TrueBlueGED Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 The Bruins won with Charra being the top guy. It can be done, that is all. Are you insinuating that Chara wasn't a Norris-level defender in 2011? He finished 3rd in the voting. And of course it can be done, but the infrequency with which it happens points to how difficult it is. I agree we need to hope Ristlainen gets up to around Letang's level. I think he can. The good thing is, their top LHD in the final was Dumolin. Kulikov was better than Dumolin this season. Not saying anything here. But just sayin'. Yea, I mean, if you have that guy, then the rest of the blue line can be lesser (assuming you have the forwards the compensate). But if you don't have that guy, then Kulikov as your #2 isn't gonna get it done. No pressure Risto, no pressure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Looking back at the defensemen on cup winning teams since 2005, the only team that makes me feel hopeful in the event that Risto doesn't become an elite, all-situations #1 defenseman is Carolina in 2006. Gulp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 (edited) Looking back at the defensemen on cup winning teams since 2005, the only team that makes me feel hopeful in the event that Risto doesn't become an elite, all-situations #1 defenseman is Carolina in 2006. Gulp.True did this awhile back. He listed every cup winning team and their top pair. A top pair is th key Edited June 29, 2016 by WildCard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 (edited) Are you insinuating that Chara wasn't a Norris-level defender in 2011? He finished 3rd in the voting. And of course it can be done, but the infrequency with which it happens points to how difficult it is. Yea, I mean, if you have that guy, then the rest of the blue line can be lesser (assuming you have the forwards the compensate). But if you don't have that guy, then Kulikov as your #2 isn't gonna get it done. No pressure Risto, no pressure! Yup, no bones about it, there's a lot on his shoulders. Do we think there's a fair likelihood of him being a #1? Edited June 29, 2016 by Thorny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3putt Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Are you insinuating that Chara wasn't a Norris-level defender in 2011? He finished 3rd in the voting. And of course it can be done, but the infrequency with which it happens points to how difficult it is. Yea, I mean, if you have that guy, then the rest of the blue line can be lesser (assuming you have the forwards the compensate). But if you don't have that guy, then Kulikov as your #2 isn't gonna get it done. No pressure Risto, no pressure! I am saying he was 21st among defenseman in scoring. The calculus for the Norris has tilted in favor of offense. Charra was largely a defensive force and not at the offensive level of Keith or Karlsson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 (edited) True did this a while back. A top pair is th keyAnd specifically a #1. Dumolin and Letang got it done. Letang had the cup winning goal. Edit: Risto does have a WJC winning tally. Edited June 29, 2016 by Thorny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Yup, no bones about it, there's a lot on his shoulders. Do we think there's a fair likelihood of being a #1? I do, but there's a wide range in there of what constitutes a #1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 I certainly think he can be as good as Letang. I do too, but there's also a non-trivial possibility he falls short...and that is not a pretty picture for us. Ah Buffalo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 I do too, but there's also a non-trivial possibility he falls short...and that is not a pretty picture for us. RASMUS RISTOLAINEN WILL BE FINE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 I do think there is an offer sheet possibility if Murray misses on Stamkos. We have the cap room, we have the youth to compensate for the lost picks. We have the need and there are a ton of young D available. I know he's the wrong hand, but Seth Jones is a particularly easy target given the Jackets cap. I wonder if Murray can use the threat of an offer sheet to Jones or Lidstrom to leverage a deal for Fowler or Murray? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewookie1 Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 I do think there is an offer sheet possibility if Murray misses on Stamkos. We have the cap room, we have the youth to compensate for the lost picks. We have the need and there are a ton of young D available. I know he's the wrong hand, but Seth Jones is a particularly easy target given the Jackets cap. I wonder if Murray can use the threat of an offer sheet to Jones or Lidstrom to leverage a deal for Fowler or Murray? :P Lindholm, he not that good yet. And maybe, 1st Risto, McCabe and Girgs will be resigned. If we fail to get Stamkos I'd imagine Murray getting creative. CBJ would be my target mainly because we have a good relationship with Anaheim which I'd rather not burn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 I do think there is an offer sheet possibility if Murray misses on Stamkos. We have the cap room, we have the youth to compensate for the lost picks. We have the need and there are a ton of young D available. I know he's the wrong hand, but Seth Jones is a particularly easy target given the Jackets cap. I wonder if Murray can use the threat of an offer sheet to Jones or Lidstrom to leverage a deal for Fowler or Murray? Do you really think he'd chase after a defensemen after losing out on Stamkos? I think he's done on that front for the year. WGR was talking about possibly Mike Hoffman, and I could see some sense in that--he's younger than the non-Stamkos wingers on the market, could score 30 with a real center, and Ottawa isn't (or wasn't, anyway, before the GM change) super enamored with him, and they have an internal budget to boot. It might work. Full disclosure: I predicted we'd acquire Hoffman in Tom Webster's contest :D .....Even if this happened, my predictions were horribly inaccurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 I think in Murrays dream world he somehow packages Ennis/Girgensons and Gorges/McCabe for a QB LD, but that's not likely. I'd make a play for Ryan Murray and Scott Hartnell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 (edited) I think in Murrays dream world he somehow packages Ennis/Girgensons and Gorges/McCabe for a QB LD, but that's not likely. I'd make a play for Ryan Murray and Scott Hartnell What is it you like so much about Murray? He's had a pretty disappointing career thus far IMO. Edited June 29, 2016 by TrueBlueGED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewookie1 Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 What is it you like so much about Murray? He's had a pretty disappointing career thus far IMO. If he comes on the cheaper side, he'd be a project but with Top Pairing potential. Although I'm not sure what dudacek's exact reason is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 (edited) What is it you like so much about Murray? He's had a pretty disappointing career thus far IMO.It's a bit of a Tim Murray thing: I was really high on him as a junior; I think circumstances (injuries, bad team) have not allowed him to blossom yet and hurt him in the public eye. His per game career numbers are in the same ballpark or better than Maatta, Dumba, Ceci and Trouba. He's a leftie, can play both special teams and move the puck. He plays a Pysyk style subtle game, but is better with more offence, and more ability to make a difference. Good character guy and appears to be a good stylistic match for Risto and our young forwards. Is still 22 with room to grow. I agree he's been disappointing in terms of where he was drafted, but only because Lindholm and Reilly (and Risto and Jones from the next year) have moved passed him. He's as good or better than the rest of his peers. It's a classic buy-low opportunity. Why don't you like him? Seems to be your type of defenceman. Edited June 29, 2016 by dudacek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyK Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Is it July 1st yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 If we sign Vesey and Stamkos, I would figure out a trade with Columbus for Murray. I think Dudacek could be right, kid had a couple injuries and then has been stuck on a crappy Columbus team. The injuries are the biggest concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 It's a bit of a Tim Murray thing: I was really high on him as a junior; I think circumstances (injuries, bad team) have not allowed him to blossom yet and hurt him in the public eye. His per game career numbers are in the same ballpark or better than Maatta, Dumba, Ceci and Trouba. He's a leftie, can play both special teams and move the puck. He plays a Pysyk style subtle game, but is better with more offence, and more ability to make a difference. Good character guy and appears to be a good stylistic match for Risto and our young forwards. Is still 22 with room to grow. I agree he's been disappointing in terms of where he was drafted, but only because Lindholm and Reilly (and Risto and Jones from the next year) have moved passed him. He's as good or better than the rest of his peers. It's a classic buy-low opportunity. Why don't you like him? Seems to be your type of defenceman. Well for starters, I don't think needing to take on Hartnell's contract is buying low at all. Beyond that, and this is probably less than completely fair, I just tend to think that it a really high pick hasn't put it together in a few pro years, they end up not doing so over the next few. I can't think of many top-2 picks that had really slow starts to their career and ended up fulfilling their potential. You're right, the concept of Murray is very much my kind of defenseman. But the reality of Murray has fallen quite short of that concept, and I'm not sure I have a ton of faith in him turning it on. I'm just pretty meh on him overall. All that said, I'd be happy with a buy low...but not if it involves taking on Hartnell. Maybe if they also retained a chunk of his cap hit, but I don't want him on our books for 3 years at his full hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Fair points, but I'm not making the trade expected him to be Doughty. More like hoping for Numminen and being OK with Hjalmarsson. Kid has only played 160 games. I think defencemen need to play twice that before you start making conclusions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted June 29, 2016 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Per Friedman Hearing CLB closing in on a deal with RFA Seth Jones. That would be good news...eliminating offer sheet worry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Per Friedman Hearing CLB closing in on a deal with RFA Seth Jones. That would be good news...eliminating offer sheet worry And likely putting them over the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Jones signs for six years at $5.4M annually. Another deal that should help us with Risto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 Jones signs for six years at $5.4M annually. Another deal that should help us with Risto. So many comparables showing Risto value is 6 years at around $5.5. Why hasn't he signed yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted June 29, 2016 Report Share Posted June 29, 2016 And likely putting them over the cap. Wow, I just looked at their situation. That is one expensive bad team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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