2022 Offseason Game Plan

[GASabresIUFAN]

6 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

I don't agree with this at all.  At least 1 more NHL season will pass before Johnson signs.  Even if the Sabres manage to keep him, he'll almost certainly need at least 1 year in the A -- so at least 2 NHL seasons will elapse before the Sabres will know whether Johnson can handle a regular NHL role.  Meanwhile, Bryson is a guy who has already shown that he can do so, and will presumably improve with more experience over the next 2 seasons while we see what Johnson can do.

The truth is he is expendable now.  Since Power entered the lineup his PT has been reduced to 11-12 minutes a game.  This is someone easily replaced if necessary.  I like Bryson and like that he can play both sides, but if I need to trade him to get the RHD we need for Power, I’d do it in a heart beat.  

[Brawndo]

13 hours ago, JohnC said:

Who has been paired with Power other than Joki? 

 

He has spent time with Dahlin, Bryson, Samuelsson and Fitzgerald 

[nfreeman]

3 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

The truth is he is expendable now.  Since Power entered the lineup his PT has been reduced to 11-12 minutes a game.  This is someone easily replaced if necessary.  I like Bryson and like that he can play both sides, but if I need to trade him to get the RHD we need for Power, I’d do it in a heart beat.  

This is fair, and I agree that it would make sense to trade him as part of a package for a proven, good, young RHD.  I just don't think they'll move on from Bryson without a good, proven NHL defenseman to replace him.

[triumph_communes]

Relying on rookie upgrades reminds me of the sad Baptise/Bailey year of disappointment. Please don’t be round two. 
 

 

Bryson and Fitzgerald have no spot on a playoff team. We need to push them that far out for a successful off season. 

Edited April 26, 2022 by triumph_communes

[dudacek]

24 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

I don't agree with this at all.  At least 1 more NHL season will pass before Johnson signs.  Even if the Sabres manage to keep him, he'll almost certainly need at least 1 year in the A -- so at least 2 NHL seasons will elapse before the Sabres will know whether Johnson can handle a regular NHL role.  Meanwhile, Bryson is a guy who has already shown that he can do so, and will presumably improve with more experience over the next 2 seasons while we see what Johnson can do.

Couldn't agree more.

There really seems to be a lot of premature projecting going with Power, Mule, Joki, Bryson, Krebs, Mitts, Cozens, Quinn and Peterka.

Not only how good they will be and what role they will play, but also how the pieces should all fit together.

There's no need to rush anything here. Let's see what actually develops first.

This team has struggled without depth for so long, I'm shocked that at the first time we actually have some we can't wait to get rid of it.

Edited April 26, 2022 by dudacek

[sabresparaavida]

3 minutes ago, triumph_communes said:

Relying on rookie upgrades reminds me of the sad Baptise/Bailey year of disappointment. Please don’t be round two. 
 

 

Bryson and Fitzgerald have no spot on a playoff team. We need to push them that far out for a successful off season. 

Fitzgerald, I agree. He should be in the AHL, with perhaps a call up if we need him due to injuries. Bryson however, I think I’d a solid 7 Dman. He can play both sides and fill in on the third pairing on the cheap. I think he is great in that roll. A reminder that Bjork was on Boston, and frankly I’d rather have Bryson playing than Bjork.

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, Curt said:

What is this A/B business?  We have a numbering system for defensemen.  Is it not good enough?  What does this A/B stuff add?

To me it just looks like you are saying that you think Jokiharju is a 4, he is good enough to play in your top 4, but just barely.

When I categorize a player as a B player in comparison to an A player in the pairings, I'm looking at a player who is more of a support player who to a degree defers to the A player. And yes I do believe that Jokiharju is good enough to be in the top 4 group. Another example is Samuelsson on the first pairing with Dahlin is going to be a B player because Dahlin is going to be the more active player in the couple. I'll carry it out even further: Any defenseman paired with Dahlin is going to be a B player. Hope this clarifies the point I was attempting to make. 

[Curt]

36 minutes ago, JohnC said:

When I categorize a player as a B player in comparison to an A player in the pairings, I'm looking at a player who is more of a support player who to a degree defers to the A player. And yes I do believe that Jokiharju is good enough to be in the top 4 group. Another example is Samuelsson on the first pairing with Dahlin is going to be a B player because Dahlin is going to be the more active player in the couple. I'll carry it out even further: Any defenseman paired with Dahlin is going to be a B player. Hope this clarifies the point I was attempting to make. 

Leaves me with more  questions than answers.

An “A” player is more active than a “B” player in what areas of the game?

A “B” player defers to the “A” player in what areas of the game?

[JohnC]

4 minutes ago, Curt said:

Leaves me with more  questions than answers.

An “A” player is more active than a “B” player in what areas of the game?

A “B” player defers to the “A” player in what areas of the game?

It's obvious that a player paired with Dahlin is not going to carry the puck as much. 

In addition the player paired with Dahlin will have to be more defensive minded because Dahlin is going to be more aggressive on offense. 

Edited April 26, 2022 by JohnC

[Curt]

2 minutes ago, Curt said:

Leaves me with more  questions than answers.

An “A” player is more active than a “B” player in what areas of the game?

A “B” player defers to the “A” player in what areas of the game?

 

1 minute ago, JohnC said:

It's obvious that a player paired with Dahlin is not going to carry the puck as much. 

I would agree with that, everyone would, but it doesn’t help me to understand anything.

It would help me to understand what you mean with the A/B thing if you would answer the questions that I asked above.

Do your A/B designations apply only to which player is better at zone exits?

[JohnC]

47 minutes ago, Curt said:

 

I would agree with that, everyone would, but it doesn’t help me to understand anything.

It would help me to understand what you mean with the A/B thing if you would answer the questions that I asked above.

Do your A/B designations apply only to which player is better at zone exits?

If at this point you don't understand what I'm saying you never will. Find someone else to screw with. 

[Weave]

4 minutes ago, JohnC said:

If at this point you don't understand what I'm saying you never will. Find someone else to screw with. 

Probably would have been more diplomatic to say, “I can’t explain it any better”.

Ha! Me.  Diplomatic.  What a crock.

[JohnC]

7 minutes ago, Weave said:

Probably would have been more diplomatic to say, “I can’t explain it any better”.

Ha! Me.  Diplomatic.  What a crock.

I wasn't concerned about being diplomatic. 

[Curt]

14 minutes ago, JohnC said:

If at this point you don't understand what I'm saying you never will. Find someone else to screw with. 

I sincerely am not screwing with you.  I am just asking a couple simple questions in good faith to try to gain an understanding of what you are talking about.

If I had to guess right now, it seems that the A guy is just the more offensive of the pair and the B guy is the more defensive.  Is it anything more than that?

[Curt]

16 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I wasn't concerned about being diplomatic. 

I honestly don’t understand the hostility.  I was polite and I thought my questions were reasonable.

It seems that you invented a new set of terminology for categorizing NHL defensemen; A players and B players.

I apologize if this is not something brand new, if it’s something that I should already been familiar with, but did you not expect questions when you logged in and just started calling guys A players and B players?

I’m not asking questions to screw with you.  I’m asking questions because I’ve never seen anyone use these terms before and I’d like to understand exactly what they mean.

Edited April 26, 2022 by Curt

[JohnC]

2 minutes ago, Curt said:

I honestly don’t understand the hostility.  I was polite and I thought my questions were reasonable.

It seems that you invented a new set of terminology for categorizing NHL defensemen; A players and B players.

I apologize if this is not something brand new, if it’s something that I should already been familiar with, but did you not expect questions when you logged in and just started calling guys A players and B players?

There comes a point when the discussion ends up going in circles. That's what happened on this topic. When discussing putting together defensive pairs the issue isn't always who are your best players but what players fit together and complement each others strengths and weaknesses.  That issue/concern also is a consideration when putting together lines. I was attempting to point that out with the Dahlin example. Dahlin likes to carry the puck and sometimes on the offensive end create and force an offensive play. His partner has to be willing to be more defensive minded and conservative in order to give the primary player (A) player the space to assert himself. Joki playing with Dahlin, or anyone else paired with him, will have to play a more subordinate/supportive role (B) to the more dominant player. 

It also applies to the lines where sometimes you balance out a more offensive minded winger with a more defensive-minded and defensive responsible member on the line. I just don't see this as a brand new or perplexing concept to grasp. 

I apologize for the curtness (no pun intended) or hostile tone.  

[Crusader1969]

Kris Baker quoted in the athletic today

“On the topic of trading a top pick for a forward, Baker is not so keen.

“That would not only impede the need for depth up front but could potentially place barriers to entry for Jack Quinn and JJ Peterka,” Baker said. “This season was set up for the guys to play free and come together as a group.

“I don’t expect this to be wildly popular, but I’d be comfortable seeing what they can do to start next season, limit the tweaks and fill the obvious need in net.”

maybe I’m wrong here but I think this is the popular notion?   Goalie and a solid Dman.  - don’t block the path for the young forwards.   

[sabresparaavida]

21 hours ago, triumph_communes said:

Relying on rookie upgrades reminds me of the sad Baptise/Bailey year of disappointment. Please don’t be round two. 
 

 

Bryson and Fitzgerald have no spot on a playoff team. We need to push them that far out for a successful off season. 

Baptiste’s best AHL year he was 21/22 and got 41 points in 59 games.

Bailey’s best he was 45 in 70 or 36 in 52 in his 21 and 22 year old seasons (not counting last year where he slightly outperformed this at 25)

Quinn stats 59 points in 44 games at age 20.

JJP 64 points in 69 games at 19-20. 
 

Quinn and JJP are out producing their best seasons at a younger age, the worry should not be the same.

[GASabresIUFAN]

26 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Kris Baker quoted in the athletic today

“On the topic of trading a top pick for a forward, Baker is not so keen.

“That would not only impede the need for depth up front but could potentially place barriers to entry for Jack Quinn and JJ Peterka,” Baker said. “This season was set up for the guys to play free and come together as a group.

“I don’t expect this to be wildly popular, but I’d be comfortable seeing what they can do to start next season, limit the tweaks and fill the obvious need in net.”

maybe I’m wrong here but I think this is the popular notion?   Goalie and a solid Dman.  - don’t block the path for the young forwards.   

Acquiring a 4th line center won’t impede any of our young forwards.  I do agree on scoring forwards. 

[Crusader1969]

19 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Acquiring a 4th line center won’t impede any of our young forwards.  I do agree on scoring forwards. 

If the top 12 are 

Skinner , Tage, Tuch

JJ Cozens Quinn

Krebs Mitts Olofsson 

aplund Girgs Okposo 

who are you taking out of the lineup?

[Carmel Corn]

50 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

If the top 12 are 

Skinner , Tage, Tuch

JJ Cozens Quinn

Krebs Mitts Olofsson 

aplund Girgs Okposo 

who are you taking out of the lineup?

Injuries?  Just look at how many man-games were lost this season.  Maybe we re-sign Vinnie as well.

[Curt]

1 hour ago, Crusader1969 said:

If the top 12 are 

Skinner , Tage, Tuch

JJ Cozens Quinn

Krebs Mitts Olofsson 

aplund Girgs Okposo 

who are you taking out of the lineup?

I know that it seems most everyone is taking it as a given, but are we really 100% sure that Peterka is going to start next season in the NHL?  I know it’s a possibility, but I’m not convinced it’s a certainty.

[inkman]

23 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

The truth is he is expendable now.  Since Power entered the lineup his PT has been reduced to 11-12 minutes a game.  This is someone easily replaced if necessary.  I like Bryson and like that he can play both sides, but if I need to trade him to get the RHD we need for Power, I’d do it in a heart beat.  

My pants just got bigger realizing the Sabres can ice their top 4 for 50 minutes a game and they should.  Holy Schinkies.  
 

I’d still like a salty vet RHD who you can put in the top 4 to pair with either Power or Samuelsson.  Whoever isn’t with Dahlin.  

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, Crusader1969 said:

If the top 12 are 

Skinner , Tage, Tuch

JJ Cozens Quinn

Krebs Mitts Olofsson 

aplund Girgs Okposo 

who are you taking out of the lineup?

As I written before, I’d move on from Girgensons, but I acknowledge that’s unlikely. I also think Asplund is expendable in the right deal.  I would also re-sign Vinnie and waive Bjork.  DG utilized Eakin continually in the lineup to win key draws in late game situations, PP and PK.  His FO% was 56.1 this season, but he is unlikely to return next fall and there isn’t an adequate replacement for his faceoff skill on the roster.

Here are the % of our other centers, Girgensons 50.9, Cozens 45.3, Mitts 43.8, Asplund 42.6, TNT 40.5 and Krebs 35.6.  

There is also a question of whether JJP’s two way game is NHL ready.  

The Sabres are likely to carry 14 forwards next season for a variety of reasons including help getting to the cap floor, injury insurance and matchups.  This year the team used 22 different forwards to combat injuries.  Only 7 guys played most of the season (69 to 78 games).  Another 7 played 38 to 60 games. 4 more played 18-19 games. Of those 14 main forwards 3 are either gone or should be (Hayden, Bjork and Eakin). A 4th, Hinostroza, is a UFA and may not return.  That’s 4 potential roster spots.  Quinn is getting one and that is the only sure thing.  I think this uncertainty, the need for a good faceoff guy and the need for a cap hit opens the door for the acquisition of 2 way center for KO’s line. 

 

[LGR4GM]

4 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

As I written before, I’d move on from Girgensons, but I acknowledge that’s unlikely. I also think Asplund is expendable in the right deal.  I would also re-sign Vinnie and waive Bjork.  DG utilized Eakin continually in the lineup to win key draws in late game situations, PP and PK.  His FO% was 56.1 this season, but he is unlikely to return next fall and there isn’t an adequate replacement for his faceoff skill on the roster.

Here are the % of our other centers, Girgensons 50.9, Cozens 45.3, Mitts 43.8, Asplund 42.6, TNT 40.5 and Krebs 35.6.  

There is also a question of whether JJP’s two way game is NHL ready.  

The Sabres are likely to carry 14 forwards next season for a variety of reasons including help getting to the cap floor, injury insurance and matchups.  This year the team used 22 different forwards to combat injuries.  Only 7 guys played most of the season (69 to 78 games).  Another 7 played 38 to 60 games. 4 more played 18-19 games. Of those 14 main forwards 3 are either gone or should be (Hayden, Bjork and Eakin). A 4th, Hinostroza, is a UFA and may not return.  That’s 4 potential roster spots.  Quinn is getting one and that is the only sure thing.  I think this uncertainty, the need for a good faceoff guy and the need for a cap hit opens the door for the acquisition of 2 way center for KO’s line. 

 

So you would get rid of Asplund but you are in here complaining about losing Eakin because of his faceoff skills? holy *****.