anything for the bottom of the barrell on the 2nd-worst team in the NHL?

[Randall Flagg]

The small return on Kane, the fact that there wasn't any interest in Lehner, and the Sabres still being stuck with Bogo and Moulson just illustrates how disastrous Murray was as GM.

 

GMJB has his work cut out for him. Hopefully we can make some hockey trades this summer and get some lottery luck because we're in the middle of nowhere right now.

The only GM I'm mad at today is Murray, yup. 

[nfreeman]

The small return on Kane, the fact that there wasn't any interest in Lehner, and the Sabres still being stuck with Bogo and Moulson just illustrates how disastrous Murray was as GM.

 

GMJB has his work cut out for him. Hopefully we can make some hockey trades this summer and get some lottery luck because we're in the middle of nowhere right now.

 

Yes indeed.

[dejeanerret]

To get a 1st, 4th, and player, even if they are conditional, for a 20 game rental is a pretty solid haul.  

 

But one would have to wonder if the Bruins gave up that much for Nash (18 goals/10 assists/33 years old)  what would they have given up to Buffalo for Kane (20/20/26)? Especially getting a gtd first rounder.  The other players are meh.

 

The season is lost, but maybe the Bruins didn't want to deal within the division?  If I were the Sabres I wouldn't care since the assets I'm getting are for the future.

[PerreaultForever]

Do you have proof that GM had a better offer at a different time? It was pretty consistently reported that teams weren't interested in seriously talking about trading for Kane until the last few days. 

 

And did you see how many players that are about as good as those guys got waived yesterday? Nobody is trading for a bunch of ###### players so teams are waiving them. We are going to play ours to not disrupt Rochester. 

Proof? Oh come on man, nobody has proof of anything on a sports chat board. Let's not do that.

 

There is no way he couldn't have moved Kane for a true first (and probably a decent prospect) when Kane was on his hot streak right after the Duchene trade. That was the moment, but it was widely reported at that time that Botterill wanted a lot more than just a first and a good prospect. He blew it. 

[SDS]

Stupid anecdote from my personal life:

 

I totaled my car in December that had 168k on it. I would have never sold that car for under 10k. Geico offered $5400 and told me I could ask for more if I could justify it. Seems as though not a single sale or online valuation tool backed up my personal value on it. I settled for $5400 because that was the offer I had and it was time to move on.

[Randall Flagg]

To get a 1st, 4th, and player, even if they are conditional, for a 20 game rental is a pretty solid haul.  

 

But one would have to wonder if the Bruins gave up that much for Nash (18 goals/10 assists/33 years old)  what would they have given up to Buffalo for Kane (20/20/26)? Especially getting a gtd first rounder.  The other players are meh.

 

The season is lost, but maybe the Bruins didn't want to deal within the division?  If I were the Sabres I wouldn't care since the assets I'm getting are for the future.

Not sure I'd trade a 2nd next year for Beleskey's awful contract and a late first this year, so I'm not too worried about it. We have enough garbage eating our cap as it is.

[Radar]

Fans had Kane grossly overrated. He's a very talented hockey player who produce for maybe two and a half months this year, had some character questions, was a rental. The Sabres got a conditional 1st,a prospect and a 4th. I said earlier I expected a 2nd and a prospect so I guess I'm not disappointed because we got what I expected. This guy is no Rick Nash and those people who expected that return your fantasy hockey doesn't play in the real world.

[Gramps]

I think it really comes down to this, Kane was called a "greedy selfish player" and Botterill blew it as a greedy GM, over valued him, missed the timing and basically got nothing in a face saving deal. 

 

We did NOTHING at the deadline. We should have moved Gorges, Pouliot, Nolan, Josefson, all the UFAs and we should have moved them for anything. 

We still have Lehner, we still have Moulson (I know), all we had to look forward to this year before the lottery was a glimmer of hope for the future with a good deadline house cleaning and we got a big bag of nothing. 

 

Well I guess we find out now if Kane was a cancer but that's about it. 

 

Who was gonna take any of the guys listed above ? Healthy scratches are not a best seller at the deadline. We already knew there was no interest in Lehner.

[GASabresIUFAN]

So, how do you make a team offer more other than by saying "no"? Eventually he has to say yes to someone.

We’ll never know what was offered and when, but I suspect he had better offers days ago, probably a 2018 2nd and a decent prospect, similar to the Grabner deal, but he hoped a desperate team would give him the first he wanted. In the end, the offers dried up and he had to try to make lemonade from rotten lemons.

 

He took a major risk and failed.

Edited February 26, 2018 by GASabresIUFAN

[7+6=13]

I think if you list all the assets that were moved today and what they yielded in return, objectively you'd say Buffalo got very little

 

It's completely fair to raise the issue of WHY

 

Was it J BOT making a bad deal or was that the only deal out there

 

The committee in defense of this trade can only point to one reason, wait and see --- however, at this time, with the information we have in front of us, it's a bad deal

 

 

No Buffalo sports figure deserves the benefit of doubt anymore --- we all collectively gave it to GMTM and got burned, let's have J BOT EARN trust

 

He's not going to earn your trust because you presume that which you can't know.  You're the wait and see not those that are defending the trade.  I try not to get hung up on what I can't know and only what I do know.  

 

SJ offered this trade - JBot went to the other clubs and said I'm getting offered this, will you do better?  Other team(s) said no.  We trade Kane because that's his value to the other NHL teams.  How on earth could I pretend to know or get hung up on what I'd have to pretend to know what was offered 2 Months ago.  

[That Aud Smell]

As to the 2nd bolded:  why would any other NHL team give up anything for the bottom of the barrell on the 2nd-worst team in the NHL?

 

Indeed - there were better players available on waivers today.

 

Proof? Oh come on man, nobody has proof of anything on a sports chat board. Let's not do that.

 

There is no way he couldn't have moved Kane for a true first (and probably a decent prospect) when Kane was on his hot streak right after the Duchene trade. That was the moment, but it was widely reported at that time that Botterill wanted a lot more than just a first and a good prospect. He blew it. 

 

The idea that JBOTS should have traded Kane when he was tearing it up back in December is one that has some appeal to it.

 

But, again. We have no way of knowing whether JBOTS was getting better deals offered to him at that time. We just don't know. Maybe there'll be some leaks about how JBOTS missed the boat? I dunno. I feel like if he'd been offered an unconditional 2018 1st and a prospect in December, Kane would've been gone.

[Randall Flagg]

Proof? Oh come on man, nobody has proof of anything on a sports chat board. Let's not do that.

 

There is no way he couldn't have moved Kane for a true first (and probably a decent prospect) when Kane was on his hot streak right after the Duchene trade. That was the moment, but it was widely reported at that time that Botterill wanted a lot more than just a first and a good prospect. He blew it. 

You stated a claim with conviction and I asked for evidence, there is none. You're right that this is a message board, which is why we're discussing it. 

 

I completely disagree that there is no way he couldn't have done that. GM's don't have the attention spans of gnats. They were reported to not be interested then, because they know who Kane is, and hot streaks and cold streaks, especially over spans smaller than 30 games, are not going to move the value needle in the real world even if they have us fans frothing on message boards at the time.

[MattPie]

The only way J-Bot may have blown this was if a team offered significantly more at some point and he waited. Something none of us know.

[Randall Flagg]

We’ll never know what was offered and when, but I suspect he had better offers days ago, probably a 2018 2nd and a decent prospect, similar to the Grabner deal, but he hoped a desperate team would give him the first he wanted. In the end, the offers dried up and he had to try to make lemonade from rotten lemons.

 

He took a major risk and failed.

This assertion comes after you admit we'll never know. 

 

The big question we all have is why get upset over something you even state we have no way of knowing. You suspect that? I certainly don't and have no reason to. 

 

Especially when all reports indicated the exact opposite. While I agree twitter reporters suck, they are ALL we have, and they suggest the opposite of what you posit and then make hard conclusions about and get angry at.

Edited February 26, 2018 by Randall Flagg

[Radar]

Proof? Oh come on man, nobody has proof of anything on a sports chat board. Let's not do that.

 

There is no way he couldn't have moved Kane for a true first (and probably a decent prospect) when Kane was on his hot streak right after the Duchene trade. That was the moment, but it was widely reported at that time that Botterill wanted a lot more than just a first and a good prospect. He blew it.

 

Please apply for Botterill's job you obviously know more and please specify what you think offers we're missed out on. Arm chair bs.

[Trettioåtta]

The only way J-Bot may have blown this was if a team offered significantly more at some point and he waited. Something none of us know.

 

Not necessarily true, you can do things like take on cap or combine him with a highly touted but almost certain bust of a prospect to get more etc.

[7+6=13]

To get a 1st, 4th, and player, even if they are conditional, for a 20 game rental is a pretty solid haul.  

 

But one would have to wonder if the Bruins gave up that much for Nash (18 goals/10 assists/33 years old)  what would they have given up to Buffalo for Kane (20/20/26)? Especially getting a gtd first rounder.  The other players are meh.

 

The season is lost, but maybe the Bruins didn't want to deal within the division?  If I were the Sabres I wouldn't care since the assets I'm getting are for the future.

 

You're not paying attention because you don't paint the whole picture - only what consoles you.  They also had to take on salaries - something the Sabres absolutely should run from and they did.

[That Aud Smell]

Fans had Kane grossly overrated. He's a very talented hockey player who produce for maybe two and a half months this year, had some character questions, was a rental. The Sabres got a conditional 1st,a prospect and a 4th. I said earlier I expected a 2nd and a prospect so I guess I'm not disappointed because we got what I expected. This guy is no Rick Nash and those people who expected that return your fantasy hockey doesn't play in the real world.

 

This is about where I am. I thought the team would get a 2nd for him and a prospect/good young player. I'd hoped the 2nd would be in 2018, but whatever. They pushed it to 2019 on the hope it might be a 1st? Sure.

 

We’ll never know what was offered and when, but I suspect he had better offers days ago, probably a 2018 2nd and a decent prospect, similar to the Grabner deal, but he hoped a desperate team would give him the first he wanted. In the end, the offers dried up and he had to try to make lemonade from rotten lemons.

 

He took a major risk and failed.

 

:huh:

[PerreaultForever]

You stated a claim with conviction and I asked for evidence, there is none. You're right that this is a message board, which is why we're discussing it. 

 

I completely disagree that there is no way he couldn't have done that. GM's don't have the attention spans of gnats. They were reported to not be interested then, because they know who Kane is, and hot streaks and cold streaks, especially over spans smaller than 30 games, are not going to move the value needle in the real world even if they have us fans frothing on message boards at the time.

Well then you do something creative if you're a good GM, eat some cap for them, make it a multi player or multi team deal. You do SOMETHING.

 

There is nothing here on deadline day to give anyone even a glimmer of hope that this team will be in any way better next year after this deadline. Anything to build on. Anything. 

[That Aud Smell]

You're not paying attention because you don't paint the whole picture - only what consoles you.  They also had to take on salaries - something the Sabres absolutely should run from and they did.

 

The fact that the Sabres didn't take on bad money is something that's probably not getting enough consideration right now.

[darksabre]

Well then you do something creative if you're a good GM, eat some cap for them, make it a multi player or multi team deal. You do SOMETHING.

 

There is nothing here on deadline day to give anyone even a glimmer of hope that this team will be in any way better next year after this deadline. Anything to build on. Anything. 

I love this stuff. Like you know he didn't try any of those things.