Complaint Thursdays

[BuffaloSoldier2010]

Me and m'lady parted ways yesterday, but don't worry, I'm not going to get all suicidal.

 

I just need hockey season to start!

[biodork]

I'd like to complain about the fallacy that academia is an any way "cushy." If you're at a research institution, you will work far more than you will at any comparable non-academic job. And, (as you've figured out) if you're pre-tenure you have to deal with constant pressure to produce cutting edge research, get strong teaching ratings, keep your senior colleagues happy since they'll eventually be voting on whether you can stay or not...

 

... not to mention teaching is nowhere near as fun/rewarding as it sounds.

 

 

Sorry guy, but academia relative to most other endeavors is definitely "cushy."

 

Yes, working in a research lab for a university (major or minor) does result in long hours, but let's face it, a lot of those hours aren't necessarily terribly productive. Working in the real world might result in shorter hours (or it might not) but the pressure to produce whatever widget you make is much more direct. 'Production is down because of x, well get a replacement for x in here yesterday, so we can start making money again' is the refrain in the real world. 'You can't run y experiment because you don't have z? Well, go order another z, charge it to the yy budget, and get back to me in 2 weeks when it comes in' is only SLIGHTLY exaggerated. (Technically it should have been 'you can't run y experiment because you don't have z? Well, go order the parts you need to make a z, charge it to the yy budget, and get back to me in 3 weeks when the parts have come in and you've assembled the parts.')

 

There is pressure to produce in academia, but efficiency is not often highly valued. (Which if you are efficient can and does induce it's own stressors.) Yes, a proposal for a grant has a specific deadline, but it usually is known well in advance and there is ample time to get everything in order. Yes, there are other deadlines as well, but typically they are well known in advance and they can be met without pulling all-nighters (though oftentimes the all-nighter becomes part of the process). The pressure is rarely the same as it is in the real world.

 

Cushy is rarely related to the stress level of a job; it is far more often related to the amount of physical labor required, the immediate urgency of performing the task at hand, and the relative level of how much of the 'grunt' work can be avoided by passing it off to underlings or administrative staff. Academia is, when looked at this way, cushy. It also typically is quite stressful.

 

Remember, if it was FUN, they wouldn't call it WORK.

 

You both have valid points, but to Taro I will say (speaking as an academia underling) it's really not cushy at all if you aren't faculty, and sometimes even if you are. I love that I have flexible hours and a casual work environment, but the tradeoff is much lower pay than a job in the so-called "real world", and also the lack of job security that goes with having your job tied to research funding (which is currently abysmal). The established full professors are definitely sitting pretty, but any new faculty struggling to get started right now are most definitely not enjoying a stress-free job.

[Claude_Verret]

My complaint for today plus some.

 

Driving on my way in today I see 5 young female mallards on the side of the road waiting to cross. I slow down, put my flashers on, stop and they start walking (across a five lane road mind you). I'm the only one there until the light changes behind me. I'm stopped. With flashers on. I see traffic coming up from behind me. I literally hang out the window of my car while it's raining, arms flailing to get the cars to stop. What does Mr Numbnuts do? Comes by me doing 45 mph. Takes out the first duck. Not pretty. :angry: The rest of the cars on both sides of the median allow the rest to pass. Can't get the picture out of my head of that duck being run over. Or the other ducks looking back as they finished crossing. Guess you can't save 'em all. :cry:

 

People are a-holes. I had a very similar incident happen a few years ago outside of work, except it was geese not ducks. The roads are filled with selfish a-holes who display very little concern for their own safety never mind the rest of us who need to share the road with them. :censored:

[frissonic]

OK, not really a "complaint" (well, the complaint is in the not knowing...) For the last few weeks, a very attractive woman I see nearly every day in the cafeteria has been looking in my direction... a lot. I know this woman is married (and just had a child). I am no movie star (well, maybe a slightly taller, heavier version of Danny DeVito) and I really have no interest in any dalliance with married persons. So why the stares? Also, yesterday a perfectly lovely twenty-something walked past me on campus and out of the blue flashed a huge smile and said an excited "Hi!". I just turned 55 and unless someone is starting rumors that I won the lottery (I haven't), what the heck is going on? It took me 25 years to get used to attractive women ignoring me and now for some as-yet-unknown reason, I am suddenly attractive? I don't think so.... :blink:

gift horse ... mouth ...... B-)

[Claude_Verret]

Yeah, all of yours is far worse than mine. I just got scoped, so no screws or anything. And any type of eye surgery always seems like it would be the worst. Well, I'm thinking surgery below the belt would lead to some very uncomfortable times.

 

I've never had below the belt surgery, but I did suffer the idignity / pain of being catheterized on three ocassions before and after various surgeries. :death:

[Buffalo Wings]

My complaint for today plus some.

 

Driving on my way in today I see 5 young female mallards on the side of the road waiting to cross. I slow down, put my flashers on, stop and they start walking (across a five lane road mind you). I'm the only one there until the light changes behind me. I'm stopped. With flashers on. I see traffic coming up from behind me. I literally hang out the window of my car while it's raining, arms flailing to get the cars to stop. What does Mr Numbnuts do? Comes by me doing 45 mph. Takes out the first duck. Not pretty. :angry: The rest of the cars on both sides of the median allow the rest to pass. Can't get the picture out of my head of that duck being run over. Or the other ducks looking back as they finished crossing. Guess you can't save 'em all. :cry:

You are truly a saint, chz. Reminds me of a round of golf I played on a rainy day earlier this year - we're on the green that sits next to a pond and many of the baby frogs had jumped out of the water to hop around the green. They were the size of your fingertip (at most) and they weren't in our way at all, but some dolt in my foursome decides to smash one with his putter. Dude...really?

 

I know I'm about to start a fire flaming inferno with this, but I'm ticked off at PEF members for voting the contract down. I think my job is safe, but that vote just laid off almost 4,000 people statewide. Those who voted it down don't even care, either. It saves their own job and doesn't hurt their retirement. What's worse is that my agency is informing those affected via EMAIL. Seriously? At one other agency, at least the directors personally informed the employees of their fate face-to-face. Talk about lack of compassion....

[Cereal]

Sorry guy, but academia relative to most other endeavors is definitely "cushy."

 

Yes, working in a research lab for a university (major or minor) does result in long hours, but let's face it, a lot of those hours aren't necessarily terribly productive. Working in the real world might result in shorter hours (or it might not) but the pressure to produce whatever widget you make is much more direct. 'Production is down because of x, well get a replacement for x in here yesterday, so we can start making money again' is the refrain in the real world. 'You can't run y experiment because you don't have z? Well, go order another z, charge it to the yy budget, and get back to me in 2 weeks when it comes in' is only SLIGHTLY exaggerated. (Technically it should have been 'you can't run y experiment because you don't have z? Well, go order the parts you need to make a z, charge it to the yy budget, and get back to me in 3 weeks when the parts have come in and you've assembled the parts.')

 

There is pressure to produce in academia, but efficiency is not often highly valued. (Which if you are efficient can and does induce it's own stressors.) Yes, a proposal for a grant has a specific deadline, but it usually is known well in advance and there is ample time to get everything in order. Yes, there are other deadlines as well, but typically they are well known in advance and they can be met without pulling all-nighters (though oftentimes the all-nighter becomes part of the process). The pressure is rarely the same as it is in the real world.

 

Cushy is rarely related to the stress level of a job; it is far more often related to the amount of physical labor required, the immediate urgency of performing the task at hand, and the relative level of how much of the 'grunt' work can be avoided by passing it off to underlings or administrative staff. Academia is, when looked at this way, cushy. It also typically is quite stressful.

 

Remember, if it was FUN, they wouldn't call it WORK.

Taro -- see biodork's post, she hit the nail on the head. The only parts of academia that are any cushier than a job of similar qualification in the "real world" (industry) are the potentially flexible hours and relaxed work environment. And these two benefits are awesome! I will miss the flexible hours, personally. But, add in the increased stress, hours/week, and all the stupid political crap. I think the pressure of deadlines, etc. you mentioned is very often greater than in the real world. Not sure of your experience in academia...

 

I suspect that it depends on how strong the research institution, as CO stated; I'm sure there are less stressful positions and concentrations to be found in academia. You can be in the right OR wrong position in academia, and you can be in the right OR wrong position in industry.

 

My $0.02...

[frissonic]

so, part of my team has been tasked to complete a "gap study." it's not nearly as fun as it sounds. at all. in fact, whatever the complete opposite of fun is, that's how you can label this study.

 

in short, i have to read through about 700 test procedures that were drafted by our engineering team, written in engineer-speak, and determine what gaps there are between what's in our operation/maintenance and testing procedures and what the next group will need when performing these procedures.

 

a) i have no idea what 90% of these TPs are designed to test, so ... yah.

b) the assumed reading level of "the next group" that's inheriting our maintenance level is approximately 9th grade. now ... you tell me how i'm supposed to distill engineering dialog down to something a 14 year old can understand.

 

some days, i really love my job and can't wait to come in to work. this is not one of those days. nor will any day next week. or ... all of october. or november. or the rest of 2011 and a good portion of 2012.

 

on the plus side, hooray for employment.

[MattPie]

b) the assumed reading level of "the next group" that's inheriting our maintenance level is approximately 9th grade. now ... you tell me how i'm supposed to distill engineering dialog down to something a 14 year old can understand.

 

I dated a technical editor for a long time. I thought that just meant you couldn't use works like "indefatigably". The logic could be convoluted as you like. :) (She needed to edit software manuals down to a sixth-grade level for non-native English speakers)

[Taro T]

I'm not quite sure why, but this post really bothers me. I think it's the use of the term "real" world.

 

I'm in the "real" world and don't stress like that. But put me in front of 30 teenagers for 7 hours a day and I can gaurantee I'll be bat-$#!t crazy in a week.

 

Unless you're a farmer, homebuilder, make clothing and to a lesser extent automaker(EDIT:I'm sure there are others, but nobodody actually needs a 4G Iphone or 50 inch plazma), is anyone actually in the "real" world?

We weren't really discussing highschool teachers. The discussion was more about academic research.

 

I worked in "the real world" (your terminology) for over a decade and I do quite a bit of "real world" consulting currently. But, those who say that academic jobs at Tier I research institutions are cushy almost invariably have never tried their hand at it. That is my point. We mock that which we do not understand. Hence the complaint in my original post (since this is "complaint Thursday") :D

 

You both have valid points, but to Taro I will say (speaking as an academia underling) it's really not cushy at all if you aren't faculty, and sometimes even if you are. I love that I have flexible hours and a casual work environment, but the tradeoff is much lower pay than a job in the so-called "real world", and also the lack of job security that goes with having your job tied to research funding (which is currently abysmal). The established full professors are definitely sitting pretty, but any new faculty struggling to get started right now are most definitely not enjoying a stress-free job.

 

Taro -- see biodork's post, she hit the nail on the head. The only parts of academia that are any cushier than a job of similar qualification in the "real world" (industry) are the potentially flexible hours and relaxed work environment. And these two benefits are awesome! I will miss the flexible hours, personally. But, add in the increased stress, hours/week, and all the stupid political crap. I think the pressure of deadlines, etc. you mentioned is very often greater than in the real world. Not sure of your experience in academia...

 

I suspect that it depends on how strong the research institution, as CO stated; I'm sure there are less stressful positions and concentrations to be found in academia. You can be in the right OR wrong position in academia, and you can be in the right OR wrong position in industry.

 

My $0.02...

1st off, I understand academic jobs at Tier I institutions fairly well. Both my wife and I have spent several years within that world. (Graduate school, work in corporate research departments, work in academic research departments; between the 2 of us, we've got that nut pretty well cracked.)

 

I absolutely agree with all 3 of you that it can be a very stressful environment to work in. Thus my previous comments.

 

There is pressure to produce in academia, but efficiency is not often highly valued. (Which if you are efficient can and does induce it's own stressors.) ...

 

... It also typically is quite stressful.

 

That stated however, in light of the terms that most non-academicians would use, it would be considered cushy. :P

 

So are we now at the point where I'm complaining about you complaining about my complaint towards CO's original complaint in the complaint thread? I think that's where we're at, but I'm not positive. (It's late in the day and I've felt like crud all day.) I'm wondering how many more iterations we can get to before this becomes an XC sort of distraction from the point of this thread?

 

PS for BD. I should actually get a chance to read that article this weekend. Thanks.

[biodork]

PS for BD. I should actually get a chance to read that article this weekend. Thanks.

 

You're welcome! And no offense intended by any comments... I just get a little frustrated when people make it sound like a University job and/or being in school is so much easier than doing something else, because there are positives and negatives about every job, and school is not automatically the easier path. As with everything in life, there are many, many, shades of grey.

 

/off rant :)

[shrader]

OK, not really a "complaint" (well, the complaint is in the not knowing...) For the last few weeks, a very attractive woman I see nearly every day in the cafeteria has been looking in my direction... a lot. I know this woman is married (and just had a child). I am no movie star (well, maybe a slightly taller, heavier version of Danny DeVito) and I really have no interest in any dalliance with married persons. So why the stares? Also, yesterday a perfectly lovely twenty-something walked past me on campus and out of the blue flashed a huge smile and said an excited "Hi!". I just turned 55 and unless someone is starting rumors that I won the lottery (I haven't), what the heck is going on? It took me 25 years to get used to attractive women ignoring me and now for some as-yet-unknown reason, I am suddenly attractive? I don't think so.... :blink:

 

Well just how much do you look like Danny DeVito? He's a pretty funny guy.

[frissonic]

I dated a technical editor for a long time. I thought that just meant you couldn't use works like "indefatigably". The logic could be convoluted as you like. :) (She needed to edit software manuals down to a sixth-grade level for non-native English speakers)

Yah, I'm in a similar position. Technical writer. For this particular gig, we are required to write to an assumed 9th grade reading level. No lie, pictures are preferred for as many procedure steps as possible. Line drawings, photos, screen shots ... whatever. SOMEthing to show the user what it is they need to do.

 

To be fair though, while I find the TP reading boring as hell, I really do enjoy the overall job and company ... it's just that my last project was ending and I was next up in the queue for assignment. I drew "the short straw."

 

Like I said, I'm happy to be employed. Can't argue that.

[FogBat]

My complaint for today plus some.

 

Driving on my way in today I see 5 young female mallards on the side of the road waiting to cross. I slow down, put my flashers on, stop and they start walking (across a five lane road mind you). I'm the only one there until the light changes behind me. I'm stopped. With flashers on. I see traffic coming up from behind me. I literally hang out the window of my car while it's raining, arms flailing to get the cars to stop. What does Mr Numbnuts do? Comes by me doing 45 mph. Takes out the first duck. Not pretty. :angry: The rest of the cars on both sides of the median allow the rest to pass. Can't get the picture out of my head of that duck being run over. Or the other ducks looking back as they finished crossing. Guess you can't save 'em all. :cry:

I'm with you there. It is sick and disgusting how some people have an IDGAF attitude over such animals. Just because I tilt to the right doesn't mean that I have no feelings toward them. To me, they're another majestic display of God's creation.

 

It's another thing altogether when an animal runs out in front of me when I'm doing 65 and I'm loaded to the hilt. I can't just swerve to miss that thing. (Happened to me a few years ago when I was near Bristol, Tennessee when a woodchuck ran right out in front of me. You don't have to ask who won.) It can take me up to 6-8 football fields to stop, and even longer if I'm going downhill. At any rate, animals don't think like humans do. Their sense of danger awareness is much different from ours. If they want to cross the road without thinking that they're about to get flattened, they'll do it.

[darksabre]

My complaint for today plus some.

 

Driving on my way in today I see 5 young female mallards on the side of the road waiting to cross. I slow down, put my flashers on, stop and they start walking (across a five lane road mind you). I'm the only one there until the light changes behind me. I'm stopped. With flashers on. I see traffic coming up from behind me. I literally hang out the window of my car while it's raining, arms flailing to get the cars to stop. What does Mr Numbnuts do? Comes by me doing 45 mph. Takes out the first duck. Not pretty. :angry: The rest of the cars on both sides of the median allow the rest to pass. Can't get the picture out of my head of that duck being run over. Or the other ducks looking back as they finished crossing. Guess you can't save 'em all. :cry:

 

In the truck driver's defense, I probably would have done the same. Not on purpose, mind you, but if I see a car parked in a lane with its flashers on, I'm just going to go around it. He probably just thought you were some nut and by the time the ducks entered his sight line it was too late. Chalk it up to "sh*t happens."

 

That said, I hate when people stop for geese and just wait for them to cross. Baby ducks? Fine. But an ambling line of geese is a simple problem. Little known fact, but if you drive slowly into them, they will get out of the way. Mainly because fight or flight response is rather effective.

[FogBat]

People are a-holes. I had a very similar incident happen a few years ago outside of work, except it was geese not ducks. The roads are filled with selfish a-holes who display very little concern for their own safety never mind the rest of us who need to share the road with them. :censored:

After looking at your current location, I've noticed that a lot of people in North Carolina have some really bad driving habits. It's really bad around the Charlotte area, especially during rush hour - no matter what part of the metro area I go through.

 

Now, I mentioned something on this thread that I was looking to get that home daily job as an assistant fleet manager with my current company. I got the word yesterday that they found someone else for the position. My fleet manager told me that they hired from the outside and that this guy already had terminal experience. So much for trying to come off the road. Maybe some other time.

[spndnchz]

In the truck driver's defense, I probably would have done the same. Not on purpose, mind you, but if I see a car parked in a lane with its flashers on, I'm just going to go around it. He probably just thought you were some nut and by the time the ducks entered his sight line it was too late. Chalk it up to "sh*t happens."

 

That said, I hate when people stop for geese and just wait for them to cross. Baby ducks? Fine. But an ambling line of geese is a simple problem. Little known fact, but if you drive slowly into them, they will get out of the way. Mainly because fight or flight response is rather effective.

 

It wasn't a truck it was a car. The dude was looking at me waving out my car window yelling STOP!

 

Still can't get that sound or thought out of my head. I'm damaged.

[FogBat]

It wasn't a truck it was a car. The dude was looking at me waving out my car window yelling STOP!

 

Still can't get that sound or thought out of my head. I'm damaged.

I'm sorry you're going through this, chz.

[spndnchz]

I'm sorry you're going through this, chz.

 

Dude didn't even stop. Just kept going. ###### ######.

[darksabre]

It wasn't a truck it was a car. The dude was looking at me waving out my car window yelling STOP!

 

Still can't get that sound or thought out of my head. I'm damaged.

 

Ah, saw duck and my brain read truck.

 

Like I said, I probably would have just looked at you funny and then not seen the ducks.

 

Sorry you had to witness that though. It's not a good feeling. I've hit animals before (only in a minivan I once owned, which I'm convinced was because it was possessed), and it never feels good. That thunk on the big plastic bumper was awful. I'm glad that car is dead. I haven't hit another animal since then.

[LGR4GM]

Dude didn't even stop. Just kept going. ###### ######.

gosh damn flyer's fans are a menace!

[Andrew Amerk]

What a great idea! I bet the owner of your company is behind that!

 

Haha. Who knows. It just kinda depressing to see an item in there for $3. All items in that machine should be less than a buck.

[Eleven]

Married chick keeps calling me for "da bang." Not my fault she married older (25+years difference) for money (she did) and there's NO way I'm breaking the sanctity of that vow (her vow not mine).

 

The calls start at about midnight.

 

Three times weekly.

 

And she's hot.

 

Dammit.

 

EDIT: Yes, I have said no. And again, and again. Damn this temptress!

[5th line wingnutt]

I enjoy this thread but I am a pretty happy guy. My complaints are so minor I can not see posting here.

[SwampD]

Dude didn't even stop. Just kept going. ###### ######.

Now I want wings.