Eichel & the "Fix" for '18-'19 Season

[PASabreFan]

In the context of the times, it was easy to see Perreault's greatness. He was accessible to everyone, which helped build the franchise from scratch. I feel like you have to be a student of the game to see Eichel's greatness (and he is great). You'd have to sit down and explain to a non-fan how he often uses his strength to fend off an opponent along the wall, then shields the puck as he uses his edges and curls along the blue line to cut back into the high slot and line up his sneaky shot. To a lot of people, that doesn't look like anything special.

 

The highlight reel plays for Eichel have been few and far between, and I might suggest there were more in his rookie year before the rest of the league caught up to him.

[SwampD]

I don't think so. We didn't get the generational player that causes those fan reactions. Those that do go just to see him..... I think the standards for what makes a Sabre worth going to the arena to see, regardless of the team, has dropped if Eichel is that guy. He certainly doesn't excite the way 11 did. And I don't think he excites the way 16 did either.

I agree.

I'm not sure I agree. He had two moves last night alone where you heard the entire arena gasp. And only two games back from injury. If he had scored on either, we would have been seeing them all day today.

[dudacek]

I think the Eichel critique above is delivered through a haze of a decade of disillusionment.

Just as the thoughts on Perreault are filtered through wide eyes of childhood wonder.

 

I think Perreault was better, but maybe not at 21.

And the game today doesn’t allow for much of what Gilbert delivered anymore.

Edited March 23, 2018 by dudacek

[PASabreFan]

I think the Eichel critique above is delivered through a haze of a decade of disillusionment.

Just as the thoughts on Perreault are filtered through wide eyes of childhood wonder.

 

I think Perreault was better, but maybe not at 21.

And the game today doesn’t allow for much of what Gilbert delivered anymore.

I carefully pointed that out. It was all vetted through my legal team.

[Bluto]

It seems that this thread was just some kind of drive by random thing by a rookie around here.  

 

So, if it is a legit proposal and some thing else ...

 

After management decided to stick it to the fans and be absolutely terrible for 2+ years that has turned into 5+ and counting, if they trade the player that was the direct result of all that then they should anticipate rioting in the streets and the burning down of the arena.

 

That's all.

 

I'm really not a "rookie" at all.  I followed the Buffalo Bison's of the AHL in the 50's and went to the first Sabres game vs. Montreal in 1970.  If I'm a rookie - I'm an old rookie.  Jack is NOT the guy to build around.   He's the best we have right now - but - -watch him give up on so many plays and dog-it regularly.  Maybe some of the problem comes from him - maybe?  Don't trade him for draft picks - - get a few SOLID NHL players and dump the fakers on the roster.  GO SABRES!

[Crusader1969]

I'm really not a "rookie" at all.  I followed the Buffalo Bison's of the AHL in the 50's and went to the first Sabres game vs. Montreal in 1970.  If I'm a rookie - I'm an old rookie.  Jack is NOT the guy to build around.   He's the best we have right now - but - -watch him give up on so many plays and dog-it regularly.  Maybe some of the problem comes from him - maybe?  Don't trade him for draft picks - - get a few SOLID NHL players and dump the fakers on the roster.  GO SABRES!

They aren't trading hm, so really not worth discussing

[PerreaultForever]

I think the thing about Eichel is he isn't improving. He's very talented, but he's basically the same guy he was when he first got here. The lack of development makes you question the work ethic and/or desire. perhaps if he lacks those, it is infectious. 

[Bluto]

Eichel will never improve.  There are 65 players right now in the NHL with more goals than him!  He's got the 'kid' mentality - the spoiled kid mentality - and can't lead a team.  I don't think he's the guy that will walk up to a new, established player that joins the Sabres and shakes his hand and says - - "let's get this team going" !  I doubt that very much! 

[Huckleberry]

I'm hoping Olofsson or Nylander might turn into a winger for Eichel.

[nfreeman]

Well, I have posted my feelings about the tank many times.  It was a terrible decision that has worked out as expected, and Eichel was in no way worth it -- but very few players in NHL history would have been worth it.

 

Having said that, we are where we are and we need to make decisions based on what is best for this team given our current status.  In that context, IMHO Eichel is an excellent young player who at times looks like a dominant, top-5 NHL player and is locked up though his prime. 

 

You don't trade a guy like that unless you know there's a Forsberg coming back -- and it seems incredibly unlikely that a trade like that will materialize.  So yes, the door isn't closed, but a trade possibility is pretty much an abstraction.

 

And what you definitely don't do is decide that he's not as good as you were hoping, so you're going to trade him for a bunch of decent players and start over.  That would be insane.

[nucci]

believe me, 11 is the reason why I'm a Sabres fan living near Toronto. Jack is just as exciting, he just doesn't have the line-mates and doesnt get to shoot against 5'8 goalies with very little padding. 

I'm not down on Eichel but no where near as exciting as Perreault. We used to sit up in our seats when he got on the ice and almost stand when he picked up the puck behind the net. The Aud would be buzzing...

[miles]

i think EVENTUALLY the sabres will be able to fit together a good team around eichel. i think it is 4 or 5 year out, which is halfway through his contract. 

 

short of the sabres getting at least 2 all stars early in an affordable contract, there is way to trade him. it doesnt make sense. i dont see any team dumb enough to trade at least 2 established very good players for 1 great one 

 

eichel is the face of this team, whether you like it or not

[Marvelo]

Trade the kid!  He can't make this team any better with a few new players around him next season.  He IS NOT that guy!

 

Just do it, cut bait and begin the 'start over' process. 

 

 

People are calling me a ROOKIE on here - - I don't post much on web sites! 

 

I'm really not a "rookie" at all.  I followed the Buffalo Bison's of the AHL in the 50's & 60's and went to the first Sabres game vs. Montreal in 1970.  If I'm a rookie - I'm an old rookie.  Jack is NOT the guy to build around.   He's the best we have right now - but - -watch him give up on so many plays and dog-it regularly.  Maybe some of the problem comes from him - maybe?  Don't trade him for draft picks - - get a few SOLID NHL players and dump the fakers on the roster.  GO SABRES!

 

I appreciate that you've been a Buffalo hockey fan since the 50s and 60s. That's a long, long time. You deserve respect. I used to go to the Bisons games with my dad and brother in the late 60s. It was great when the Bisons won that championship in '69-70. I was there. When you follow hockey that long, you get a sense for it. It may seem crazy to others, but the thousands of games watched results in a cumulative hockey sense.

 

Fast forward to 2018. Buffalo has been in last place for years. They've had the worst scoring of any team ever. Some say they tanked on purpose...When you put players on the ice who have no business being in the NHL and pay huge amounts of money to aging, slow and borderline players, it can be seen as tanking on purpose. 

 

But I see that putting bad players on the ice year after year is just the end product of assembling an incompetent management team, headed up by an incompetent owner and his wife, who began their regime by hiring that incompetent rookie management team, firing them after a couple years and hiring another one.

 

So WHO, I ask you is going to be the one to put together a mega-trade for our best player? An incompetent rookie GM that's who... as was his predecessor. I have zero confidence in any of these Pegula hires.

 

I am moving away from the idea of complete incompetence and toward the the idea of intentional incompetence. The end-game being that Pegula Sports and Entertainment is the Bain Capital of the sporting world, picking up distressed organizations on the relative cheap, dwindling them down and eventually shuttering them. 

Edited March 23, 2018 by Marvelo

[LGR4GM]

Eichel will never improve. There are 65 players right now in the NHL with more goals than him! He's got the 'kid' mentality - the spoiled kid mentality - and can't lead a team. I don't think he's the guy that will walk up to a new, established player that joins the Sabres and shakes his hand and says - - "let's get this team going" ! I doubt that very much!

No you're a rookie poster because you come into a forum with a crap comment like Eichel being 65th in goal scoring. I didn't even bother to look of this was right because it's irrelevant. He missed 15 games, and he's still got the most goals on buffalo and is still almost a ppg player. So thxs rookie for venting but you're completely wrong about Eichel and trying to use that stat with no context basically proves that 4 me.

 

I can tell you're an older poster too with the kid mentality comment. He's 21 and I've seen a lot of growth between 19 and 21 from him. I think I'll see more.

Edited March 23, 2018 by Skurk Liger

[darksabre]

Eichel will never improve.  There are 65 players right now in the NHL with more goals than him!  He's got the 'kid' mentality - the spoiled kid mentality - and can't lead a team.  I don't think he's the guy that will walk up to a new, established player that joins the Sabres and shakes his hand and says - - "let's get this team going" !  I doubt that very much! 

Please go back to calling WGR instead of posting here. 

[PASabreFan]

Well done, Welcome Wagon! Don't let them get you down, Bluto. Welcome. Please keep posting.

Eichel will never improve.  There are 65 players right now in the NHL with more goals than him!  He's got the 'kid' mentality - the spoiled kid mentality - and can't lead a team.  I don't think he's the guy that will walk up to a new, established player that joins the Sabres and shakes his hand and says - - "let's get this team going" !  I doubt that very much! 

It might help if ROR got traded and Jack got the C. Ryan came here wanting to be The Man, and I get the feeling they are oil and water.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

I'm really not a "rookie" at all.  I followed the Buffalo Bison's of the AHL in the 50's and went to the first Sabres game vs. Montreal in 1970.  If I'm a rookie - I'm an old rookie.  Jack is NOT the guy to build around.   He's the best we have right now - but - -watch him give up on so many plays and dog-it regularly.  Maybe some of the problem comes from him - maybe?  Don't trade him for draft picks - - get a few SOLID NHL players and dump the fakers on the roster.  GO SABRES!

 

Gotcha.

 

Sorry for the confusion.  I meant that you are a Sabrespace rookie.

 

:beer:

[Crusader1969]

Well, I have posted my feelings about the tank many times.  It was a terrible decision that has worked out as expected, and Eichel was in no way worth it -- but very few players in NHL history would have been worth it.

 

Having said that, we are where we are and we need to make decisions based on what is best for this team given our current status.  In that context, IMHO Eichel is an excellent young player who at times looks like a dominant, top-5 NHL player and is locked up though his prime. 

 

You don't trade a guy like that unless you know there's a Forsberg coming back -- and it seems incredibly unlikely that a trade like that will materialize.  So yes, the door isn't closed, but a trade possibility is pretty much an abstraction.

 

And what you definitely don't do is decide that he's not as good as you were hoping, so you're going to trade him for a bunch of decent players and start over.  That would be insane.

 

 

1) I can't believe we are still talking about the 2015 season. the Tank worked, we got our two best players, the re-build has failed to this point but there is still hope as the prospects that we actually did draft from 2015-2017 are getting closer to being NHL ready

2) what exactly did the Sabres blow up? the team was mediocre at best in 2012 to 2013 and wasn't going anywhere. All players traded were on expiring contracts and their time was up in Buffalo. Can you look back and say "wow, i can't believe we traded that guy!"  not one guy who  was traded away amounted to anything, most are already out of the league or on their 2nd team since leaving Buffalo.

3) what are you basing Jack isn't good enough? are you the same people that said Reinhart is a bust? probably saying Nylander is a bust as well. Sometimes, it pays to be patient...Except when waiting on the Mittlestadt decision! please let today be the day we find out, one way or the other.

 

how much more exciting is it to be a Hurricane fan? team continually drafts around 10th and is stuck.

[BuffaloBorn]

You don't trade a guy like eichel, at that age too? You're talking about a potential top 5 guy. Any trade involving him would be a disaster. I didn't realize Chiarelli was a sabresspace poster

[MattPie]

I think the thing about Eichel is he isn't improving. He's very talented, but he's basically the same guy he was when he first got here. The lack of development makes you question the work ethic and/or desire. perhaps if he lacks those, it is infectious. 

 

Eichel will never improve.  There are 65 players right now in the NHL with more goals than him!  He's got the 'kid' mentality - the spoiled kid mentality - and can't lead a team.  I don't think he's the guy that will walk up to a new, established player that joins the Sabres and shakes his hand and says - - "let's get this team going" !  I doubt that very much! 

 

Eichel's 2-way game is worlds better than it was when he was a rookie, all while maintaining his scoring pace, which is near the top of the NHL, per-game. I wasn't old enough to watch Perreault with a critical eye, but was he some sort of 2-way demon on the ice, or a guy that could skate through the entire team and score on a guy with the equivalent of a couple phone books on his legs?

 

Leadership: Wasn't one of Perreault's knocks that he wasn't a leader? He was the Captain from 1981-1986 after being the league for 11 years before that.

 

I'm not bagging on Gil, but I think people are looking back wearing a pretty serious 1970s-style pair of rose-colored glasses here.

 

Well done, Welcome Wagon! Don't let them get you down, Bluto. Welcome. Please keep posting.

It might help if ROR got traded and Jack got the C. Ryan came here wanting to be The Man, and I get the feeling they are oil and water.

 

It must be nice to have more relentlessly-negative voices around here. :)

Edited March 23, 2018 by MattiPaj

[PASabreFan]

Eichel's 37th in points per game.

[Crusader1969]

think thats pretty amazing when considering the team he plays for.

[North Buffalo]

Eichel's 2-way game is worlds better than it was when he was a rookie, all while maintaining his scoring pace, which is near the top of the NHL, per-game. I wasn't old enough to watch Perreault with a critical eye, but was he some sort of 2-way demon on the ice, or a guy that could skate through the entire team and score on a guy with the equivalent of a couple phone books on his legs?

 

Leadership: Wasn't one of Perreault's knocks that he wasn't a leader? He was the Captain from 1981-1986 after being the league for 11 years before that.

 

I'm not bagging on Gil, but I think people are looking back wearing a pretty serious 1970s-style pair of rose-colored glasses here.

 

 

 

It must be nice to have more relentlessly-negative voices around here. :)

You are right about Gil though he got better as he got older. Still he could skate through an entire D with guys drapped on him or juke them and increase speed while not appearing to lift his legs. Dont remember him being great on D though except he became a pretty good back checker. One thing was he would pick the puck up behind his own net and skate the entire length of the ice and score. He had a nack of getting the D to open enough so he could split them.

 

Also he was a very good passer especially with Rico’s shot and Renee’s hustle. The whole line had speed. Jack will be much better when he has linemates with skill and speed. Casey and say draft pick, CJ or someone like him

[dudacek]

Eichel's 37th in points per game.

This gets overlooked.

He needs to be top 10.

[nfreeman]

Perreault was unquestionably a top-5 player for most of his career, and there were a number of years when he was in the conversation for #1. Eichel is simply nowhere near that level at this point. He might get there but he might not.