JJFIVEOH Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 I'd consider them both backups right now! That's probably a better way of looking at it haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biodork Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 That's probably a better way of looking at it haha. I'm hoping at least one of them proves he can be the starter with more consistent playing time, but I feel like should be either guy's job to win at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 I won't discount DBs coaching but lets not ignore the fact the roster has been completely turned over. "Completely" turned over? Not even close. It's probably only 6 forwards, 2 D, and 2 goalies; that's only HALF the lineup. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Crotch Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Probably because the only other option at this point is Chad Johnson. Most consider him the backup, but he hasn't necessarily put up terrible numbers in his short career. I like Johnson. ...and I don't think there is anything wrong with that. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_sauve28 Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Is this really only half of our team? Seriously!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 (edited) Flagg brought up a good point earlier about the Kane and Eichel line combination. As good as Ennis and Kane are, Ennis is a playmaker, and Kane a sniper; both of which Eichel likes to do. And, both Ennis and Kane have the puck, a lot. I think putting Eichel with Moulson and Zemgus gets the puck in his hands a lot more. It lets him be the creator/playmaker, and then he's in control of the line rather than having 3 guys together who, IMO, just don't compliment each other. Honestly I think O'Reilly's neutral zone game and smarts make him the perfect combo for Kane and Ennis, at least much more so than Eichel Edited September 27, 2015 by WildCard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Flagg brought up a good point earlier about the Kane and Eichel line combination. As good as Ennis and Kane are, Ennis is a playmaker, and Kane a sniper; both of which Eichel likes to do. And, bot Ennis and Kae have the puck, a lot. I think putting Eichel with Moulson and Zemgus gets the puck in his hands a lot more. It lets him be the creator/playmaker, and then he's in control of the line rather than having 3 guys together who, IMO, just don't compliment each other. Honestly I think O'Reilly's neutral zone game and smarts make him the perfect combo for Kane and Ennis, at least much more so than Eichel And, as great as Eichel will become, he will only be a 19 year old rookie. Putting O'Reilly between Kane & Ennis makes that definitely the top line drawing the toughest competition. Giving Eichel a sniper (Moulson) and a digger / grinder w/ skill (Girgensons) AND the other team's 2nd line is custom made to have him successful right out of the gate. '16-'17, could see them shuffling things up significantly, but in October 2015 O'Reilly should center the top line IMHO. This team could have some significant line shuffling this year, which is par for the recent course, but the cool thing is it's because they have multiple GOOD options for each line rather than the hound's breakfast of the past 2 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 I really don't know why Lehner is being described as our "starter" when he's far from proven... it should be an open competition. He is the starter because the of the price we payed, its an open competition because its his job to lose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 I think Reinhart starts the season in Roch. He looks better physically, but still not quite there yet. Put vets like McGinn and Legwand on the 3rd line and let Reinhart get top line minutes in Roch. Will be better for him in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Flagg brought up a good point earlier about the Kane and Eichel line combination. As good as Ennis and Kane are, Ennis is a playmaker, and Kane a sniper; both of which Eichel likes to do. And, bot Ennis and Kae have the puck, a lot. I think putting Eichel with Moulson and Zemgus gets the puck in his hands a lot more. It lets him be the creator/playmaker, and then he's in control of the line rather than having 3 guys together who, IMO, just don't compliment each other. Honestly I think O'Reilly's neutral zone game and smarts make him the perfect combo for Kane and Ennis, at least much more so than Eichel And, as great as Eichel will become, he will only be a 19 year old rookie. Putting O'Reilly between Kane & Ennis makes that definitely the top line drawing the toughest competition. Giving Eichel a sniper (Moulson) and a digger / grinder w/ skill (Girgensons) AND the other team's 2nd line is custom made to have him successful right out of the gate. '16-'17, could see them shuffling things up significantly, but in October 2015 O'Reilly should center the top line IMHO. This team could have some significant line shuffling this year, which is par for the recent course, but the cool thing is it's because they have multiple GOOD options for each line rather than the hound's breakfast of the past 2 years. These two posts make a ton of sense when looked at logically. Great insight here, fellas. Much appreciated. GO SABRES!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 I think Reinhart starts the season in Roch. He looks better physically, but still not quite there yet. Put vets like McGinn and Legwand on the 3rd line and let Reinhart get top line minutes in Roch. Will be better for him in the long run. I was one of the biggest advocates of starting Reinhart in Ra-cha-cha and putting him at wing initially on the Sabres, but he has significantly improved his strength (he was a boy last training camp and now is a hockey player). His hockey sense is solid, and I haven't seen anything that screams 'send him down.' If he can center 2 vets on line 3, I am fine w/ leaving him up (as C even). I've only seen last night's game and bits of his other game and his 1st training camp session, maybe there were things you saw that suggest he should go down. Could you elaborate on what they were? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 (edited) And, as great as Eichel will become, he will only be a 19 year old rookie. Putting O'Reilly between Kane & Ennis makes that definitely the top line drawing the toughest competition. Giving Eichel a sniper (Moulson) and a digger / grinder w/ skill (Girgensons) AND the other team's 2nd line is custom made to have him successful right out of the gate. '16-'17, could see them shuffling things up significantly, but in October 2015 O'Reilly should center the top line IMHO. This team could have some significant line shuffling this year, which is par for the recent course, but the cool thing is it's because they have multiple GOOD options for each line rather than the hound's breakfast of the past 2 years. A very good point to the bold. That line might be our highest scoring line this year just because of the competition they'll face. Zemgus has been putting up solid, and improving, numbers for a couple seasons. Imagine him on a line where he isn't the playmaker? Where he can just plant himself in front like he did tonight, and grind along the boards? I'm with you on the ton of line shuffling, but hopefully it doesn't get like Lindy used to be during games. He is the starter because the of the price we payed, its an open competition because its his job to lose. Yeap. That, and he's had some solid success in the NHL before. Not a long stretch, granted. I think Reinhart starts the season in Roch. He looks better physically, but still not quite there yet. Put vets like McGinn and Legwand on the 3rd line and let Reinhart get top line minutes in Roch. Will be better for him in the long run. Reinhart, IMO, benefits nothing from Rochester. The biggest thing in that area for me is that he's already out smarted all that competition, and seen NHL level play and looked good against NHL play. He'll struggle much more than Eichel to start, but on the 3rd line, with some vets and facing 3rd pairing defenders, he should really catch his groove by January or so. Plus, we've seen our guys get concussed down in the AHL, a lot. Armia, McCabe, and Zemgus come to mind. Last thing I want is Reinhart getting knocked out cold vs some goon AHL lifer trying to prove himself Edited September 27, 2015 by WildCard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Risto also got a concussion down there didn't he? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3putt Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 I think Reinhart starts the season in Roch. He looks better physically, but still not quite there yet. Put vets like McGinn and Legwand on the 3rd line and let Reinhart get top line minutes in Roch. Will be better for him in the long run.I think you are expecting something that is not coming from Samson. He will never have the flash of Eichel, but his game the other night feeding open guys, keeping possession in the o zone, back checking and picking up the trailer is something we need more of. He will not become flashier in the A and this is still a rebuild. We have seen improvement, but I Watched the Hawks with their retooled roster, and a rejuvenated kings squad that tells me we are not contenders yet and will need to take sum lumps while they learn how to win consistently. Reinhart will improve more against NHL players than he will in the A imho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 (edited) I was one of the biggest advocates of starting Reinhart in Ra-cha-cha and putting him at wing initially on the Sabres, but he has significantly improved his strength (he was a boy last training camp and now is a hockey player). His hockey sense is solid, and I haven't seen anything that screams 'send him down.' If he can center 2 vets on line 3, I am fine w/ leaving him up (as C even). I've only seen last night's game and bits of his other game and his 1st training camp session, maybe there were things you saw that suggest he should go down. Could you elaborate on what they were? Thanks. Couple things that stand out to me are his play away from the puck and his lack of strength on the puck. He seems to lose a lot of 50/50 pucks on the wall, just gets out muscled physically and loses it. Away from the puck he still appears to be a step behind where he should be... seems like he's either trying to catch up with the play or is a step behind on the back check. Maybe I'm just being too critical, but expectations should be high considering where he was drafted. Playing in Roch against men will help improve in both of those areas. I'd rather see him center a top line in Roch than 3rd line in Buffalo. Edited September 27, 2015 by pi2000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Risto also got a concussion down there didn't he? I believe he did Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Is that Girgensons with an 'A'? Yes. Who has the other letters? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Yes. Who has the other letters? Wouldn't put too much credence on letters yet (other than Gionta's C) as they haven't used a full NHL lineup yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 we need one great goalie. I'm looking forward to a few barnburners this year. Next year we can get a goalie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 I think you are expecting something that is not coming from Samson. He will never have the flash of Eichel, but his game the other night feeding open guys, keeping possession in the o zone, back checking and picking up the trailer is something we need more of. He will not become flashier in the A and this is still a rebuild. We have seen improvement, but I Watched the Hawks with their retooled roster, and a rejuvenated kings squad that tells me we are not contenders yet and will need to take sum lumps while they learn how to win consistently. Reinhart will improve more against NHL players than he will in the A imho. Agreed. Samson is a unique player. There aren't a lot like him. I assume, and I'm pretty sure, that guys like Bylsma and Murray see it different than we do and see how good he is in the little things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 I like Johnson. ...and I don't think there is anything wrong with that. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Couple things that stand out to me are his play away from the puck and his lack of strength on the puck. He seems to lose a lot of 50/50 pucks on the wall, just gets out muscled physically and loses it. Away from the puck he still appears to be a step behind where he should be... seems like he's either trying to catch up with the play or is a step behind on the back check. Maybe I'm just being too critical, but expectations should be high considering where he was drafted. Playing in Roch against men will help improve in both of those areas. I'd rather see him center a top line in Roch than 3rd line in Buffalo.I'll give you that I haven't seen him win many battles along the boards, but he hasn't been there that much. Play away from the puck looked ok to me, but it was a small sample size. He very well could/does need more work on that. Will it improve more going against NHLers or AHLers? My guess is that will improve more against better competition. I wouldn't overweigh his expectations based on being the 2nd overall pick last year. It was a weaker than typical draft and he was (IIRC based on posts here) the 1st 1st forward selected that didn't enter the NHL fulll time at 18 since Dumont. He looks to be on track to be a solid NHLer, maybe very solid/special. His passing and his vision seem to be ready for the big league. Not sure how much beating AHLers would improve that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 Is...is that My Little Pony? Jesus Doohkie, I expect better out of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 And, as great as Eichel will become, he will only be a 19 year old rookie. Putting O'Reilly between Kane & Ennis makes that definitely the top line drawing the toughest competition. Giving Eichel a sniper (Moulson) and a digger / grinder w/ skill (Girgensons) AND the other team's 2nd line is custom made to have him successful right out of the gate. '16-'17, could see them shuffling things up significantly, but in October 2015 O'Reilly should center the top line IMHO. This team could have some significant line shuffling this year, which is par for the recent course, but the cool thing is it's because they have multiple GOOD options for each line rather than the hound's breakfast of the past 2 years. O'Reilly should be anything and everything :wub: Separately (well, maybe not entirely), I've never felt it move so much during preseason. While I still think we're probably looking at ~10th in the East, I'm reasonably certain we're going to be an exciting 10th place team. After the last two years, that's a pretty dramatic change in a single offseason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted September 27, 2015 Report Share Posted September 27, 2015 (edited) Couple things that stand out to me are his play away from the puck and his lack of strength on the puck. He seems to lose a lot of 50/50 pucks on the wall, just gets out muscled physically and loses it. Away from the puck he still appears to be a step behind where he should be... seems like he's either trying to catch up with the play or is a step behind on the back check. Maybe I'm just being too critical, but expectations should be high considering where he was drafted. Playing in Roch against men will help improve in both of those areas. I'd rather see him center a top line in Roch than 3rd line in Buffalo. You are absolutely correct on the pucks on the wall. As for his play away from the puck, I'd advise you to take another look at the Leaf game, but with a different focus. If you are looking for puck pursuit and overpowering guys defensively, you will always be disappointed by Samson. His game is about finding and using open spaces and moving to where the puck is going. He will never reach the same stature, obviously, but his play style is very Gretzky-esque. As he grows you are going to see how the puck will start following him around. Watch how when a teammate has the puck he almost always finds a soft spot offensively. The Deslauriers goal was a great example. He slowed down to create a seam, then moved into it. When backchecking he always has his head up, drops down low and fills potential danger spots. I rarely saw him out of position. In my view he is much better served in the NHL because the key to improvement for him is adapting to NHL speed — not in terms of his own skating, but in terms of how quickly holes open and close. He can only do that by playing at NHL speed. Our roster is constructed in such a way that he can be shifted around between the 5th and 10th forward spot and get 11-14 minutes a night with solid players, playing against second or third liners and never be asked to carry the team. He can pile up enough points on the PP to keep his confidence up and grow into a second-line role. He'll learn way more about the NHL by being in the NHL. Edited September 27, 2015 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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