French Collection Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 I think he's a keeper. We'll see him compete for a job in 2 years. Our top six in 2020 will rival anyone's. Let's develop him properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3putt Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 Not a fan of drafting a hs kid but I watched both vieoes True posted and I'm impressed. He really does look like Keller He has a bigger frame and is taller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robviously Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 We don't know. But the GM has done his evaluations and he knows who HE has evaluated to be BPA. The draft very much IS a crap shoot, which is why there is so much pressure to get evaluations right and pick players that have the best chance of success at the NHL level. It is why you cannot pigeon-hole yourself into drafting for position. You pick the kid you have have evaluated to be most likely to succeed. If you have a shortfall positionally, at least you have players you can move to address it. You know what you get when you draft for perceived need? You get a draft that features Zach Kassian, Markus Foligno, Brayden McNabb, we were were soft and targeted a need for tough kids. Yeah, that worked. Let;s go out and reach to fill a need. I agree with your overall point, but the fact that our first three picks (1st, 3rd, and 4th round) are all NHL players actually is an indication of a pretty good draft in 2009. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 We don't know. But the GM has done his evaluations and he knows who HE has evaluated to be BPA. The draft very much IS a crap shoot, which is why there is so much pressure to get evaluations right and pick players that have the best chance of success at the NHL level. It is why you cannot pigeon-hole yourself into drafting for position. You pick the kid you have have evaluated to be most likely to succeed. If you have a shortfall positionally, at least you have players you can move to address it. You know what you get when you draft for perceived need? You get a draft that features Zach Kassian, Markus Foligno, Brayden McNabb, we were were soft and targeted a need for tough kids. Yeah, that worked. Let;s go out and reach to fill a need. How can u complain about about a 3rd rd pick (McNabb) and a 4th rd pick (Foligno) who have already played 238 games (43rd of all players drafted in 2009) and 347 games (21st in games played) respectively. Kassian (28th in games played in 2009 class) was rated 10th NA skater by CSS. Not exactly a reach at 13. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude Balls Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 And Eichel isn't? :wacko: Damn, the Sabres may have just passed the Bruins as the ugliest team in the league with the "can't do a pull up" pick. Thank God we still have Marcus and Jake ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 I agree with your overall point, but the fact that our first three picks (1st, 3rd, and 4th round) are all NHL players actually is an indication of a pretty good draft in 2009. We passed over prospects like Nick Leddy, Ryan Ellis, Chris Kreider, and even ROR to draft for need. You don't draft for need. You draft for best chance of success. IMO nothing is more important in a GM than talent evaluation for this reason alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winston Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 "Slick Mitts" is what I'm gonna call a guy named Mittelstadt who can dangle like he does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExWNYer Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 Damn, the Sabres may have just passed the Bruins as the ugliest team in the league with the "can't do a pull up" pick. Thank God we still have Marcus and Jake ;-) I'll take an ugly team that produces pretty results any day of the week. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 How can u complain about about a 3rd rd pick (McNabb) and a 4th rd pick (Foligno) who have already played 238 games (43rd of all players drafted in 2009) and 347 games (21st in games played) respectively. Kassian (28th in games played in 2009 class) was rated 10th NA skater by CSS. Not exactly a reach at 13. The Kassian pick was the most "need related" of the picks. He wasn't a reach. they never are. But we picked a guy based on his toughness instead of a guy like Kreider or Leddy that obviously had talents that were more likely to make them better NHL'ers. Kassian is Raffi Torres if we are being generous. Look what was on the board while we addressed toughness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 The Kassian pick was the most "need related" of the picks. He wasn't a reach. they never are. But we picked a guy based on his toughness instead of a guy like Kreider or Leddy that obviously had talents that were more likely to make them better NHL'ers. Kassian is Raffi Torres if we are being generous. Look what was on the board while we addressed toughness.No offense, but saying someone obviously had talents in hindsight is, well, easy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 We passed over prospects like Nick Leddy, Ryan Ellis, Chris Kreider, and even ROR to draft for need. You don't draft for need. You draft for best chance of success. IMO nothing is more important in a GM than talent evaluation for this reason alone. That's hindsight. You have no idea what their draft board looked like. They may have taken their BPA. Also guys drafted 104 have only a 19% chance of playing in 100 NHL games and 93% aren't top 9 forwards. Only Kruger drafted after Foligno has played more NHL games then Markus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 That's hindsight. You have no idea what their draft board looked like. They may have taken their BPA. Also guys drafted 104 have only a 19% chance of playing in 100 NHL games and 93% aren't top 9 forwards. Only Kruger drafted after Foligno has played more NHL games then Markus. Source man. Libk the source Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 (edited) http://www.tsn.ca/statistically-speaking-expected-value-of-nhl-draft-picks-1.317819 Hit the 2009 draft on hockeydb.com and click on games and it will show all the draftees and how many games played hi to low. http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2009e.html Edited June 24, 2017 by GASabresFan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 That's hindsight. You have no idea what their draft board looked like. They may have taken their BPA. Also guys drafted 104 have only a 19% chance of playing in 100 NHL games and 93% aren't top 9 forwards. Only Kruger drafted after Foligno has played more NHL games then Markus. If any of them were BPA, then it was the right pick given a poor evaluation. But I don't think they were BPA. And I base that on Darcy's repeated comments re: addressing toughness after the draft. It was a chase after need instead of a chase after BPA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 http://www.tsn.ca/statistically-speaking-expected-value-of-nhl-draft-picks-1.317819Good man. Too drunk to read that now but maybe tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 How do we know who the BPA is if none of these kids have played at an NHL level? It's such a stupid comment, if the draft is a crap shoot you take a position/positions you're most vulnerable at and you try to improve it. Last I looked our C's were pretty solid, people are saying he'll transition into a winger, I don't even play the game of hockey on a semi pro level so who know, maybe he can't make that leap, we also just drafted that Rasmus Asplund guy last season who was also a C, I really hope this transition to a wing is easy because if not we have many wasted picks about to be coming up oh and our defense still looks like a giant heap of sheet. Wing is easier, you don't have as much defensive responsibilities, though a good two way winger or a player that can play both is valuable. Speed often determines if a player can play wing.. Casey has that... and from what I have read is willing to go into the corners... we will see on the next level but the kid looks solid, just needs to build his strength. I have played both, not at anywhere near this level and find center much tougher mentally. He appears to have both skills and can score... good pick imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 http://www.tsn.ca/statistically-speaking-expected-value-of-nhl-draft-picks-1.317819 Hit the 2009 draft on hockeydb.com and click on games and it will show all the draftees and how many games played hi to low. http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2009e.html That link better explains why you go BPA than anything I can type. The odds are so low that a given prospect ever gets a cup of coffee in the NHL that you absolutely have to draft BPA at the expense of pretty much everything else. There is little room for error in NHL picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasmus_ Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 I think he sounded poignant, intelligent and straight forward with his presser. His tape doesn't lie, getting stronger isn't an issue. Sam in his rookie year in preseason and the first nine games couldn't handle the NHL size/strength. It's a good pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matter2003 Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 High School kid. He'll be a while. he plans on going to college next year. Great...so he can just go to school, come out, not sign and be a FA...great rules the NHL has... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 (edited) If any of them were BPA, then it was the right pick given a poor evaluation. But I don't think they were BPA. And I base that on Darcy's repeated comments re: addressing toughness after the draft. It was a chase after need instead of a chase after BPA.I think your factor of "heavy" players would be baked into a team's BPA, along with size, IQ, hands, speed, two way play etc... When I talk about need, I'm talking about position and making sure you don't over weight one position in pipeline. Regier never drafted centers early in the draft and we suffered for it. TM traded away our D depth and only draft 1 D with 8 1st and 2nd rd picks and we are now paying for that oversight. TM loved RW's and RW is the only position with depth in the organization. I think all of us agree that Regier and his scouts did a crappy job of player evaluation and development, but 2009 was one of his better efforts. Edited June 24, 2017 by GASabresFan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 Pysyk, Myers, and Zadorov are big losses to out defensive core? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 Great...so he can just go to school, come out, not sign and be a FA...great rules the NHL has...Uhg why? why Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasmus_ Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 I think Bogosian has been better than Myers since the trade, and that's not saying much as Myers has been injured most of that time. So call a spade a spade. Zadorov is too young to say he cannot turn into a functional defensemen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 (edited) In 2011 Mark McNeill did amazing physically at the combine. How many of you have heard of him? The physical strength of an 18 yr old doesn't tell you how good an NHL player they'll be but how physically ready they are at that moment for the NHL. Jacob Chychrun has less talent then Nylander but he's physically NHL ready. Edited June 24, 2017 by LGR4GM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 24, 2017 Report Share Posted June 24, 2017 (edited) We got a fat American kid who can skate and shoot like Phil Kessel? Damn...! And sorry I'm late. I was out in the barn doing some pull-ups. ...sorry, did I say doing? I meant wearing. Edited June 24, 2017 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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