2023-2024 Sabres lineup

[dudacek]

57 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said: Mitts-Cozens doesn't make sense to me and if Mitts is 3rd line, Cozens line is too weak. 

 

Mitts has the passing and the stickhandling, Dylan the transition game and the shot. They both work hard and can win contested pucks.

Why don’t they make sense?

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

 

Mitts has the passing and the stickhandling, Dylan the transition game and the shot. They both work hard and can win contested pucks.

Why don’t they make sense?

Two reasons. One, their skill sets overlap a little, but the line lacks a sniper imo. 

Ultimately without Quinn you have 5 top line players in Thompson, Cozens, Tuch, Skinner, Mitts (in that order of value) and it's the 6th guy that is really in question. The rest is a chemistry thing that Granato is best suited to figure out. 

[Thorny]

11 hours ago, Taro T said:

He played on the wing last season when recovering from an injury down the stretch.  There's 1 scenario where it happens.

And they were pretty strict with keeping Cozens at C, as far as I can remember. I’d actually be pretty surprised if he moved to wing, his game is perfect for the middle 200 foot wise 

[Thorny]

1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:

Two reasons. One, their skill sets overlap a little, but the line lacks a sniper imo. 

Ultimately without Quinn you have 5 top line players in Thompson, Cozens, Tuch, Skinner, Mitts (in that order of value) and it's the 6th guy that is really in question. The rest is a chemistry thing that Granato is best suited to figure out. 

Both Cozens and Mitts can pass and snipe 

[bob_sauve28]

So the data says we might regress in scoring? I’ve always found predictions difficult, especially ones about the future, as Yogi Bera said 

 

 

 

[Night Train]

[North Buffalo]

15 minutes ago, bob_sauve28 said:

So the data says we might regress in scoring? I’ve always found predictions difficult, especially ones about the future, as Yogi Bera said 

 

 

 

Or they could score more too... tis the silly season of stupid predictions... 😔 

[Weave]

Given the expectation that there will be more focus on team defense, I think it is most likely that we will see a reduction in team scoring.

[Taro T]

32 minutes ago, Weave said:

Given the expectation that there will be more focus on team defense, I think it is most likely that we will see a reduction in team scoring.

That, and the expectation that the Sabres seem to be viewed as a playoff caliber team around the NHL (whether they actually ARE a playoff team remains to be determined) they should be seeing starters 80%+ of the time on the road and 50%+ when at home.  Both of which are increases from last year.

Of course, as they'll be on a 100 point pace and not just a 90 point pace they should be getting more opportunities for EN goals.  Could also see more scoring as more guys get closer to their peaks and most the entire team is experienced in Granato's system.  Not expecting those to outweigh the decreases in scoring the other 2 should result but it isn't entirely out of the question.

[MISabresFan]

Forwards: Thompson, Cozens, Kulich, Mittelstadt, Tuch, Rousek, Savoie, Skinner, Olofson, Murray, Weisbach, Rosen

Defense: Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Clifton, E Johnson, Lyubushkin, Joki

Goalies - Levi, UPL

[Taro T]

5 minutes ago, MISabresFan said:

Forwards: Thompson, Cozens, Kulich, Mittelstadt, Tuch, Rousek, Savoie, Skinner, Olofson, Murray, Weisbach, Rosen

Defense: Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Clifton, E Johnson, Lyubushkin, Joki

Goalies - Levi, UPL

No Peterka, Krebs, nor Okposo, Girgensons, or Jost?

Interesting.

[WhenWillItEnd66]

9 minutes ago, MISabresFan said:

Forwards: Thompson, Cozens, Kulich, Mittelstadt, Tuch, Rousek, Savoie, Skinner, Olofson, Murray, Weisbach, Rosen

Defense: Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Clifton, E Johnson, Lyubushkin, Joki

Goalies - Levi, UPL

Those forwards would get killed defensively. Also not much grit in the forward lines. Missing quite a few players as well. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, Weave said:

Given the expectation that there will be more focus on team defense, I think it is most likely that we will see a reduction in team scoring.

Johnson commented on that when he was signed.  That was true when Trotz went to Washington, but in Colorado Johnson said that the greater focus on defense lead to greater puck possession which he says lead to more offense.  I checked the stats and his statement has merit.  Their GA/pg fell from 2.97 to 2.36 over the 3 years before their Cup run, while the offense went from 3.11 GF/gp to 3.52 over the same period.  In the Cup year the offense improved to 3.75, but the GA slipped a little to 2.83, but their differential was still +76.

If the Sabres were able to duplicate those results, the NHL better watch out as the Sabres scored 3.62 gf/gp last season. 

Edited July 12, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN

[Weave]

21 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Johnson commented on that when he was signed.  That was true when Trotz went to Washington, but in Colorado Johnson said that the greater focus on defense lead to greater puck possession which he says lead to more offense.  I checked the stats and his statement has merit.  Their GA/pg fell from 2.97 to 2.36 over the 3 years before their Cup run, while the offense went from 3.11 GF/gp to 3.52 over the same period.  In the Cup year the offense improved to 3.75, but the GA slipped a little to 2.83, but their differential was still +76.

If the Sabres were able to duplicate those results, the NHL better watch out as the Sabres scored 3.62 gf/gp last season. 

We frequently used a fast break offense that thrived on long outlet passes.  I see long outlet passes being the exception next season.

[GASabresIUFAN]

3 minutes ago, Weave said:

We frequently used a fast break offense that thrived on long outlet passes.  I see long outlet passes being the exception next season.

That could indeed come to pass, but we also scored often by hemming teams in their D zone.  Maybe the increased puck possession Johnson speaks of leads to more “half court” type goals and therefore less reliance on the fast break?  From my perspective, I’m ok with a decrease in offense as long as it leads to a substantial decrease in GA and a significant + differential says of 35 to 40+.

[French Collection]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

That could indeed come to pass, but we also scored often by hemming teams in their D zone.  Maybe the increased puck possession Johnson speaks of leads to more “half court” type goals and therefore less reliance on the fast break?  From my perspective, I’m ok with a decrease in offense as long as it leads to a substantial decrease in GA and a significant + differential says of 35 to 40+.

I believe in the goal differential being a good indicator. Whether a team is offense or defense first, a positive goal differential usually means wins.

[Night Train]

8 hours ago, MISabresFan said:

Forwards: Thompson, Cozens, Kulich, Mittelstadt, Tuch, Rousek, Savoie, Skinner, Olofson, Murray, Weisbach, Rosen

Defense: Dahlin, Power, Samuelsson, Clifton, E Johnson, Lyubushkin, Joki

Goalies - Levi, UPL

This reminds me of Bottom 5 and his zeal to promote too many kids. Patience. 

[Turbo44]

8 hours ago, Taro T said:

No Peterka, Krebs, nor Okposo, Girgensons, or Jost?

Interesting.

And only 21 of 23 roster spots filled 

[Doohickie]

22 hours ago, Weave said:

Given the expectation that there will be more focus on team defense, I think it is most likely that we will see a reduction in team scoring.

Right and I also wonder if there's some cause-effect going on with high scoring teams who don't win (or get into the playoffs) focusing on defense the following year, almost like it's a self-fulfilling prophecy.  Hopefully their goal differential will be bigger this year; that's what I'd focus on; I don't care how you get there.

[French Collection]

I am still hoping for a trade involving VO. I am tired of watching him not compete, which is a buzzword KA and DG use a lot.

I know they would be giving up his 28 goals but I am ready to move on. The injury to Quinn further decreases Buffalo’s ability to score, but he will return sometime in the second half.

Increased defensive awareness with the acquisitions of Clifton and EJ will help the goal differential.

I am still hoping for a veteran partner for Levi but just Levi alone will help the goaltending. UPL/Comrie getting around .900 in sv% would be a step in the right direction if KA doesn’t make a move. Fingers crossed on that.

I expect JJP and Krebs to take a step forward, scoring wise, which would help offset the loss of Quinn. Krebs is not a goal scorer but his elevated play would set up more goals. Greenway scoring a few will help the offense remain potent.

Without an NHLer returned for VO, Jost, Rousek, Savoie and Kulich could all help by rotating in and contributing a bit until one of them steps up and claims a spot. If a guy like Rousek pots 10 goals but is a plus at 5v5 that is a step in the right direction. A Kulich audition on PP2 could yield Olofsson like results.

There are many possibilities for forward lines but I see DG keeping the TNT line intact. I see Mitts moving to the second line with Cozens and a rotation of Savoie, Kulich and Rousek to try and find a fit. Savoie gets his 9 game look and could mesh

Krebs and Greenway anchoring the third line get one of those 3 guys auditioning for a spot. I think Rousek settles in to that role with one of those

Jost could be moved up from 4C to try out on wing but I like him more on the 4th line and 13F.

If VO could return a veteran 4C that would make a solid 4th line with KO and Girgs. I believe KA will have to retain some salary on VO, which isn’t a big deal.

[dudacek]

We're in this weird spot  where we have not:

• acquired a top D
• added another goalie
• moved Olofsson

Yet Adams still gives off a vibe of 'we got better and we will be better"

I think there's a bit of poker happening here where Adams is trying to wait a few scenarios out yet has strengthened his hand enough he thinks the other guy should fold first.

I've moved into the territory of "moves could still happen, but don't count on it."

[French Collection]

Just now, dudacek said:

We're in this weird spot  where we have not:

• acquired a top D
• added another goalie
• moved Olofsson

Yet Adams still gives off a vibe of 'we got better and we will be better"

I think there's a bit of poker happening here where Adams is trying to wait a few scenarios out yet has strengthened his hand enough he thinks the other guy should fold first.

I've moved into the territory of "moves could still happen, but don't count on it."

Teams are tight against the salary cap, maybe he is waiting to “help” someone out.

My mind keeps coming back to a Pacioretty or Marleau like move, where the other team gives you a draft pick just to take a salary on a useable player.

I think they still move VO and possibly Joki. I think Bryson clears waivers due to his salary.

KA has been extremely conservative with weaponizing that cap space. My guess is he doesn’t want to block the young guys and/or upset the chemistry with a disgruntled guy.

[dudacek]

I find it very hard to imagine a world where we dump Olofsson and lose Quinn for maybe 60 games or more and it doesn't hurt the offence.

Do we really think we can count on 120ish goals from Skinner/Tage/Tuch again?

I really hope we won't be needing to score as much this year to win.

[Doohickie]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

We're in this weird spot  where we have not:

• acquired a top D
• added another goalie
• moved Olofsson

Yet Adams still gives off a vibe of 'we got better and we will be better"

I think there's a bit of poker happening here where Adams is trying to wait a few scenarios out yet has strengthened his hand enough he thinks the other guy should fold first.

I've moved into the territory of "moves could still happen, but don't count on it."

Kevyn is playing 5D chess with people who don't know you can jump in checkers.  He may outsmart himself.

[dudacek]

8 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

Kevyn is playing 5D chess with people who don't know you can jump in checkers.  He may outsmart himself.

It will be nice if his patience pays off and frustrating until then.