Rasmus_ Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said: I've watched Stillman play and he is Fitz. The advanced stats and the eye test match. To me using an asset, any asset, to acquire him is a waste. I don't care about whether or not Bloom makes it, but considering he lost a year of development to COVID, then fought through injuries and has blossomed since being traded, made we want to see him develop further. From a general sense, I don't mind moving on from a few forward prospects to help the defense, but I actually wanted someone to help the defense get better now or in the future. Stillman does neither of those things. If you have never seen him play, you'll understand as soon as you do. @dudacek who has watched him often with the Nucks out in Van feels the same way about Stillman the player. As I've said previously, hopefully, this is a precursor to an actual upgrade. Here is a really nice write-up on Bloom. https://thehockeynews.com/news/the-sabres-have-a-hidden-gem-in-josh-bloom Bloom is an excellent skater, a developing scorer, and the Sabres must have believed in him because they signed him last year even though they didn't need to. Vancouver is my other team, I watch nearly every game. He's been one of the worst defensemen on a team full of deplorable defensemen. It's a meh move. Hopefully they use him in the right fits, to add physicality, but don't ask him to do more than that. I agree 100% on the comparison to Fitzgerald, I think he's a downgrade on Fitzgerald. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrenchConnection44 Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 Well … we shall see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrenchConnection44 Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 1 hour ago, Thorny said: Bloom has 42 points in 40 OHL games since being dealt, playing in the league two years after being drafted, like if Savoie played in the CHL next year he didn’t blossom, he returned to the type of production tantamount to being the bare minimum to retain status as a prospect with a reasonably likely chance, relative to other prospects of his ilk, of developing into a depth NHLer, several years from now Totally fair. It pained me enough I threw in the “even for a guy” bit not named Stacey, no As I pointed out in the Prospect thread, Bloom has really not had much more time against older competition than Savoie has; and it does not take into account that Bloom missed all of 2020 because of Covid restrictions in Canada. And significantly improved after that. I am okay trading Bloom but for more a than a #6-7 defenseman on a team whose defenders fall off dramatically after 5. Nevertheless, as with every trade or draft pick, there is no way to determine whether it was a useful one or not for at least a couple of years if not more. So there’s no real argument one way or another other than spitballing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 3 minutes ago, FrenchConnection44 said: As I pointed out in the Prospect thread, Bloom has really not had much more time against older competition than Savoie has; and it does not take into account that Bloom missed all of 2020 because of Covid restrictions in Canada. And significantly improved after that. I am okay trading Bloom but for more a than a #6-7 defenseman on a team whose defenders fall off dramatically after 5. Nevertheless, as with every trade or draft pick, there is no way to determine whether it was a useful one or not for at least a couple of years if not more. So there’s no real argument one way or another other than spitballing. I’m just glad Adams agreed with me on Bloom, anyways. wish the kid success Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 From the athletic’s Matt Fairburn Quote His underlying metrics haven’t been great the past two seasons. His teams have allowed 58 percent of the high-danger scoring chances with him on the ice at five-on-five, according to Natural Stat Trick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerreaultForever Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 1 hour ago, Thorny said: Personally I never really pay much attention to the audience score on rotten tomatoes Well I do and I don't. But it's really no different than listening to the people around here. The thing about this I'm noticing is there isn't any dissent. It isn't like 5 happy with the trade 1 against or whatever, it's every single post is some level of happiness on their side, and on this side a lot of head scratching and speculation and even hope it's part of a bigger move that'll make it all make sense, cause at this moment, it doesn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 20 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said: Well I do and I don't. But it's really no different than listening to the people around here. The thing about this I'm noticing is there isn't any dissent. It isn't like 5 happy with the trade 1 against or whatever, it's every single post is some level of happiness on their side, and on this side a lot of head scratching and speculation and even hope it's part of a bigger move that'll make it all make sense, cause at this moment, it doesn't. I mostly agree with you, but context matters. Canuck fans hate and want to get rid of more than half their roster. Add being an actual fringe player to that situation and the message board response is predictable. Casey Fitzgerald didn't play enough to get universally hated here and it sounds like Stillman is basically the same player. I suspect he'll play a similar role and be regarded similarly by the fan base. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerreaultForever Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 31 minutes ago, dudacek said: I mostly agree with you, but context matters. Canuck fans hate and want to get rid of more than half their roster. Add being an actual fringe player to that situation and the message board response is predictable. Casey Fitzgerald didn't play enough to get universally hated here and it sounds like Stillman is basically the same player. I suspect he'll play a similar role and be regarded similarly by the fan base. He is similar to Fitz but with a higher price tag and we gave up a prospect to get him. I still say not claiming Mike Reilly when the Bruins waived him was a big mistake this year. He could have played in Bryson's spot all season. Knock at the time was he had a 4m ish contract and we would be stuck with him next year and now we traded for a bottom end guy with a 4m ish contract that we are stuck with for next year. I had hope for Bloom as, pardon the pun, a late bloomer that would be a gritty power forward somewhere down the line for us. Maybe not, but it's too soon to give up on him imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said: He is similar to Fitz but with a higher price tag and we gave up a prospect to get him. I still say not claiming Mike Reilly when the Bruins waived him was a big mistake this year. He could have played in Bryson's spot all season. Knock at the time was he had a 4m ish contract and we would be stuck with him next year and now we traded for a bottom end guy with a 4m ish contract that we are stuck with for next year. I had hope for Bloom as, pardon the pun, a late bloomer that would be a gritty power forward somewhere down the line for us. Maybe not, but it's too soon to give up on him imo. PuckPedia is showing his cap hit as $1.35 MM for this year and next. He is barely over an entry level cost to the Sabres. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 3 hours ago, PerreaultForever said: I still say not claiming Mike Reilly when the Bruins waived him was a big mistake this year. He could have played in Bryson's spot all season. Knock at the time was he had a 4m ish contract and we would be stuck with him next year and now we traded for a bottom end guy with a 4m ish contract that we are stuck with for next year. I had hope for Bloom as, pardon the pun, a late bloomer that would be a gritty power forward somewhere down the line for us. Maybe not, but it's too soon to give up on him imo. No we didn't. 2 hours ago, Taro T said: PuckPedia is showing his cap hit as $1.35 MM for this year and next. He is barely over an entry level cost to the Sabres. this is correct. He does NOT have a 4mil cap but 1.35m Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalonill Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 I still don't understand this trade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 16 minutes ago, Buffalonill said: I still don't understand this trade It’s Casey Fitzgerald’s replacement 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Lee Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 The logic of the trade is pretty clear, even if there is general disagreement amongst fans. The team needed to improve its depth on defence. The organization is not as down on Bryson and Clague as the fanbase is. The analytics department has their own data not available to the public and that data likes Stillman as a depth player. He has another year on his contract at an AAV that is not at all problematic. We gave up a prospect who was far down the depth chart in an area of surplus talent. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhenWillItEnd66 Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 I honestly cannot even lie that i know enough about either player to gauge. From what i have seen the analytics for Stillman are not horrible. You need to add at least some bump with the way the kids improve under our coaching. Jost came in as a waiver claim and seems to fit well as a 3rd/4th liner. I will have to give the benefit of the doubt to the Sabres as they are paying people who know a ton more about hockey players (Even obscure ones) then i do. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 1 hour ago, Buffalonill said: I still don't understand this trade How can you not understand the trade? This is a team that doesn’t have a 7th Dman they can put out there when needed that they have any confidence in last game, without Dahlin they played Bryson 13 mins and Clague 9 Stillman is a bottom pair guy at best but he has to be better than what they have 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalonill Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 21 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said: How can you not understand the trade? This is a team that doesn’t have a 7th Dman they can put out there when needed that they have any confidence in last game, without Dahlin they played Bryson 13 mins and Clague 9 Stillman is a bottom pair guy at best but he has to be better than what they have Hes not a uprage though That's my point . I would put them all in the same category Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 Just now, Buffalonill said: Hes not a uprage though That's my point . I would put them all in the same category Even if he is equivalent to Clague and Bryson, He is a better stylistic match for some opponents. In that regard, he IS an upgrade. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Train Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 32 minutes ago, Stormcloudmember66 said: I honestly cannot even lie that i know enough about either player to gauge. Nor does anyone else. Yes, he's an insurance policy. A very minor transaction. It's to avoid a D callup from Rochester, . He'll probably be thrown in the lineup at some point to replace someone that is banged up. Meanwhile, they may be trying to do something else. Not hard to figure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalonill Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 16 minutes ago, Weave said: Even if he is equivalent to Clague and Bryson, He is a better stylistic match for some opponents. In that regard, he IS an upgrade. still hoping they get jensen I would feel very very comfortable going into the playoff with him added 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 8 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said: I don't care about whether or not Bloom makes it So you're saying "It's the principle of the thing", is that it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottysabres Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 59 minutes ago, Archie Lee said: The logic of the trade is pretty clear, even if there is general disagreement amongst fans. The team needed to improve its depth on defence. The organization is not as down on Bryson and Clague as the fanbase is. The analytics department has their own data not available to the public and that data likes Stillman as a depth player. He has another year on his contract at an AAV that is not at all problematic. We gave up a prospect who was far down the depth chart in an area of surplus talent. You forgot, Stillman likes to bath with rubber ducky's, so....there's that at least Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Train Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 His underlying metrics haven’t been great the past two seasons. His teams have allowed 58 percent of the high-danger scoring chances with him on the ice at five-on-five, according to Natural Stat Trick. But those teams were the Blackhawks and Canucks, two underwhelming defensive teams. Defensive stats are rarely earned by one player. Stillman had better metrics when he played in Florida, and the Sabres are hoping to surround him with better teammates who could bring out that version of him. That's the rest of the Athletic comment. Not just the critical part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sidc3000 Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 7 hours ago, FrenchConnection44 said: Well … we shall see. doing friends a solid. Got it 👍 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centralparkhockey Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 Haven’t posted in years, but I’m here to say that I was up in Ottawa last week and happened to see North Bay play the 67’s. Watched for him closely and I only noticed Bloom skating on the power play. Perhaps he wasn’t developing as a well rounded player. Seems like Adams just jettisoned him. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
French Collection Posted February 28, 2023 Report Share Posted February 28, 2023 56 minutes ago, Weave said: Even if he is equivalent to Clague and Bryson, He is a better stylistic match for some opponents. In that regard, he IS an upgrade. Yeah, it’s better than bringing up Pilut. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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