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Trade: Calgary Michael Frolik to Buffalo for a 4th

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50 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

He traded the base. He gutted the base. Murray ***** us. 

Perhaps you've forgotten, but back then we called the base "the rotten core."

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50 minutes ago, Thorny said:

If a true second line forward can be had for draft picks, a young player that will be here for the foreseeable future, you absolutely move the picks. Our best offensive player is in his prime right now, as is his wingman, and our 9 mil LW will soon be exiting it. We need the help now. You don't shy away from moving a pick that, if things go to plan, becomes a top 6 player in several years.  

When Murray was arguably trying to jumpstart the rebuild too soon, Jack was a rookie. It's a totally different situation now. Adding a ROR type player for a package like we paid the first time would be ideal timing. I'm not saying to toss away picks for older players, or expiring contracts. But for good win now players, absolutely. 

You'll not get argument here that they need to bring in help for today/ the near future.

But REALLY believe that Botterill sees the window paralleling Dahlin's development, not Eichel's.  Until a move is made that contradicts that (such as the sort you mention) will stick to that belief.

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39 minutes ago, Taro T said:

You'll not get argument here that they need to bring in help for today/ the near future.

But REALLY believe that Botterill sees the window paralleling Dahlin's development, not Eichel's.  Until a move is made that contradicts that (such as the sort you mention) will stick to that belief.

A mistake, especially taking into account recent data that suggests forwards are not-insignificantly more valuable than D men in the current game. Looking at things like Wins Above Replacement. 

Jack has also proven to be all-world, as much I love Dahlin there’s no guarantee he gets to that. Dahlin’s prime starts probably ~23/24 considering he’s on D...That takes Jack to 27 or 28. 

I can’t say I’m comfortable with that being the target, if that’s so. Seems likely that it is, I’ve mentioned before Friedman’s comment re:  Botterill pre 2018 lottery about what a win would afford Jason. 

The GM is clearly comfortable casting himself in the Tortoise role, we’ll see if that works out considering Jack’s the Hare. 

THIS EDIT in before @Doohickie mentions Yzerman’s Red Wings. 😁😉

Edited by Thorny
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1 hour ago, Doohickie said:

Perhaps you've forgotten, but back then we called the base "the rotten core."

No that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about in 2015 and 2016 when Murray gutted the team of the talent they drafted. Trading picks and young players. That is the base I am speaking of and why we suck now. We didn't add enough talent and instead traded it away because we were impatient and it is the exact process people are now suggesting. 

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Okay... so you're saying they didn't just take it down to the studs but also removed structural members.

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8 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

No that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about in 2015 and 2016 when Murray gutted the team of the talent they drafted. Trading picks and young players. That is the base I am speaking of and why we suck now. We didn't add enough talent and instead traded it away because we were impatient and it is the exact process people are now suggesting. 

It’s not the exact same process because our centrepiece franchise C isn’t a rookie anymore. 

This is the time to ship off our current JT Compher or Nikita Zadorov or Grigorenko for our new ROR. The timing that was once wrong for such a move is now right. The context matters here. 

Edited by Thorny
Obvious disclaimer of: “if such trade is so available.”

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The Skinner contract is one I keep thinking about cause it’s definitely a win now type deal. It’s massive money for UFA years and he’ll be exiting his prime before the back half if it starts. Can we really afford to wait to compete with that deal hanging there? Is that deal in fact a sign Botterill was actually under the impression the roster he assembled coming into the season was good enough to make the playoffs? That he wasn’t punting anything at all? 

Questions...questions that need answering. 

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Of course, while we're waiting for the planets and stars and stuff to align perfectly for a Cup run in Buffalo, all anyone is asking for from Botterill is a freakin' playoff berth. People would take a heroic run to ninth at this point. Let's not let the perfect be the enemy of the good.

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3 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

No that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about in 2015 and 2016 when Murray gutted the team of the talent they drafted. Trading picks and young players. That is the base I am speaking of and why we suck now. We didn't add enough talent and instead traded it away because we were impatient and it is the exact process people are now suggesting. 

Except that if TM was here they would have a true 2C and a starting goalie and according to your other thread they would be playoff contenders and trending up which is also how I see it so we kinda agree except you think what TM did was gut the team and I see it as he was moving JAG’s until he found the right pieces.

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14 hours ago, tom webster said:

Except that if TM was here they would have a true 2C and a starting goalie and according to your other thread they would be playoff contenders and trending up which is also how I see it so we kinda agree except you think what TM did was gut the team and I see it as he was moving JAG’s until he found the right pieces.

JAG probably a generous label for the defensemen he brought in.  To me, that was his ultimate sin here, he placed nearly zero value on the blue line.

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Here's a good photo of Hutton, Eichel, and Frolik.

I think this proves convincingly that Folik is, in fact, invisible.  

😂

 

eyJidWNrZXQiOiJibmNvcmUiLCJrZXkiOiJ3cC1j

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