TrueBlueGED Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 The way I see it, Murray has only been trying to build a team for two offseasons, and the starting point for the build was a historically bad team. That has to count for something, I think. But the clock starts ticking for me this offseason--he has to find a way to shed at least 1 bad contract in a trade (with Vegas hopefully helping on a second), revamp the defense, and get the right coach. That's a somewhat daunting list, so maybe hope for 2/3 of it? Anyway, as far as I'm concerned, we're officially behind where we should be in the rebuild (we should be a bubble team IMO). If we're still behind next year (ie. no playoffs), then I start to think about making a change...particularly if he hitches his wagon to Bylsma to start the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 The way I see it, Murray has only been trying to build a team for two offseasons, and the starting point for the build was a historically bad team. That has to count for something, I think. But the clock starts ticking for me this offseason--he has to find a way to shed at least 1 bad contract in a trade (with Vegas hopefully helping on a second), revamp the defense, and get the right coach. That's a somewhat daunting list, so maybe hope for 2/3 of it? Anyway, as far as I'm concerned, we're officially behind where we should be in the rebuild (we should be a bubble team IMO). If we're still behind next year (ie. no playoffs), then I start to think about making a change...particularly if he hitches his wagon to Bylsma to start the year. Completely agreed. And I really thought we'd get up to bubble team status this season. Some were predicting playoffs, but I knew that wouldn't be easy so wasn't expecting it. But to basically fail to improve in any meaningful way, and potentially not at all depending on how we finish, is very dissapointing. The goal I think has to be progress season to season. Murray's slogan, after all, is "Get better every day". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Completely agreed. And I really thought we'd get up to bubble team status this season. Some were predicting playoffs, but I knew that wouldn't be easy so wasn't expecting it. But to basically fail to improve in any meaningful way, and potentially not at all depending on how we finish, is very dissapointing. The goal I think has to be progress season to season. Murray's slogan, after all, is "Get better every day". Yea, and I really don't think we're better this season than last season. I didn't think Murray had a good offseason, and the results this year (on pace for a whopping 1 more point than last season, and currently with a worse goal differential) hasn't done anything to make me re-evaluate that view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Yea, and I really don't think we're better this season than last season. I didn't think Murray had a good offseason, and the results this year (on pace for a whopping 1 more point than last season, and currently with a worse goal differential) hasn't done anything to make me re-evaluate that view. Biggest problem is that he didn't acquire a D that could step up... Kuli was over estimated and hurt... Gorges has been a disaster, Bogo has gotten worse and was injured, None of the young league guys are ready, though Fedun and Falk were serviceable and appreciated... Sabres still need a second pairing and they need two guys... IMO Bogo, Gorges and Kuli should be gone next year... at least Kuli at deadline and Gorges let go... Bogo should be traded around the draft or over the summer. Would love to see Molson go and let the young guys come in next year. Add a healthy Fasching with PU and possibly a developing Nylander, combined with Baptiste, Rodriguez and Bailey and that is two nice future lines to go with the current top two... Obviously mix and matching with the top two, and having Gionta and probably Foligno around for another year will let these guys develop. But the forward lines look nice and who knows if any other of the college or junior guys step up next summer. But the Sabres need D probably picked with their top two pics unless they have acquire a young guy via trade... What a frustrating year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottysabres Posted March 1, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Biggest problem is that he didn't acquire a D that could step up... Kuli was over estimated and hurt... Gorges has been a disaster, Bogo has gotten worse and was injured, None of the young league guys are ready, though Fedun and Falk were serviceable and appreciated... Sabres still need a second pairing and they need two guys... IMO Bogo, Gorges and Kuli should be gone next year... at least Kuli at deadline and Gorges let go... Bogo should be traded around the draft or over the summer. Would love to see Molson go and let the young guys come in next year. Add a healthy Fasching with PU and possibly a developing Nylander, combined with Baptiste, Rodriguez and Bailey and that is two nice future lines to go with the current top two... Obviously mix and matching with the top two, and having Gionta and probably Foligno around for another year will let these guys develop. But the forward lines look nice and who knows if any other of the college or junior guys step up next summer. But the Sabres need D probably picked with their top two pics unless they have acquire a young guy via trade... What a frustrating year... I look at it from a positional view. Meaning RW (right handed shot, speed and/or power with finish) appears balanced when you look at Okposo, Bailey, Baptiste, Fasching and Nylander. LW however is a big ? It should be addressed for sure. Defense is just a straight out disaster up and down the pipeline. Goaltending is suspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 The way I see it, Murray has only been trying to build a team for two offseasons, and the starting point for the build was a historically bad team. That has to count for something, I think. But the clock starts ticking for me this offseason--he has to find a way to shed at least 1 bad contract in a trade (with Vegas hopefully helping on a second), revamp the defense, and get the right coach. That's a somewhat daunting list, so maybe hope for 2/3 of it? Anyway, as far as I'm concerned, we're officially behind where we should be in the rebuild (we should be a bubble team IMO). If we're still behind next year (ie. no playoffs), then I start to think about making a change...particularly if he hitches his wagon to Bylsma to start the year. Good post. This where I am as well. I have mixed reviews of this rebuild thus far and this off season and first half of next will tell a lot. Bylsma could go as I don't believe these guys really care for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacque Richard Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Five years to rebuild please! What will that guarantee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robviously Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 The way I see it, Murray has only been trying to build a team for two offseasons, and the starting point for the build was a historically bad team. That has to count for something, I think. But the clock starts ticking for me this offseason--he has to find a way to shed at least 1 bad contract in a trade (with Vegas hopefully helping on a second), revamp the defense, and get the right coach. That's a somewhat daunting list, so maybe hope for 2/3 of it? Anyway, as far as I'm concerned, we're officially behind where we should be in the rebuild (we should be a bubble team IMO). If we're still behind next year (ie. no playoffs), then I start to think about making a change...particularly if he hitches his wagon to Bylsma to start the year. The starting point was a historically bad team with a ton of future assets. Murray made a bunch of trades to accelerate the rebuild and they haven't worked. If the only thing he does is draft Eichel, we're probably about in the same place in the standings now. There are people on this board that could have done better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 The starting point was a historically bad team with a ton of future assets. Murray made a bunch of trades to accelerate the rebuild and they haven't worked. If the only thing he does is draft Eichel, we're probably about in the same place in the standings now. There are people on this board that could have done better. If the only thing he did was hire a different coach, we're probably in the playoffs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 The fact that Bylsma is here at this point can start off the Murray assessment, as far as I am concerned. Agreed. WTF Tim. How on earth do you not see this isn't working? He should have been fired after Robin publically stated guys are tuning out the coach. Our record is crap. Our possession metrics are epically crap. What is the hold up here???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pastajoe Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 I had a dream last night that I was chosen to make the first round draft pick for the Sabres, the 3rd pick in round. I was sitting with GMTM, and said let's look at who's the best D available. GMTM handed me a sheet that had a Czech goalie I never heard of on it. He said that was the pick. I said, but we need a D. He said pick the goalie. I did eat pepperoni, cheese, and crackers late last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Agreed. WTF Tim. How on earth do you not see this isn't working? He should have been fired after Robin publically stated guys are tuning out the coach. Our record is crap. Our possession metrics are epically crap. What is the hold up here????I'm firmly convinced hiring Dan was a Pegula move and so is keeping him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 I had a dream last night that I was chosen to make the first round draft pick for the Sabres, the 3rd pick in round. I was sitting with GMTM, and said let's look at who's the best D available. GMTM handed me a sheet that had a Czech goalie I never heard of on it. He said that was the pick. I said, but we need a D. He said pick the goalie. I did eat pepperoni, cheese, and crackers late last night. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Agreed. WTF Tim. How on earth do you not see this isn't working? He should have been fired after Robin publically stated guys are tuning out the coach. Our record is crap. Our possession metrics are epically crap. What is the hold up here???? My fear continues to be they're on the same page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 (edited) I had a dream last night that I was chosen to make the first round draft pick for the Sabres, the 3rd pick in round. I was sitting with GMTM, and said let's look at who's the best D available. GMTM handed me a sheet that had a Czech goalie I never heard of on it. He said that was the pick. I said, but we need a D. He said pick the goalie. I did eat pepperoni, cheese, and crackers late last night. This deserves it's own thread. My fear continues to be they're on the same page. I get a sinking feeling in my stomach whenever someone mentions this. Murray's quotes on the matter do nothing to assuage the fears, either. Edited March 1, 2017 by Thorny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 I had a dream last night that I was chosen to make the first round draft pick for the Sabres, the 3rd pick in round. I was sitting with GMTM, and said let's look at who's the best D available. GMTM handed me a sheet that had a Czech goalie I never heard of on it. He said that was the pick. I said, but we need a D. He said pick the goalie. I did eat pepperoni, cheese, and crackers late last night. This is really funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woods-racer Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 I still have a hard time believing that our D look this bad NOT because of Dan. They are asked to run around the D-zone and cover guys in a kind of hybrid zone-man scheme. They always seem out of place on a goal because they are constantly chasing or going back to a spot. It is by far and away not Bogo's, Franson's or Gorge's scheme that gives them any chance to excel at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre fan Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 In TM's defense, he has made some great trades (especially getting OReilly for next to nothing), and the Kane trade is looking better now that Kane has started to play how he is capable, which is certainly a top-3 guy. He lost the draft lottery and while Jack is very good, McDavid would make an instant impact on his team that would make the whole team better. Furthermore, trades for what were to be top-4 d-,men in Bogo, kulikov, Gorges etc have all been a bust. Bogo was a very high draft pick and highly rated (not sure what happened but he looks lost). To say that TM hasn't put together a good enough defense is not fair as he has tried and of course just about every other team in the NHL is looking for defensemen so The Sabres are not alone nor different from a ton of other teams. we do have Risto and McCabe and Guhle looks to be the real deal so hat's 3 great d-men. Our young guys look great and we certainly have a good future with them so all-in-all TM deserves a passing grade at this point. I also agree with whoever said hat Blysma was a Pugula thing and he ain't going nowhere anytime soon which is too bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robviously Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 If the only thing he did was hire a different coach, we're probably in the playoffs How would the new coach fix our horrific defense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 How would the new coach fix our horrific defense? By not relying on insane stretch passes out of the zone that lead to turnovers and odd man rushes. By playing an aggressive system that puts pressure on the other team, and not on the worst part of our team our defense; using our strengths to protect our weaknesses instead of the other way around, which he does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Five years to rebuild please! What will that guarantee Lots of drunk Sabres fans How would the new coach fix our horrific defense? Kuli and Franson need to go today. Either trade Gorges in the off-season (good luck), or send him to Rochester or Albany or Utica or wherever they are taking my team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetweenThePipes00 Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 I understand the heat on Bylsma, whatever he is doing isn't working. Sometimes coaches are a bad fit for certain groups of players and apparently his system may be too much for a young team. But the idea of firing Murray anytime soon is just nuts to me. He inherited a MESS. To say his trades to accelerate the rebuild haven't worked is flat-out wrong. He got the best player in both the O'Reilly and Kane deals by far. You can say they haven't accelerated it ENOUGH for YOU, but it just goes to show how far down they were starting. They improved 27 points last season over the year before. Without those deals, where are they last season? 65-70 points instead of 81? If they get 21 points in the last 19 games (which is possible), they'll have made a 30-point jump in 2 seasons. To me, that's pretty accelerated compared to where they would be if they didn't make those trades. It's not good enough, of course, but expecting more was unrealistic, IMO. Of course Murray has made mistakes. I wish Bogosian was better, but half of us hated Myers too. I wish Murray would have addressed the defense more this season, I wish the Moulson contract didn't exist. D-Lo is not an NHL player (although, again, if it cost us 2 points in the 2014-15 standings to lose McNabb, it was worth it) ... it's incredibly frustrating to watch. I get it. But bottom line: You hired the guy to tear it down, get a stud and build around said stud. That was the plan. Said stud is not even 21. Murray has drafted 25 guys, most of whom, again, are not even old enough to drink in the U.S. Yet already people want to change course and fire him? That seems foolhardy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkard Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 I'm firmly convinced hiring Dan was a Pegula move and so is keeping him This is where I'm at. I don't think TM has the authority to can DB because I don't think he hired him to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre fan Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 funny cause at the start of the year, our offense was non-existent with Jack, EK and Oreilly all out with injuries and Blysma moving guys around far too much. anyways, our defense seemed to keep us in many games and we were allowing very few goals per game but losing 1-0, 2-1 or whatever. we couldn't score...now we are scoring as good as any team and our forwards are playing well. now it seems the defense has tanked...strange Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabills Posted March 1, 2017 Report Share Posted March 1, 2017 Man, this thread is gon' be lit in about 2 hours if Murray doesn't make a move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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