That Aud Smell Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 (edited) If you are Jack Eichel - scoring doesn't matter because you are a ######. If you are Ryan O'Reilly heart and soul doesn't matter because you lack scoring prowess. See how that works? Well, now, wait a sec. I think GoDD's point is a finer one. I think he's potentially in favour of over-paying for an inner-core-of-one (does a team go out as far as stiff mantle?), but he's pointing out that paying for that guy will limit other choices you can make. These are things that I am confident GM TM has considered, and has sketched out in his (evolving) long-term plan. GM TM just needs to bet on the right horses. In a league where superstars get over $10 million per year, O'Reilly-types are absolutely worth the $7.5 million range. The better players are going to take up a higher percentage of the cap than in years past, just the way it is. What it really means is you can't afford to pay your 4th liners $2 million (I'm lookin' at you, Marcus Foligno). Good stuff. But there are presently just the two players with cap hits of $10M, yeah? And a few others at $9M? Edited December 16, 2015 by That Aud Smell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Well, now, wait a sec. I think GoDD's point is a finer one. I think he's potentially in favour of over-paying for an inner-core-of-one (does a team go out as far as stiff mantle?), but he's pointing out that paying for that guy will limit other choices you can make. These are things that I am confident GM TM has considered, and has sketched out in his (evolving) long-term plan. GM TM just needs to bet on the right horses. Good stuff. But there are presently just the two players with cap hits of $10M, yeah? And a few others at $9M? Yes, but they're also the only two stars to sign extensions this past offseason where all of the contract years are UFA years. Watch what Stamkos and Kopitar get for next season. I'll be positively shocked if either of them come in under $10 million. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Yes, but they're also the only two stars to sign extensions this past offseason where all of the contract years are UFA years. Watch what Stamkos and Kopitar get for next season. I'll be positively shocked if either of them come in under $10 million. :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norcal Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 That does nothing beneficial for the salary cap. In fact, if the $'s decrease too much at the back end, it actually ends up worse for the cap if he doesn't play for the entire contract length.I was thinking spend more up front and when some other players come up for contracts it would help to fit them under the cap. Is there really a danger of Risto not playing out a 7-8 year contract? Nobody else is up for a raise like that for a few years atleast so there is cap space for now. I admit I do not have a working knowledge of the cap and how exactly the money is allocated and accounted for. Whatever happened to the bridge deal geez, that's a lot of money to pay a kid, even one as talented as Risto or Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 I was thinking spend more up front and when some other players come up for contracts it would help to fit them under the cap. Is there really a danger of Risto not playing out a 7-8 year contract? Nobody else is up for a raise like that for a few years atleast so there is cap space for now. I admit I do not have a working knowledge of the cap and how exactly the money is allocated and accounted for. Whatever happened to the bridge deal geez, that's a lot of money to pay a kid, even one as talented as Risto or Jack All the $'s committed to a contract are averaged out over the life of the contract so (except for very rare exceptions) the contract cap hit is identical every year regardless as to how they are actually paid out. As for the bridge deal, what of Risto's play the past 3 years indicates that this year is the significant aberation and he'll regress? Go bridge deal and you'll very likely be looking at $9MM+ cap hits after that barring career trajectory altering injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtDart Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Rasmus is getting a raise. I big freaking raise. So you can sign him for up to 8 years... how many years and how much money? I say 7.25mil X8 years. Before tonights Redwings game for defenders: 5th in goals 7th in assists 5th in points 9th in ppp 8th in shots and 20th in TOI tree fitttty........whatever it takes to keep him here. 7+ seems right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thwomp! Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 My opinion: Do 8x7 if you can get it. Don't do a bridge because we'll end up paying more over 8 years and 2 contracts (bridge and follow-up extension that will be needed) than we would with an 8x7 now. Don't just let him play out his entry level deal and then pay him because that will be more expensive as well. 8x7 does a few things: 1) acknowledges that he's a long term organizational cornerstone. 2) rewards his play and gives him a huge raise from his entry level deal. 3) because of 1 and 2 he will likely be amenable to an 8x7 that would potentially give us a decent break in the future when we're hopefully contending, Risto is out playing his contract, and we need all the cap space we can get to lock up other key pieces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Well, now, wait a sec. I think GoDD's point is a finer one. I think he's potentially in favour of over-paying for an inner-core-of-one (does a team go out as far as stiff mantle?), but he's pointing out that paying for that guy will limit other choices you can make. These are things that I am confident GM TM has considered, and has sketched out in his (evolving) long-term plan. GM TM just needs to bet on the right horses. Good stuff. But there are presently just the two players with cap hits of $10M, yeah? And a few others at $9M? Yes I'm fine with O'Reilly. You can average him in with guys like Deslauries and Georges. 3 men at an average of 4 mil. On pace for the cap. If you are going to give Ristolainin 7 mil, and he is just a 2~3 type of dman, good luck finding a true 1 for 10 mil and a true 1 center if Eichel is just another good player. It's like picking a spouse. If she's hot, odds are she can't cook and is somewhat demanding. If you are going to marry a 185lb Buffalo girl, it's all good if she's funny, can cook, and give a good bj. O'Reilly is the good fattie. Ristolainen is sort of hot, but always needs to consult his mom on every decision and talks with a vocal fry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norcal Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 All the $'s committed to a contract are averaged out over the life of the contract so (except for very rare exceptions) the contract cap hit is identical every year regardless as to how they are actually paid out. As for the bridge deal, what of Risto's play the past 3 years indicates that this year is the significant aberation and he'll regress? Go bridge deal and you'll very likely be looking at $9MM+ cap hits after that barring career trajectory altering injury. I see, thanks. Pay the kid then, no bridge deal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 He's a pending RFA. He's only 21. I say give him a bridge deal in the 3-4 yr range at around 4-5 per.... something like 4yrs/$18mil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Yes I'm fine with O'Reilly. You can average him in with guys like Deslauries and Georges. 3 men at an average of 4 mil. On pace for the cap. If you are going to give Ristolainin 7 mil, and he is just a 2~3 type of dman, good luck finding a true 1 for 10 mil and a true 1 center if Eichel is just another good player. This is helpful. It's like picking a spouse. If she's hot, odds are she can't cook and is somewhat demanding. If you are going to marry a 185lb Buffalo girl, it's all good if she's funny, can cook, and give a good bj. O'Reilly is the good fattie. Ristolainen is sort of hot, but always needs to consult his mom on every decision and talks with a vocal fry. This, much less so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thwomp! Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 It's like picking a spouse. If she's hot, odds are she can't cook and is somewhat demanding. If you are going to marry a 185lb Buffalo girl, it's all good if she's funny, can cook, and give a good bj. O'Reilly is the good fattie. Ristolainen is sort of hot, but always needs to consult his mom on every decision and talks with a vocal fry. Somehow, GoDD's metaphors always have the same basic theme and can fit any situation interchangeably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 If 14 year backdiving contracts were still a thing, I'd agree. But today, it's just not true. In a league where superstars get over $10 million per year, O'Reilly-types are absolutely worth the $7.5 million range. The better players are going to take up a higher percentage of the cap than in years past, just the way it is. What it really means is you can't afford to pay your 4th liners $2 million (I'm lookin' at you, Marcus Foligno). And you sho 'nuff can't blow $5MM per year on Moulson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 And you sho 'nuff can't blow $5MM per year on Moulson. I understand the whole Eichel-mentor-billet-family thing. But that contract stands as a mark against GM TM at this point. Do they have a buyout path for Mouslon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Somehow, GoDD's metaphors always have the same basic theme and can fit any situation interchangeably. We need a GoDD metaphor generator. This, much less so. No post with the words hot, fry, fattie and cook can be all bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 We need a GoDD metaphor generator. Please, no. No post with the words hot, fry, fattie and cook can be all bad. Well, notice I didn't say not at all helpful. :angel: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Here's a very solid breakdown on why ROR is paid what he's worth, why he's not Gorges or Des, and his relative pay to the rest of the league http://forums.sabrespace.com/topic/23462-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-traded-to-sabres/?p=742295 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 (edited) Here's a very solid breakdown on why ROR is paid what he's worth, why he's not Gorges or Des, and his relative pay to the rest of the league http://forums.sabrespace.com/topic/23462-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-traded-to-sabres/?p=742295 (this is where we should pray for larger than expected cap increases, and for Murray to smartly give Risto and Girgs long-term deals rather than bridge contracts). an exceptional assessment, i think. well, except, maybe for this piece. Edited December 16, 2015 by That Aud Smell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 (edited) I find that way of describing women and relationships really creepy, sad, and sexist. Edited December 16, 2015 by qwksndmonster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thwomp! Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 I find that way of describing women and relationships really creepy, sad, and sexist. There's the theme I was referring to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 an exceptional assessment, i think. well, except, maybe for this piece. Hey, I can't be held responsible for Bylsma thinking he's Jordan Staal defensively and stripping him of all offensive opportunity. Well I can be, but I shouldn't be! And I want to be right, dammit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 Hey, I can't be held responsible for Bylsma thinking he's Jordan Staal defensively and stripping him of all offensive opportunity. Well I can be, but I shouldn't be! And I want to be right, dammit! Ahh, I see. What's Girg's offensive zone start #? (I should look it up, but it sounds like you might know.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 I'd sign him for 7 x 7. No problem. I didn't realize you had that kind of cash… I think a lawyer can afford 49 dollars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woods-racer Posted December 17, 2015 Report Share Posted December 17, 2015 I think a lawyer can afford 49 dollars Your amusing he was talking dollars, he may have been watching Sesame St and could be talking cookies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 What's Ristolainen worth? Getzlaf maybe? :ph34r: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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