Weave Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 But as SabresFan536 says, and I keep saying, so I apologize, if you are going to rebuild, Pominville is NOT the way to go. He doesn't clear much space and he's not that young. You want to send them Sekera too, which actually means they are taking on salary ... how is that a smart rebuilding plan? Pay more for worse players, one of which will be past his prime by the time we are good again? Iginla to Buffalo (or anywhere) in a rebuilding plan is fine, but ... I suppose I shouldn't speak for Calgary fans, but if I was one, I would certainly be pissed. Not because of trading Iginla so much as what we got. *IF* it were to go down, this is how I see it too. Pomminstein doesn't fit in a Calgary retool. More likely, Iginla moves for a combo of picks and players like Ennis, Gerbe, Kassian, Adam. Guys that have the ability and offense to entertain but are young enough to be a part of a future in Calgary. Add in that they are inexpensive and it all adds up. The Pomminstein's on this team won't go to retooling franchises. Pommer is a much better fit as a piece to the puzzle on a team with deep playoff ambitions. This is rapidly devolving the way the Malkin/Statsny talk did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesportsbuff Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 *IF* it were to go down, this is how I see it too. Pomminstein doesn't fit in a Calgary retool. More likely, Iginla moves for a combo of picks and players like Ennis, Gerbe, Kassian, Adam. Guys that have the ability and offense to entertain but are young enough to be a part of a future in Calgary. Add in that they are inexpensive and it all adds up. The Pomminstein's on this team won't go to retooling franchises. Pommer is a much better fit as a piece to the puzzle on a team with deep playoff ambitions. This is rapidly devolving the way the Malkin/Statsny talk did. But there's a very distinct difference, that being their age. Malkin is an elite level player, Stastny is a superstar level player -- both are 25. You can throw first round picks and promising prospects around to get one of those guys, sure. But not for Iginla. Calgary isn't going to get a king's ransom for Iginla, especially if they don't do it this year. Honestly, if Feaster offered me Iginla for Ennis, Kassian and a first round pick, I would laugh in his face. That's given up far too much for a guy who probably has a max of 5 years left in the NHL, and who knows how many of those will actually be "productive." I doubt if he's still putting up 80 pt seasons at 39 years old. He simply would not be worth it, and I assume most teams would probably agree. I doubt Calgary would get offers containing much more than a combination of mid-level prospects, a roster player or two, and picks. Also, as I said in my last post, you have to consider the possibility that Iginla would return to Calgary after the remaining two years of his contract. He'll be 36 when he hits UFA again (barring an extension) and will probably be looking to sign the final deal of his career. I don't think teams are going to sacrifice major components of their future for a two-year window at winning w/ Iginla. Anyway, I doubt a deal happens, and regardless of what we all think Iginla's value is, I'm just saying that if Calgary were interested in moving him, things seem to be falling into place nicely where the Sabres would have an opportunity at him. He would want to go to a contender (check). Calgary could maximize return by trading him now as opposed to next off-season, where he'll only be under contract for one more year. They've made a deal recently and Buffalo presumably has the parts to make a deal like this happen now. Perhaps Regehr could play a role in persuading Iginla to OK a deal here the way so many worked on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 But there's a very distinct difference, that being their age. Malkin is an elite level player, Stastny is a superstar level player -- both are 25. :wallbash: I wasn't comparing the substance of trades being speculated, I was comparing what started as wish lists or Ek rumors devolving into debates about what it would take to get a player that has almost no lieklihood of moving. Ahhhh..... August. *sigh* As for the rest, rebuilds = young players coming in. It might not be 2 young players and a pick, it could very well be 1 highly regarded player or a prospect and a pick, but the premise is the same. Mid career players rarely get traded to teams that are rebuilding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted August 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Flyers van Riemsdyk gets a 6 year extension. Money not public yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Flyers van Riemsdyk gets a 6 year extension. Money not public yet. I wonder what his dive per goal ratio will be in 2017. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
korab rules Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 I wonder what his dive per goal ratio will be in 2017. He is still finding his way in the NHL, but he was an absolute stud in the playoffs against us last year. He would look pretty good in Blue and Gold instead of that philthy orange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 He is still finding his way in the NHL, but he was an absolute stud in the playoffs against us last year. He would look pretty good in Blue and Gold instead of that philthy orange. Until then.....he's a burnt orange diving moof. (sure he's good, but I don't have to like him :beer: ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted August 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 4.25 per for JVR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 4.25 per for JVR. If he keeps improving, that deal is a steal for them. It reminds me of our deal with Leino. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetweenThePipes00 Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Tyler Ennis' eyes just lit up, or at least his agent's did ... I understand they are totally different kinds of players, and JVR is everything Sabres fans crave because of his size ... but at teh same age last season Ennis put up more points, and had a pretty good series against Philly (both he and JVR had 4 points ... granted, JVR was physically dominating, but he also had less success against the Bruins defense, suggesting the soft-ass Buffalo D had something to do with it.) Whatever the case, agents and arbitrators LOVE comparables ... if Ennis keeps producing more or even the same as JVR, he may be a little more expensive than I hoped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dEnnis the Menace Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Tyler Ennis' eyes just lit up, or at least his agent's did ... I understand they are totally different kinds of players, and JVR is everything Sabres fans crave because of his size ... but at teh same age last season Ennis put up more points, and had a pretty good series against Philly (both he and JVR had 4 points ... granted, JVR was physically dominating, but he also had less success against the Bruins defense, suggesting the soft-ass Buffalo D had something to do with it.) Whatever the case, agents and arbitrators LOVE comparables ... if Ennis keeps producing more or even the same as JVR, he may be a little more expensive than I hoped. That's a very good point. Hopefully we'll lock the Tylers up a little sooner rather than later (much to the liking of our Liger friend). If he could sustain the production, maybe 4.25 wouldn't be a bad contract... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 If he keeps improving, that deal is a steal for them. It reminds me of our deal with Leino. Okay....if I'm going to be fair, I have to say JVRD has outstanding outside speed and a great set of hands, which accents his reach. So far he has proved to be extremely streaky. He really didn't see much power play time last year until the playoffs. But he was 2nd overall for a reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Amerk Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Like I said on Hasek, "it wasn't the same circumstance," but as a fan of his I was happy to see him go somewhere and win a cup. I would rather that have happened than have him go play for some second rate team and never make playoffs again. The ideal theory is that being one of the best goalies in the world, you should be able to go to a second rate team and put them on your back and carry them in the playoffs. Being a supreme athlete, you would want to face that challenge. The idea is to NOT use your position as one of the best goalies in the world to whine and cry until you are able to play for one of the best teams in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 The ideal theory is that being one of the best goalies in the world, you should be able to go to a second rate team and put them on your back and carry them in the playoffs. Being a supreme athlete, you would want to face that challenge. The idea is to NOT use your position as one of the best goalies in the world to whine and cry until you are able to play for one of the best teams in the league. I probably won't continue in this discussion (it's been repeated on this board at least a 1/2 dozen times), but I have to take exception to this post (at least in part). Hasek NEVER gave any indication that he wanted out of Buffalo until after the Sabres got absolutely NOTHING for Peca (not even Peca himself) in a season that they ended up A fluke goal from having to beat a team they'd swept and then facing a team they beat in OT in their own barn during the regular season. Hasek was involved in the local community. (Coached youth league sports and the like.) He had donated a lot of money to his Hasek's Heros foundation w/in a year of demanding his trade. Are those the sort of thing that athletes that want to skip town typically do prior to demanding a trade? Hasek could have gotten more money when Rigas had given him a contract extension, but he didn't go as crazy in negotiations as he could have. He believed the 'I'll give the team the tools to get the job done' BS. And, btw, in '99, he DID carry a '2nd rate team on his back,' not just to the playoffs but to a tie in Game 6 of the SCF's. (I'm still waiting for the puck to drop at the blue line to Hasek's left.) If the Criminals weren't undercapitalized and aware (Timmy was aware, at a minimum, I doubt John was, but still he let Timmy call the shots) of how extended they were, they'd've had much less acrimonious negotiations w/ Peca (and others) and at a minimum would have gotten an asset for him that year, or better yet, would have signed him to a contract he was worth. Hasek saw the writing on the wall, and after Gilmour bailed on them, decided after the season was over that he wanted out too. Hasek would have retired a Sabre if he hadn't felt betrayed by the Criminals. (And getting off topic.) I've always been far more disappointed in Gilmour than I was in Dom. Yeah, he gave up a bad goal (on ~ the 12 shot of the 4th period) but he didn't quit on them. He could easily have given up a legit goal in OT about 6 separate times if he wanted to. Watch Gilmour on his breakaway, or on his backcheck on the game winner; and then tell me which one quit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 I'd hate to keep that subject going, but it just came to mind. Wasn't that the same game where Kasparaitis literally threw a puck over the boards and got away with it? The place where I was watching that game closed down early and kicked us out before OT started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 I'd hate to keep that subject going, but it just came to mind. Wasn't that the same game where Kasparaitis literally threw a puck over the boards and got away with it? The place where I was watching that game closed down early and kicked us out before OT started. It certainly was. And he was told in no uncertain terms that if he did that again, he would get called for it. (Not certain which of the 2 penalties that were perpetrated was the one that would be called: closing his hand on the puck, or delay of game.) :censored: :censored: :censored: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
korab rules Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 It certainly was. And he was told in no uncertain terms that if he did that again, he would get called for it. (Not certain which of the 2 penalties that were perpetrated was the one that would be called: closing his hand on the puck, or delay of game.) :censored: :censored: :censored: Kasparaitis is one of my most hated players in the NHL of all time. That overtime winner was like a stake to my heart. I thought I was going to be ill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Kasparaitis is one of my most hated players in the NHL of all time. That overtime winner was like a stake to my heart. I thought I was going to be ill. I can still hear RJ saying his name in my nightmares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullwinkle Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 I wonder what his dive per goal ratio will be in 2017. I'd take him on my fantasy team any day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 I'd take him on my fantasy team any day. They keep dives in Fantasy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 They keep dives in Fantasy? Well, it's a keeper league and he's lobbying to add that stat. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabresFan526 Posted August 31, 2011 Report Share Posted August 31, 2011 Tyler Ennis' eyes just lit up, or at least his agent's did ... I understand they are totally different kinds of players, and JVR is everything Sabres fans crave because of his size ... but at teh same age last season Ennis put up more points, and had a pretty good series against Philly (both he and JVR had 4 points ... granted, JVR was physically dominating, but he also had less success against the Bruins defense, suggesting the soft-ass Buffalo D had something to do with it.) Whatever the case, agents and arbitrators LOVE comparables ... if Ennis keeps producing more or even the same as JVR, he may be a little more expensive than I hoped. I think this is a really good deal for Philly. The difficult thing to assess from a comparables perspective is that this is a 6 year deal. I think over 6 years, this is a steal. However, my sense is that Ennis does not get the same cap hit as JVR as Darcy's style has historically been to give a second contract that maintains the player as an RFA after the contract expires. So, I would expect Ennis more likely getting a 3 year deal to keep him as an RFA after the deal expires. If that is the case, I think a cap hit of about $3 million is likely what to expect in that scenario. Having said all of that, with new ownership, anything is possible and Ennis could get longer term at a higher cap figure. Specifically, I do not expect Tyler Myers to get a 3 year deal that expires and he becomes an RFA. I expect he will get a pretty long term deal at a sizable cap hit in the $5-$6 million range. Overall, I think this is a great deal for Philly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will Posted August 31, 2011 Report Share Posted August 31, 2011 That overtime winner was like a stake to my heart. I thought I was going to be ill. #3 on my list of worst hockey (game) related memories. higher on the list than the chuk'n'nik coratid sprinklers, even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesportsbuff Posted August 31, 2011 Report Share Posted August 31, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Amerk Posted August 31, 2011 Report Share Posted August 31, 2011 HA x 4million Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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