Jump to content

Trade ideas and speculation


Hoss

Recommended Posts

As for Ennis, he should be involved in a hockey trade which are few and far between at deadline time. 

 

Good point.

 

Well, GMTM gave Ennis an extension, so I don't think he view Ennis as a weak-kneed Darcy remnant.  And given Ennis' poor season, his value is probably pretty low, so I tend to doubt that he'll be moved.  But anything is possible.

 

Fair. But perhaps he signed him to a manageable deal with the idea (or at least the option) that he'd be made more valuable in a deal that way.

 

Also, and I know we kick this around from time to time, but: Why do we need national reporters to pass along these kinds of quotes from GM TM? Or do I miss them when they appear in the local MSM?

Edited by That Aud Smell
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good point.

 

 

Fair. But perhaps he signed him to a manageable deal with the idea (or at least the option) that he'd be made more valuable in a deal that way.

 

Also, and I know we kick this around from time to time, but: Why do we need national reporters to pass along these kinds of quotes from GM TM? Or do I miss them when they appear in the local MSM?

 

Here you go:  http://sabres.buffalonews.com/2016/01/13/43076/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ennis, Reinhart, and Gorgeous Gorges for Barrie and Rantanen.

 

I would love that trade, but that's not nearly enough for Barrie/Rantanen... maybe Barrie and a guy like Comeau or Skille or we can get Compher back, or... I JUST WANT TYSON BARRIE DAMMIT!

 

No thanks.  I don't want to part with Reinhart.  And if you think giving up Reinhart with two other useful players for Barrie and Comeau/Skille who was picked up off the dumpster pile, you're nuts.  Barrie is a top notch defensemen, but this makes 0 sense.  

I don't want a 1st for Mcginn.  A first from a playoff team is a 50/50 shot to be an NHL'er 2-4 yrs down the road.  I'd rather resign McGinn and have him for the next 3 years.

 

Or you do what you did with Moulson and trade him for value, and bring him back.  Keep the lines of communication open and he could easily return.  He's been given new life here. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But I think the $2.5MM would count against the Sabres' cap, innit?  So the cap hit would be pretty close to what they'd get from a buyout?

 

I continue to think a Moulson buyout is highly likely this summer.

 

I'm fairly sure the buyout would last longer. If traded, he'd cost the Sabres $2.5M for three seasons after this. From this, it looks like buying out would cost the Sabres more years and more cap hit than trade retaining 50%.

 

The cost is either 1/3 or 2/3 of the remaining salary, averaged out over twice as many years that were left on the contract. This is determined by the age of the player at the time of the buyout - if they are under 26, they get 1/3, if they are 26 or older they get 2/3.

It is worth mentioning that any salary slide on the remaining years goes out the window. If a 26+ player has a year at $4.2m and a year at $3.6m left, they don't get $1.4m, $1.4m, $1.2m, $1.2m - they get $1.3m in each of the 4 years.

http://www.silversevensens.com/2015/6/10/8737195/nhl-buyout-rules-refresher-guide

 

EDIT: Oops, that's the cost (as in paycheck). The cap hit is different, but difficult to explain. There's an example in the linked article. It sounds like he'd be on the book for 6 years with a cap hit of $1.8M for years 4-6. No thanks, we need to worry about Ristolainen, Eichel, Reinhart, etc. by then.

Edited by MattPie
Link to comment
Share on other sites

No thanks.  I don't want to part with Reinhart.  And if you think giving up Reinhart with two other useful players for Barrie and Comeau/Skille who was picked up off the dumpster pile, you're ###### nuts.  Barrie is a top notch defensemen, but this makes 0 sense.  

 

Or you do what you did with Moulson and trade him for value, and bring him back.  Keep the lines of communication open and he could easily return.  He's been given new life here. 

 

That assumes he comes back of course.  I'm not willing to assume that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't want a 1st for Mcginn.  A first from a playoff team is a 50/50 shot to be an NHL'er 2-4 yrs down the road.  I'd rather resign McGinn and have him for the next 3 years.

Agreed. This was the line of thought I was getting at.

 

I understand trying to get value for guys, but it has to be at the right time and it has to be the right guys. 

 

McGinn has proven himself quite valuable to this young team. This is a different scenario than the typical "cagey vet rental". 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just think McGinn is getting overrated. He's a nice enough player for what he is, but at the end of the day he's a ~35 point player who doesn't bring much of any value defensively and doesn't drive possession. Guys like him are replaceable. If I can get a 1st for him I do it...not because I want another pick in the mid-20s, but because I want an additional asset to include in a trade for a top-4 LHD.

 

I'm fairly sure the buyout would last longer. If traded, he'd cost the Sabres $2.5M for three seasons after this. From this, it looks like buying out would cost the Sabres more years and more cap hit than trade retaining 50%.

 

 

http://www.silversevensens.com/2015/6/10/8737195/nhl-buyout-rules-refresher-guide

 

EDIT: Oops, that's the cost (as in paycheck). The cap hit is different, but difficult to explain. There's an example in the linked article. It sounds like he'd be on the book for 6 years with a cap hit of $1.8M for years 4-6. No thanks, we need to worry about Ristolainen, Eichel, Reinhart, etc. by then.

Exactly. Getting him off the books 3 years sooner with a little larger cap hit is by far the superior solution.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just think McGinn is getting overrated. He's a nice enough player for what he is, but at the end of the day he's a ~35 point player who doesn't bring much of any value defensively and doesn't drive possession. Guys like him are replaceable. If I can get a 1st for him I do it...not because I want another pick in the mid-20s, but because I want an additional asset to include in a trade for a top-4 LHD.

 

Exactly. Getting him off the books 3 years sooner with a little larger cap hit is by far the superior solution.

 

If 35 pt wingers are so replaceable why do we only have 2?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just think McGinn is getting overrated. He's a nice enough player for what he is, but at the end of the day he's a ~35 point player who doesn't bring much of any value defensively and doesn't drive possession. Guys like him are replaceable. If I can get a 1st for him I do it...not because I want another pick in the mid-20s, but because I want an additional asset to include in a trade for a top-4 LHD.

 

Exactly. Getting him off the books 3 years sooner with a little larger cap hit is by far the superior solution.

 

Exactly, he's a nice piece to have at the deadline, he'll be cheap enough for a lot of teams to fit in, and even if you cover 30%, you're going to get something valuable.  Murray can be frank with him just like he was with Moulson and McCormick.  It's not impossible or improbable that he wouldn't come back.  We're talking about a guy fitting in the top six that is really a lower six player.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Because we just spent two years trying to lose and Moulson's body decided it wanted to retire early. In my view McGinn is a lesser version of Stafford.

 

He fits in well with our personnel.  I see no reason to mess with that.

 

We're on different wavelengths here.  I've been yelling no more picks for two + seasons now.  I've had enough of it.  We have a good mix.  I don't want subtractions from it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

He fits in well with our personnel. I see no reason to mess with that.

 

We're on different wavelengths here. I've been yelling no more picks for two + seasons now. I've had enough of it. We have a good mix. I don't want subtractions from it.

Yup.

 

Blue, you can argue that McGinn is overvalued all you want, but this team is noticeably better with him on the ice. I think that's valuable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

At the bottom of Garth's blog he notes which guys are likely to be on the block and which are likely to stay: http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/GARTHS-CORNER/Murrency/6/73974

 

McGinn is on the "stay" list. I'm fine with everyone on the "go" list other than I'm one of the few on here who still likes Ennis when healthy. I think he has puck skills that are useful on the power play.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yup.

 

Blue, you can argue that McGinn is overvalued all you want, but this team is noticeably better with him on the ice. I think that's valuable.

I don't want to trade him for the sake of it, but rather, to help address what I consider to be a more important need. I also feel that players of McGinn's caliber are the ones who routinely get overpaid by a fair margin, and I have no interest in doing that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't want to trade him for the sake of it, but rather, to help address what I consider to be a more important need. I also feel that players of McGinn's caliber are the ones who routinely get overpaid by a fair margin, and I have no interest in doing that.

I'm not advocating over-payment, but I don't want to open up an area of need at the expense of trying to close another. McGinn is a glue guy. We can fix our defense with him, but at what cost to the team in other vital areas? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Because we just spent two years trying to lose and Moulson's body decided it wanted to retire early. In my view McGinn is a lesser version of Stafford.

Sorry True, but there is no way that comparison is accurate.

 

I understand that he may be a little overrated on here, but you can't deny how much better he's played then anyone anticipated. He certainly has a future here as a 3rd line winger, and I don't think GMTM will overpay on him. My worry with moving him at the deadline is locker room chemistry, and that's not something I usually concern myself with at all. He provides a great example, works well with ROR (and is his best friend), and is another young but veteran presence in that room. I really, really don't want to become Edmonton. If McGinn wants to resign, resign him. If he's absolutely unwilling, move him. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry True, but there is no way that comparison is accurate.

 

I understand that he may be a little overrated on here, but you can't deny how much better he's played then anyone anticipated. He certainly has a future here as a 3rd line winger, and I don't think GMTM will overpay on him. My worry with moving him at the deadline is locker room chemistry, and that's not something I usually concern myself with at all. He provides a great example, works well with ROR (and is his best friend), and is another young but veteran presence in that room. I really, really don't want to become Edmonton. If McGinn wants to resign, resign him. If he's absolutely unwilling, move him.

Why is the comparison invalid? Stafford has better offensive numbers and isn't any worse defensively.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This topic is OLD. A NEW topic should be started unless there is a VERY SPECIFIC REASON to revive this one.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...