SwampD Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Then he needs to fix that. Agreed he was better in the third on rebounds, btw, swamp. It was the second I didn't like. Gotcha. I'm going to rewatched the game today as I only saw from late in the second on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Gotcha. I'm going to rewatched the game today as I only saw from late in the second on. Enjoy the first. That was a joy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matter2003 Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 (edited) I dunno....those look like pretty damn good starting goalie numbers to me....6th in the NHL in save percentage... Must be nice to play on a team like Holtby does for a goalie....has played 6 more games and face 63 fewer shots than Lehner has... Let's look at Shots per 60 minutes of the goalies in this snippet: Dubnyk: 29.58 Anderson 32.27 Darling: 30.78 Bobrovsky: 29.31 Holtby: 27.35 Lehner: 33.56 Murray: 30.58 Greiss: 30.95 Nillson: 34.03 So basically the Sabres give up shots like they are going out of style with Nillson facing even more per 60 minutes than Lehner...and before someone says they are a lot of long distance shots, well yes that is true, but I'd be willing to bet the Sabre goalies also face far more shots from wide open players in the slot the defenders and forwards simply forget about and shots from the 3rd man trailing which the Sabres still haven't figured out to cover more than halfway through the season. These are prime scoring chances the Sabres give up as if they will earn a prize from the NHL by leading the league in those categories... .925 save percentage, 6th in the NHL and only .02 back from being 2nd in the NHL? Looks pretty damn good to me, but maybe I'm just imagining things....his win total would be up significantly if the Sabres didn't score 0,1, or 2 goals in half their games this year...especially in the beginning with Eichel out. Edited February 12, 2017 by matter2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 The biggest Issue I got with blaming a goalie for lack of rebound control is the fact that sometimes your Defense needs to be in the right spot to clear the puck as well. And ours often aren't, especially bogo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Here's something else on Lehner: it's fair, IMHO, to attribute some of the Sabres' PK deficiencies to him -- I think there's more than a little truth to the axiom that your best penalty-killer has to be your goalie. Lehner ranks 21st in PK SV% and has surrendered the 6th-most PPGs. However, it's fair to note that Carey Price's PK #s are worse than Lehner's -- Price has surrendered the most PPGs in the NHL and is 25th in PK SV%. Price is 9th in overall SV%; Lehner is now 4th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabel79 Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Here's something else on Lehner: it's fair, IMHO, to attribute some of the Sabres' PK deficiencies to him -- I think there's more than a little truth to the axiom that your best penalty-killer has to be your goalie. Lehner ranks 21st in PK SV% and has surrendered the 6th-most PPGs. However, it's fair to note that Carey Price's PK #s are worse than Lehner's -- Price has surrendered the most PPGs in the NHL and is 25th in PK SV%. Price is 9th in overall SV%; Lehner is now 4th. It's probably not a coincidence that both of them have absolute garbage PKs (Montreal having gotten rid of their good PK) in front of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 There is a reason I wanted legwand back, he was great on the PK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Look at the data Flagg posted in the other thread showing where other teams shoot on BUF. Most of their shots are from the point, in thr middle which is the easiest saves to make.... I like that he saves those shots, but he doesn't see much rubber from the high percentage scoring areas because of how the Sabres setup defensively in their zone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Look at the data Flagg posted in the other thread showing where other teams shoot on BUF. Most of their shots are from the point, in thr middle which is the easiest saves to make.... I like that he saves those shots, but he doesn't see much rubber from the high percentage scoring areas because of how the Sabres setup defensively in their zone. Right, and he's pretty bad at stopping them from the high percentage areas. Probably contributes to his poor PK numbers, but there's so much noise in PK SV%, it's impossible to say statistically in a one season sample. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matter2003 Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 (edited) Here's something else on Lehner: it's fair, IMHO, to attribute some of the Sabres' PK deficiencies to him -- I think there's more than a little truth to the axiom that your best penalty-killer has to be your goalie. Lehner ranks 21st in PK SV% and has surrendered the 6th-most PPGs. However, it's fair to note that Carey Price's PK #s are worse than Lehner's -- Price has surrendered the most PPGs in the NHL and is 25th in PK SV%. Price is 9th in overall SV%; Lehner is now 4th. OK, but how many times are the PP players scoring after being allowed to stand wide open in the slot with no defender anywhere near them? Seems to happen at least once a game on a PP with this team and it usually ends up in our net... Here's something else on Lehner: it's fair, IMHO, to attribute some of the Sabres' PK deficiencies to him -- I think there's more than a little truth to the axiom that your best penalty-killer has to be your goalie. Lehner ranks 21st in PK SV% and has surrendered the 6th-most PPGs. However, it's fair to note that Carey Price's PK #s are worse than Lehner's -- Price has surrendered the most PPGs in the NHL and is 25th in PK SV%. Price is 9th in overall SV%; Lehner is now 4th. Lehner is actually 6th Edited February 12, 2017 by matter2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 All these weaknesses and one of the worst defenses in the league in front of him, and he's still one of the best goaltenders in the league. Can you imagine how good he's going to be when those get corrected? I can't believe Murray only spent a mid 1st rounder to pick up a young goaltender with Vezina potential. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matter2003 Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 All these weaknesses and one of the worst defenses in the league in front of him, and he's still one of the best goaltenders in the league. Can you imagine how good he's going to be when those get corrected? I can't believe Murray only spent a mid 1st rounder to pick up a young goaltender with Vezina potential. And couple that with goaltenders usually don't hit their prime until age 28 and he could be a really really good one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Yup, going to be fun watching him develop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 And couple that with goaltenders usually don't hit their prime until age 28 and he could be a really really good one... That gets forgotten a lot. These are Lehner's peers age-wise: Gibson, Vasilievsky, Allen and Mrazek. The only younger starters are Hellebuyck and Murray In NHL goalie terms, Robin is a baby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 That gets forgotten a lot. These are Lehner's peers age-wise: Gibson, Vasilievsky, Allen and Mrazek. The only younger starters are Hellebuyck and Murray In NHL goalie terms, Robin is a baby. yup sign him now, 7x 4mill I'd say Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 yup sign him now, 7x 4mill I'd say Respectfully: NFW. It is crazy, IMHO, to commit to any goalie for longer than 3 years, especially well before his contract status requires you to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Two words Devan Dubnyk. He didn't hit his stride in the NHL until 28. Tim Thomas didn't become an NHL starter until 31. Lehner is getting better and he looks much more focused. With Petersen in the pipeline, I'd say 4 for 16. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JujuFish Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 OK, but how many times are the PP players scoring after being allowed to stand wide open in the slot with no defender anywhere near them? Seems to happen at least once a game on a PP with this team and it usually ends up in our net... Lehner is actually 6th Depends on where you cut off goalies. Among goalies with at least 8 starts, he's 11th. Among goalies with at least 10 starts, he's 9th. 15 starts, 7th. 20 starts, 6th. 21 starts, 4th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted February 13, 2017 Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 Respectfully: NFW. It is crazy, IMHO, to commit to any goalie for longer than 3 years, especially well before his contract status requires you to do so. Its a bargain :p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matter2003 Posted February 13, 2017 Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 Depends on where you cut off goalies. Among goalies with at least 8 starts, he's 11th. Among goalies with at least 10 starts, he's 9th. 15 starts, 7th. 20 starts, 6th. 21 starts, 4th. I was just going by Yahoo sports qualified leaders...not sure if every site is different as to what they consider qualified but usually it's determined by the league and comes from playing in X amount of games or X amount of minutes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted February 15, 2017 Report Share Posted February 15, 2017 .946 save percentage so far in February - seven starts, so basically he's played every second day. He's faced 279 shots in that span - 40 a game! - that's a busy month's work for Ken Dryden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAud Posted February 15, 2017 Report Share Posted February 15, 2017 .946 save percentage so far in February - seven starts, so basically he's played every second day. He's faced 279 shots in that span - 40 a game! - that's a busy month's work for Ken Dryden To Lehner critics, the fact that he sometimes struggles with too many rebounds outweighs actual NHL results Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted February 15, 2017 Report Share Posted February 15, 2017 .946 save percentage so far in February - seven starts, so basically he's played every second day. He's faced 279 shots in that span - 40 a game! - that's a busy month's work for Ken Dryden. If, after his rookie playoff run, Dryden faced 40+ shots more than a dozen times in his career, it would be shocking. (Perhaps that was the angle you were going for. If so, as Emily used to say, nevermind.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted February 15, 2017 Report Share Posted February 15, 2017 If, after his rookie playoff run, Dryden faced 40+ shots more than a dozen times in his career, it would be shocking. (Perhaps that was the angle you were going for. If so, as Emily used to say, nevermind.) True but Hasek didnt feel in the game till he faced 40 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted February 15, 2017 Report Share Posted February 15, 2017 To Lehner critics, the fact that he sometimes struggles with too many rebounds outweighs actual NHL results *unsustainable I'm also convinced ~10 of the saves he makes each game are off of chances that he generates himself through lack of puck control. He'd probably be playing a better all-around game even if his SV% was a little lower. Counter-intuitive, but that's what I'm seeing with my own two eyes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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