Eleven Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I don't have answers, just speculation. How many times do you try to contact someone in good faith before you decide to write them off? Yeah, I get that. But if the other GMs knew that Darcy wasn't returning calls because he knew he wasn't allowed to do a thing, why the snickering, you know? Yeah, you know. I think we're on the same page; there's some missing info from the whole story, but not enough missing info for it to be a non-story. Bull. Weave's assertion is that we are all pretty much convinced that Darcy was "handcuffed", and I was merely supposing that wasn't really true, using the facts of what he did with Pegula's money once he "got his handcuffs removed", so to speak. I merely speculate. I honestly think we should re-think Darcy's "plight" is all, as I think we have good reason. But of course, I realize some folks are slower than others to re-think their positions on the internet. :D What the hell are you talking about? This is Regier, not Ruff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Bull. Weave's assertion is that we are all pretty much convinced that Darcy was "handcuffed", and I was merely supposing that wasn't really true, using the facts of what he did with Pegula's money once he "got his handcuffs removed", so to speak. I merely speculate. I honestly think we should re-think Darcy's "plight" is all, as I think we have good reason. But of course, I realize some folks are slower than others to re-think their positions on the internet. :D I think there's two separate issues here: that of competence, and that of "handcuffs." The Boyes acquisition, burying Kotalik's contract in Rochester, and the huge term/bonuses handed out to Leino and Ehrhoff are 4 things that absolutely would not have happened under Golisano. We can certainly debate the merit of those moves, but I think it's pretty accepted that Golisano/Quinn would have blocked all 4 moves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyldnwoody44 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 lol, I caught it already, but Icebergs don't merely come from glaciers. I was stationed on board an ice breaker in the Navy back in my day, they also build up on the Edge of the Ice Shelf, from high winds and accumulating Ice layers. Navy eh? Fellow sailor. I was on a carrier in Norfolk. Were you in Iceland? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Yeah, I get that. But if the other GMs knew that Darcy wasn't returning calls because he knew he wasn't allowed to do a thing, why the snickering, you know? Yeah, you know. I think we're on the same page; there's some missing info from the whole story, but not enough missing info for it to be a non-story. They may not have known why he wasn't returning calls. I dunno. And I am sure I'll never know the whole story. But I do believe our much maligned media guys who insinuate inside knowledge of incompetence/arrogance/and spite returned on Darcy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 They may not have known why he wasn't returning calls. I dunno. And I am sure I'll never know the whole story. But I do believe our much maligned media guys who insinuate inside knowledge of incompetence/arrogance/and spite returned on Darcy. I mean, you'd almost have to believe it, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Much like the fantasy owner that offers you crappy trades with a straight face....there is also the guy who lets a trade proposal sit in his email for a week or two before responding. Then if it looks in his favor down the road...he probably comes back to you with that as a starting point. Just look at the supposed Drury contract agreement. Any guy who can do that to his own player can jerk around an opposing GM. Darcy is...THAT GUY.....yet again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Here's what bugs me about that one. If Darcy has this bad reputation among other teams. Why is it that Ted Black and the other new front office guys, who all worked for another team, didn't know this coming in? That makes zero sense to me. I heard this story at my job a couple weeks back....a couple years back we were getting ready to hire a guy we to be a higher-up bigwig (VP/COO) level. He came very highly recommended from his previous company (which is a sister company based out of Pittsburgh). While our CEO thought he was doing his due diligence, it turned out that the other company wanted this guy gone so badly that they told our CEO whatever he wanted to hear so he would hire him. Someone else posted this as a joke a while back (GoDD?) but maybe in T-Pegs' research he talked to guys who wanted to see Darcy stay in his position because they knew that he had built a bad roster and was overvaluing his players and would eventually need to make moves. Just a theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wonderbread Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I heard this story at my job a couple weeks back....a couple years back we were getting ready to hire a guy we to be a higher-up bigwig (VP/COO level. He came very highly recommended from his previous company (which is a sister company based out of Pittsburgh). While our CEO thought he was doing his due diligence, it turned out that the other company wanted this guy gone so badly that they told our CEO whatever he wanted to hear so he would hire him. Someone else posted this as a joke a while back (GoDD?) but maybe in T-Pegs' research he talked to guys who wanted to see Darcy stay in his position because they knew that he had built a bad roster and was overvaluing his players and would eventually need to make moves. Just a theory. I remember this discussion. I could see it happening, especially to this franchise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChimp Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Yeah, I get that. But if the other GMs knew that Darcy wasn't returning calls because he knew he wasn't allowed to do a thing, why the snickering, you know? Yeah, you know. I think we're on the same page; there's some missing info from the whole story, but not enough missing info for it to be a non-story. What the hell are you talking about? This is Regier, not Ruff. OK, you wanted to confuse me, it worked. I was talking about Regier, and was certain I made that clear. If you were talking about Lindy, then I apologize for mixing two discussions, but I'm reading it all back and I'm pretty sure we were both talking about Regier, and I believe it's not necessarily true that his hands were tied...oh forget it. This isn't going well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I seriously doubt Bucky or any other member of the local media is going to just make items up. If it is not hard to believe that other GMs are laughing at the Sabres and Regier. The Lieno contract alone is a side splitter. Put that tweet into context and it's even worse. That tweet immediately followed this one: TBNbucky Bucky Gleason Making moves is tough for #sabres when they cant find trading partners because GMs felt alienated in the past. Big problem. Fair point. But then why are other GMs "snickering?" They surely would have known his plight. Well, I think (i) the local media guys are not making stuff up about other GMs "snickering" or otherwise putting down DR and (ii) it's very important to take what other GMs say anonymously about DR in this situation with a huge grain of salt, for a number of reasons: 1. I have read, and it seems entirely logical to me, that there is a fair amount of envy/resentment from other teams towards the Sabres due to TP sailing in and throwing huge $$ at everything that moves. 2. Any media reports that increase pressure on DR to make a deal will hurt the Sabres and benefit other teams. 3. Other teams have been fleeced by DR in the past and been criticized for it, and here's a chance for some free payback. 4. In a league with 29 other GMs and many more other "league executives", it won't be that hard to find a couple of guys with an axe to grind. I have a hard time believing Regier is so irresponsible as to not even return a phone call. Difficult to make a trade with, overvalues his players, values the wrong thing in players....sure, I can buy all of that. But to be so completely inept as to ignore other GMs? That's a bit much. I know we're all on the Darcy hate bandwagon and want him gone, but can we at least maintain some semblance of common sense? FWIW, I think I've heard this in the past, but not in the context of other GMs calling -- I think it was in the context of agents' calls -- i.e. from FAs the Sabres were planning to let go. Much like the fantasy owner that offers you crappy trades with a straight face....there is also the guy who lets a trade proposal sit in his email for a week or two before responding. Then if it looks in his favor down the road...he probably comes back to you with that as a starting point. Just look at the supposed Drury contract agreement. Any guy who can do that to his own player can jerk around an opposing GM. Darcy is...THAT GUY.....yet again. Oh for God's sake. There is enough valid material to criticize DR about without making stuff up. It's been pretty well established that that particular debacle was TG's doing. For the record, I am ready to can DR. I find the fact that the team was floundering a month ago and clearly needed a shakeup, and he let it go for another month, which effectively torpedoed the season, enough to get me there. I would love to be proven wrong, but at this point I am ready to say it: DR must go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I heard this story at my job a couple weeks back....a couple years back we were getting ready to hire a guy we to be a higher-up bigwig (VP/COO) level. He came very highly recommended from his previous company (which is a sister company based out of Pittsburgh). While our CEO thought he was doing his due diligence, it turned out that the other company wanted this guy gone so badly that they told our CEO whatever he wanted to hear so he would hire him. Someone else posted this as a joke a while back (GoDD?) but maybe in T-Pegs' research he talked to guys who wanted to see Darcy stay in his position because they knew that he had built a bad roster and was overvaluing his players and would eventually need to make moves. Just a theory. But unless guys like Ted Black and the other front office suits completely burned bridges on their way out in the past, they should have some good working relationships with people out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 But unless guys like Ted Black and the other front office suits completely burned bridges on their way out in the past, they should have some good working relationships with people out there. True. But that assumes that either they talked to a lot of people or maybe that Pittsburgh wasn't one of the places DR refused to work with. They'd be coming from an organization where their experience with DR is positive. Or what if they DID know and tried to tell T-Pegs and he refused to listen? I'm just saying it is possible that someone blew some smoke up the new front office's backside about how good he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 True. But that assumes that either they talked to a lot of people or maybe that Pittsburgh wasn't one of the places DR refused to work with. They'd be coming from an organization where their experience with DR is positive. Or what if they DID know and tried to tell T-Pegs and he refused to listen? I'm just saying it is possible that someone blew some smoke up the new front office's backside about how good he is. Or this thing is being completely overanalyzed and this year has been a perfect storm of crap. But hey, where's the fun in that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Or this thing is being completely overanalyzed and this year has been a perfect storm of crap. But hey, where's the fun in that? I don't think that posing the idea that someone might have tried to pull the wool over a rookie owner's eyes "overanalyzed". No one is asking for Pegula's phone records or who he talked to that said Darcy was greatly respected around the league....at least not yet. I'm just trying to make sense of how Regier could be considered a good GM by the new owner and his front office, but the media is reporting (and has been for a while, apparently) that Darcy's reputation is anything but. All this while the team continues to implode before our very eyes. Besides, what else do we have to talk about? Another loss? Another newbie "look at me, I'm important too!" thread? That's fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I have no doubt that Regier is looking. I'm sure he is always "looking" to make a deal. My problem is in his abilities to actual get one done, and hopefully its a decent one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I don't think that posing the idea that someone might have tried to pull the wool over a rookie owner's eyes "overanalyzed". No one is asking for Pegula's phone records or who he talked to that said Darcy was greatly respected around the league....at least not yet. I'm just trying to make sense of how Regier could be considered a good GM by the new owner and his front office, but the media is reporting (and has been for a while, apparently) that Darcy's reputation is anything but. All this while the team continues to implode before our very eyes. Besides, what else do we have to talk about? Another loss? Another newbie "look at me, I'm important too!" thread? That's fun. Darcy may in fact be a good GM and Lindy may in fact be a good head coach. All we know now is that the combination doesn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Darcy may in fact be a good GM and Lindy may in fact be a good head coach. All we know now is that the combination doesn't work. Or Darcy may be a bad GM and Lindy a good coach. Or Darcy a good GM/Lindy bad coach. Or they could both suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Or Darcy may be a bad GM and Lindy a good coach. Or Darcy a good GM/Lindy bad coach. Or they could both suck. Thank you for proving your "what else is there to talk about?" post. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fan2456 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Thank you for proving your "what else is there to talk about?" post. :lol: So can we handle the Devils' Trap? ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Thank you for proving your "what else is there to talk about?" post. :lol: It's what I do. :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Oh for God's sake. There is enough valid material to criticize DR about without making stuff up. It's been pretty well established that that particular debacle was TG's doing. For the record, I am ready to can DR. I find the fact that the team was floundering a month ago and clearly needed a shakeup, and he let it go for another month, which effectively torpedoed the season, enough to get me there. I would love to be proven wrong, but at this point I am ready to say it: DR must go. I don't care who was giving the orders.....Regier carried them out. Any person capable of F'ing over his own player and who can not be trusted, no matter who he is doing the biding for....is not of high character. Time and time again stories have come out how Darcy values his job security and salary over doing the high character thing. Look what he did to Drury, to Teppo, all the players who have left with a grudge after getting yanked around (Peca, Dumont, Briere, Hasek, Kozlov, Grier, Drury, Gilmour). If you are willing to carry out orders for a scumbag.....you, yourself are a scumbag. Especially when you rake in $1 million+ a year. How many times did Darcy tell the fans with a straight face that they were doing all they could to win a cup? Darcy is a survivor, plain and simple. Do the bare bones minnimum and not make waves in order to keep your job. He never intended to win a Stanley Cup. His intentions were to never make a mistake big enough of his own doing to get blamed and fired. Look at all the transactions or lack of transactions he has flubbed, but people pass it off to Quinn. Again...if that is the case....he is a puppet, and true GM's who have pride and balls are going to look down on him. And when Darcy "doesn't need them" and ignores them because he is happy in his own little world of mediocrity.....people are going to have little pity on him when he takes his first real chance and fails miserably. Will Darcy kick your dog and steal your lawn equipment? No. But to hold him as this sweet little man who is a saint is folly. He is nice in that he isn't an aggressive manipulator. He is just a survivor, plain and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 forgot the /rant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I don't see how Regier yanked around Hasek and Kozlov. Hasek is my favorite Sabre of all time, but he basically held the franchise hostage and made them trade him for pennies on the dollar. Kozlov clearly never wanted to be here, a la Carter in Columbus. No argument on the other names mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 forgot the /rant Having never heard me talk in person before.....I think you read my posts all wrong. Try This: Read my post in the voice and cadence of Darcy Regier. Seriously. Try it. That goes for anyone else who thinks I drink a shot of 151 and hold out an extended flame towards a kitten and spit, as I make a post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wnyguy Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 I don't see how Regier yanked around Hasek and Kozlov. Hasek is my favorite Sabre of all time, but he basically held the franchise hostage and made them trade him for pennies on the dollar. Kozlov clearly never wanted to be here, a la Carter in Columbus. No argument on the other names mentioned. Forget it, he's on a roll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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