Ranking: Why we suck this year

[PASabreFan]

15 minutes ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

That photo looks legit Punch.  Is it from your personal archives?

Yes. I have many. Most are more embarrassing than that. It's the only reason Punch is nice to me. Recently he sassed me a little. All it took was one pic sent as a friendly reminder.

Edited December 29, 2023 by PASabreFan

[Quint]

Never bring a Sabre to a gunfight. 

 

Edited December 30, 2023 by Quint

[Second Line Center]

Tage and Cozens: 
 

 

Cozens is 6’3 and 180 lbs.  Get him to 200.  
 

Tage is 6’7 and 218.  Should be at about 230.

Would like them to focus less on agility and more on strength/size.  Cozens more so than Tage   

 

[TageMVP]

Gotta add some grit. It's been lacking for too long. 

Even if the Sabres made the playoffs they'd get squashed in a hurry. Every team picks up their grit come playoff time. 

Although, I'd still take getting bounced early in the playoffs over the last 12 years any day of the week. 

[tom webster]

On 12/28/2023 at 10:44 PM, Pimlach said:

He quit.  They traded Rayan Miller when he was out of town.  Patty wanted to keep Miller and a few vets during the rebuild that turned full tank.  That was not agreed upon by the bloated Pegula organization.  

Terry liked the trade offer, Murray (the GM) made the trade.  A Pegula strap-hanger named Joe Batista told then coach Ted Nolan.  Teddy told Pat.   

Pat quit, he was supposed to be running hockey ops, he wanted control of a move like that. 

He has not been around since.  

Pat LaFontaine is a great man. Pat Lafontaine is not a hockey executive for a lot of reasons. Quitting two jobs in a huff should give you some insight. Sorry, this one isn’t on Terry, as much as some here want it to be.

[Pimlach]

2 hours ago, tom webster said:

Pat LaFontaine is a great man. Pat Lafontaine is not a hockey executive for a lot of reasons. Quitting two jobs in a huff should give you some insight. Sorry, this one isn’t on Terry, as much as some here want it to be.

I agree that he is not a hockey exec.  But Terry is central to his leaving abruptly.  

[tom webster]

2 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

I agree that he is not a hockey exec.  But Terry is central to his leaving abruptly.  

As was the Islander’s owner before him. Pat’s behavior was erratic, mood swings legendary. He’s just not cut out for the job.

No matter who the boss is, how hands on they want to be, you have to at least pretend to listen and respect their opinions.

Marv Levy once said the greatest advice he ever got was when Mary Wilson told him to just “talk to Ralph.” Once you earn their trust, you learn how much latitude you have.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, tom webster said:

As was the Islander’s owner before him. Pat’s behavior was erratic, mood swings legendary. He’s just not cut out for the job.

No matter who the boss is, how hands on they want to be, you have to at least pretend to listen and respect their opinions.

Marv Levy once said the greatest advice he ever got was when Mary Wilson told him to just “talk to Ralph.” Once you earn their trust, you learn how much latitude you have.

All true.  Pat is not perfect.  Terry was in his big organization phase and surrounded by “experts”.  Why hire a VPOHO in the first place if others were allowed to usurp his wishes.  Terry is at the core of the problem, as usual.   
 

You see where Briere picked to go.   

Edited December 31, 2023 by Pimlach

[French Collection]

4 hours ago, Second Line Center said:

Tage and Cozens: 
 

 

Cozens is 6’3 and 180 lbs.  Get him to 200.  
 

Tage is 6’7 and 218.  Should be at about 230.

Would like them to focus less on agility and more on strength/size.  Cozens more so than Tage   

 

Double dose for Power.

[Pimlach]

On 12/29/2023 at 12:20 PM, PASabreFan said:

Yes. I have many. Most are more embarrassing than that. It's the only reason Punch is nice to me. Recently he sassed me a little. All it took was one pic sent as a friendly reminder.

Edited December 31, 2023 by Pimlach

[LTS]

3 hours ago, tom webster said:

As was the Islander’s owner before him. Pat’s behavior was erratic, mood swings legendary. He’s just not cut out for the job.

No matter who the boss is, how hands on they want to be, you have to at least pretend to listen and respect their opinions.

Marv Levy once said the greatest advice he ever got was when Mary Wilson told him to just “talk to Ralph.” Once you earn their trust, you learn how much latitude you have.

And one wonders if his concussion history played a significant part in those mood swings.  Another athlete whose career was seriously impacted by head injuries.

[Crusader1969]

The 2023-24 Buffalo Sabres ....

terrible at most everything 

 

You could add in Face Off Percentage in their too 

Coaching is killing this team.  Either Fire the entire staff OR fire the assistants and keep Donny. 
 

Just do something !

Edited January 1 by Crusader1969

[Scottysabres]

We suck this year because we've had 12 seasons of practice at sucking. We've perfected sucking so much that we suck the suck out of sucking. This organization has sucked its way to sucking the suckeist suck of sucking suck.

Which sucks.

[Gatorman0519]

1 hour ago, Scottysabres said:

We suck this year because we've had 12 seasons of practice at sucking. We've perfected sucking so much that we suck the suck out of sucking. This organization has sucked its way to sucking the suckeist suck of sucking suck.

Which sucks.

They certainly own the outlier of sucking now in modern NHL history for its duration of sucking. 

[Alaska John]

My fear about this team is that they're rinsing and repeating the culture mistakes.  Eichel and Reinhardt didn't come to the team with defeatist attitudes.  Neither did O'Reilly.  These players, who were top talents on the team, just got worn down, disgusted, and had to go.  A year ago KA was crowing about having players who wanted to be here and who respected the Sabres logo.  Now all those top picks are looking at each other and seeing another year of their careers going down the drain.  They HAVE to be looking at other teams and wondering if there's a way to get somewhere else.  

[JohnC]

11 minutes ago, Alaska John said:

My fear about this team is that they're rinsing and repeating the culture mistakes.  Eichel and Reinhardt didn't come to the team with defeatist attitudes.  Neither did O'Reilly.  These players, who were top talents on the team, just got worn down, disgusted, and had to go.  A year ago KA was crowing about having players who wanted to be here and who respected the Sabres logo.  Now all those top picks are looking at each other and seeing another year of their careers going down the drain.  They HAVE to be looking at other teams and wondering if there's a way to get somewhere else.  

My big worry is exactly what you stated. The constant losing over an extended period of time is understandably corrosive to players' morale. Pro players are lifelong intense competitors. An inordinate amount of losing and being relegated to watching the playoffs on TV while their competitors are participating in the playoffs has to make them think about getting out of their frustrating situation. 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

14 minutes ago, Alaska John said:

My fear about this team is that they're rinsing and repeating the culture mistakes.  Eichel and Reinhardt didn't come to the team with defeatist attitudes.  Neither did O'Reilly.  These players, who were top talents on the team, just got worn down, disgusted, and had to go.  A year ago KA was crowing about having players who wanted to be here and who respected the Sabres logo.  Now all those top picks are looking at each other and seeing another year of their careers going down the drain.  They HAVE to be looking at other teams and wondering if there's a way to get somewhere else.  

I respectfully disagree with you on this. 

The players you mentioned came into a disasterous situation.  The #2 picks in 2014 and 2015 were a direct result of the catastrophic *tank*.

ROR was brought in as part of terrible first re-build attempt.

I do not see the situation now as in any way being similar to those times.  The roster is not quite there yet, but the team and culture is not a disaster. 

[Weave]

30 minutes ago, JohnC said:

My big worry is exactly what you stated. The constant losing over an extended period of time is understandably corrosive to players' morale. Pro players are lifelong intense competitors. An inordinate amount of losing and being relegated to watching the playoffs on TV while their competitors are participating in the playoffs has to make them think about getting out of their frustrating situation. 

This is why I was vehemently against going with a young, unproven roster.  You have to get the core expecting to win, and learning to win right away.  The fundamental flaw of the last 12 years had been a continued plan to have the kids carry the play and not supplying them with enough proven performers that can pick up the load when the kids inevitably falter.

You can’t have this many young players AND have enough proven vets to back them up. 

Edited January 1 by Weave

[Alaska John]

1 hour ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

I respectfully disagree with you on this. 

The players you mentioned came into a disasterous situation.  The #2 picks in 2014 and 2015 were a direct result of the catastrophic *tank*.

ROR was brought in as part of terrible first re-build attempt.

I do not see the situation now as in any way being similar to those times.  The roster is not quite there yet, but the team and culture is not a disaster. 

Well I hope you're right that the culture isn't deadly yet.  I also hope that it doesn't get that bad again.

[JohnC]

4 hours ago, Weave said:

This is why I was vehemently against going with a young, unproven roster.  You have to get the core expecting to win, and learning to win right away.  The fundamental flaw of the last 12 years had been a continued plan to have the kids carry the play and not supplying them with enough proven performers that can pick up the load when the kids inevitably falter.

You can’t have this many young players AND have enough proven vets to back them up. 

The issue for me isn't the over-reliance on young players. I still believe that it was/is the right approach. However, there still was a need to bring in the right veteran players to support the youngsters. And as I said in previous posts (as others have also stated) there isn't the right mix of players on this roster. There are too many perimeter players and not enough stalwarts battling around the net. That was classically evident in the Ottawa game where the 40 plus shots on net were easily seen by their goalie due to little obstruction. It's been like that all season. 

[JohnC]

5 hours ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

I respectfully disagree with you on this. 

The players you mentioned came into a disasterous situation.  The #2 picks in 2014 and 2015 were a direct result of the catastrophic *tank*.

ROR was brought in as part of terrible first re-build attempt.

I do not see the situation now as in any way being similar to those times.  The roster is not quite there yet, but the team and culture is not a disaster. 

The problem isn't that the Sabres are in a state of disaster. The issue is whether it has adequately advanced in their rebuild. There is a process in any rebuild. It can be excruciating to follow. It's not always linear. However, that doesn't mean that at this stage there shouldn't be a progression from the last year. The end of season playoff run left most of us positive about this year's playoff likelihood. From what has happened so far that upbeat feelings toward this season and playoff prospects have been dashed. Something is wrong when this team can be impressive against the best teams in the league one day, and then soon after struggle against the lower tier teams. The compete level and inconsistency that this team has shown so far shouldn't be tolerated. 

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

The problem isn't that the Sabres are in a state of disaster. The issue is whether it has adequately advanced in their rebuild. There is a process in any rebuild. It can be excruciating to follow. It's not always linear. However, that doesn't mean that at this stage there shouldn't be a progression from the last year. The end of season playoff run left most of us positive about this year's playoff likelihood. From what has happened so far that upbeat feelings toward this season and playoff prospects have been dashed. Something is wrong when this team can be impressive against the best teams in the league one day, and then soon after struggle against the lower tier teams. The compete level and inconsistency that this team has shown so far shouldn't be tolerated. 

That's not it for me. It's not about whether they are doing a little better or worse than last year, about an uneven progression, for me it's about HOW THEY PLAY. In that regard I see no progression at all. 

[mjd1001]

I keep going back and forth on 2 things....

1. Thompson and Cozens are the primary shortfall of scoring on this team. Skinner is giving you what you got last year.  Mitts is too.  Tuch was and has fallen off a bit but isn't a major shortfall.  Peterka has more than made up for him and VO's production from last year (maybe not MORE but it is the same combined). And this team is giving up less goals per game.  SO, MOST Other things are the same, its just Thompson and Cozens that need to get fixed.  BUT.....then I think with the number of high draft picks on this team, the years already of development....you should NOT Have to rely on those to guys giving you 75-80 goals in a season to be good enough to make the playoffs.

So, sure, Thompson and Cozens are the major difference between this year and last year....but on the other hand...It SHOULDN'T be reliant on those two players.

[JohnC]

8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

That's not it for me. It's not about whether they are doing a little better or worse than last year, about an uneven progression, for me it's about HOW THEY PLAY. In that regard I see no progression at all. 

Your response makes absolutely no sense to me. Progression from last year would mean that this team would be playing better/improved play and be in the thick of a playoff run. What you are basically saying is that you agree with me, and then conclude that you disagree with me. That is nonsensical reasoning. This is what happens when someone is too robotic and programmed with all their responses to all questions and comments. You may not be aware of it but a difference without a difference is no difference. 🙃

Edited January 2 by JohnC

[SwampD]

12 hours ago, JohnC said:

The issue for me isn't the over-reliance on young players. I still believe that it was/is the right approach. However, there still was a need to bring in the right veteran players to support the youngsters. And as I said in previous posts (as others have also stated) there isn't the right mix of players on this roster. There are too many perimeter players and not enough stalwarts battling around the net. That was classically evident in the Ottawa game where the 40 plus shots on net were easily seen by their goalie due to little obstruction. It's been like that all season. 

 

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

Your response makes absolutely no sense to me. Progression from last year would mean that this team would be playing better/improved play and be in the thick of a playoff run. What you are basically saying is that you agree with me, and then conclude that you disagree with me. That is nonsensical reasoning. This is what happens when someone is too robotic and programmed with all their responses to all questions and comments. You may not be aware of it but a difference without a difference is no difference. 🙃

Dude.