Worst Sabres Team Ever?

[PASabreFan]

Welcome to my world.  except it started 3 years ago for me.

That's OK. Just don't cross the point of no return. You know where that point is. Because when you do, and then years later your team gives you something to be happy about, for one week, it kinda sucks. You can't fake it.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Collecting checks now, their daring the GM to trade them

You are probably right on some of the guys.  The question is who would bring in our losers into their winning teams?  Frankly, at this point most of our guys should be playing desperate hockey because their NHL careers are riding on playing better and soon.  

[jsb]

I'm not sure if it's the worst Sabres team ever but it unquestionably is the most disappointing. 

Expected so much more from this team. 

Expected so much more from the anti-Bylsma contingent that blamed him for everything and it turns out their worst nightmare came true, they hired a worst coach than they thought he was.

 

The grass isn't always greener on the other side although I like mine tinged with a little red!

[Drunkard]

Bold move jumping ship to the 2011 Sabres :D

 

I jumped ship to Chicago, and now they're in last place...jumped ship to FSU, and they lost Fisher and they're starting QB...we haven't seen the playoffs since I've joined this board....

 

Time for you to start rooting for Boston so they can crash and burn in every sport then. C'mon. Do it!

[pi2000]

Worstest ever

[That Aud Smell]

I'm not sure if it's the worst Sabres team ever but it unquestionably is the most disappointing. 

Expected so much more from this team. 

Expected so much more from the anti-Bylsma contingent that blamed him for everything and it turns out their worst nightmare came true, they hired a worst coach than they thought he was.

 

The grass isn't always greener on the other side although I like mine tinged with a little red!

 

Well stated.

 

I don't regret the team's moving on from Bylsma. I'm sure I've said it in the past: Bylsma's small ice, chip and chase, grind 'em down system and approach were designed/intended to compensate for a host of shortcomings and deficiencies in this group. Stated another way: Bylsma's system was basically a set of training wheels that allowed this group to appear as though they could ride a bike.* Housley seems to have said "to hell with the training wheels." My understanding is that Housley demands that this team play a style and system befitting the league's better, more competitive teams. And this group has been utterly exposed as a consequence.

 

* Ride a bike = be a competitive NHL hockey team.

[pi2000]

Well stated.

 

I don't regret the team's moving on from Bylsma. I'm sure I've said it in the past: Bylsma's small ice, chip and chase, grind 'em down system and approach were designed/intended to compensate for a host of shortcomings and deficiencies in this group. Stated another way: Bylsma's system was basically a set of training wheels that allowed this group to appear as though they could ride a bike.* Housley seems to have said "to hell with the training wheels." My understanding is that Housley demands that this team play a style and system befitting the league's better, more competitive teams. And this group has been utterly exposed as a consequence.

 

* Ride a bike = be a competitive NHL hockey team.

 

That's a nice convenient narrative to rationalize the firing of Bylsma.  Fact is, this same group played with more effort and determination under Bylsma than they do under Housley.   It has nothing to do with system, and everything to do with effort.   

[LGR4GM]

That's a nice convenient narrative to rationalize the firing of Bylsma.  Fact is, this same group played with more effort and determination under Bylsma than they do under Housley.   It has nothing to do with system, and everything to do with effort. 

I agree with part of this. The bolded however I do not. A team playing with effort under Bylsma was always doomed because his system was trash. For whatever reason though, Housley is unable to get the level of effort Bylsma did. 

[WildCard]

I agree with part of this. The bolded however I do not. A team playing with effort under Bylsma was always doomed because his system was trash. For whatever reason though, Housley is unable to get the level of effort Bylsma did. 

Pretty sure the effort is the same, the system is just exposing our lack of talent. Jack has been playing s much better this year; he's consistently putting in effort for the last 20 games or so

[darksabre]

Pretty sure the effort is the same, the system is just exposing our lack of talent. Jack has been playing s much better this year; he's consistently putting in effort for the last 20 games or so

Agreed.

[pi2000]

I agree with part of this. The bolded however I do not. A team playing with effort under Bylsma was always doomed because his system was trash. For whatever reason though, Housley is unable to get the level of effort Bylsma did. 

 

A less talented team under Bylsma was 15 points better than the team under Housley at this same point last season... and Bylsma did that without Eichel for more than half those games.   Imagine where this team would be without Eichel? 

 

 

Pretty sure the effort is the same, the system is just exposing our lack of talent. Jack has been playing s much better this year; he's consistently putting in effort for the last 20 games or so

 

Do you watch the games?   Eichel had a much better ppg under Bylsma.

[LGR4GM]

A less talented team under Bylsma was 15 points better than the team under Housley at this same point last season... and Bylsma did that without Eichel for more than half those games.   Imagine where this team would be without Eichel? 

 

 

 

Do you watch the games?   Eichel had a much better ppg under Bylsma.

And under Bylsma that was the best the team would ever be. They lack talent. Also Bylsma was awful at developing players.  Everything  coming out at his firing to how different it is now confirms that Bylsma was terrible at teaching players. 

[That Aud Smell]

That's a nice convenient narrative to rationalize the firing of Bylsma.  Fact is, this same group played with more effort and determination under Bylsma than they do under Housley.   It has nothing to do with system, and everything to do with effort.   

 

Yeah - I just disagree. Intuitively, should the same group (substantially) play harder for a soulless curmudgeon (pardon the poetic license) or a power of positive thinking ginger and HOFer? I'm saying the latter. My bet is that Housley asks them to do more -- way more -- than Bylsma did. And they're not up to it.

Do you watch the games?   Eichel had a much better ppg under Bylsma.

 

I believe he also scored more on the power play last season. The failure of that unit is an indictment on Housley, for sure.

[Sabel79]

Yeah - I just disagree. Intuitively, should the same group (substantially) play harder for a soulless curmudgeon (pardon the poetic license) or a power of positive thinking ginger and HOFer? I'm saying the latter. My bet is that Housley asks them to do more -- way more -- than Bylsma did. And they're not up to it.

 

I believe he also scored more on the power play last season. The failure of that unit is an indictment on Housley, for sure.

One-thousand times this.  

 

Disco took the dirt he was given and made mud pies out of it.  Housley's over here trying to make something out of the Great British Bake-Off.  Doesn't taste good.  Might improve with better ingredients.  

Also, I remember being much angrier with the Sabres organization the year they traded Mogilny.  What was that, 95?  That team was hot garbage, but it was also right before things got interesting.  

[Scottysabres]

This team is now officially defunct.

 

With the news players are now at each others throats, it is becoming abundantly clear. Like a rudderless ship crashing the rocks along the shoreline this team is now on the rocks.

 

Something needs to happen here. The culture is taking its toll. Botterill is going to have to shake it up in a major way.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

I believe he also scored more on the power play last season. The failure of that unit is an indictment on Housley, for sure.

 

Did they not fire the PP guru from last year when they cleaned house?  Should have kept him since it was the one really bright spot last season.

[Scottysabres]

I would say yes, with the culture currently in play, this is the worst Sabres team in history.

[Sabre fan]

Housley is trying to get this team to play like Nashville who obviously is light years ahead in talent. Disco Dan coached this team to it's strengths which isn't much but he didn;t ask for something they were or are not capable of. and yes, Disco did it without jack for half the year and many other major injuries

[LGR4GM]

Even still Housley hasn't done well this season

[That Aud Smell]

Did they not fire the PP guru from last year when they cleaned house?  Should have kept him since it was the one really bright spot last season.

 

They did separate all of Bylsma's staff, yeah - that's pretty SOP when a change is made at the top. I forget the guy's name who had the PP last season (Woods?), but I think I remember reading that he's elsewhere (Minny?) with a top-10 unit PP again.

 

Edit: Minny is now 17th overall. Maybe they were better than that at one point in the season.

 

Edit 2: Cripes. I'd lost track of how the team was 1st in power play last season. FIRST! 24.5%! This season, it's 12.9%. The projected delta between the two season's total PP goals is ~25 goals. God almighty. Housley and his coaching staff are squarely to blame for that.

 

Housley is trying to get this team to play like Nashville who obviously is light years ahead in talent. Disco Dan coached this team to it's strengths which isn't much but he didn;t ask for something they were or are not capable of. and yes, Disco did it without jack for half the year and many other major injuries

 

I think that's an interesting way to turn the matter on its head, a bit:

 

Should Housley be credited or blamed for implementing a system and style that are ill-suited to the talent on the roster?

Edited January 10, 2018 by That Aud Smell

[WildCard]

Do you watch the games?   Eichel had a much better ppg under Bylsma.

Well no, he didn't. He had .93 goals/game under Byslma last year, and has .91 goals/game under Housley this year.

 

He had 14 ES goals last year, he already has 16 this year. 

 

Interesting that the zone starting percentage has been wildly different under the two though

https://www.hockey-reference.com/players/e/eicheja01.html

[LGR4GM]

They did separate all of Bylsma's staff, yeah - that's pretty SOP when a change is made at the top. I forget the guy's name who had the PP last season (Woods?), but I think I remember reading that he's elsewhere (Minny?) with a top-10 unit PP again.

 

Edit: Minny is now 17th overall. Maybe they were better than that at one point in the season.

 

 

I think that's an interesting way to turn the matter on its head, a bit:

 

Should Housley be credited or blamed for implementing a system and style that are ill-suited to the talent on the roster?

Depends on if the GM is on the same page and wants the team to learn the system no matter what so when good players come in they will pick up the system faster. 

[That Aud Smell]

Well no, he didn't. He had .93 goals/game under Byslma last year, and has .91 goals/game under Housley this year.

 

He had 14 ES goals last year, he already has 16 this year. 

 

Interesting that the zone starting percentage has been wildly different under the two though

https://www.hockey-reference.com/players/e/eicheja01.html

 

holy smokes - I'll say. (For those who don't click: Eichel is getting nearly 62% o-zone starts this season; he got 55% in his rookie season and 52% last season.)

[LGR4GM]

holy smokes - I'll say. (For those who don't click: Eichel is getting nearly 62% o-zone starts this season; he got 55% in his rookie season and 52% last season.)

He's not good at faceoffs. 

[pi2000]

Yeah - I just disagree. Intuitively, should the same group (substantially) play harder for a soulless curmudgeon (pardon the poetic license) or a power of positive thinking ginger and HOFer? I'm saying the latter. My bet is that Housley asks them to do more -- way more -- than Bylsma did. And they're not up to it.

 

I believe he also scored more on the power play last season. The failure of that unit is an indictment on Housley, for sure.

 

In this case, your intuition is misguided.   Sure, conceptually you'd think they'd play with more urgency and determination under Housley.   However, the reality is... they are not.

 

I'm not too worried about the power play... last year was a fluke IMO... and teams have figured out how to take away Eichel's one timer, they're looking for it, and goalies know it's coming.   The PP % was due for some regression anyway.   It's been better as of late.

 

 

And under Bylsma that was the best the team would ever be. They lack talent. Also Bylsma was awful at developing players.  Everything  coming out at his firing to how different it is now confirms that Bylsma was terrible at teaching players. 

 

I don't know if I buy this.   They were a 78 point team last year, with a less talented group of defensemen, and missing Eichel for 1/3 of the season.    I'd would've liked to see what Bylsma could've done in year 3 with an improved defense and healthy Eichel... maybe they get 7-8 more wins and that puts them in the playof discussion... with this roster... which is what the expectation was under Housley (because how could he be any worse than Bylsma?!  well he is.. much much much worse when looking at the results).

 

 

Should Housley be credited or blamed for implementing a system and style that are ill-suited to the talent on the roster?

 

 He needs to take most of the blame for this team playing without any sense urgency on a nightly basis.     That has nothing to do with system.    He could have the greatest system known to hockey, but if he can't sell it to this own players and get them to play with some sense of passion, then it's completely useless.     

 

"Really, coaching is simplicity. It's getting players to play better than they think that they can." - Tom Landry 

 

 

Well no, he didn't. He had .93 goals/game under Byslma last year, and has .91 goals/game under Housley this year.

 

He had 14 ES goals last year, he already has 16 this year. 

 

Interesting that the zone starting percentage has been wildly different under the two though

https://www.hockey-reference.com/players/e/eicheja01.html

 

So he has regressed under Housley?  OK.   Also consider that last season he did that on a bad leg.  He's fully healthy now, and a year older, he should be much better.

 

 

Depends on if the GM is on the same page and wants the team to learn the system no matter what so when good players come in they will pick up the system faster. 

 

I'm fine with Housley's system... the problem is he can't get the players to put forth a consistent effort.   That won't change by bringing in new players.