Randall Flagg Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Fowler is not exceptional in any sense of the word. He's an adequate offensive D. I consider him the offensive d version of Gudbranson. Shrugs, he's not that special. I think he's a good top-4 defenseman, who has shown that he can log the most minutes on a team that's a game away from the Stanley Cup Final, but who may not necessarily be the best option for doing that (which is why we need Risto to hit his ceiling, which I think is made much easier by playing next to Fowler over Gorges or McCabe or Yandle or someone like that.) I also think that it's a far thing from a guarantee that any of these three prospects hit that level. It's certainly possible. But no one can be sure for years, and I want to get some winning in before Jack and Sam get off their ELCs, and I want proper development for Risto, and I think Fowler can help with all of these things and not leave us worse off down the road, because he's still young too. And like I said, I wouldn't feel comfortable guaranteeing that Chych/Juolevi/Serg ever hit that level in the first place. I don't see how anyone can look back on any past draft and come away ready to guarantee that. Roughly about the time of the eighth pick I estimate:) Gotcha. I can't wait until 830 AM, because the whole day should be crazy and fun. Sabres have 8th pick. Would it take that long? Not sure, i've missed the last few drafts live. Excited to be able to watch this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Roughly about the time of the eighth pick I estimate:) We should pick before 8pm. If each team has 10minutes to pick, 8 teams = 80minutes max and even with Bettman's intro, 8pm pick should land if not sooner. Toronto, Winnipeg, and Columbus already know who they are taking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 BPA. Position be damned. Yep. GMTM has said as much. You don't draft 18 year olds based on need. You fill out your roster with free agency and trades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 http://media.wgr550.com/a/115702733/6-22-sabres-amateur-scouting-director-greg-royce.htm? Amateur Scouting Director Greg Royce on wgr today. Murray had said that there are two defensemen and one forward they are looking at. Royce here describes Juolevi's hockey sense, and then says that Sergachev is "right there with Juolevi." Does this mean that those two are Tim's guys, and not Chychrun? I happen to hope so. He also doesn't mention hockey IQ when talking about Chychrun, while mentioning it with the other two, and calling it the most important element of a player's game. I have to think they want one of those two defensemen, and then Nylander or Keller or some forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude_Verret Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 I think Nylander if he's there, otherwise it's Juolevi or Sergachev. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted June 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 How much $$ do you think he'll get? If we can't afford a good, but not great, defenseman, then how can we ever sign these guys who have top pairing ceilings and Cam Fowler floors* when they develop, especially since by then Jack and Sam and Risto will be on their big contracts, where that won't necessarily be the case when Fowler is up? *Their floors are busting, like every other prospect, by the way He makes $4 million now and is thought to be a bargain at that price. I`d have to think some team will offer at least $6m for him. In 2 years you have Eichel, Reinhart and (Hopefully) Vesey coming off their ELC`s. Sabres already have to move out $$ in order to even attempt to pay Stamkos. I don`t mind trading for Fowler for 2 years, Im just not trading the 8th pick for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 We should pick before 8pm. If each team has 10minutes to pick, 8 teams = 80minutes max and even with Bettman's intro, 8pm pick should land if not sooner. Toronto, Winnipeg, and Columbus already know who they are taking. You forget the 20-30 min of advertising time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 You forget the 20-30 min of advertising time... But the clock doesn't stop running in the background. It just keeps rolling, so teams will submit their picks and be up on stage when they come back from commercial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ct fab Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 I think Nylander if he's there, otherwise it's Juolevi or Sergachev. I think it's Keller not Nylander to go along with Juol and serg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 http://media.wgr550.com/a/115702733/6-22-sabres-amateur-scouting-director-greg-royce.htm? Amateur Scouting Director Greg Royce on wgr today. Murray had said that there are two defensemen and one forward they are looking at. Royce here describes Juolevi's hockey sense, and then says that Sergachev is "right there with Juolevi." Does this mean that those two are Tim's guys, and not Chychrun? I happen to hope so. He also doesn't mention hockey IQ when talking about Chychrun, while mentioning it with the other two, and calling it the most important element of a player's game. I have to think they want one of those two defensemen, and then Nylander or Keller or some forward. I think the Sabres like Sergachev, which surprises me but it is the feeling I get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radar Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 BPA. Position be damned. This. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 I think the Sabres like Sergachev, which surprises me but it is the feeling I get. I feel the same way. I thought they had Chychrun in their top two, if not as their top guy, until I heard that. Now I think there's no chance we draft him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Sergachev would be really exciting. Some worry in there with how his game would translate, but there's no denying the offensive ability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3putt Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 I think the Sabres like Sergachev, which surprises me but it is the feeling I get. :worthy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ct fab Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Sergachev is my favorite dman, complete package. All the other dmen have a ? or two, he really doesn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabresith Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Have any of you ever watched a full game of Sergachev? Guy skates like Tyler Myers( not a compliment). Average offensive ability. Never really seen him give a full effort. Honestly, the last person I want to draft. If we stay at 8 my choice in order would be Nylander,Chychrun, Keller, then jolevi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 I feel the same way. I thought they had Chychrun in their top two, if not as their top guy, until I heard that. Now I think there's no chance we draft him. I don't believe a word any team says leading up to the draft. In fact, I usually believe the opposite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 I don't believe a word any team says leading up to the draft. In fact, I usually believe the opposite. Like Buddy used to say, "Everybody is trying to rob the same train." GO SABRES!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norcal Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 (edited) I don't believe a word any team says leading up to the draft. In fact, I usually believe the opposite.The fact that Chychrun wasn't mentioned is almost too easy to read between the lines. Oh the head games, is he or isn't he one of the targets?Give me Joulevi if they keep 8 for my two cents and send him back to juniors this year unquestionably. Let him dominate a year there, if he does he can replace Gorges next year. Edited June 22, 2016 by Murray's Rats Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorner Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 While I agree that Fowler is more of a top-4 than pure top pair...Risto's partner is currently a 3rd pair. Fowler is a monumental upgrade even if he's not perfect. This. So after a lot of thought, here's my wish list at 8, taking into account who has some non-trivial possibility of being there. Though none of the group would make me angry, I have a clear preference for the top three. Nylander Juolevi Keller Sergachev Chychrun Jost Do not want Brown, Bean, McLeod, or McAvoy. I have no idea how I'm ranking the guys around 8 anymore. So many interesting angles from all sides that I can't even venture to make a list. My main concern now is getting a young potential (or current) top 4 LHD in the system. Whether that's at #8 or someone like Fowler. It's all good to go BPA at 8 even if it's not a D, but then there has to be a trade. Can't go into next season with Gorges, McCabe and Colaiacovo as our LHD with Guhle as our best defensive prospect. Trading the 8th pick for Fowler would also be blasphemous. You can`t trade a top end D prospect, that has potential to be a high end top pair Dman for the next decade, for a good (not great) player with only 2 years left on his deal is CRAZY!!! I don`t mind adding Fowler but I`d be offering Girgensons, a lower draft pick and maybe a decent prospect. Yes you may have to be patient for the 8th pick to develop but his floor should be turning into Fowler, his ceiling is much much higher. I disagree. I don't think it's blasphemous at all to trade a chance at a great D (and also a chance at only a pretty good one) for a young, established, good offensive defenceman that fits our needs. Don't agree that all 3 D, or the one we choose necessarily has a ceiling higher than Fowler. And the floor could be lower. You're a lot higher on the D prospects than I am. These guys are not Ekblad, Hanifin, and Provorov. I'd be THRILLED if we took a defenseman and he winds up as good as Fowler is now, in four years. Agree with your posts on this matter. That`s good cause you will need him in 4 years since Fowler is a UFA in 2 and likely Sabres won`t have the $$ to re-sign him. As True pointed out, I believe we almost certainly would be able to sign him. There are multiple combinations of things that could happen with this draft and trades around it that I think would be good outcomes. One of the few I would not be thrilled with is drafting a forward at 8, and failing to swing a trade for a Dman. Signing Chris Russell or Brian Campbell and hoping Guhle pans out to be a top pairing LHD, or waiting for another draft year to get that solid LHD prospect in the system, when D already take a fair bit of time to develop, would be a mistake, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted June 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Have any of you ever watched a full game of Sergachev? Guy skates like Tyler Myers( not a compliment). Average offensive ability. Never really seen him give a full effort. Honestly, the last person I want to draft. If we stay at 8 my choice in order would be Nylander,Chychrun, Keller, then jolevi. I have - saw him twice this year, Once in Windsor and the other in Hamilton. Plus probably about 15 times on TV. I think he is fantastic. extremely nasty guy to play against, elite skating for a man of his size, and once a game (at least) will drive to the net and create either a scoring chance for himself or a teammate. Plus he can QB a power play and has a great shot, not much not to like. I don`t think anyone ever complayed about Tyler Myers skating for a guy that is 6`7 - it was his intelligence and compete level - neither should be a worry about Sergachev. I think I posted this before but Sergi had a slow start while adjusting to the NA rinks but after Halloween he plays 41 games and puts up 43 points. The only time his effort has been questioned is playing at the U18s when all but him and the guy from Q were suspended from Team Russia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorner Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 http://media.wgr550.com/a/115702733/6-22-sabres-amateur-scouting-director-greg-royce.htm? Amateur Scouting Director Greg Royce on wgr today. Murray had said that there are two defensemen and one forward they are looking at. Royce here describes Juolevi's hockey sense, and then says that Sergachev is "right there with Juolevi." Does this mean that those two are Tim's guys, and not Chychrun? I happen to hope so. He also doesn't mention hockey IQ when talking about Chychrun, while mentioning it with the other two, and calling it the most important element of a player's game. I have to think they want one of those two defensemen, and then Nylander or Keller or some forward. Just listened now. Unless there is some misdirection going on, Juolevi is their #1 D. Almost sure of it. And Sergachev is #2. I'm ok with this. One should be available at 8. The forward is likely Nylander. What's interesting is it's hard to say if they rank Nylander above or below the D. Judging by how close Royce made Juolevi and Sergachev sound, I doubt he's in between the two. I think their ranking is Juolevi at 6, Sergachev at 7, and Nylander at 8. They will take the highest of those three that's available, if they keep the pick. I also get the sense they really like Tkachuk, and would be willing to trade up, but won't give up a ton to do so. So it's probably unlikely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Maybe it happens but I'd still be very very surprised if Serg is our pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorner Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Maybe it happens but I'd still be very very surprised if Serg is our pick. I thought I would be too originally, but interestingly enough I'm going to come out and say I predict he is our pick. My guess: 1. TOR - Matthews 2. WIN - Laine 3. CBJ - Puljujarvi (Adam Devine) 4. EDM - Tkachuk 5. VAN - Dubois 6. CGY - Nylander 7. ARZ - Juolevi 8. BUF - SERGACHEV 9. MTL - Who Cares Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 22, 2016 Report Share Posted June 22, 2016 Part of me would be sad to see the "Murray hates Russians" meme die :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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