GDT Montreal at Buffalo Sabres 7pm ET 10-25-2018

[Doohickie]

10 minutes ago, Mustache of God said:

IF (never would happen) but if Edmonton put McDavid on the market, the return would be insane for him (players, picks, prospects) think the O'Reilly trade but on steroids. I imagine a blockbuster trade with him would have 3 or more teams involved, pretty much the biggest trade in the history of the NHL?

I'd argue that Edmonton would be a stronger team with the return from McDavid, having better talent up & down their line-up making the team more competitive. Right now Edmonton is the McDavid show and that's why they still suck, because hockey is a team game and one player can't do it all.

Look no further than the Eric Lindros trade.  Philly gave their entire prospect pool up for one elite prospect.  Quebec/Colorado rode the players they got in that trade to multiple Stanley Cups while Philly made the Finals once (I think... I'd have to look it up).  But Philly never won a Cup with Lindros.

When we were bumming about the tank and the prospect of moving Jack came up, I was actually receptive to that for the same reason:  A bunch of pretty good players > one great player.  Vegas showed that in their run to the Finals last year.  Even this year, we're seeing contributions from Sobotka and Berglund that don't show up on the score sheet but the result is that we're not losing games with our third and fourth lines.  Everyone says the ROR trade shored up our bottom six.  Trade someone like McDavid or Eichel and you're going to improve your top six (eventually... once the prospects gained mature).

[WildCard]

16 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I'm not putting up with you.  I've just got Points for Abusive Behavior for the way I reacted to you earlier and decided I don't want to be "that guy" anymore.  ?

What in the hell is this?

[Doohickie]

Apparently the prelude to getting suspended or banned.

My plan is that it dies of old age.

[Doohickie]

(I'm the inspiration for Rule #2 in the original post of this thread.)

[Eleven]

I don't know why there's so much O'Reilly talk in a GDT, but for what it's worth:

1.  I'm not buying the idea that he was bad for the dressing room.

2.  I don't think the Sabres got a great return for him.  I think Flagg's evaluation of the players received is right on.

3.  I think the day will come when we will miss his scoring and possibly even his quiet leadership.

[WildCard]

3 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I don't know why there's so much O'Reilly talk in a GDT, but for what it's worth:

1.  I'm not buying the idea that he was bad for the dressing room.

2.  I don't think the Sabres got a great return for him.  I think Flagg's evaluation of the players received is right on.

3.  I think the day will come when we will miss his scoring and possibly even his quiet leadership.

1) Disagreed

2) Agreed

3) Disagreed; his scoring isn't going anywhere but down, and his leadership on all accounts wasn't great. We might miss his overall play, but I doubt it will be that impactful. 

[LGR4GM]

9 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I don't know why there's so much O'Reilly talk in a GDT, but for what it's worth:

1.  I'm not buying the idea that he was bad for the dressing room.

2.  I don't think the Sabres got a great return for him.  I think Flagg's evaluation of the players received is right on.

3.  I think the day will come when we will miss his scoring and possibly even his quiet leadership.

Something was up with the dressing room and his quiet leadership wasn't fixing it.

I agree with you on the return. I don't think Tage is currently the prospect we should have targeted. 

We will always miss his scoring but I think it gives other players the opportunity to take up that scoring. I don't believe in his leadership. 

[IKnowPhysics]

1 hour ago, WildCard said:

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Andrew Amerk said:

My eyesight might be terrible...who is the coach on the bench that had zero reaction?

Also, love Hutton’s reaction. 

 

Steve Smith don't give a *****, his job's not done.  Even after the choreographed arm pump of Housley and Payne.

 

George Babcock looks like he's about to throw Rich Stinziano off the bench in the next frame.

[jsb]

42 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I'm not putting up with you.  I've just got Points for Abusive Behavior for the way I reacted to you earlier and decided I don't want to be "that guy" anymore.  ?

 

25 minutes ago, WildCard said:

What in the hell is this?

Dude, do you not read my GDT posts???? Here I am trying to live up to your past inspiring GDT's and you don't even read mine?? My feelings are forever more hurt. ???

Remember GDT rules

1. No acne jokes
2. No telling Mr. Flagg to STF..... you know the rest
3. Logo hate was grandfathered into the rules so that's ok
4. Please look for previous made GDT's before posting yours 
5. Must Win
6. LETS GO BUFFALO

Edited October 26, 2018 by jsb

[Doohickie]

Yeah, you think that just came out of the ether?

[PASabreFan]

31 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Apparently the prelude to getting suspended or banned.

My plan is that it dies of old age.

It's always there, a stain, a blot, a scar. It's the permanent record we were warned about as school boys. You'll never work in this town again. At least only you can see your rapsheet.

[sabills]

30 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

(I'm the inspiration for Rule #2 in the original post of this thread.)

Well its nice to have a legacy

[That Aud Smell]

5 hours ago, sabills said:

So I'm still not 100% on the ROR trade, dude has skills and there's no denying that he's a great center, but last year when they go down two different times there's no way they come back from it. This game they looked unphased. I'm sure there's a variety of reasons for that, including just having more skill, and having more confidence because they KNOW they have more skill. But it does make me wonder if that negativity from O'Reilly really did have a true negative effect on them.

Is this the first time ROR came up in this GDT?

I feel partly responsible because, early this morning, I just dropped a lil' note in the Around the NHL thread about STL's record.

1 hour ago, Randall Flagg said:

Asking for the human mechanism for what differentiates comebacks this year from comebacks driven by ROR in previous years, as has been asserted happens in this thread, is not sticking to stats.

Asking for discrepancies that are being plucked out where adding in all of the information we have completely wipes them out, is not burying my nose in spreadsheets and being cold and callous and ignorant of the fact that all humans have problems.  

Are we obliged to do so? Is anyone?

58 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

But it was brought up in that context in this thread, and when I look at this team, that team, "attitude," "comebacks," the picture doesn't support that, as I tried to flesh out. 

I do appreciate your kind words, and the other posters for putting up with me. 

You are more than alright, fella. I think there is a lot of truth in what you've extrapolated. I think there's also some truth in the team being in a better mindset (albeit not as strong on the ice, by the numbers) with ROR on another team. I've heard a few stories -- 2 to be precise, actually -- about ROR and his time with the Sabres. Not really stories, even. Just ... characterizations, overviews. I think there's something there.

Now. It's very much a fair question of whether the benefits of moving on from that are outweighed by the disadvantages of losing such an effective hockey player.

It's a bit like a study I once read (because reasons) about child-bearing women who were eating a good amount of fish with high levels of mercury and maybe it was also PCBs in them. The study's authors went in assuming that the data would come out one way. But it wound up sorta mixed. Apparently because fish is really, really good for you.

[sabills]

27 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I don't know why there's so much O'Reilly talk in a GDT, but for what it's worth:

1.  I'm not buying the idea that he was bad for the dressing room.

2.  I don't think the Sabres got a great return for him.  I think Flagg's evaluation of the players received is right on.

3.  I think the day will come when we will miss his scoring and possibly even his quiet leadership.

Sorry about that, I got this sh!t show started

5 hours ago, sabills said:

So I'm still not 100% on the ROR trade, dude has skills and there's no denying that he's a great center, but last year when they go down two different times there's no way they come back from it. This game they looked unphased. I'm sure there's a variety of reasons for that, including just having more skill, and having more confidence because they KNOW they have more skill. But it does make me wonder if that negativity from O'Reilly really did have a true negative effect on them.

 

 

[IKnowPhysics]

45 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I'm not putting up with you.  I've just got Points for Abusive Behavior for the way I reacted to you earlier and decided I don't want to be "that guy" anymore.  ?

Haaaaa. Welcome to the club finally.  You're not the first and you won't be the last.  I have two strikes and a brief ban from a couple years back because nfreeman didn't like that neither the word dick nor compound words with dick as the root word were being caught by the profanity filter.

 

ProTip tho: if Flagg is really stepping on your nuts, put him on ignore.  No shame in that.  Then when you opt into reading his posts, it's nobody's fault but your own.  You'll realize that and respond negatively muuuccch less.

Disclosure: Flagg is not on my ignore list.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

24 minutes ago, IKnowPhysics said:

 

 

Steve Smith don't give a *****, his job's not done.  Even after the choreographed arm pump of Housley and Payne.

 

George Babcock looks like he's about to throw Rich Stinziano off the bench in the next frame.

Is that a box they have set up for the little guy to stand on, or is it just a shadow?

[IKnowPhysics]

Just now, N S said:

Is that a box they have set up for the little guy to stand on, or is it just a shadow?

Good question.  No.  It's the lexan cover for the video monitors in the bench floor (there's one or two of them).  That's what the coaches watch for replays, etc, that aren't on the jumbotron for use in deciding when to challenge goals, etc.

I would not have known the answer to this is if I didn't just have baller seats at the Kings game.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

13 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

It's always there, a stain, a blot, a scar. It's the permanent record we were warned about as school boys. You'll never work in this town again. At least only you can see your rapsheet.

Sort of.

I was warned way back and then I was unwarned a month later.  It does show in the warning history, but the sum is 0 warning points.

Anyway, seems that I have been a good boy, or at least good enough, since late 2011.

[Andrew Amerk]

1 hour ago, Doohickie said:

What an obnoxiously long post.  ?

Thank you for not quoting the entire thing. 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

2 hours ago, Andrew Amerk said:

My eyesight might be terrible...who is the coach on the bench that had zero reaction?

Also, love Hutton’s reaction. 

Yup.  

Hutton is like ... 'well that's nice and all, but I have not played well tonight and this thing still has a minute + to go' ...

 

Edited October 26, 2018 by N S
fat fingers ... still

[Andrew Amerk]

37 minutes ago, jsb said:

 

Dude, do you not read my GDT posts???? Here I am trying to live up to your past inspiring GDT's and you don't even read mine?? My feelings are forever more hurt. ???

Remember GDT rules

1. No acne jokes
2. No telling Mr. Flagg to STF..... you know the rest
3. Logo hate was grandfathered into the rules so that's ok
4. Please look for previous made GDT's before posting yours 
5. Must Win
6. LETS GO BUFFALO

Don’t forget the new #7 - no quoting the entire GDT post. 

38 minutes ago, IKnowPhysics said:

 

 

Steve Smith don't give a *****, his job's not done.  Even after the choreographed arm pump of Housley and Payne.

 

George Babcock looks like he's about to throw Rich Stinziano off the bench in the next frame.

Thank you. I seriously couldn’t make out who the figure was on my tiny screened device. 

[Doohickie]

31 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

It's always there, a stain, a blot, a scar.

Chicks dig scars.

[LTS]

@Randall Flagg- I appreciate all the research and work you put into things.  You can choose to not believe without more detailed evidence which will probably never be shared because the public should not get the full picture of everything that goes on.

Perhaps you have extensive locker room experience and have never run into the situation, but unfortunately I can tell you that I have.  Naturally I don't have statistics to back all of this up.

In college when I played volleyball we had a situation where one of our best players was also a person the rest of the team really didn't want to be around, for a multitude of reasons. Naturally we all want to win, but playing volleyball just didn't seem as fun with him around. We're off to a less than mediocre record to start the season.  We're not great, but we're definitely better than what we were showing. About 1/4 way through the season he lands funny and messes up his ankle.  In theory we should be worse because the replacement player is definitely not in the same class of player as this guy.  Basically, this guy drops off the planet and we don't see him anymore.  We went on to improve our record dramatically, pretty much overnight.  We were all having a lot more fun playing.  

I've also witnessed similar things when coaching youth hockey.  A single kid in the locker room is just a routine problem causer. The kids really don't like him and as such they don't look forward to being in the locker room. Practices are annoying because this kid just brings everyone down.  He gets injured and is away from the team and there's an immediate improvement in every aspect of the team.

We can say these guys are professionals, but I've worked in an office space where we had a person who just dragged the office down despite being a good worker. Their performance never looked bad but the rest of the office just didn't perform the same.  They left, everything got better.  Just because they get paid a ton of money to play the game it certainly does not mean they can just ignore the impacts certain players may have.

Bottom line I am not sure it matters what's true. The Sabres, at the moment, do not miss ROR, that's the real bottom line.  St. Louis with ROR does not appear to have improved much over how they ended last season.  Will it change?  Who knows... 

[Doohickie]

28 minutes ago, IKnowPhysics said:

ProTip tho: if Flagg is really stepping on your nuts, put him on ignore.  No shame in that.  Then when you opt into reading his posts, it's nobody's fault but your own.  You'll realize that and respond negatively muuuccch less.

Oh, that was part of the abusive behavior.  I *told* him I was putting him on ignore.  ?

As a result of my penalty I actually pulled a bunch of people off ignore, actually.  There's one notable exception and it's more of a case of writing style than of views expressed.

[North Buffalo]

Too late for popcorn sales... how’d  I miss this.... get your popcorn, popcorn here!  

 

Edited October 26, 2018 by North Buffalo