Derrico Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 BPA works in theory, but at some point a conscious decision has to be made to add quality defenceman to the team and/or pipeline, as we are in such dire need of them. We don't have to select a defenceman at 8, but if we don't, Botterill needs to find a way to add either a young prospect D man or young roster D man to the roster, this offseason. Seems like yesterday the Sabres strength was young Dmen (McNabb, Myers, McCabe, Brennan, Schiestel). The need was high end centremen. Wasn't it just 3 or 4 years ago we heard Darcy say the Sabres had 3 of the top 50 centremen in the league or something crazy? It was obvious to everyone but him the real weakness on the team. Will any of the drafted D be ready to help next year? Even the year after? Who knows what needs the team has in 3 or 4 years time. B.P.A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 Seems like yesterday the Sabres strength was young Dmen (McNabb, Myers, McCabe, Brennan, Schiestel). The need was high end centremen. Wasn't it just 3 or 4 years ago we heard Darcy say the Sabres had 3 of the top 50 centremen in the league or something crazy? It was obvious to everyone but him the real weakness on the team. Will any of the drafted D be ready to help next year? Even the year after? Who knows what needs the team has in 3 or 4 years time. B.P.A. Well, they'll need D men. If they can't swing a trade for one. The prospect pool has no D depth, in order to maximize the likelihood of contributing prospects in the future, teams look to stock prospects at each position, in the cupboard. It would make sense to add to the defence prospect pool as it's lacking relative to other positions. My argument though is that they can't enter into next season with the same future outlook for our d corps as it currently stands. Draft a defenceman prospect, trade for one, or sign a young roster d man. That's the top priority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 Well, they'll need D men. If they can't swing a trade for one. The prospect pool has no D depth, in order to maximize the likelihood of contributing prospects in the future, teams look to stock prospects at each position, in the cupboard. It would make sense to add to the defence prospect pool as it's lacking relative to other positions. My argument though is that they can't enter into next season with the same future outlook for our d corps as it currently stands. Draft a defenceman prospect, trade for one, or sign a young roster d man. That's the top priority. No disagreement there, but a young D in a trade short of the issue of a few with cap problems may make trading too expensive... If so maybe a trade up for a top D, or if a top O falls to Sabres, use that to trade for a young D. Too many unknowns right now... but not a horrible position to be in and I still think one or two of the young D step up this year a la Ghule... Austin, Antipin if signed and, Borgen.., Antipin looked competent against USA but a a little gun shy. Wasnt taking any chances and looks like Russians held him back. Probably a great learning experience for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 Well, they'll need D men. If they can't swing a trade for one. The prospect pool has no D depth, in order to maximize the likelihood of contributing prospects in the future, teams look to stock prospects at each position, in the cupboard. It would make sense to add to the defence prospect pool as it's lacking relative to other positions. My argument though is that they can't enter into next season with the same future outlook for our d corps as it currently stands. Draft a defenceman prospect, trade for one, or sign a young roster d man. That's the top priority. Im still scratching my head at the notion that the team has no D depth in pipeline. As we discussed yesterday 4 out of 6 draft picks in 2015 were dmen and 4 more in 2016. We are starting to see them at the pro level now with Guhle and Stephens. next year I would expect Borgen and Fitzgerald to be added. Soon the pipeline will be over-flowing with D prospects while the Forward depth will look weaker. Though I do agree that adding 1 more dman through trade or UFA is needed this off-season. I'm still leaning Dman with the 8th pick but if they believe that a guy like Mittelstadt, Tippett or Glass is a much better prospect than the D at 8, I think you take the Forward. There will be decent prospects available in the 2nd round or they can use the 2 second rounders to move up to grab a guy they like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted May 16, 2017 Report Share Posted May 16, 2017 Im still scratching my head at the notion that the team has no D depth in pipeline. As we discussed yesterday 4 out of 6 draft picks in 2015 were dmen and 4 more in 2016. We are starting to see them at the pro level now with Guhle and Stephens. next year I would expect Borgen and Fitzgerald to be added. Soon the pipeline will be over-flowing with D prospects while the Forward depth will look weaker. Though I do agree that adding 1 more dman through trade or UFA is needed this off-season. I'm still leaning Dman with the 8th pick but if they believe that a guy like Mittelstadt, Tippett or Glass is a much better prospect than the D at 8, I think you take the Forward. There will be decent prospects available in the 2nd round or they can use the 2 second rounders to move up to grab a guy they like. Good points. I should rephrase to say that I think we are lacking blue-chip defensive prospects in the system, aside from perhaps Guhle. Aside from him, it's hard to say any of the others have anything close to a likely shot at becoming true top 4 guys, and at least not anytime soon. That's what I'm getting from their scouting projections, anyways. Maybe someone will surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 A guy to stay away from in the 2nd. Robin Salo. He has skating issues from what I can see and what I have read. I don't want to deal with that. I also think there are other prospects in the range he will go who are better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rakish Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 A guy to stay away from in the 2nd. Robin Salo. He has skating issues from what I can see and what I have read. I don't want to deal with that. I also think there are other prospects in the range he will go who are better. Huh...(rakish crosses Salo off his draft board) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 (edited) Huh...(rakish crosses Salo off his draft board) lol, don't have to, I have been known to be wrong. He's also very smart and has other skills but I just hesitate whenever I hear about a defender with skating questions. Edited May 22, 2017 by LGR4GM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasmus_ Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 The Sabres have two second overall draft picks that have scored at top six levels as 20-year-olds and a 26-year-old first line centre on a long-term contract. Skilled centres are always a need, but they certainly aren't a pressing need. I agree, and the only center's that have the semi legit possibility of being there would be Glass and Middlestadt. I stll don't see or agree with that. The only C that I would go jumping up to the mic for is Vilardi. I like his zone presence and the way he enters the zone. His skating is his knock, but I think he's going to be a very fine centermen. I'm still very bullish on Liljegren. lol, don't have to, I have been known to be wrong. He's also very smart and has other skills but I just hesitate whenever I hear about a defender with skating questions. I like Salo at our top of the second round pick. He is someone that I'm higher on than Brannstrom. But, to each their own. This is a pepper this and that way type of draft with little difference, minus preference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 I like Salo at our top of the second round pick. He is someone that I'm higher on than Brannstrom. But, to each their own. This is a pepper this and that way type of draft with little difference, minus preference. I'm on the Connor Timmins, if he slides OR Henri Jokiharju at #38. Salo's skating just puts me right off. If he was there at #57(?) then I might take him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 I think this draft has more depth then we are giving it credit for. High end talent like McDavid or Eichel, maybe not but decent depth for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 I think this draft has more depth then we are giving it credit for. High end talent like McDavid or Eichel, maybe not but decent depth for sure. I keep a spreadsheet on the rankings from 10 or so services and writers like THN, Tsn, DraftBuzz and ISS, and so far there are about 50 players that these scouts and writers have given a 1st rd grade to. That said that is a firm 22 or so at the top and then another 15 with solid support. This draft reminds me of 2014, where the best player may arguably be the 24th player in Pastrank or 2013 where 13th pick Forsberg is the best forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 I keep a spreadsheet on the rankings from 10 or so services and writers like THN, Tsn, DraftBuzz and ISS, and so far there are about 50 players that these scouts and writers have given a 1st rd grade to. That said that is a firm 22 or so at the top and then another 15 with solid support. This draft reminds me of 2014, where the best player may arguably be the 24th player in Pastrank or 2013 where 13th pick Forsberg is the best forward. I want to argue about the 2013th draft and the best forward but I am going to stay on topic! I agree, I think this draft will have some mid and later round guys that become really good NHL players but weren't overly hyped. I think 50 might be the drop off or there about. I hope we use at least 1 of our 2nd round picks because I think we will get someone good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 I meant 2012 with Forsberg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasmus_ Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 (edited) I'm on the Connor Timmins, if he slides OR Henri Jokiharju at #38. Salo's skating just puts me right off. If he was there at #57(?) then I might take him. Well if Timmins is there of course, I think he's gone by 32, but who knows. Same with Jokiharju. I know the knock on Salo is his skating, but I like the other elements of his game. Fair enough. It's really a wish wash from mid tier 1st round all the way into the mid 2nd round on scouting rankings. Edited May 22, 2017 by TheCerebral1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewookie1 Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 If the 4th best forward and the 5th best dman is there I'm taking the forward or trying to trade down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rakish Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 For me, this draft is a lot deeper than 2012. For instance, if I combine the two drafts, among forwards, there are 21 2017 picks and 9 2012 picks in the top 30. Defensemen are split more evenly, 14 2017's vs 16 2012's. Though, as everyone seems to agree, no one at the top end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 22, 2017 Report Share Posted May 22, 2017 (edited) If the 4th best forward and the 5th best dman is there I'm taking the forward or trying to trade down. We don't know if the 4th best forward is as good as the 5th best defender though or vice versa In this draft I would say the 4th best forward is better then the 5th best defender though. Edited May 22, 2017 by LGR4GM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 What I'm hoping for is coming away with two 1st rd picks in this draft. Depending on how Jbot fixes the D, I'm actually ok with draft a forward at 8. For example, if we trade Kane, we are going to need 2 good LW's. Nylander is one, but we don't have no.2. I also want a 1st rd caliber D regardless. Ideally, we trade down and grab either D Valimaki or LW Vesalainen. Then use our 2nd rd picks and acquired assets to move back into the first and grab the LW or D we didn't get the earlier. There is a ton of quality choices. D Hague, Foote, and Timmins come to mind as do LW Comtois and Radcliffe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 (edited) What I'm hoping for is coming away with two 1st rd picks in this draft. Depending on how Jbot fixes the D, I'm actually ok with draft a forward at 8. For example, if we trade Kane, we are going to need 2 good LW's. Nylander is one, but we don't have no.2. I also want a 1st rd caliber D regardless. Ideally, we trade down and grab either D Valimaki or LW Vesalainen. Then use our 2nd rd picks and acquired assets to move back into the first and grab the LW or D we didn't get the earlier. There is a ton of quality choices. D Hague, Foote, and Timmins come to mind as do LW Comtois and Radcliffe. Trying to catch up on the draft. Unless Makar or Heiskanen are there, I want to trade the pick for a defenceman more than ever, or, failing that to trade down. The guys around our pick all have high bust potential. Tippett is selfish and lazy. Rasmussen's tools disguise the fact he's not a player Pettersson, Glass, Tolvanen, Necas all have upside, but they all are lesser versions of Nylander and I don't want too many of those soft, flashy types on my team. Suzuki is more my type of player, but he's not worth 8. Neither are Foote or Liljegren. Why aren't Valimaki and Brannstrom ranked higher? Those guys look like players to me. I'd trade 8 and 57 to Carolina for 12 and 43 — walk away with Valimaki and at least one of a number of solid d-men available in the first half of the second. Or something similar. Edited May 23, 2017 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 I don't know why Valimaki isn't rated higher. He dominated in the WHL and is one of the older draft eligible draft prospects. I guess he has never dominated in any of the big International tourneys that has worked against him. However isn't asking a lot for an 18 year old to dominate in the U20s? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted May 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 Article detailing we will pick Timmins (d) or Cody Glass ©; the latter is a Reinhart player, making Samson expendable and therefore, gone https://www.fanragsports.com/nhl/sabres/sabres-unable-fix-immediate-issues-nhl-draft/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 Trying to catch up on the draft. Unless Makar or Heiskanen are there, I want to trade the pick for a defenceman more than ever, or, failing that to trade down. The guys around our pick all have high bust potential. Tippett is selfish and lazy. Rasmussen's tools disguise the fact he's not a player Pettersson, Glass, Tolvanen, Necas all have upside, but they all are lesser versions of Nylander and I don't want too many of those soft, flashy types on my team. Suzuki is more my type of player, but he's not worth 8. Neither are Foote or Liljegren. Why aren't Valimaki and Brannstrom ranked higher? Those guys look like players to me. I'd trade 8 and 57 to Carolina for 12 and 43 — walk away with Valimaki and at least one of a number of solid d-men available in the first half of the second. Or something similar. very weak 5 vs 5 stats. He is like 74th in even scoring, usually those guys get picked in the 5th round. We are picking Glass or Liljegren I think though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 Article detailing we will pick Timmins (d) or Cody Glass ©; the latter is a Reinhart player, making Samson expendable and therefore, gone https://www.fanragsports.com/nhl/sabres/sabres-unable-fix-immediate-issues-nhl-draft/ No chance I draft Timmons at 8, maybe #18. Glass would have to be in the system for 2-3 years before you can assess if he's better then Reinhart. Interesting read but Timmons at 8 isn't happening. You can trade down if you really want him. I don't know why Valimaki isn't rated higher. He dominated in the WHL and is one of the older draft eligible draft prospects. I guess he has never dominated in any of the big International tourneys that has worked against him. However isn't asking a lot for an 18 year old to dominate in the U20s?He's also not the best defender on his team I think ? Might impact things but I'd take him over Timmons maybe. Those two are close in my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted May 23, 2017 Report Share Posted May 23, 2017 No chance I draft Timmons at 8, maybe #18. Glass would have to be in the system for 2-3 years before you can assess if he's better then Reinhart. Interesting read but Timmons at 8 isn't happening. You can trade down if you really want him. He's also not the best defender on his team I think ? Might impact things but I'd take him over Timmons maybe. Those two are close in my mind. Do you mean Wotherspoon? He's a 4 year WHL vet and good NYI prospect despite being a 4th rd pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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