2023-2024 Sabres lineup

[GASabresIUFAN]

5 hours ago, dudacek said:

We're in this weird spot  where we have not:

• acquired a top D

Was Kevyn even really looking for a "top" D?  He was looking to make his roster harder to play against and get Power a legit partner.  He is taking a risk that Clifton can play up, but I don't think it's a huge risk because Clifton is at worst an upgrade on both ends of the ice over Joki.  KA is playing moneypuck.  From his perspective why pay a Dumba $6 mill a year when you can pay Clifton 3, probably get similar results, and leave cap space to sign the true D stars.  

Excepting Comrie, here are KA's last 5 significant moves.  He signed Lyubushkin, traded for Stillman and Greenway, signed Johnson and signed Clifton.  All these moves have been about upgrading the defense beyond the top 3 and or making us bigger, more physical, and harder to play against.

PS: I still hold out a faint hope for a goaltending upgrade.  As is I think we are a playoff team.  With additional goaltending help, I'd say we have top 3 Atlantic potential.  

Edited July 13, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN

[JohnC]

25 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Was Kevyn even really looking for a "top" D?  He was looking to make his roster harder to play against and get Power a legit partner.  He is taking a risk that Clifton can play up, but I don't think it's a huge risk because Clifton is at worst an upgrade on both ends of the ice over Joki.  KA is playing moneypuck.  From his perspective why pay a Dumba $6 mill a year when you can play Clifton 3, probably get similar results, and leave cap space to sign the true D stars.  

Excepting Comrie, here are KA's last 5 significant moves.  He signed Lyubushkin, traded for Stillman and Greenway, signed Johnson and signed Clifton.  All these moves have been about upgrading the defense beyond the top 3 and or making us bigger, more physical, and harder to play against.

PS: I still hold out a faint hope for a goaltending upgrade.  As is I think we are a playoff team.  With additional goaltending help, I'd say we have top 3 Atlantic potential.  

I would still like to add a 4/5 defenseman to the blueline unit. As you well know, I'm not bothered by our current staffing in net. Add another good third pairing player to the unit and upgrade the lower pairings. In my opinion, Dahlin and Power are playing too many minutes. There is a need to better distribute the minutes within all the pairings. 

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Was Kevyn even really looking for a "top" D?  He was looking to make his roster harder to play against and get Power a legit partner.  He is taking a risk that Clifton can play up, but I don't think it's a huge risk because Clifton is at worst an upgrade on both ends of the ice over Joki.  KA is playing moneypuck.  From his perspective why pay a Dumba $6 mill a year when you can play Clifton 3, probably get similar results, and leave cap space to sign the true D stars.  

Excepting Comrie, here are KA's last 5 significant moves.  He signed Lyubushkin, traded for Stillman and Greenway, signed Johnson and signed Clifton.  All these moves have been about upgrading the defense beyond the top 3 and or making us bigger, more physical, and harder to play against.

PS: I still hold out a faint hope for a goaltending upgrade.  As is I think we are a playoff team.  With additional goaltending help, I'd say we have top 3 Atlantic potential.  

The Sabres don't need a top D, we have Dahlin and Power.

[Taro T]

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

I would still like to add a 4/5 defenseman to the blueline unit. As you well know, I'm not bothered by our current staffing in net. Add another good third pairing player to the unit and upgrade the lower pairings. In my opinion, Dahlin and Power are playing too many minutes. There is a need to better distribute the minutes within all the pairings. 

Thought you were one of the posters that was fine with Jokiharju as Power's partner.  (If not, apologies.)  If so, how do you reconcile not considering Clifton enough of an upgrade at D with believing Jokiharju was/is good enough?

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, Taro T said:

Thought you were one of the posters that was fine with Jokiharju as Power's partner.  (If not, apologies.)  If so, how do you reconcile not considering Clifton enough of an upgrade at D with believing Jokiharju was/is good enough?

I am fine with Joki as Power's partner. And have said so many times. However, I have also said (many times) that if a better partner could be acquired to partner with Power, I would be fine with that. Why would I be against a better partner or even a forward replacing a lesser player? That's a sign that the roster is getting deeper and internal competition is ratcheting up. If Joki is moved down to the third pairing, then that pairing should be better than before. A roster with more talent is what every front office strives for. That's not only a good thing but also a situation that I'm not going to complain about. 

Is Joki a better partner for Power than Clifton is? I don't know. Players compete and determine where they should be slotted. And when the inevitable injuries occur the team with more depth handles the setbacks better. 

[Thorny]

On 7/13/2023 at 2:09 PM, GASabresIUFAN said:

Was Kevyn even really looking for a "top" D?  He was looking to make his roster harder to play against and get Power a legit partner.  He is taking a risk that Clifton can play up, but I don't think it's a huge risk because Clifton is at worst an upgrade on both ends of the ice over Joki.  KA is playing moneypuck.  From his perspective why pay a Dumba $6 mill a year when you can pay Clifton 3, probably get similar results, and leave cap space to sign the true D stars.  

Excepting Comrie, here are KA's last 5 significant moves.  He signed Lyubushkin, traded for Stillman and Greenway, signed Johnson and signed Clifton.  All these moves have been about upgrading the defense beyond the top 3 and or making us bigger, more physical, and harder to play against.

PS: I still hold out a faint hope for a goaltending upgrade.  As is I think we are a playoff team.  With additional goaltending help, I'd say we have top 3 Atlantic potential.  

The myth is that KA is acquiring the “moneypuck” guys so he can weaponize our cap space elsewhere.  The moneypuck guys are just the guys 

Edit If you meant signings as in Power Dahlin, I agree 

[GASabresIUFAN]

58 minutes ago, Thorny said:

The myth is that KA is acquiring the “moneypuck” guys so he can weaponize our cap space elsewhere.  The moneypuck guys are just the guys 

Edit If you meant signings as in Power Dahlin, I agree 

That is what I meant when is wrote "true D stars"

[Marvin]

Ominous thought: is the plan to start the season with 12F, 8D, and 3G?

[SABRES 0311]

3 minutes ago, Marvin said:

Ominous thought: is the plan to start the season with 12F, 8D, and 3G?

We still have training camp and preseason. I think it’s too early to tell what configuration we have opening night. 

[Taro T]

5 minutes ago, Marvin said:

Ominous thought: is the plan to start the season with 12F, 8D, and 3G?

Flat out can't see that being the plan and honestly believe the reason Tokarski is back is to have a 3rd goalie that they are ok with (not good with, but ok with) playing a couple of games if ABSOLUTELY necessary should whomever their preferred 3rd goalie is gets waiver claimed.

[Turbo44]

21 minutes ago, Marvin said:

Ominous thought: is the plan to start the season with 12F, 8D, and 3G?

  Nope:

2G, 13F, 8D as the roster is presently constructed.

I think they’d prefer 2G, 14F, 7D

My dream lineup:

Levi, Hart

dahlin, sammi, power, Clifton, Johnson, Boosh, stillman

tage, Tuch, skinner, middlestadt, cozens, Konencny, Tatar, Krebs, Peterka, greenway, jost, girgs, Okposo, savoie

joker and Oloffson traded away, Tatar signed UFA, Hart, konecny traded for

 

Edited July 16, 2023 by Turbo44

[GASabresIUFAN]

6 hours ago, Marvin said:

Ominous thought: is the plan to start the season with 12F, 8D, and 3G?

I think we are a long way from that conclusion.  If it's 12 forwards, I'd take that as a sign management has a great deal of faith in Kulich or Rousek stepping in if necessary.  In addition, Murray has NHL experience and they like Biro as well.  We'll also be getting Quinn back at some point.  

I do agree 8 D will be on the roster.  Last year's disaster with D injuries taught KA a valuable lesson; can't have enough capable D.  

I hope, like you do, that the 3 headed goalie monster is gone by the end of camp.  I still have a faint hope that a capable goalie is on the way at some point this off-season.

[Doohickie]

On 7/13/2023 at 2:39 PM, JohnC said:

Dahlin and Power are playing too many minutes.

The best defensemen typically do.

[JohnC]

28 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

The best defensemen typically do.

Of course, your best defensemen and even forwards are going to get the most minutes. But if you can lessen the minutes by two or three minutes for these workhorse players, it will have an accumulating effect as the grinding season winds on. Our best players are also playing on the PK and PP. I'm hoping that the additions of Clifton and Johnson could absorb some of those added minutes on the special teams. By upgrading the pairings and even forward lines I'm hoping that there will be a more balanced distribution of playing time. I'm not suggesting equal time as I am making the minutes less top heavy. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

https://theathletic.com/4696719/2023/07/17/sabres-roster-projection-depth-free-agency/

Here is their best guess of the opening night roster

L1 - Skinner TNT Tuch - Why mess with success?

L2 - JJP Cozens Mitts - is this a place for Kulich or Savoie to earn a roster spot?

Quote

For now, though, I’m projecting Mittelstadt to get the chance to play on the wing in the top six. Adding a playmaker like Mittelstadt alongside a play driver like Cozens and developing scorer like Peterka could help everyone involved. The way Mittelstadt finished last season, he’s earned a chance at a bigger role.

L3 - Greenway Krebs VO - Playmaker Krebs gets a sniper, and VO gets to play with 2 guys who play 200 Feet.

L4 - Girgensons Jost KO - 

Extras - Rousek and possibly Savoie

D1 - Samuelsson Dahlin

D2 - Power Clifton

D3 - Jokiharju Johnson

extra: Lyubushkin

Out: Stillman and Bryson - They could try to sneak one or both down to Rochester if TP is willing to carry the big salary in Rochester.  Joki has the most trade value.

Goalies - Levi and UPL - Comrie getting sent down or traded when camp ends.  

I think this is a logical view of the team as of today.  Imho UPL losses the goalie battle to Comrie for the backup job.  I also think they'll carry 8 D and the battle will be between Stillman and Clague for that job.  I also wonder if Jost goes to the 13th slot and Z moves to 4th line center opening a job for Rousek to play every day.

I also wonder if the D pairings might become more fluid in game.  For example, with the Sabres nursing a lead late, would Dg try a Johnson Samuelsson pairing to help shutdown an opponents top line?

Edited July 18, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN

[dudacek]

55 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

https://theathletic.com/4696719/2023/07/17/sabres-roster-projection-depth-free-agency/

Here is their best guess of the opening night roster

L1 - Skinner TNT Tuch - Why mess with success?

L2 - JJP Cozens Mitts - is this a place for Kulich or Savoie to earn a roster spot?

L3 - Greenway Krebs VO - Playmaker Krebs gets a sniper, and VO gets to play with 2 guys who play 200 Feet.

L4 - Girgensons Jost KO - 

Extras - Rousek and possibly Savoie

D1 - Samuelsson Dahlin

D2 - Power Clifton

D3 - Jokiharju Johnson

extra: Lyubushkin

Out: Stillman and Bryson - They could try to sneak one or both down to Rochester if TP is willing to carry the big salary in Rochester.  Joki has the most trade value.

Goalies - Levi and UPL - Comrie getting sent down or traded when camp ends.  

I think this is a logical view of the team as of today.  Imho UPL losses the goalie battle to Comrie for the backup job.  I also think they'll carry 8 D and the battle will be between Stillman and Clague for that job.  I also wonder if Jost goes to the 13th slot and Z moves to 4th line center opening a job for Rousek to play every day.

I also wonder if the D pairings might become more fluid in game.  For example, with the Sabres nursing a lead late, would Dg try a Johnson Samuelsson pairing to help shutdown an opponents top line?

To me, the bold sounded exactly like what Donnie was planning to do.

And not just during a game, but game to game too, depending on the opponent.

Clifton and Johnson offer elements that were missing for him tactically last year, and provide more of a trust factor.

As an aside, I love listening to Donnie talking hockey. There’s a deep well of knowledge there and all kinds of purpose - both tactically and in how to handle people.

It baffles me that some think he’s out of his depth.

[LGR4GM]

9 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

https://theathletic.com/4696719/2023/07/17/sabres-roster-projection-depth-free-agency/

Here is their best guess of the opening night roster

L1 - Skinner TNT Tuch - Why mess with success?

L2 - JJP Cozens Mitts - is this a place for Kulich or Savoie to earn a roster spot?

L3 - Greenway Krebs VO - Playmaker Krebs gets a sniper, and VO gets to play with 2 guys who play 200 Feet.

L4 - Girgensons Jost KO - 

Extras - Rousek and possibly Savoie

D1 - Samuelsson Dahlin

D2 - Power Clifton

D3 - Jokiharju Johnson

extra: Lyubushkin

Out: Stillman and Bryson - They could try to sneak one or both down to Rochester if TP is willing to carry the big salary in Rochester.  Joki has the most trade value.

Goalies - Levi and UPL - Comrie getting sent down or traded when camp ends.  

I think this is a logical view of the team as of today.  Imho UPL losses the goalie battle to Comrie for the backup job.  I also think they'll carry 8 D and the battle will be between Stillman and Clague for that job.  I also wonder if Jost goes to the 13th slot and Z moves to 4th line center opening a job for Rousek to play every day.

I also wonder if the D pairings might become more fluid in game.  For example, with the Sabres nursing a lead late, would Dg try a Johnson Samuelsson pairing to help shutdown an opponents top line?

The bold needs to end. Please go watch Kulich in Rochester, he was inconsistent and relied heavily on his shot for most of the year. He's not NHL ready and needs to stay in Rochester. He's become this overhyped player simply because he put up 46pts in 62 games which is less than JJP and Quinn did, and look at their rookie nhl years. If they bring Kulich up, it shows they didn't and don't care about development because he's not ready. 

Edited July 18, 2023 by LGR4GM

[JohnC]

8 hours ago, dudacek said:

To me, the bold sounded exactly like what Donnie was planning to do.

And not just during a game, but game to game too, depending on the opponent.

Clifton and Johnson offer elements that were missing for him tactically last year, and provide more of a trust factor.

As an aside, I love listening to Donnie talking hockey. There’s a deep well of knowledge there and all kinds of purpose - both tactically and in how to handle people.

It baffles me that some think he’s out of his depth.

You are right that he is great to listen to. I have often heard coach Don G on WGR and in his post-game comments. What sets him apart from many of his coaching colleagues is how he keenly listens to questions, and then with clarity answers them. He thinks before he speaks. It's not unusual for him to respond to a question by saying that's an interesting question. I haven't thought about the issue in the way you framed. He's more of a listener than an expansive talker. (Contrast to Krueger.)

What sets him apart from other coaches is that his coaching philosophy is more psychologically based than tactically base. That's not to say that he isn't well schooled in tactics because he is. But his strength as a coach is anchored in how well he works with individual players. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

38 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

The bold needs to end. Please go watch Kulich in Rochester, he was inconsistent and relied heavily on his shot for most of the year. He's not NHL ready and needs to stay in Rochester.

That was the Athletic opinion not mine. I was paraphrasing from the article.

Edited July 18, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN

[inkman]

44 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

The bold needs to end. Please go watch Kulich in Rochester, he was inconsistent and relied heavily on his shot for most of the year. He's not NHL ready and needs to stay in Rochester. He's become this overhyped player simply because he put up 46pts in 62 games which is less than JJP and Quinn did, and look at their rookie nhl years. If they bring Kulich up, it shows they didn't and don't care about development because he's not ready. 

I’m still thinking Rousek gets that spot.  

[GASabresIUFAN]

44 minutes ago, inkman said:

I’m still thinking Rousek gets that spot.  

On paper, he is the 13th forward as of right now.  The situation gets a little complicated if management wants to give Savoie or Benson a tryout. Personally I don't think either is NHL ready, but who knows for sure until we see them play.  

I also agree that Kulich isn't NHL ready either, but my guess is he will be by mid-season this coming year.  The very status quo forward groups in Buffalo and Rochester is an indication to me that management is confident it's forward depth in the system to help out if injuries hit.

[French Collection]

1 hour ago, inkman said:

I’m still thinking Rousek gets that spot.  

He is more mature and it is his time to give it a go.

The other guys mentioned could use more time to develop. Kulich could force his way into the l8neup by season’s end by taking another step in the AHL.

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

On paper, he is the 13th forward as of right now.  The situation gets a little complicated if management wants to give Savoie or Benson a tryout. Personally I don't think either is NHL ready, but who knows for sure until we see them play.  

I also agree that Kulich isn't NHL ready either, but my guess is he will be by mid-season this coming year.  The very status quo forward groups in Buffalo and Rochester is an indication to me that management is confident it's forward depth in the system to help out if injuries hit.

He or Jost.  And likely it's Rousek that isn't in the 12 man game day lineup but he could definitely force Granato's hand with a strong camp.

Expecting he'll come into camp ready to go knowing his opportunity is so close.  But it'll be interesting to see how much weight Kulich has put on over the summer.  He's definitely planning on stealing that roster spot from Rousek.  That should be a great battle to watch.

[Gatorman0519]

Looks like they are running back the same roster with slight defensive improvements. The loss of Quinn hurts the top 6.  I’m not slotting us in a playoff spot for sure at this point. Might still be a year away yet. 

[Randall Flagg]

12 minutes ago, Gatorman0519 said:

Looks like they are running back the same roster with slight defensive improvements. The loss of Quinn hurts the top 6.  I’m not slotting us in a playoff spot for sure at this point. Might still be a year away yet. 

If this is their team and it misses the playoffs this coming year, there is zero reason to believe they are only ONE year away then