GDT: The real semifinal. Round 3.

[miles]

reinhart looked very good last night. fighting for possession and really working hard. 

 

not to look back, but i feel that he didnt play this hard in buffalo

 

 

also, i have to say im rooting for every team except vegas...stupid eichel

Edited May 23, 2023 by miles

[Pimlach]

2 minutes ago, miles said:

reinhart looked very good last night. fighting for possession and really working hard. 

 

not to look back, but i feel that he didnt play this hard in buffalo

 

 

also, i have to say im rooting for every team except vegas...stupid eichel

Well, you are looking back.  A lot of people are because so many former players are doing well on their new teams. 

Why single out Reinhart, when no one on the Sabres played this hard (as in playoff level hard) during those years?  The playoffs are another level of competition, one that they did not ever experience.  

 

[Pimlach]

10 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

I just think that, if the rule centers around whoever wins the race or projects to win the race to the puck, the refs get that call wrong laughably often. Oh, and you can't review THAT line infraction if the ensuing faceoff leads to a goal, but you can review the other line infraction 

 

I like the original rule.  Play it out the old school way.

now it is a judgement call, so there will be times they judge it wrong.  

[JustOneParade]

3 hours ago, French Collection said:

First time he looks like $10M Bob since he signed that deal.

He’s definitely dialed in, just like his Vezina years. One more round like this and he adds a Conn Smythe to his trophy case.

Bob v. Canes in this series: .978 SV%.  🔥🏆

[Doohickie]

12 hours ago, jad1 said:

Samson will be fine.

Not only did he score but he was out on the ice late to protect the lead.

[Doohickie]

3 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Hey I never wanted him to go. I had hope that he would have liked Granato enough to stick around. But it was too late for that.

I think Kevyn saw him as part of the Eichel clique that needed to go. To me the 1 yr deal he gave Reino was the first concrete indication of the changes to come. 

[GoPuckYourself]

2 hours ago, miles said:

reinhart looked very good last night. fighting for possession and really working hard. 

 

not to look back, but i feel that he didnt play this hard in buffalo

 

 

also, i have to say im rooting for every team except vegas...stupid eichel

This is so true, I don’t think most of these guys played as hard as when they were here. Maybe it was all the losing that just beat them down but my theory is that they didn’t have to be the man when they were traded, Eichel didn’t have to be the captain savior, Florida had plenty of top guys where Reinhart just needed to fit in, same with Montour etc.

[French Collection]

1 hour ago, GoPuckYourself said:

This is so true, I don’t think most of these guys played as hard as when they were here. Maybe it was all the losing that just beat them down but my theory is that they didn’t have to be the man when they were traded, Eichel didn’t have to be the captain savior, Florida had plenty of top guys where Reinhart just needed to fit in, same with Montour etc.

A lot of truth to this.

Reinhart is on the third line in Florida. He gets a lot of points on PP1 but also gets good matchups at 5v5.

Montour took Weegar’s ice time + was elevated above Ekblad on the PP.

[JohnC]

4 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I like the original rule.  Play it out the old school way.

now it is a judgement call, so there will be times they judge it wrong.  

I'm old but not old school. Allowing players to play it out creates more opportunities for players to needlessly get hurt. Do referees sometimes get the icing call wrong? Of course they do. So what. A lot of judgment calls are wrongly called during the game. In this case player safety concerns trump the old icing rule. There are plenty of situations where players can get hurt. This shouldn't be one of them. 

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I'm old but not old school. Allowing players to play it out creates more opportunities for players to needlessly get hurt. Do referees sometimes get the icing call wrong? Of course they do. So what. A lot of judgment calls are wrongly called during the game. In this case player safety concerns trump the old icing rule. There are plenty of situations where players can get hurt. This shouldn't be one of them. 

I agree.  I’m also not the one complaining about the missed calls.  Just stating that judgement calls will be wrong at times, and sometimes they are crucial and can cost you a goal because defensive zone face offs are important. 
 

If the league was worried about player safety they could do a lot more than this silly rule.  

Edited May 23, 2023 by Pimlach

[Zamboni]

3 hours ago, GoPuckYourself said:

This is so true, I don’t think most of these guys played as hard as when they were here. Maybe it was all the losing that just beat them down but my theory is that they didn’t have to be the man when they were traded, Eichel didn’t have to be the captain savior, Florida had plenty of top guys where Reinhart just needed to fit in, same with Montour etc.

And like a lot of players do … They elevate their play in the playoffs. some play slightly out of character. As Gretzky would say… Some of the leafs players were on milk cartons.

[Thorny]

7 hours ago, miles said:

reinhart looked very good last night. fighting for possession and really working hard. 

 

not to look back, but i feel that he didnt play this hard in buffalo

 

 

also, i have to say im rooting for every team except vegas...stupid eichel

He did 

[Thorny]

5 hours ago, GoPuckYourself said:

This is so true, I don’t think most of these guys played as hard as when they were here. Maybe it was all the losing that just beat them down but my theory is that they didn’t have to be the man when they were traded, Eichel didn’t have to be the captain savior, Florida had plenty of top guys where Reinhart just needed to fit in, same with Montour etc.

Granato, who everyone is singing the praises of, frequently *lauded* Reinhart’s efforts and leadership ability. 
 

We need to stop carrying weight for bad GMs who built bad teams. It’s ok, they can’t hurt you anymore. Adams is here. Shhhhhhh. 

3 hours ago, French Collection said:

A lot of truth to this.

Reinhart is on the third line in Florida. He gets a lot of points on PP1 but also gets good matchups at 5v5.

Montour took Weegar’s ice time + was elevated above Ekblad on the PP.

These guys getting more favourable roles and matchups is a totally different point to the “these guys didn’t play hard” bit, tho

Edited May 23, 2023 by Thorny

[PromoTheRobot]

9 minutes ago, Thorny said:

He did 

I thought Sam played his ass off under Granato.

Edited May 23, 2023 by PromoTheRobot

[LGR4GM]

Sam Reinhart will never get the credit he deserves here. He had the game winning assist and game winning goal in the last 2 games.  Sadly too many ppl wrote him off early and didn't like his play style. He's always been effective and efficient. He's on the Florida 3rd line because he's defensively more responsible and helps Lundell. Oh well, doesn't really matter now. 

Considering Adams went out of his way to talk to Reinhart after his trade maybe Reinhart did try and did care but the other toxic turds drowned him out. 

[Thorny]

13 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Sam Reinhart will never get the credit he deserves here. He had the game winning assist and game winning goal in the last 2 games.  Sadly too many ppl wrote him off early and didn't like his play style. He's always been effective and efficient. He's on the Florida 3rd line because he's defensively more responsible and helps Lundell. Oh well, doesn't really matter now. 

Considering Adams went out of his way to talk to Reinhart after his trade maybe Reinhart did try and did care but the other toxic turds drowned him out. 

I think he just played on bad teams tbh. Poorly assembled. I know the culture has changed but so too has the overall talent level. All that stuff we all said about the rosters not being good enough, about Mojo and Sobotka being clearly insufficient as a line 2, like from training camp.. all that stuff is still true. The culture was a symptom of talent lacking teams for far too long. I don’t think we just randomly drafted/traded for a bunch of ******. There’s a few exceptions, notably enhanced by bad timing, but by and large it’s not that there was a surplus of toxicity, what we had imo was an absence of leadership. I think @Weavementions this a lot, unless I’m mistaken. Our prized draft picks coming into, largely, a talent AND leadership *void* (Notably and especially, lacking veteran leaders who were *still good*). Which, through losing, fosters the growth of the seeds  of poor culture. 

It all comes back to Murray and Botterill and whoever’s decision it was to scorched-earth tank. I don’t know that I have it in me to blame any single one player. Not after 10 000 posts ripping management for a decade. 

not even Brad Boyes

Edited May 23, 2023 by Thorny

[Weave]

4 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I think he just played on bad teams tbh. Poorly assembled. I know the culture has changed but so too has the overall talent level. All that stuff we all said about the rosters not being good enough, about Mojo and Sobotka being clearly insufficient as a line 2, like from training camp.. all that stuff is still true. The culture was a symptom of talent lacking teams for far too long. I don’t think we just randomly drafted/traded for a bunch of ******. There’s a few exceptions, notably enhanced by bad timing, but by and large it’s not that there was a surplus of toxicity, what we had imo was an absence of leadership. I think @Weavementions this a lot, unless I’m mistaken. Our prized draft picks coming into, largely, a talent AND leadership *void* (Notably and especially, lacking veteran leaders who were *still good*). Which, through losing, fosters the growth of the seeds  of poor culture. 

It all comes back to Murray and Botterill and whoever’s decision it was to scorched-earth tank. I don’t know that I have it in me to blame any single one player. Not after 10 000 posts ripping management for a decade. 

not even Brad Boyes

@Thorny You remember correctly.  The biggest mistake of the tank (other than the tank itself) was bringing in a bunch of high end kids when the environment around them was leaderless and talentless.  It’s the opposite of what Pburgh did for Crosby.

I wont fault GMTM for turning some of our draft capital into mid career, talented veterans.  We needed prime of career veteran leadership to get Sam and Jack started. And sticking with just drafting to fill out the team would have taken us to where we are today anyway.  And we all know that it took half that time for Sam and Jack to be done with Buffalo. I do fault GMTMs choices though.  The concept of Kane and Bogo were correct.  Kane and Bogo, not so much.

[GoPuckYourself]

3 hours ago, Weave said:

@Thorny You remember correctly.  The biggest mistake of the tank (other than the tank itself) was bringing in a bunch of high end kids when the environment around them was leaderless and talentless.  It’s the opposite of what Pburgh did for Crosby.

I wont fault GMTM for turning some of our draft capital into mid career, talented veterans.  We needed prime of career veteran leadership to get Sam and Jack started. And sticking with just drafting to fill out the team would have taken us to where we are today anyway.  And we all know that it took half that time for Sam and Jack to be done with Buffalo. I do fault GMTMs choices though.  The concept of Kane and Bogo were correct.  Kane and Bogo, not so much.

I just don't agree with the leaderless theory, when we drafted Eichel our captain was Brian Gionta, we also had Matt Moulson, Ryan O'Reilly and Josh Gorges who all wore a letter for the teams they came over from. 

[Thorny]

Vegas looking like the team to beat 

[Eleven]

10 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Vegas looking like the team to beat 

No, it really isn't.  This series is SO SLOOOOOWWWWWWWWWW

Florida is going to make Vegas play hockey.

[Thorny]

Just now, Eleven said:

No, it really isn't.  This series is SO SLOOOOOWWWWWWWWWW

Florida is going to make Vegas play hockey.

Huh? 

Florida is getting their ass handed to them while Carolina gets goalied lol

I’m sure the two final 4 teams out west are actually bad and slow and they just don’t have those sabres vi1bes lol

[Thorny]

22 minutes ago, GoPuckYourself said:

I just don't agree with the leaderless theory, when we drafted Eichel our captain was Brian Gionta, we also had Matt Moulson, Ryan O'Reilly and Josh Gorges who all wore a letter for the teams they came over from. 

3/4 being pylons on ice that year is more deserving of the “slow” designation. The key as mentioned was veterans who could actually still play thus commanding respect. The roster was bad. We don’t need to have a retroactive conversation that oh wait we were actually good, It’s all jack and sam’s fault, whatever. This debate should be over. We built bad teams. How many guys need to blossom in other organizations before we put aside our bias and acknowledge it? 
 

times have changed - if the organization was capable of realizing what went wrong surely we can. I don’t see the need to pretend Eichel and Sam couldn’t have been good here because it makes one feel better. Is this the new thing? “Ok they are good, I admit it....but it couldn’t have happened here!” That’s just FOMO.

Ya, it could have. It just didn’t because the people actually in charge did a putrid job. 

Edited May 24, 2023 by Thorny

[Eleven]

9 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Huh? 

Florida is getting their ass handed to them while Carolina gets goalied lol

I’m sure the two final 4 teams out west are actually bad and slow and they just don’t have those sabres vi1bes lol

Relax.  I'm not the only poster who has commented that the WC semi is the slowest and least urgent semifinal in ages.

 

[Thorny]

Just now, Eleven said:

Relax.  I'm not the only poster who has commented that the WC semi is the slowest and least urgent semifinal in ages.

 

Me taking the Mickey out of this place IS me relaxing 

[Thorny]

3 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Relax.  I'm not the only poster who has commented that the WC semi is the slowest and least urgent semifinal in ages.

 

Vegas was quicker, by far, than Edmonton at even strength. Did the fastest team in the league decide to have no urgency, round 2? Vegas manipulates the pace, it’s not a “lack of urgency” or some other thing we need to invent to downplay their success 

Or Dallas for that matter