GDT Sabres at Rangers 6pm 4/25/21 MSG, WGR550

[bunomatic]

57 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

McDavid for Jack and Sam.  Do you do it?

In a heartbeat

[Zamboni]

1 hour ago, Doohickie said:

McDavid for Jack and Sam.  Do you do it?

McDavid for Eichel and Cozens. Do you do it?

McDavid for Eichel and Dahlin. Do you do it?

🤔

[Andrew Amerk]

39 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

I’m not stuck anywhere.  Captains have pretty much always been the best players with a few exceptions.  I think Eichel was given the C before his time.  I think the team was foolishly stripped of veterans to perform a foolish tank.  I think the whole thing was a calamity.   The kind that gets you 10+ years of hickey hell.  

Captains today are best player on the team. Not the best player at leading. 

[MODO Hockey]

2 hours ago, Andrew Amerk said:

Captains today are best player on the team. Not the best player at leading. 

What ?

Gabriel Landeskog - Colorado
Roman Jusi - Nashville
Jonathan Toews - Chicago
Bo horvat - Vancouver
Patrice Bergeron - Boston
Jared Spurgeon - Minnesota

And more.. 

These are not the best players on the team, but i sure as hell would say they are best at leading.
You dont get chosen to lead just because you can score points, obviously there is more behind it than that.

 

[Sabre fan]

is Mathews not captain over in TO?

[Radar]

8 hours ago, Zamboni said:

McDavid for Eichel and Cozens. Do you do it?

McDavid for Eichel and Dahlin. Do you do it?

🤔

Can I take door #2 please.

[LGR4GM]

5 hours ago, MODO Hockey said:

What ?

Gabriel Landeskog - Colorado
Roman Jusi - Nashville
Jonathan Toews - Chicago
Bo horvat - Vancouver
Patrice Bergeron - Boston
Jared Spurgeon - Minnesota

And more.. 

These are not the best players on the team, but i sure as hell would say they are best at leading.
You dont get chosen to lead just because you can score points, obviously there is more behind it than that.

 

Some of them were absolutely the best players on their teams when they became captain. 

[LGR4GM]

23 minutes ago, Sabre fan said:

is Mathews not captain over in TO?

John Tavares is and maybe you and everyone else here will finally start to understand how lacking in talent Buffalo has been for years.

Tavares was made captain 2 years ago, before Matthews broke out and Tavares is still one of the best players on his team. 

[MODO Hockey]

6 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Some of them were absolutely the best players on their teams when they became captain. 

What is your point here? 

[LGR4GM]

Just now, MODO Hockey said:

What is your point here? 

You responded about these players not being the best on their team. Many were at the time they became captain and are at worst the 2nd or maybe 3rd best player now. 

 

[Torpedo Forecheck]

You really do need your best players to be your leaders, everyone naturally looks to them.  Sometimes teams force it, sometimes team name a lesser veteran leader and that can be a different problem.

[Thorny]

9 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I’m not stuck anywhere.  Captains have pretty much always been the best players with a few exceptions.  I think Eichel was given the C before his time.  I think the team was foolishly stripped of veterans to perform a foolish tank.  I think the whole thing was a calamity.   The kind that gets you 10+ years of hickey hell.  

Pretty sure he’s on the New York Islanders, actually 

8 hours ago, Zamboni said:

McDavid for Eichel and Cozens. Do you do it?

McDavid for Eichel and Dahlin. Do you do it?

🤔

Yes to 1. Second one is tricky.

[Hank]

6 hours ago, MODO Hockey said:

What ?

Gabriel Landeskog - Colorado
Roman Jusi - Nashville
Jonathan Toews - Chicago
Bo horvat - Vancouver
Patrice Bergeron - Boston
Jared Spurgeon - Minnesota

And more.. 

These are not the best players on the team, but i sure as hell would say they are best at leading.
You dont get chosen to lead just because you can score points, obviously there is more behind it than that.

 

I agree with your point, but Josi does not belong on your list. He's been Nashville's best player for years, with the possible exception of Pekka the year they went to the finals. 

[Thorny]

1 minute ago, Hank said:

I agree with your point, but Josi does not belong on your list. He's been Nashville's best player for years, with the possible exception of Pekka the year they went to the finals. 

Bergeron too was their overall best player when he got the C 

Toews arguably too, really 50/50 with Kane in their heyday. Kane is not going to get the C, though, haha

[KC Scouts]

6 hours ago, MODO Hockey said:

What ?

Gabriel Landeskog - Colorado
Roman Jusi - Nashville
Jonathan Toews - Chicago
Bo horvat - Vancouver
Patrice Bergeron - Boston
Jared Spurgeon - Minnesota

And more.. 

These are not the best players on the team, but i sure as hell would say they are best at leading.
You dont get chosen to lead just because you can score points, obviously there is more behind it than that.

 

Exactly.. Patrick Kane would be captain if it was about being the best player or the one who scores the most points. He'll never be a captain, and that's not a slight on him.... it's about the kind of guy he is when it comes to hockey (how he plays, how he interacts with others, personality , temperament...etc)

[MODO Hockey]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

You responded about these players not being the best on their team. Many were at the time they became captain and are at worst the 2nd or maybe 3rd best player now. 

 

I dont think you are looking at this from the right direction. 
With your mindset the one player that has most points or has the best performance each season ends with beeing the new captain next season.

And obviously you could not be more wrong. 

The point is that eventhough u may score many points, it is how you behave, on and off the ice, overall, and i think you know this, that makes you material for a team when it comes to picking a captain. 

 

Edited April 26, 2021 by MODO Hockey

[Pimlach]

This debate over Captains is silly.  They are, and have always been, top players that also posses leadership ability.  Arguing whether they are the “best on the team” is besides the point when most teams have several players that could be considered their best.  The best player will vary year to year over enough time. 
 

Eichel has been the teams best player since the day he showed up in Buffalo but that did nit make him Captain worthy.   After 2 years, at age 21 he was given the C. Big load for a guy that young.   He had decent scoring stats that season but was outwardly frustrated most of the time.  His +/- dropped to -25 and the team finished dead last with 62 points when not even trying to tank.  They had just changed coaches and GM.  He was Captain of a team getting worse, not better, and it was hard for him.  Kane was traded at the deadline.  Bogo perpetually injured.  ROR expressed frustration and was shipped out of town.  Lerner was a mess and had a story to tell.  Along with Eichel, these were the pieces of the tank that were going to make us better.  
 

[inkman]

10 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

I didn’t see the game. Was Togaraki bad or the kiddie Corp D group?

Is this spelling intentional?

[Thorny]

13 minutes ago, KC Scouts said:

Exactly.. Patrick Kane would be captain if it was about being the best player or the one who scores the most points. He'll never be a captain, and that's not a slight on him.... it's about the kind of guy he is when it comes to hockey (how he plays, how he interacts with others, personality , temperament...etc)

A lot of people would say Toews is a better hockey player than Kane was during their cup runs. Defensive ability is a contributing factor. It’s not just “points” and “leadership” that distinguishes players 

[LGR4GM]

12 minutes ago, MODO Hockey said:

I dont think you are looking at this from the right direction. 
With your mindset the one player that has most points or has the best performance each season ends with beeing the new captain next season.

And obviously you could not be more wrong. 

The point is that eventhough u may score many points, it is how you behave, on and off the ice, overall, and i think you know this, that makes you material for a team when it comes to picking a captain. 

 

No I am saying your original examples were *****. 

The argument was that the teams best players become captain and you proceeded to give examples where that was not true except for the fact that those players became Captains almost exclusively when they were the best player on the team. You are now tossing other random trash into the mix to muddy the point. 

You are wrong. The best players are almost exclusively the ones who become captains. Bergeron, best player when he was named captain. Josi is probably still the best on Nashville. Landeskog was the best before MacKinnon exploded. Toews was the best all around player on Chicago for years. Horvat was the best before they got Petersson although Boeser I suppose could be argued. The best player is typically named captain. John Tavares best player on his team until this year. And at worst these guys might be 2nd best players on their respective teams now which wasn't the point. 

So no, you are not looking at it from the right direction and your examples failed to prove your point. 

[LGR4GM]

17 minutes ago, MODO Hockey said:

I dont think you are looking at this from the right direction. 
With your mindset the one player that has most points or has the best performance each season ends with beeing the new captain next season.

And obviously you could not be more wrong. 

The point is that eventhough u may score many points, it is how you behave, on and off the ice, overall, and i think you know this, that makes you material for a team when it comes to picking a captain. 

 

No I don't. I am telling you flat out that the players you listed were the best or at worst 2nd best players on their respective teams at the time they were made Captain. Why? because the best players get named Captain and then typically keep that mantel. 

[KC Scouts]

30 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

No I don't. I am telling you flat out that the players you listed were the best or at worst 2nd best players on their respective teams at the time they were made Captain. Why? because the best players get named Captain and then typically keep that mantel. 

i think we are all splitting hairs a bit......The captain is going to be one of the top 3-4 players on the team, he could be a defenseman. 

The point is he should have all the qualities.....doesn't always work out that way because those players are a very rare find. So teams often settle and fool themselves into believing they have a CAPTAIN when they really have a captain....

[MODO Hockey]

37 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

No I am saying your original examples were *****. 

The argument was that the teams best players become captain and you proceeded to give examples where that was not true except for the fact that those players became Captains almost exclusively when they were the best player on the team. You are now tossing other random trash into the mix to muddy the point. 

You are wrong. The best players are almost exclusively the ones who become captains. Bergeron, best player when he was named captain. Josi is probably still the best on Nashville. Landeskog was the best before MacKinnon exploded. Toews was the best all around player on Chicago for years. Horvat was the best before they got Petersson although Boeser I suppose could be argued. The best player is typically named captain. John Tavares best player on his team until this year. And at worst these guys might be 2nd best players on their respective teams now which wasn't the point. 

So no, you are not looking at it from the right direction and your examples failed to prove your point. 

Wow. I rest my case. *****

 

[Taro T]

11 hours ago, Andrew Amerk said:

It depends on whether Donnie G has them adjust or not. The Rags moved the puck very quickly and well, which continually got the Sabres out of position. 

The only way to really counteract that is to be aggressive with the puck and attack the puck carriers. 

But, that brings us back to the question of WHY were they out of position?  Were they out of position because the Rags are that much quicker & disciplined than the Sabres are, or were they out of position because they were trying to preempt the Rags from getting shots because they knew their goalie has gone back to being a sieve & he will let in goals on shots that most NHL netminders won't give up?  Which, if the latter is the case, they'll end up giving up more & better chances than if they just played disciplined in their own end letting the chips fall where they may.

Not expecting the Rags to take the Sabres lightly tomorrow, so they will have to play better to have any chance of beating them.  Hoping they can do so.

[Thorny]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

No I am saying your original examples were *****. 

The argument was that the teams best players become captain and you proceeded to give examples where that was not true except for the fact that those players became Captains almost exclusively when they were the best player on the team. You are now tossing other random trash into the mix to muddy the point. 

You are wrong. The best players are almost exclusively the ones who become captains. Bergeron, best player when he was named captain. Josi is probably still the best on Nashville. Landeskog was the best before MacKinnon exploded. Toews was the best all around player on Chicago for years. Horvat was the best before they got Petersson although Boeser I suppose could be argued. The best player is typically named captain. John Tavares best player on his team until this year. And at worst these guys might be 2nd best players on their respective teams now which wasn't the point. 

So no, you are not looking at it from the right direction and your examples failed to prove your point. 

I actually think Landeskog is a good example of it going to the touted "leadership" guy and not the best player. I remember that being a big thing mentioned with him constantly. 

Though looking back you could make the argument that he was the best. Funnily enough, ROR (along with Stastny) were the guys above him in scoring. But all 3 really close. 

Edited April 26, 2021 by Thorny