The New Lineup Thread

[Crusader1969]

For evaluation purposes it looks like they are trying a myriad of configurations. I don't think Botterill and Housley in their own minds believe they know what their "best team" is yet.

But that's not a tank.

I feel pretty confident that they know that Moulson isn't a part of it but there he is...11gp 0g 0a

 

I agree it's not a full out Tank but they aren't going all out to win either.

[darksabre]

I feel pretty confident that they know that Moulson isn't a part of it but there he is...11gp 0g 0a

 

I agree it's not a full out Tank but they aren't going all out to win either.

What are they even supposed to do? We've got a bunch of bad contracts we really can't move, we've got a bunch of kids that we really don't want to bring up from the A until they've built a little winning culture down there. And it's really too early to start trading the good assets we have. We're stuck. It's not a tank, they're just bad.

[bunomatic]

Moulson is real bad. The guy can't play hockey. WTF was the braintrust thinking when they signed this guy? Other than we need a babysitter.

[Doohickie]

Eh..... I thought Matty looked okay last game.

[Thorny]

What are they even supposed to do? We've got a bunch of bad contracts we really can't move, we've got a bunch of kids that we really don't want to bring up from the A until they've built a little winning culture down there. And it's really too early to start trading the good assets we have. We're stuck. It's not a tank, they're just bad.

Exactly.

 

As comforting, in a way, as it would be to think we are this bad by design, that's not the case. This is just what they are.

Edited November 14, 2017 by Thorny

[ubkev]

What are they even supposed to do? We've got a bunch of bad contracts we really can't move, we've got a bunch of kids that we really don't want to bring up from the A until they've built a little winning culture down there. And it's really too early to start trading the good assets we have. We're stuck. It's not a tank, they're just bad.

I think, I just might have said we'd regret Kyle Okposo's contract before the year was out...

 

Edit: not that it's unredeemable. He just has a -ton of work to do.

Edited November 14, 2017 by ubkev

[dudacek]

Moulson over Bailey is not tanking.

It is player development.

 

Botterill was very clear that 11minutes every NHL second game is not how he wants to develop his prospects.

That is Moulson’s role.

[darksabre]

Exactly.

 

As comforting, in a way, as it would be to think we are this bad by design, that's not the case. This is just what they are.

 

This is what happens when you need to stock the farm. You end up with plugs on the big squad filling space. 

 

I think, I just might have said we'd regret Kyle Okposo's contract before the year was out...

 

Edit: not that it's unredeemable. He just has a ######-ton of work to do.

It's possible. I hope he turns it around but it's not looking good right now. 

 

Moulson over Bailey is not tanking.

It is player development.

 

Botterill was very clear that 11minutes every NHL second game is not how he wants to develop his prospects.

That is Moulson’s role.

Developing prospects is what this is all about. Botterill isn't going to bring guys up from the farm just to play them here to scrape out an extra win or two. He wants them down there developing and winning. Which means we're stuck with guys like Tennyson and Moulson this year. 

[dudacek]

Am I the only one who thinks Okposo is looking a lot more like himself the past couple weeks?

[Marvelo]

Am I the only one who thinks Okposo is looking a lot more like himself the past couple weeks?

 

I haven't watched for awhile and I'll take your word that maybe he's rounding into shape, but who gives a 7 year contract to someone who is almost 30?  Seems the Sabres never learn.

[Crusader1969]

I agree with all of you - not a full out "Tank" but a "subtle" one. If you aren't going all out to win, isn't that at least a subtle tank? -  a tank that Toronto could be proud of.

 

I also agree that developing prospects is the right way to go. Id keep all the prospects in the AHL for the entire year, let them win. Only call up here and there to fill for injuries.

I haven't watched for awhile and I'll take your word that maybe he's rounding into shape, but who gives a 7 year contract to someone who is almost 30?  Seems the Sabres never learn.

 

 

I think to get guys to come to the Sabres, we have to over pay. Lessons should be learnt that these contracts very rarely work out. Exactly why I am leaning towards trading Kane.

[erickompositör72]

I was so excited when we signed Moulson, because for the half-season we had him, he seemed to maintain a goal pace similar to Vanek's that season.

 

I didn't realize the future implications...

 

 

However, I do think he's looked better the past couple of games. It seemed like Nolan and Larsson have the ability dig the puck out of corner and find Moulson open (I think Larsson has pretty good vision), which is the only way he'll score goals. I don't think this will happen with great regularity, but hopefully enough to provide some secondary or tertiary scoring.

[spndnchz]

Am I the only one who thinks Okposo is looking a lot more like himself the past couple weeks?

Yes. Yes he is.

[Thorny]

I agree with all of you - not a full out "Tank" but a "subtle" one. If you aren't going all out to win, isn't that at least a subtle tank? -  a tank that Toronto could be proud of.

 

I also agree that developing prospects is the right way to go. Id keep all the prospects in the AHL for the entire year, let them win. Only call up here and there to fill for injuries.

 

 

 

I think to get guys to come to the Sabres, we have to over pay. Lessons should be learnt that these contracts very rarely work out. Exactly why I am leaning towards trading Kane.

No. Tanking is an extreme distinction reserved for teams that are trying to lose. What is being detailed here are rebuilding strategies. We can't just say "not going all out to win" means subtle-tank. For one, tanking is black or white. You are either trying to lose, or you are not.

 

And Two, there is too much grey area when it comes to rebuilding to classify those things as tank moves. A team that purposely, slowly eases back an injured player into the lineup isn't going "all out to win" technically, but is still acting in the best interest of the team going forward.

 

I think we're agreeing on most of it just not the verbage. But for me at least, tanking is reserved for teams trying purposely to lose, which we are definitely not.

[Marvelo]

Thank you to Phil Housley for reuniting Reinhart with Eichel and Kane. See, we told you so.

[Drunkard]

Thank you to Phil Housley for reuniting Reinhart with Eichel and Kane. See, we told you so.

 

This. As much as I wanted to see Reinhart remain at center, I'm glad he's back on a line with a couple of guys who like the shoot the puck since he seems to prefer to camp out in front of the net and screen the goalie.

 

I'd prefer Reinhart centering Kane on a separate line and leaving Eichel with Pominville and someone like Girgensons on his LW, but this will have to do for now.

Girgensons Eichel Pominville (this line worked earlier in the season but was broken up for some unknown reason)

 

Pouliot O'Reilly Okposo

 

Kane Reinhart Baptiste (I wish they would try something like this)

 

Moulson Larsson Nolan

[Weave]

Ullmark not at Amerks practice this morning?  Call up?

[darksabre]

Ullmark not at Amerks practice this morning? Call up?

I would assume so. I don't think Lehner should have finished that game last night.

[Doohickie]

Imagine Ullmark getting the start.... it would be the OneBuffalo thing to do.  Peterman replaces Tyrod, Linus replaces Robin, all in the same weekend.

[Randall Flagg]

Lehner got knocked in the head, didn't he?

[Doohickie]

I thought it was a groin pull.  He stretched, made a big save, then went down.  If he got hit in the head in the process, I missed that part.

[darksabre]

Lehner got knocked in the head, didn't he?

Yeah. I thought his injury was actually his groin though, the way he was slow to get back to his feet. So who knows. 

[Doohickie]

Here's the video.... did Scandella clip him after the save?

 

[dudacek]

Groin was my initial take. Scandella definitely hit him though.

That was a helluva save.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Is this lineup finally coming together?

 

The 1st line now seems locked in with Kane, Jack and Sam.

So is the 2nd line. Pouliot, RoR and Okposo, who finally is looking like himself again.

Z and Pommers should make up 2/3 of a decent 3rd line. Larsson is ok as a 4th line/Pking center.

 

Seems to me, it might be worth bringing up either Smith or Criscuolo to see if they can skate with Z and Pommers and create some more depth scoring. If they bring up Smith, then Z plays center. If they bring up Criscuolo, then Z plays LW. At this point, Moulson, Griffith, and Baptiste don’t help this team. Send them down or out.

 

The Minn boys, Falk and Marco are settling in together, although 18 minutes a night of Falk is probably to many. McCabe Risto should work if Risto can get healthy. That leaves 2/3 slots for Antipin (who by season’s end will lockdown one slot), Bogo (if he ever returns), Gorges (to add physical play if necessary) and Baloo.

 

I’ve said this before, but I might dress 7 D, and only 11 forwards and double shift someone like Kane, Jack, Ko and ROR to get more offense. Wowie shortens his bench in the 3rd anyway, so does getting 5 minutes from Moulson spread out over 4 guys really hurt? The 7th D could be Baloo or Antipin as a PP specialist or Gorges as a Pker.

Edited November 15, 2017 by GASabresIUFAN