LGR4GM Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 FUCALE!! Why is Haile Selassie dressed up like a pilot, not to mention as a white dude, dropping what looks like a mic in that gif, Liger? It's captain obvious, obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 Well then, you're wrong. I still don't see it. Lehner's cost, injury history, and playing experience (which he has been average at) relative to Ullmark makes Ullmark's prospects more exciting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 I still don't see it. Lehner's cost, injury history, and playing experience (which he has been average at) relative to Ullmark makes Ullmark's prospects more excitingI can't come close to seeing it this way either, for the reasons Dudaced laid out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 I can't come close to seeing it this way either, for the reasons Dudaced laid out. Well, maybe I am wrong then. :lol: But I'm more excited about Ullmark than Lehner, personally Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 (edited) I still don't see it. Lehner's cost, injury history, and playing experience (which he has been average at) relative to Ullmark makes Ullmark's prospects more excitingLehner was hot and cold in the NHL this year. I'd give him a grade of "pretty good." Ullmark was good for a rookie (and then went cold) and then struggled in the A. Lehner is the better goalie at this time, and the one I'm more excited about. Edited March 31, 2016 by qwksndmonster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 (edited) This will pretty much be my only post on this subject. Sorry I'm to drunk to read any of the above :P I think Lehner has been decent this year, I think he had something to prove for himself and for Murray. A high ankle sprain is more difficult to treat than a bone fracture. That they decide for a new surgery is not good, but might just be the best option. He now has an extra month to get back into shape. They decided in time to call it quits on this season and we'll hopefully have a healty #1 goalie with him. We should sign Chad to a 2 year contract to be sure if lehner has a setback, Its not good to be in this situation but I don't want to miss the playoffs because we missed out on an experienced goalie and to be honest chad deserves this. Edit: if you don't get chad back in time, contact the canucks and offer them a 3rd for miller , :D Edited March 31, 2016 by Huckleberry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 Ugh. Not only did we give up a one for Lehner, but we had a perfectly serviceable starting goalie in Michal Neuvirth who we swapped for Johnson from the Islanders. I hope GMTM's body of work offsets his goalie deals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 Ugh. Not only did we give up a one for Lehner, but we had a perfectly serviceable starting goalie in Michal Neuvirth who we swapped for Johnson from the Islanders. I hope GMTM's body of work offsets his goalie deals. You don't think ROR, Kane, Reinhart and Bogosian offset that a bit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLYNNSanity Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 I like Linus's personality, but hes been playing like crap in roch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 You don't think ROR, Kane, Reinhart and Bogosian offset that a bit?It does. Let's hope he only needs one Mulligan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 It does. Let's hope he only needs one Mulligan. He'll undoubtedly need another. Is there a GM in history who only made one bad move? Hell, he already needs a second with Moulson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 I feel bad for Lehner and I hope he recovers. He still doesn't pass my eyeball test. Interesting.. I thought he did way better than expected considering the injury and slow start to the season. I'm actually opposite, I think he surpassed overall expectations and looked like the answer to our starting goalie situation Clean up the ankle get him ready for next season was the right call Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 Interesting.. I thought he did way better than expected considering the injury and slow start to the season. I'm actually opposite, I think he surpassed overall expectations and looked like the answer to our starting goalie situation Clean up the ankle get him ready for next season was the right call I think that's fair. I should wait and see how he is next season before really judging him. Also his surgery was successful, not sure if this was posted previously. http://sabres.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=876353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 I think that's fair. I should wait and see how he is next season before really judging him. Also his surgery was successful, not sure if this was posted previously. http://sabres.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=876353 Yeah its still a toss up given the injury history and small body of work, but he played well for us and you have to figure the team in front of him is going to improve greatly next year. From all the reports though he was a real leader on and off the ice too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 (edited) I'm not sure Lehner is the answer long-term; its a lot easier to have an acceptable level of play for a team no one expects to win than on a team that carries high expectations. That will be the true test. That said, over a 20-game sample he did pass the eyeball test for me. I knew he had elite size and athleticism, I had concern about his focus and technique. The concern hasn't disappeared, but he appeared to be very dialled in for all but a couple games and he bounced back well after a shaky start. He has to fix that half-butterfly he uses when an attacker is at a sharp angle at the half-wall. I also really like that his compete level seemed not only high, but very team focused; the man wants to be a leader on this team. I like that Murray seems to seek out players who want to be the guy. I also like how he fought through what is a bad injury for goalies and hope the surgery allows him to be in top form come training camp. If he was battling an ankle all year, then haven't seen him at his best, and he was pretty good while hampered. If his ceiling is what we saw this year over 60 games, then it looks like he is a capable NHL goalie. Given the track record of picks in the bottom third of the first round, I am very happy with the trade. Edited March 31, 2016 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thwomp! Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 You don't think ROR, Kane, Reinhart and Bogosian offset that a bit? The ROR trade was a good one. The only good one in my opinion. You can look at what we gave up for Kane and Bogo as too much along the same lines as the lehner trade. I'm not sure how reinhart fits in here since we tanked for him, not traded for him. Oh and neuvirth had been in the vezina conversation for most of the year until his injury and Murray did not push hard to sign him even though we needed a goalie, he was ok for us last year, and seemingly would have been OK with coming back here. Our first and neuvirth is better than lehner in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 He'll undoubtedly need another. Is there a GM in history who only made one bad move? Hell, he already needs a second with Moulson.Minor gaffes happen. Lehner has the potential to be a huge steaming pile. You don't want two or more of those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAud Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 This may seem obvious but isn't the 1st rounder we gave up for Lehner (and Legwand) irrelevant in a "Lehner vs. Ullmark vs. Johnson vs. etc" argument? It's highly relevant in a GMTM assessment discussion but...seems to come up in the former as much as the latter. Anyway there's a lot to like about both Lehner and Ullmark. Lehner has a larger body of work (no one has mentioned his stellar 2010-11 run to the AHL Championship) but has the injury history whereas Ullmark would seem to have more upside but needs time to prove it out. I don't get too wrapped up in small bodies of work for goalies, as in less than 1 season. If we are talking 20-30 games in the NHL or AHL as a data point it's useful but only in the context of the rest of their career as save % can vary quite a bit. I am looking forward to seeing if the alleged changes in goalie equipment size next year will increase scoring, and more to the point will it increase scoring less with large goaltenders like our Swede's who will still need large size equipment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 Let's call this Murray movie for what it is B*U*S*T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clintwestwood Posted March 31, 2016 Report Share Posted March 31, 2016 hmm, so with a better defense we could conceivably use Johnson next year as a starter. I think you could say the same about any of our guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted April 1, 2016 Report Share Posted April 1, 2016 Some on here used the goal support argument against me when I tried to support my case for Enroth, telling me that the team is sometimes more comfortable with certain goaltenders in net so they might play a less conservative game. So let's apply it here, something to keep in mind. There are 57 goaltenders to play 750+ minutes so far this year. Here are the three Sabres rankings. Johnson: 19th (2.21/60 minutes) Ullmark: 56th (1.33/60 minutes) Lehner 57th (1.26/60 minutes) http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/ratings.php?disp=1&db=201516&sit=5v5&pos=goalies&minutes=750&teamid=0&type=goals&sort=F60&sortdir=DESC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted April 1, 2016 Report Share Posted April 1, 2016 This may seem obvious but isn't the 1st rounder we gave up for Lehner (and Legwand) irrelevant in a "Lehner vs. Ullmark vs. Johnson vs. etc" argument? It's highly relevant in a GMTM assessment discussion but...seems to come up in the former as much as the latter. Anyway there's a lot to like about both Lehner and Ullmark. Lehner has a larger body of work (no one has mentioned his stellar 2010-11 run to the AHL Championship) but has the injury history whereas Ullmark would seem to have more upside but needs time to prove it out. I don't get too wrapped up in small bodies of work for goalies, as in less than 1 season. If we are talking 20-30 games in the NHL or AHL as a data point it's useful but only in the context of the rest of their career as save % can vary quite a bit. I am looking forward to seeing if the alleged changes in goalie equipment size next year will increase scoring, and more to the point will it increase scoring less with large goaltenders like our Swede's who will still need large size equipment. It is relevant when you consider we had Michal Neuvirth and traded him away. We could have just signed him and kept the 1st. Anders Lindback would have been an adequate #2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted April 1, 2016 Report Share Posted April 1, 2016 I was all for keeping Neuvirth, even after hearing the Caps fans talk about how frail he is, always getting hurt. When I heard about him getting hurt for the 17th time this year with the Flyers, I wasn't so disappointed after all. I'll give Lehner next year to see if the injuries follow him the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted April 1, 2016 Report Share Posted April 1, 2016 The ROR trade was a good one. The only good one in my opinion. You can look at what we gave up for Kane and Bogo as too much along the same lines as the lehner trade. I'm not sure how reinhart fits in here since we tanked for him, not traded for him. Oh and neuvirth had been in the vezina conversation for most of the year until his injury and Murray did not push hard to sign him even though we needed a goalie, he was ok for us last year, and seemingly would have been OK with coming back here. Our first and neuvirth is better than lehner in my opinion. We didn't give up too much for Kane and Bogosian. It was about getting pieces that fit in to the team that Murray wanted to build. Trades cannot just be analyzed in a vacuum like Regier tried to teach everyone. Besides, we got the best player in the trade. Saying that giving up a late first for Lehner was too much, has jumped the shark. It was a draft pick. Who knows who we would have picked had we kept it. The pick was a much more replaceable asset than what we may potentially have in Lehner. Let's call this Murray movie for what it is B*U*S*T Buffalo's Undeniable Starting Tender Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted April 1, 2016 Report Share Posted April 1, 2016 It is relevant when you consider we had Michal Neuvirth and traded him away. We could have just signed him and kept the 1st. Anders Lindback would have been an adequate #2. Maybe Neuvirth was yet another tank player that didn't want to be here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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