WildCard Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 They didn't experience it, so it has no bearing on them. Teams need to learn how to win at this level. There are a million examples of talented teams who fall short because they haven't been there before, and they don't know what it takes to win. We have 1 guy, I think, who's been to a Cup, and maybe, what? 3-6 other guys who've even seen the playoffs? All of which aren't our important pieces. There's something to be said for a winning mentality, and it comes in steps, not leaps and bounds. The longer we delay the first step, the less likely we'll ever be actually successful. Now, am I expecting playoffs this year? No. But I want some momentum, some pride and some confidence going into next year. I really, really don't want to be Edmonton; a collection if talented guys that win at every level but get so beat up in losing at the NHL level that it just drains them This is where I'm at. I think players learn to win the moment the team has enough talent to win. How many really talented teams, in any sport, aren't competitive?Easy, Edmonton. How many highly talented teams never have success in the postseason? Remember the good old Colts? Or the Canucks? Players know how to win. These guys have all won throughout their hockey careers. This concept of "learning to win" seems a bit far-fetched to me. I guess it's me. Some guys know how to win better but that's life. The team is remarkably better as they should be and they have holes to fill. I have no complaints. Winning at this level is not the same, it doesn't just carry over. There're so many NHL players who had great junior and Worlds careers, and never tasted NHL success Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 This is where I'm at. I think players learn to win the moment the team has enough talent to win. How many really talented teams, in any sport, aren't competitive? I mostly agree with this, but there are things that take time, like executing the system without thinking, learning to trust your teammates, and gaining the confidence to recognize what you can and can't do. I think learning to win is a euphemism for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Calling Edmonton talented is a stretch. They've had three young "star" forwards for a few years and have been almost completely bare elsewhere. They've never been talented. They should be better, but they're not talented. Nor is Buffalo. Accumulating more talent is far more important than a few extra points. Preferably veteran talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 I mostly agree with this, but there are things that take time, like executing the system without thinking, learning to trust your teammates, and gaining the confidence to recognize what you can and can't do. I think learning to win is a euphemism for that. If that's what learning to win means, then I'm a believer. I just never got the impression that's what people meant by it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 I mostly agree with this, but there are things that take time, like executing the system without thinking, learning to trust your teammates, and gaining the confidence to recognize what you can and can't do. I think learning to win is a euphemism for that. ^This. I would add learning to live with each other, too. Perhaps that's the most important aspect we are describing. Tightly-knit lockerrooms aren't forged overnight. It's a process and it takes time. GO SABRES!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Calling Edmonton talented is a stretch. They've had three young "star" forwards for a few years and have been almost completely bare elsewhere. They've never been talented. They should be better, but they're not talented. Nor is Buffalo. Accumulating more talent is far more important than a few extra points. Preferably veteran talent. Totally agree on your Edmonton breakdown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTS Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Winning at this level is not the same, it doesn't just carry over. There're so many NHL players who had great junior and Worlds careers, and never tasted NHL success To not have NHL success is not because they don't know how to win. The talent level is different and they may not be good enough to win but it's not that they don't know how to do it, they just can't. It's not a matter of working out right, eating right, playing the system right. It's a matter of them not having the ability to put all of it together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted February 8, 2016 Report Share Posted February 8, 2016 Big Games this week in Tank 3.0 to circle in your calendars: Tuesday - Toronto V Calgary Wed - Arizona V Vancouver Thurs - Buffalo V Philadelphia, Toronto V Edmonton Friday - Buffalo V Montreal, Calgary V Arizona Saturday - Ottawa V Columbus, Toronto V Vancouver, Winnipeg V Edmonton Sunday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jsixspd Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Wow, the 2016 Tank competition is fierce well into the 2nd half of the season - Edmonton & Columbus tied with 47 points and 54 games played each, Toronto in the hunt with 47 points, but 3 fewer GPs (51) and Buffalo is in the thick of it too - 48 points with 53 GP. Buffalo has improved with their latest points streak - projecting out, 74 points for the season. That would still be a squalid and atrocious result, but looking better than it did a couple weeks ago when they looked like they'd struggle to hit 70 points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattPie Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Wow, the 2016 Tank competition is fierce well into the 2nd half of the season - Edmonton & Columbus tied with 47 points and 54 games played each, Toronto in the hunt with 47 points, but 3 fewer GPs (51) and Buffalo is in the thick of it too - 48 points with 53 GP. Buffalo has improved with their latest points streak - projecting out, 74 points for the season. That would still be a squalid and atrocious result, but looking better than it did a couple weeks ago when they looked like they'd struggle to hit 70 points. Even at 70 points, a 10% improvement in wins (8 games) is nothing to scoff at. Could the Sabres be better this year? Sure. Would the Sabres be better if they hadn't lost their starting GT and a couple key pieces for long stretches of time (Kane, Ennis, and Moulson)? Probably. I think the only people that are truly disappointed with this season are the ones that had unreasonable expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabel79 Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Even at 70 points, a 10% improvement in wins (8 games) is nothing to scoff at. Could the Sabres be better this year? Sure. Would the Sabres be better if they hadn't lost their starting GT and a couple key pieces for long stretches of time (Kane, Ennis, and Moulson)? Probably. I think the only people that are truly disappointed with this season are the ones that had unreasonable expectations. And Matt Moulson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattPie Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 And Matt Moulson. Hey, I already said they lost Moulson for long stretches of time. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabel79 Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Hey, I already said they lost Moulson for long stretches of time. :) And Matt Moulson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jsixspd Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) Even at 70 points, a 10% improvement in wins (8 games) is nothing to scoff at. Could the Sabres be better this year? Sure. Would the Sabres be better if they hadn't lost their starting GT and a couple key pieces for long stretches of time (Kane, Ennis, and Moulson)? Probably. I think the only people that are truly disappointed with this season are the ones that had unreasonable expectations. I figured we'd be around the 80 point mark for the season. We could still do it, I suppose. I don't think that's unrealistic; typically the worst teams in the NHL finish around the 70-73 point mark; last year's team should not be a benchmark for gauging improvement; it was a historically bad team; lots of poor players, and also also a situation where management was intentionally structuring the roster and gameplay TO lose. We should be gauging the Sabres against the worst in the league; we're still scraping bottom in that regard - one point ahead of the NHL's very worst 2/3rds pf the way thru the season isn't exactly a reason to feel warm fuzzies about the team's progress, IMHO. I kinda figured we'd be looking at ~20th place finish; not in danger of being 30th. Besides, is there any team that doesn't have a couple good or key players end up on the DL for part or all of the season? I'm not sure that's a good excuse for any team in any sport - hockey, football, baseball, etc, unless the player is a legendary superstar of some sort. Kane can't seem to hit the broadside of a barn when he shoots (he was embarrassed by Gionta in that skill competition - lol) and Ennis and Moulson are certainly not HOF timber. Edited February 9, 2016 by Jsixspd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#freejame Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 I figured we'd be around the 80 point mark for the season. We could still do it, I suppose. I don't think that's unrealistic; typically the worst teams in the NHL finish around the 70-73 point mark; last year's team should not be a benchmark for gauging improvement; it was a historically bad team; lots of poor players, and also also a situation where management was intentionally structuring the roster and gameplay TO lose. We should be gauging the Sabres against the worst in the league; we're still scraping bottom in that regard - one point ahead of the NHL's very worst 2/3rds pf the way thru the season isn't exactly a reason to feel warm fuzzies about the team's progress, IMHO. I kinda figured we'd be looking at ~20th place finish; not in danger of being 30th. Besides, is there any team that doesn't have a couple good or key players end up on the DL for part or all of the season? I'm not sure that's a good excuse for any team in any sport - hockey, football, baseball, etc, unless the player is a legendary superstar of some sort. Kane can't seem to hit the broadside of a barn when he shoots (he was embarrassed by Gionta in that skill competition - lol) and Ennis and Moulson are certainly not HOF timber. Last year's team is the only team this year's team should be compared to because, well, it's the best way of showing their improvement. You are right, we were historically bad this year and it takes time to improve upon that. If our record were six points better but our numbers are in a similar to last year, are we any better of a team or is the league worse? We should be measuring our play to that of last year to see the areas we've improved and where we still have to get better. I've seen this said several times. What should we be comparing the team to? If you compare it to other rebuilds we're doing pretty good and fitting a timetable. You said it yourself, you expected to finish with around 80 points and be around 20th. Why does it matter if 80 points gets you last place if you improved 26 points? Compare this year's team to last year's team and our rebuild to the successful rebuilds we've been modeling. We're improving. We were the worst team ever last year and now we're a bad NHL team. Next year we'll be a bubble team and then we'll be a playoff team. Standings don't matter this year, improving every aspect of our team does (which the stats pretty much say we have). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted February 10, 2016 Report Share Posted February 10, 2016 you know why this team almost has the same amounts of points the 14/15 Sabres did in the entire season? better players - has nothing to do with learning how to win. I think the team will be better off down the road by adding a high end talent found at the top of the draft than winning a couple of more games this season. I think its Toronto, Columbus and then I have no idea. Not Edmonton is all I will guess. Possibly. But there are other things to consider. It depends how much more we could win. Your point could definitely be true not considering other variables, but we have a very young team this year and lots of our pieces of the future are already here. Winning a bunch more games could mean the growth of our young stars-to-be is exceeding expectations for this year, and could bode very well for the future, potentially better than getting a high pick. Players know how to win. These guys have all won throughout their hockey careers. This concept of "learning to win" seems a bit far-fetched to me. I guess it's me. Some guys know how to win better but that's life. The team is remarkably better as they should be and they have holes to fill. I have no complaints. This is where I'm at. I think players learn to win the moment the team has enough talent to win. How many really talented teams, in any sport, aren't competitive? I agree, but the benefit in any upswing in wins wouldn't be found in "learning to win", it would be found in the more quantifiable fact that our young players are performing better, which can only mean good things to come. Generally, I am hoping for as much winning as possible, and that the lottery balls bounce our way. Even at 70 points, a 10% improvement in wins (8 games) is nothing to scoff at. Could the Sabres be better this year? Sure. Would the Sabres be better if they hadn't lost their starting GT and a couple key pieces for long stretches of time (Kane, Ennis, and Moulson)? Probably. I think the only people that are truly disappointed with this season are the ones that had unreasonable expectations. 16 more points is actually an almost 30% improvement over last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 Battle of the Bottoms tonight, Toronto @ Edmonton, both sit at 47 points (lowest in the league, 1 behind Buffalo & CBJ), but Toronto has played 3 less games. After the loss of Phaneuf though, they could plummet beyond reach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 at what point do you start cheering / hoping for Sabres losses? Im at the point that Im indifferent to Sabres wins v losses but definitely hope teams around them win. That might change and I will start hoping for losses if they are still a point or two out of the bottom with 20 games to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 Battle of the Bottoms tonight, Toronto @ Edmonton, both sit at 47 points (lowest in the league, 1 behind Buffalo & CBJ), but Toronto has played 3 less games. After the loss of Phaneuf though, they could plummet beyond reach This years Carrion was always the Leafs to lose...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 Battle of the Bottoms tonight, Toronto @ Edmonton, both sit at 47 points (lowest in the league, 1 behind Buffalo & CBJ), but Toronto has played 3 less games. After the loss of Phaneuf though, they could plummet beyond reach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 (edited) at what point do you start cheering / hoping for Sabres losses? Im at the point that Im indifferent to Sabres wins v losses but definitely hope teams around them win. That might change and I will start hoping for losses if they are still a point or two out of the bottom with 20 games to go. During the game, I'm very into the Sabres winning. But immediately after, I really don't care. I've been rooting for teams around them to win since January. This years Carrion was always the Leafs to lose...... At this point, any Tank notion for me is successful as long as Toronto fails. I've never wanted to be a bicycle seat so badly in my life. This would also make one awesome avatar Edited February 11, 2016 by WildCard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 :lol: This is excellent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 (edited) I've never wanted to be a bicycle seat so badly in my life. This would also make one awesome avatar You should see the European Tour 1979 promos. You know, the ones without the painted on bikini bottoms. Not to mention the coverage of a real nude bicycle race that Queen staged to promote the double A side single. Edited February 11, 2016 by Sabres Fan In NS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 (edited) You should see the European Tour 1979 promos. You know, the ones without the painted on bikini bottoms. :flirt: The fact that America back then got pissed about, literally, 1/2 an ass, is just hilarious Edited February 11, 2016 by WildCard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted February 11, 2016 Report Share Posted February 11, 2016 :flirt: The fact that America back then got pissed about, literally, 1/2 an ass, is just hilarious You should see what would happen if they tried it today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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