Post your defenceman trade proposals here

[GASabresIUFAN]

 

 

Your views on upgrading the D for next season continue to be both very sensical and realistically achievable. We can potentially hope for better than Scandella, but even someone like him would provide a necessary and reasonable upgrade.

 

 

You seem surprised?  Wait! Don't answer that.

 

One thing we haven't really considered is the system knowledge of the team our new GM is coming from.  Botterill and Fenton both come from top notch organizations and their knowledge of the D in those organizations could be of great benefit to the Sabres.  For example.  Pitt is going to protect Letang, Maatta and Justin Schultz.  That leaves Ian Cole and Dumoulin unprotected.  I can see Cole both fitting in on the Sabres.    

[Thorny]

You seem surprised?  Wait! Don't answer that.

 

One thing we haven't really considered is the system knowledge of the team our new GM is coming from.  Botterill and Fenton both come from top notch organizations and their knowledge of the D in those organizations could be of great benefit to the Sabres.  For example.  Pitt is going to protect Letang, Maatta and Justin Schultz.  That leaves Ian Cole and Dumoulin unprotected.  I can see Cole both fitting in on the Sabres.

 

To the bolded: haha, no didn't mean it that way.

 

Hopefully whoever comes in as GM has a ready made plan of action he can start putting in place almost immediately. I'm hoping this is something Pegula is looking for in the interview process.

[Rasmus_]

LW Evander Kane for RHD Ryan Murphy

 

#8 overall pick in 2017 draft + Rasmus Asplund for LHD Cam Fowler, 3rd round pick in 2017

 

RHD Rasmus Ristolainen    LHD Cam Fowler

 

RHD Ryan Murphy               LHD Viktor Antipin

 

RHD Brendan Guhle              LHD Jake McCabe

 

Ryan Murphy is bordering on bust, and if that's what you want to trade Kane for, I'm a bit afraid of your future proposals.   Kane is worth a bit more than that.  The Fowler trade makes some sense, but I'm not as fond of him as others are.  

Edited May 5, 2017 by TheCerebral1

[dudacek]

Pretty sure he means Ryan Murray.

 

The Minnesota second to the Panthers for Mark Pysyk.

They aren't going to be protecting him.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Pretty sure he means Ryan Murray.

The Minnesota second to the Panthers for Mark Pysyk.

They aren't going to be protecting him.

Ok I'm in. What about our 3rd? Regardless, I like his puck possession game. What are you thinking, 2nd pairing with Antipin or 3rd pairing with Bogo? I'd kind of like a more physical player with Antipin, but if they can move the puck it might not matter. I think I'd still sign Quincey.

 

So...

McCabe Risto

Pysyk Antipin

Guhle Bogo

Falk Quincey

 

What about Alex Petrovic instead for the same price?

[krt88]

where did Bogo and Gorges go?  There contracts just magically disappeared?  Guess that meant Moulson stayed?  What about Ennis?

 

That's a lot of money you are dealing with.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Bogo was on the 3rd pair. Gorges is bought out or sent to the minors. If bought out, he only costs us 1.3 mill for the next two years. We save 2.6 this season, which more then pays for both Quincey and Falk. The following season we get a 540k rebate for CoHo, thus the net cost of Gorges's but out in year 2 is only about $750k. Not exactly a huge burden.

[Rasmus_]

Bogosian should be bought out if on the bottom pair at 5.136M  - gross.  

 

I'm good with Kane and a 3rd for Brodin if that can happen.  He showed an uptick in offense this past season and still has decent stick work.  He'd be an ideal pair mate for Ristolainen. 

[TrueBlueGED]

Bogosian should be bought out if on the bottom pair at 5.136M - gross.

You'd really rather pay him $2M every year for 6 years to go away than just stomach him on the 3rd pair for 3 years?

[Sabre fan]

instead of a trade I think I prefer top hold on to our assets (and re-sign kane) and maybe sign Antipin and then a free agent. There are some interesting names who will be available, such as Alzner, DelZotto and Stone who is big but skates well.I hate the thought of even thinking of giving up Sam or Evander, who was a BIG part of our offense, for help on the blueline. I am not sure any of us are ready for a big trade that sees us give up Sam or Evander

[Thorny]

Ok I'm in. What about our 3rd? Regardless, I like his puck possession game. What are you thinking, 2nd pairing with Antipin or 3rd pairing with Bogo? I'd kind of like a more physical player with Antipin, but if they can move the puck it might not matter. I think I'd still sign Quincey.

So...

McCabe Risto

Pysyk Antipin

Guhle Bogo

Falk Quincey

What about Alex Petrovic instead for the same price?

Pysyk plays the right side, doesn't he?

 

Either way, don't think he's enough of an upgrade for our D.

[nfreeman]

Bogo was on the 3rd pair. Gorges is bought out or sent to the minors. If bought out, he only costs us 1.3 mill for the next two years. We save 2.6 this season, which more then pays for both Quincey and Falk. The following season we get a 540k rebate for CoHo, thus the net cost of Gorges's but out in year 2 is only about $750k. Not exactly a huge burden.

 

Hodgson's rebate has zero to do with a cap hit on a Gorges buyout.  #Hammymath.

 

Separately:  here are my general thoughts:

 

- Anaheim isn't trading for Kane.  They are an internal budget team and will not add a big-money forward that is about to become a UFA. 

 

- I think it's much more likely that Anaheim pays Vegas not to take one of their defensemen than it is that they trade one in a hockey trade. As a related point, the possibility of them paying Vegas not to take one of their guys means, IMHO, that the price for getting one of their guys in a hockey trade will be quite high, and, if it's Fowler or Lindholm, will likely include TWO of Reinhart, Nylander and this year's #1 (or one of those items plus other valuable assets if it's Vatanen).

 

- The same is true for Nashville and Minnesota -- i.e. they are likely to proactively work something out with Vegas, and not to get cornered into having to trade a good young defenseman.  The same should be true of the Islanders, but they are chronically mismanaged, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if they butchered this too.

 

- Much of this will depend on whether the Sabres will expose Bogo in the draft, whether Vegas would rather take Bogo, Moulson, Ennis, Zemgus or Ullmark, and whether the new GM can or will pay Vegas to take Bogo.  If I'm Vegas I'm taking Ullmark or Zemgus unless the Sabres' GM gives me, say, a 2nd-round pick to take Bogo, Moulson or Ennis.

 

- There's a reason Pysyk isn't going to get protected, one year after FLA traded for him.

[thewookie1]

Hodgson's rebate has zero to do with a cap hit on a Gorges buyout. #Hammymath.

 

Separately: here are my general thoughts:

 

- Anaheim isn't trading for Kane. They are an internal budget team and will not add a big-money forward that is about to become a UFA.

 

- I think it's much more likely that Anaheim pays Vegas not to take one of their defensemen than it is that they trade one in a hockey trade. As a related point, the possibility of them paying Vegas not to take one of their guys means, IMHO, that the price for getting one of their guys in a hockey trade will be quite high, and, if it's Fowler or Lindholm, will likely include TWO of Reinhart, Nylander and this year's #1 (or one of those items plus other valuable assets if it's Vatanen).

 

- The same is true for Nashville and Minnesota -- i.e. they are likely to proactively work something out with Vegas, and not to get cornered into having to trade a good young defenseman. The same should be true of the Islanders, but they are chronically mismanaged, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if they butchered this too.

 

- Much of this will depend on whether the Sabres will expose Bogo in the draft, whether Vegas would rather take Bogo, Moulson, Ennis, Zemgus or Ullmark, and whether the new GM can or will pay Vegas to take Bogo. If I'm Vegas I'm taking Ullmark or Zemgus unless the Sabres' GM gives me, say, a 2nd-round pick to take Bogo, Moulson or Ennis.

 

- There's a reason Pysyk isn't going to get protected, one year after FLA traded for him.

I certainly hope you are wrong since in that case next year will probably have a very similar roster to this years

[dudacek]

I certainly hope you are wrong since in that case next year will probably have a very similar roster to this years

Damn! Was hoping for a Wookie trade proposal!

 

@Freeman. I will be stunned if one of Lindholm, Fowler or Vatanen is not traded.

It's poor asset management to invest $18 million in three defencemen when you have an internal cap and kids like Montour and Theodore on cheap contracts. Bob Murray is a smart guy.

[TrueBlueGED]

Damn! Was hoping for a Wookie trade proposal!

 

@Freeman. I will be stunned if one of Lindholm, Fowler or Vatanen is not traded.

It's poor asset management to invest $18 million in three defencemen when you have an internal cap and kids like Montour and Theodore on cheap contracts. Bob Murray is a smart guy.

I also think the price Vegas would demand to not take a bonafide mid-20s top-4 Dman on a cost controlled 3-4 year contract would be fairly exorbitant. I think the teams with expansion draft issues would likely be better served by making a hockey trade to protect the players they don't want to lose. Also, a team like Minnesota that is getting bounced in round 1-2 all the time may desire a shakeup anyway. If Dumba gets a Zaitsev-like contract, Minnesota is investing about $26M in five defensemen, while their forward group rapidly ages. That's a team that could really use to flip some roster allocation. Edited May 5, 2017 by TrueBlueGED

[nfreeman]

Damn! Was hoping for a Wookie trade proposal!

 

@Freeman. I will be stunned if one of Lindholm, Fowler or Vatanen is not traded.

It's poor asset management to invest $18 million in three defencemen when you have an internal cap and kids like Montour and Theodore on cheap contracts. Bob Murray is a smart guy.

 

Well, Lindholm and Vatanen cost $10.1MM in total.  How much do you think Fowler will cost?  More than $6MM?

 

I think $16MM for a strong top 3 D group is pretty reasonable.

 

I also think the price Vegas would demand to not take a bonafide mid-20s top-4 Dman on a cost controlled 3-4 year contract would be fairly exorbitant. I think the teams with expansion draft issues would likely be better served by making a hockey trade to protect the players they don't want to lose. Also, a team like Minnesota that is getting bounced in round 1-2 all the time may desire a shakeup anyway. If Dumba gets a Zaitsev-like contract, Minnesota is investing about $26M in five defensemen, while their forward group rapidly ages. That's a team that could really use to flip some roster allocation.

 

In a vacuum this is true but Anaheim (and Minny) have real leverage in the sense that they have the option, if Vegas demands too much, of making a hockey trade for what will almost certainly be a handsome return.

 

So if, say, Vegas demands a first-round pick in exchange for not taking exposed defenseman X, Anaheim has the option of trading defenseman X for, say, Nylander and a #1 next year.  Anaheim will certainly let Vegas know this, and Vegas will have to decide whether it prefers to settle for a #2 pick from Anaheim instead of zero.

 

It will be interesting to see how it plays out, to be sure.  I just don't think Anaheim is in an unescapeable corner.

[dudacek]

Hmm...

I was thinking 11 for Vatanen and Lindholm, and Fowler getting $7 on the open market.

But you're right, if Fowler takes a hometown discount they could get lucky and get three for $16.

 

That said, Manson, Montour and Theodore are all RFAs next summer too.

Something has got to give.

[nfreeman]

Regarding Anaheim's RFAs: I think good organizations wait this type of situation out and don't make important decisions before they need to. Guys get injured, guys backslide, guys explode and hit another level -- Anaheim will be able to gather plenty of additional info before they have to make contract decisions on their RFAs.

[Wyldnwoody44]

I'd trade Andrew Peters to whatever station Millbury is on for Mr Millbury..

 

Then, public tar and feathering.

 

 

 

Honestly, everyone is tradeable sans. Eichs, timmy hos, and blond pompador

[GoPuckYourself]

The Vegas Knights GM said he's open to accepting draft picks for players to be picked off the roster, how about a 2nd and 3rd round pick to take Moulson and Bogosian off our roster? Getting better by eliminating 2 ridiculous contracts and save 10.142M to spend on better assets. We'd only have to deal with the Gorges 3.9M contract for 1 more season.

[TrueBlueGED]

Regarding Anaheim's RFAs: I think good organizations wait this type of situation out and don't make important decisions before they need to. Guys get injured, guys backslide, guys explode and hit another level -- Anaheim will be able to gather plenty of additional info before they have to make contract decisions on their RFAs.

 

I think good organizations make smart decisions. Sometimes that will be taking things to the end of the line, sometimes it will be striking while the iron is hot. The Ducks could certainly use additional forward help (particularly if younger than their current group), and I think it makes sense to do so while trade skids are greased by expansion. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

Ana situation is very interesting.
1) They have 6 D signed for next year with contracts over $3 mil per season. They are Lindholm, Fowler, Vatanen, Bieksa, Despres and Stoner (both Stoner and Despres are off LTIR). Total cost $25.03 million. Beiksa has an NMC.
2) they also have 4 younger D ready for full time NHL duty including Manson, Theodore, Montour (all three currently on the Ducks) and top prospect Jacob Larsson. Each is under contract for next season with contracts ranging from 825K to 925K.
3) They have a full roster, except a backup goalie and no cap issues next season as they are currently at $70 and no significant RFAs or UFAs to re-sign.
4) Their only problems are making room for their 4 young D, getting younger and better on offense and who to lose in the expansion draft.
5) Buying out Bieksa would cost 1.35 per season for the next 2 years.

Option 1: If I were running the Ducks, the first step is buying out Bieksa on June 15 (expansion protected rosters are due 5pm on June 17). I'd then go to a 7-3-1 and this allows me to protect pretty much everyone, including Vatanen and Silfversberg except Manson. The biggest issue with this move is that I haven't yet improved the offense, but at least, I got younger and cheaper on D. Next saving about $1.7. ($2.7 savings on Bieksa less his replacement cost)

Option 2: Buyout Bieksa and then trade Vatanen and Stoner to us for Kane and Falk. Now Ana goes for 7-3-1 and protects Fowler, Lindholm and Manson, leaving only Falk exposed to the expansion draft. This series of moves makes the offense younger and better while making the D younger and cheaper (and maybe better) opens. roster spots Theodore and Montour, and saves about $3.0 ($10.7 in contracts traded or bought out - 5.25 for Kane and 2.4 for the 3 D's replacements).

There are other options, such as doing nothing and paying off LV to take who Ana wants, but I were LV I'd demand a huge price to take a Manson over Silfversberg or Vatenan, but this option seems silly when you can mostly avoid the issue by simply buying out Bieksa.

https://www.nhl.com/news/nhl-expansion-draft-rules/c-281010592. There is nothing in these rules prohibiting buyouts before expansion.

 

One other note:  Have we forgotten about Casey Nelson to soon?  

Edited May 7, 2017 by GASabresFan

[bunomatic]

Hodgson's rebate has zero to do with a cap hit on a Gorges buyout.  #Hammymath.

 

Separately:  here are my general thoughts:

 

- Anaheim isn't trading for Kane.  They are an internal budget team and will not add a big-money forward that is about to become a UFA. 

 

- I think it's much more likely that Anaheim pays Vegas not to take one of their defensemen than it is that they trade one in a hockey trade. As a related point, the possibility of them paying Vegas not to take one of their guys means, IMHO, that the price for getting one of their guys in a hockey trade will be quite high, and, if it's Fowler or Lindholm, will likely include TWO of Reinhart, Nylander and this year's #1 (or one of those items plus other valuable assets if it's Vatanen).

 

- The same is true for Nashville and Minnesota -- i.e. they are likely to proactively work something out with Vegas, and not to get cornered into having to trade a good young defenseman.  The same should be true of the Islanders, but they are chronically mismanaged, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if they butchered this too.

 

- Much of this will depend on whether the Sabres will expose Bogo in the draft, whether Vegas would rather take Bogo, Moulson, Ennis, Zemgus or Ullmark, and whether the new GM can or will pay Vegas to take Bogo.  If I'm Vegas I'm taking Ullmark or Zemgus unless the Sabres' GM gives me, say, a 2nd-round pick to take Bogo, Moulson or Ennis.

 

- There's a reason Pysyk isn't going to get protected, one year after FLA traded for him.

Is the going price for one of their D ( Fowler, Lindholm ) 3 first round picks ? Reinhart, Nylander and this years #1 ? Thats friggin steep.

[MattPie]

The Vegas Knights GM said he's open to accepting draft picks for players to be picked off the roster, how about a 2nd and 3rd round pick to take Moulson and Bogosian off our roster? Getting better by eliminating 2 ridiculous contracts and save 10.142M to spend on better assets. We'd only have to deal with the Gorges 3.9M contract for 1 more season.

 

I believe Vegas is required to select one, and only one, player from each team. Besides, LV does have to build an actual team so while they will apparently make deals with teams to not pick a particular guy, I'd bet you'll see more cases of LV picking a prospect in exchange for a pick rather than taking out some other team's garbage. For instance, LV could tell Buffalo "we're taking Zemgus unless you throw us a pick and we'll take Falk instead" (NOTE: I'm just throwing names in there, please don't eval that particular trade-off).

Is the going price for one of their D ( Fowler, Lindholm ) 3 first round picks ? Reinhart, Nylander and this years #1 ? Thats friggin steep.

 

He did say TWO of those three.

[bunomatic]

I believe Vegas is required to select one, and only one, player from each team. Besides, LV does have to build an actual team so while they will apparently make deals with teams to not pick a particular guy, I'd bet you'll see more cases of LV picking a prospect in exchange for a pick rather than taking out some other team's garbage. For instance, LV could tell Buffalo "we're taking Zemgus unless you throw us a pick and we'll take Falk instead" (NOTE: I'm just throwing names in there, please don't eval that particular trade-off).

 

He did say TWO of those three.

Ah gotcha. My reading comprehension something something...