PromoTheRobot Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 Holy cow, some of you. Debating the GM in a season trying to finish last? Are we handing out style points? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 (edited) Yeh I am, that doesn't take away from the fact the Kane deal was after the fact and Lemieux was a miscalculation. Remains to be seen if Kane is. Like the potential, but the attitude again gives me pause and is Murray just creating another problem despite getting rid of one of his own making. Why are you acting like we were forced to trade Lemieux because of some miscalculation? Isn't more accurate to say he the price we had to pay to get what we all hope will be a first-line power forward? How do you know Lemieux wasn't going to eventually sign anyway? I'd be very surprised if more than a handful of 2nd-rounders have yet. I'd imagine there are a bunch of unsigned first rounders as well. And you admit you don't know how well the Kane trade will work out. Doesn't seem like a lot of solid evidence to me. Edited April 14, 2015 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 (edited) Why are you acting like we were forced to trade Lemieux because of some miscalculation? Isn't more accurate to say he the price we had to pay to get what we all hope will be a first-line power forward? How do you know Lemieux wasn't going to eventually sign anyway? I'd be very surprised if more than a handful of 2nd-rounders have yet. I'd imagine there are a bunch of unsigned first rounders as well. And you admit you don't know how well the Kane trade will work out. Doesn't seem like a lot of solid evidence to me. True most of my arguments stem from the fact that I don't think very highly of Murray and question his handling of PR...so what. Still was Lemieux and Kane is an iffy proposition and I really want the Sabres to move forward in a linear upward fashion after so much linear downslope. I don't want maybes and fits and starts and Murray's so called lauded draft acumen has yet show fruition, maybe not to be expected. This begs the question, why are so few 2nd rounders not NHL talent? Why is it such a crap shoot. Is it that hard to tell if these guys have talent and or will develop into something... could be the answer like evaluating offensive skill or looking for good QBs is a crap shoot after the first round. Weird that other positions are not so tough to find useable talent. Edited April 14, 2015 by North Buffalo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 True most of my arguments stem from the fact that I don't think very highly of Murray and question his handling of PR...so what. Still was Lemieux and Kane is an iffy proposition and I really want the Sabres to move forward in a linear upward fashion after so much linear downslope. I don't want maybes and fits and starts and Murray's so called lauded draft acumen has show fruition, maybe not to be expected. This begs the question, why are so few 2nd rounders not NHL talent? Why is it such a crap shoot. Is it that hard to tell if these guys have talent and or will develop into something... could be the answer like evaluating offensive skill or looking for good QBs is a crap shoot after the first round. Weird that other positions are not so tough to find useable talent. Kane is more of a definite than Lemiuex is or ever will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 (edited) Kane is more of a definite than Lemiuex is or ever will be. True, but a maybe still and what kinda of teammate? Edited April 15, 2015 by North Buffalo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 True, but a maybe still and what kinda of teammate? he is not a maybe at all. he is a top line winger and seems like a fine teammate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trettioåtta Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 he is not a maybe at all. he is a top line winger and seems like a fine teammate. Time to add "Evander Kane will be fine."? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 EVANDER KANE WILL BE FINE!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 EVANDER KANE WILL BE FINE!!!! As long as he can wear his "bling." (See other thread.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 My frustration with Murray is two fold. 1. I didn't like the way LaFontaine was handled... my grudge. Some of you think that it goes with the territory and LaFontaine misjudged the situation and walked away in a huff... fine and probably true to an extent but only because Murray doesn't appear to play well with others either unless you are his lap dog. 2. I think the way he handled Lemieux and now the Nolan situation is indicative of the kind of style he puts forward as a GM. His Uncle, while in DC was very much that way, couldn't handle the press, and got really prickly when confronted with questions about his mistakes. He didn't take any blame for his actions. Then bailing on his mistake about Lemieux, despite what he said, and shipping him off to Winnipeg. Finally, if you are going to lie, make it plausible or just don't say anything. Smile and pull a Marshawn Lynch.... Everyone says is a great judge of talent... Mess and Balls worked out great! (Sarcasm) Got us 30th, which is good in my book... but bad according to Murray, so which is it. Just saying, Murray leaves a lot to be desired from a good GM standpoint and from a talent evaluator. I don't want the Sabres to jump from one moron Darcy into another... Go Sabres... Can we stop with this? It's crap and you sound like Shcopp. Just because some of us aren't jumping up and down all a twitter like a little girl as Beiber walks by, doesn't mean that we actually want the Sabres to lose. We have been sold the future before, so we remain cautiously optimistic. We still want them to win. and I didn't mean just you, beerme1. others are saying this as well and it's really annoying. Why that sir is an insult! :flirt: Although my post is certainly the drive by type, looking at the rhetoric coming from NB, it seems right for the moment. I get what you mean as it seems the tank, anti tank is taking on a you're either with us or against us mentality now more than ever except the anti crowd is about five vocal people. It's tiring on both sides. And I'm sorry but this guy seems to be waiting for a glory day when he can say I told you so instead of rooting for the Sabres to win and frankly I've had enough of that. Go Sabres... "His Uncle in DC did this" or that. I give a what his uncle did in DC? Actually I do give a what his uncle does in Ottawa and I hope that man recovers fully. He brings a lot to the game. "Smile and pull a Marshawn Lynch" Um, think Terry Pegula expects a little more form his employees than that no? Go away with that... If anyone cant see that we are a team on the rise now that we have bottomed out and have stockpiles of talent waiting for marching orders well, I guess I should just ignore them because I am completely stoked now that this has ended and feel that we will be a force to be reckoned with for years. You can't see the talent waiting in the wings? You don't know hockey then. Not an insult to you personally swamp. Just sayin. I'm a glass is half full type. Except with regards to the Sabres as of 4/14/2015 Even tough we are at bottom, that same glass will be overflowing in short order and that will make up for any whiny indiscretion the team and it's current owner and gm, current owner and prior gm, or prior owner or owners and any prior gm has inflicted on the organization. We are going to be a fun team to watch for a long time coming. Sunshine, unicorns and rainbows from here on out for sake. Get on board or get off now! Cause if you're too butt hurt to get on board you will soon be seen as a bandwagon fan. Good times are coming. I'm wondering if that is a lie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 As a bit of an aside, I think if you look back at my posts over the last season, I was not a tanker early on. I merely used the tank (or rather, the possibility of McEichel) as a consolation when the Sabres lost. I wanted to see some good coming out of the futility that was the Buffalo Sabres this season. Up until the 14-game skid, I really rooted for a win every game. In December I was rooting for the Sabres to make the playoffs (if you recall, they weren't that far out of it). Then January happened. At some point during 0-for-January my perspective changed and started paying more attention to the Probability of McEichel than to the NHL standings. So for the anti-tankers, I kind of get it. I fell from grace you might say, but at one time I was on the lofty cloud of unimpeachable integrity with the rest of you. Whether I approved of the tank or not didn't affect the team's play and eventually I got more pragmatic; if it's a lost season, the way the Sabres would win would be to lose and get McEichel, so rooting against them started to creep into my mindset. Yuck. So I can't claim a high moral ground. I am one of the fans Mike Weber had an issue with (even though I haven't been to any games this year). But whether I can claim the moral high ground or not, I still hope to see a winning team in the next year or so. And whether the stout anti-tankers like the way the organization went about it or not, they will also benefit from the acquisition of top talent through the tank. I'm not sure if there's a point to all that... only that whichever side you are on the tank issue, we're all just fans of the Sabres. Good stuff here. This is pretty much where I evolved to over the last couple of months of this season. I'm still skeptical but if we were going to stink, we might as well collect the consolation prize. Why do you blame Murray for LaFontaine? LaFontaine hired Murray. I'd blame Pegula and a few others for LaFontaine. The guy hired a GM and then was upset he didn't get to make the hockey decisions (as far as we know). Murray is a decision maker and that's 100% better than someone who waffles and wants consensus. He's confident in what he is doing. Thus, ZFG. He's doing his job and part of that job requirement is not that you have to paint rainbows for people. His statements are extraordinarily calculated and they are natural. This means he thinks this way, all the time. Call him Vulcan-esque if you will. You hang onto this "mistake" on Lemieux. There's no evidence supporting the theory. He drafted someone and used that as an asset to obtain someone else. A cold calculated decision says my path goes left, your path goes right. I'm going to ship you off to somewhere along your path and not on mine. There's no mistake there. It's reality. If your hanging onto "he should have known". Perhaps he did and he didn't care? Perhaps he looked at Lemieux as an asset he could draft right at the beginning of the 2nd round and send off to another team. Perhaps he never wanted him here but just wanted to use that pick for that purpose. You don't know it, we don't know it. Your presumption does not make it fact. Benoit and Meszaros were perfect signings. Veteran defenseman with whom he had a prior relationship. They are offered 1 year deals to try and salvage their careers and perhaps earn another year in the NHL. At the same time they eat up slots allowing Murray to keep his D in the minors a little longer. Not a mistake.. calculated. Hell, even Bucky Gleason admitted how great of a talent evaluator Murray is.. think about it. He did just enough to keep it close without being ridiculous. He had just enough talent to fail. Stop looking for problems and enjoy life a little more. Another good one here. I'm wondering if that is a lie. Can we stop with this? It's crap and you sound like Shcopp. Indeed. The bolded is pretty obnoxious and really has no place in the conversation here. True most of my arguments stem from the fact that I don't think very highly of Murray and question his handling of PR...so what. Still was Lemieux and Kane is an iffy proposition and I really want the Sabres to move forward in a linear upward fashion after so much linear downslope. I don't want maybes and fits and starts and Murray's so called lauded draft acumen has yet show fruition, maybe not to be expected. Everyone wants this, innit? But there's really no path to linear upward improvement that is guaranteed to work. They all have maybes and fits and starts. Why that sir is an insult! :flirt: Although my post is certainly the drive by type, looking at the rhetoric coming from NB, it seems right for the moment. I get what you mean as it seems the tank, anti tank is taking on a you're either with us or against us mentality now more than ever except the anti crowd is about five vocal people. It's tiring on both sides. And I'm sorry but this guy seems to be waiting for a glory day when he can say I told you so instead of rooting for the Sabres to win and frankly I've had enough of that. Go Sabres... "His Uncle in DC did this" or that. I give a ###### what his uncle did in DC? Actually I do give a ###### what his uncle does in Ottawa and I hope that man recovers fully. He brings a lot to the game. "Smile and pull a Marshawn Lynch" Um, think Terry Pegula expects a little more form his employees than that no? Go away with that... If anyone cant see that we are a team on the rise now that we have bottomed out and have stockpiles of talent waiting for marching orders well, I guess I should just ignore them because I am completely stoked now that this has ended and feel that we will be a force to be reckoned with for years. You can't see the talent waiting in the wings? You don't know hockey then. Not an insult to you personally swamp. Just sayin. I'm a glass is half full type. Except with regards to the Sabres as of 4/14/2015 Even tough we are at bottom, that same glass will be overflowing in short order and that will make up for any whiny indiscretion the team and it's current owner and gm, current owner and prior gm, or prior owner or owners and any prior gm has inflicted on the organization. We are going to be a fun team to watch for a long time coming. Sunshine, unicorns and rainbows from here on out for ###### sake. Get on board or get off now! Cause if you're too butt hurt to get on board you will soon be seen as a bandwagon fan. Good times are coming. I appreciate the optimism here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 True, but a maybe still and what kinda of teammate? What are you looking for here? Does Kane need to buy dinners and send birthday cards to his teammates kids or does he just need to show up to the rink every night ready to play? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 What are you looking for here? Does Kane need to buy dinners and send birthday cards to his teammates kids or does he just need to show up to the rink every night ready to play? Can he make them balloon animals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Can he make them balloon animals? key consideration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Why that sir is an insult! :flirt: Although my post is certainly the drive by type, looking at the rhetoric coming from NB, it seems right for the moment. I get what you mean as it seems the tank, anti tank is taking on a you're either with us or against us mentality now more than ever except the anti crowd is about five vocal people. It's tiring on both sides. And I'm sorry but this guy seems to be waiting for a glory day when he can say I told you so instead of rooting for the Sabres to win and frankly I've had enough of that. Go Sabres... "His Uncle in DC did this" or that. I give a ###### what his uncle did in DC? Actually I do give a ###### what his uncle does in Ottawa and I hope that man recovers fully. He brings a lot to the game. "Smile and pull a Marshawn Lynch" Um, think Terry Pegula expects a little more form his employees than that no? Go away with that... If anyone cant see that we are a team on the rise now that we have bottomed out and have stockpiles of talent waiting for marching orders well, I guess I should just ignore them because I am completely stoked now that this has ended and feel that we will be a force to be reckoned with for years. You can't see the talent waiting in the wings? You don't know hockey then. Not an insult to you personally swamp. Just sayin. I'm a glass is half full type. Except with regards to the Sabres as of 4/14/2015 Even tough we are at bottom, that same glass will be overflowing in short order and that will make up for any whiny indiscretion the team and it's current owner and gm, current owner and prior gm, or prior owner or owners and any prior gm has inflicted on the organization. We are going to be a fun team to watch for a long time coming. Sunshine, unicorns and rainbows from here on out for ###### sake. Get on board or get off now! Cause if you're too butt hurt to get on board you will soon be seen as a bandwagon fan. Good times are coming. Good post, although I still disagree that NB wants the Sabres to lose. On a side note, It makes me happy that "butt hurt" is now a part of our lexicon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Good post, Agreed. And I'll also say this: I very much appreciate that venting posts like this (and like one I posted a day or two ago) actually get read by the forum and commented on. On many other forums I've been to, posts like that would be tl;dr (too long; didn't read). But as tank got to its lowest point and people had to just vent to get it out of the system, a magical thing happened: instead of devolving into arguments, there's been a lot f support at best, and respectful disagreement at worst. Yeah, it did get a bit snippy, but ultimately I'm impressed with the civility of this forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunomatic Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Agreed. And I'll also say this: I very much appreciate that venting posts like this (and like one I posted a day or two ago) actually get read by the forum and commented on. On many other forums I've been to, posts like that would be tl;dr (too long; didn't read). But as tank got to its lowest point and people had to just vent to get it out of the system, a magical thing happened: instead of devolving into arguments, there's been a lot f support at best, and respectful disagreement at worst. Yeah, it did get a bit snippy, but ultimately I'm impressed with the civility of this forum. F#&k you ! ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 F#&k you ! I remember my first beer too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunomatic Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 I remember my first beer too. Don't like my funny ? Sorry :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 (edited) Don't like my funny ? Sorry :( That was more of a "right back at ya!" ;) EDIT: Think about it.... I'm accusing you of drinking at.... 9:30 am ET? Come on... :P Edited April 15, 2015 by Neuvichs Perchatka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunomatic Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 That was more of a "right back at ya!" ;) EDIT: Think about it.... I'm accusing you of drinking at.... 9:30 am ET? Come on... :P Ah. Got it. I could use a beer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 That was more of a "right back at ya!" ;) EDIT: Think about it.... I'm accusing you of drinking at.... 9:30 am ET? Come on... :P Camping? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Camping? That's the kind of thing that ends with someone yelling, "Hey y'all! Watch this!" When you hear that, run in the opposite direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Why do you blame Murray for LaFontaine? LaFontaine hired Murray. I'd blame Pegula and a few others for LaFontaine. The guy hired a GM and then was upset he didn't get to make the hockey decisions (as far as we know). Murray is a decision maker and that's 100% better than someone who waffles and wants consensus. He's confident in what he is doing. Thus, ZFG. He's doing his job and part of that job requirement is not that you have to paint rainbows for people. His statements are extraordinarily calculated and they are natural. This means he thinks this way, all the time. Call him Vulcan-esque if you will. You hang onto this "mistake" on Lemieux. There's no evidence supporting the theory. He drafted someone and used that as an asset to obtain someone else. A cold calculated decision says my path goes left, your path goes right. I'm going to ship you off to somewhere along your path and not on mine. There's no mistake there. It's reality. If your hanging onto "he should have known". Perhaps he did and he didn't care? Perhaps he looked at Lemieux as an asset he could draft right at the beginning of the 2nd round and send off to another team. Perhaps he never wanted him here but just wanted to use that pick for that purpose. You don't know it, we don't know it. Your presumption does not make it fact. Benoit and Meszaros were perfect signings. Veteran defenseman with whom he had a prior relationship. They are offered 1 year deals to try and salvage their careers and perhaps earn another year in the NHL. At the same time they eat up slots allowing Murray to keep his D in the minors a little longer. Not a mistake.. calculated. Hell, even Bucky Gleason admitted how great of a talent evaluator Murray is.. think about it. He did just enough to keep it close without being ridiculous. He had just enough talent to fail. Stop looking for problems and enjoy life a little more. Really, Lemieux said he wanted to be treated like a 1st rounder after not getting drafted, Balls and Mess I agree with except Murray said he expected Sabres to be better as an excuse for getting rid of Nolan... My problem is we went from a wishy washy guy Darcy, to someone that has no loyalty or integrity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted April 15, 2015 Report Share Posted April 15, 2015 Really, Lemieux said he wanted to be treated like a 1st rounder after not getting drafted, Balls and Mess I agree with except Murray said he expected Sabres to be better as an excuse for getting rid of Nolan... My problem is we went from a wishy washy guy Darcy, to someone that has no loyalty or integrity. What is this based on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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