Could this be 2005/06 all over again?

[dudacek]

I think most of the conversation around here seems to be about whether the Sabres did enough to make the playoffs this year.

I'd like to see some conversation to about whether the Sabres have enough pieces in place to break out and become a contending team.

What are the differences between this years Sabres and the Sabres of 2005/06? Both teams are loaded with young players breaking in together on the verge of breaking out. Both teams are coming off a year where they missed the playoffs, but showed signs down the stretch. Neither team made significant veteran additions, but sprinkled in a big checking forward late the previous season and added a few judicious pieces on defence in the off-season. Both teams had uncertainty in goal.

Can this edition of the Sabres follow in that edition's footsteps?

For reference, Forwards:

• Tage Briere
• Tuch Dumont
• Skinner Max
• Cozens Drury
• Mitts Connolly
• Okposo Hecht
• Krebs Roy
• Quinn Vanek
• Peterka Pominville
• Greenway Grier
• Olofsson Kotalik
• Girgensons Gaustad
• Jost Mair
• Rousek Pyatt
• Kulich Paille

Defence

• Dahlin Campbell
• Power Tallinder
• Samuelsson McKee
• Clifton Lydman
• Jokiharju Kalinin
• Johnson Numminen
• Stillman Fitzpatrick

Goalie

• Levi Miller
• Comrie Biron
• Luukkonen Noronen

Edited September 10, 2023 by dudacek

[Marvin]

There are some big differences that favour the 2005-6 team:

1. Miller was older than Levi.

2. Drury has won a Cup.

3. The 2005-6 team was a more veteran team, particularly on defence.

[dudacek]

4 minutes ago, Marvin said:

There are some big differences that favour the 2005-6 team:

1. Miller was older than Levi.

2. Drury has won a Cup.

3. The 2005-6 team was a more veteran team, particularly on defence.

#1 is mostly about experience, I assume? Miller had played 11 more NHL games than Levi. He was 4 years older and 160 AHL games under his belt.

#2 Drury had played 80 playoff games. Hecht 27 and McKee 35. Numminen had played 54 but had never won a playoff series. That was the extent of that team's playoff experience. Erik Johnson has won a cup and played 55 playoff games. Alex Tuch has been to the finals and played 66. Connor Cilfton has also been to the finals and played 46. Tyson Jost has 46 playoff games, Kyle Okposo has 24.

#3: In terms of games played, it's not as different as you might think

• Johnson 920 Numminen 1160
• Dahlin 355 McKee 460
• Jokiharju 273 Lydman 289
• Clifton 232 Kalinin 273
• Samuelsson 109 Campbell 187
• Power 87 Tallinder 120

 

 

 

 

 

[Wyldnwoody44]

Ruff vs Granato 

 

Not sure how to compare, but I think that's a point worth talking about. 

[nfreeman]

@dudacek I freaking love your preseason work but holy jinx potential Batman.  Shouldn't we be keeping our heads down and not tempting the hockey gods, a few of whom are probably still PO'd at us for Black Sunday and the tank?

2005-06 was an incredible gift.  Now we're going to have a bunch of message board yobs proclaiming that they're expecting it to happen again?

We're asking for trouble.

[ddaryl]

All I consider right now is the trend. Since Adams and Granato took the reigns we have been trending north, and I full expect that to continue

IF...   We reverse the trend this season then I'll lose some faith, 

UNTIL THEN... Onwards and Upwards

[dudacek]

20 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

@dudacek I freaking love your preseason work but holy jinx potential Batman.  Shouldn't we be keeping our heads down and not tempting the hockey gods, a few of whom are probably still PO'd at us for Black Sunday and the tank?

2005-06 was an incredible gift.  Now we're going to have a bunch of message board yobs proclaiming that they're expecting it to happen again?

We're asking for trouble.

Not by the way is poll is going.

I was hoping for a little more discussion around the similarities and differences  but maybe you've got the right of it.

[#freejame]

I think the biggest thing about the 05-06 team was the amount that played together the year before on the Calder Cup team. We don’t have anything quite like that. That’s what always stuck with me about the post lockout year. 

[dudacek]

3 minutes ago, #freejame said:

I think the biggest thing about the 05-06 team was the amount that played together the year before on the Calder Cup team. We don’t have anything quite like that. That’s what always stuck with me about the post lockout year. 

Roy, Vanek Pominville, Miller, Gaustad...? Also had a few guys who were spot players for the Sabres the next year like Paille.

Does anyone remember that was only a nine-game playoff run? I didn't.

The 21/22 Amerks had Quinn Peterka, Krebs, Samuelsson, Rousek and UPL.

They went on a 10-game run.

[MattPie]

No one is going to be surprised if the Sabres are really good this year. That was the magic with 2005-06 to me.

[Flashsabre]

Funny you make this comparison.

I was thinking the other day is Boston facing our 07 situation. Their top 2 centres walking out the door together:

Bergeron, Krejci- Briere, Drury 

The Sabres still had good pieces but those 2 loses were too much.

Boston still have solid pieces but it will be impossible for them to replace what those two meant to the team as players and leaders.

Edited September 11, 2023 by Flashsabre

[bob_sauve28]

I don't like comparisons like this, but this team just seems to me ready to take off. They have talent all through the line up, they have chemistry and if they stay healthy should have a good campaign 

[PromoTheRobot]

No one saw 05/06 coming. Expectations were pretty low that season. They were enveloped in chaos.

[...]

12 hours ago, Wyldnwoody44 said:

Ruff vs Granato 

 

Not sure how to compare, but I think that's a point worth talking about. 

If we're going to talk about this topic, this is perhaps the most important point to talk about.

After hearing Vanek, Peters, Rivet and Connolly talk about what Ruff was like during that time, you'd have to think Ruff has the edge in strategy especially since we haven't seen Meatballs really get tested in that department. However, I think Meatballs has the respect of the team much more than Ruff and communicates with them far better.

I recognize there is a percentage on this board who dismiss 'the intangibles" but no matter how you slice up the hockey world (and leadership generally), qualities like "character," "compassion," "respect," and "positivity" among many others are heavily weighted. Ruff, in that period, by all accounts ranked low in the intangibles.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nhl/top-five-candidates-for-the-2023-24-jack-adams-award/ar-AA1gvNu3

https://www.usahockeymagazine.com/article/2009-10/what-makes-great-coach

https://hockeytraining.com/great-coach/

https://www.hockeyskillstraining.com/how-character-helps-you-advance-in-hockey/

 

Edited September 11, 2023 by ...
ah

[GASabresIUFAN]

We won't be going from worst to first, but if Levi plays as well as Miller did that season we'll have a great season.

[SwampD]

dudacek, what is your vote?

I think it's going to happen only because I am all in on Levi.

... and F the hockey gods.

[dudacek]

14 minutes ago, ... said:

If we're going to talk about this topic, this is perhaps the most important point to talk about.

After hearing Vanek, Peters, Rivet and Connolly talk about what Ruff was like during that time, you'd have to think Ruff has the edge in strategy especially since we haven't seen Meatballs really get tested in that department. However, I think Meatballs has the respect of the team much more than Ruff and communicates with them far better.

I recognize there is percentage on this board who dismiss 'the intangibles" but no matter how you slice up the hockey world (and leadership generally), qualities like "character," "compassion," "respect," and "positivity" among many others are heavily weighted. Ruff, in that period, by all accounts ranked low in the intangibles.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nhl/top-five-candidates-for-the-2023-24-jack-adams-award/ar-AA1gvNu3

https://www.usahockeymagazine.com/article/2009-10/what-makes-great-coach

https://hockeytraining.com/great-coach/

https://www.hockeyskillstraining.com/how-character-helps-you-advance-in-hockey/

 

I think Lindy was a product of his era and experiences 20 years ago, and isn’t the same coach today that he was then. I think he was very strong on tactics and strategy then, but was also a good leader as defined by the times.

I think there is no doubt Don is an excellent leader as defined by modern times. I’d sure as hell work for him. Tactically, I love the style he preaches. It remains to be seen whether he is a good game manager, and whether our flaws in our own end are tied to his system, or the learning curve of his players.

 

Edited September 11, 2023 by dudacek

[dudacek]

4 minutes ago, SwampD said:

dudacek, what is your vote?

I think it's going to happen only because I am all in on Levi.

... and F the hockey gods.

I’m waiting for the discussion to play out before voting.

But if the Levi/Miller parallel holds up the way I think it will, and Clifton, Greenway and Johnson do what they’ve been acquired to do, I think the pieces are there.

I think we’re going to be good.

Edited September 11, 2023 by dudacek

[B-U-F-F-A-L-O]

On 9/10/2023 at 1:52 PM, dudacek said:

I think most of the conversation around here seems to be about whether the Sabres did enough to make the playoffs this year.

I'd like to see some conversation to about whether the Sabres have enough pieces in place to break out and become a contending team.

What are the differences between this years Sabres and the Sabres of 2005/06? Both teams are loaded with young players breaking in together on the verge of breaking out. Both teams are coming off a year where they missed the playoffs, but showed signs down the stretch. Neither team made significant veteran additions, but sprinkled in a big checking forward late the previous season and added a few judicious pieces on defence in the off-season. Both teams had uncertainty in goal.

Can this edition of the Sabres follow in that edition's footsteps?

For reference, Forwards:

• Tage Briere
• Tuch Dumont
• Skinner Max
• Cozens Drury
• Mitts Connolly
• Okposo Hecht
• Krebs Roy
• Quinn Vanek
• Peterka Pominville
• Greenway Grier
• Olofsson Kotalik
• Girgensons Gaustad
• Jost Mair
• Rousek Pyatt
• Kulich Paille

Defence

• Dahlin Campbell
• Power Tallinder
• Samuelsson McKee
• Clifton Lydman
• Jokiharju Kalinin
• Johnson Numminen
• Stillman Fitzpatrick

Goalie

• Levi Miller
• Comrie Biron
• Luukkonen Noronen

I say that if isn’t this year,it’s most definitely next season. It sez here the Amerks bring home the Calder this year and that many from that championship team force their way onto the Sabres and then this ultra fast, ultra talented team next year blows the doors of the playoffs and actually go deep. 
Next season’s third line will be exactly like a 2nd first line and will always pressure their opponent. The fourth line will be like a typical third line and the defense will be like a dark forest both in size and mystic.

 

Go Sabres!

[Taro T]

On 9/11/2023 at 1:24 PM, PromoTheRobot said:

No one saw 05/06 coming. Expectations were pretty low that season. They were enveloped in chaos.

A 110+ point season, yes, nobody expected that.

A 100+ point season and being back in the playoffs, some saw that.

 

Would be really cool if it happens again.  But doubt it does this season.  (Doesn't mean it CAN'T, just that it likely won't.)  The East is a lot stronger and deeper today than it was that magical season nearly 20 years ago.

[Mango]

The pressure chamber for the Bills has been so heavy that one thing I love about the Sabres right now is that there is none. It’s a lot of fun. 
 

After the Monday Night game I am really looking forward to hockey. 

[Night Train]

A little early but I like the positive thinking. I just want to reach the post season first before dreaming big. 

[PromoTheRobot]

Quote

 

12 hours ago, Taro T said:

A 110+ point season, yes, nobody expected that.

A 100+ point season and being back in the playoffs, some saw that.

Wasn't 05/06 the season after the lockout? I don't recall anyone having any positive feelings about the Sabres. 

They missed the playoffs by 7 points in 03/04. Last place (5th) in the Northeast division. They were a ward of the NHL before Tom Golisano bought them, and he ran the team on a strict budget. Not to mention people were getting tired of the combo of Ruff and Regier.

So again, what positives were there to indicate a 100+ point season? Didn't RJ's classic call "These guys are good...Scary good!" come from the fact that no one expected the Sabres to be that good?

 

On another topic, did you know this came out of the 04/05 lockout? From Wikipedia:

Quote

On February 7, 2006, a settlement was reached in which the (Stanley Cup) trophy could be awarded to non-NHL teams in the event the league does not operate for a season, but the dispute lasted so long that, by the time it was settled, the NHL had resumed operating for the 2005–06 season, and the Stanley Cup went unclaimed for the 2004–05 season.[8]

 

Edited September 13, 2023 by PromoTheRobot

[mjd1001]

One similarity to the 05-06 campaing:

The previous season the Sabres (of course) did not make the playoffs, but had a young team.  3 of the top 5 teams in the league the season played previously were Boston, Tampa, and Toronto.  Buffalo would pass them, as they either had major changes to their rosters and/or an aging team.

[shrader]

46 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Wasn't 05/06 the season after the lockout? I don't recall anyone having any positive feelings about the Sabres. 

They missed the playoffs by 7 points in 03/04. Last place (5th) in the Northeast division. They were a ward of the NHL before Tom Golisano bought them, and he ran the team on a strict budget. Not to mention people were getting tired of the combo of Ruff and Regier.

So again, what positives were there to indicate a 100+ point season? Didn't RJ's classic call "These guys are good...Scary good!" come from the fact that no one expected the Sabres to be that good?

That 03-04 team scored a lot of goals, if my counting is correct, 10th most in the league.  I do remember there being some good vibes coming from that at the end of the season.  Of course, the lockout destroyed that.

 

On 9/10/2023 at 4:52 PM, dudacek said:

 

• Greenway Grier

Oh sure, group together to two big physical forwards who played 3 years at BU.

Seriously though, I hope he can be this team's Mike Grier.  I absolutely loved the guy.  I'm guessing I'm one of very few who have that jersey.