Patrick Kane: [Updated] D.A. Decides Not to Prosecute; NHL Determines Claims "Unfounded"

[biodork]

I would like to hear some of our female posters views on this if they care to share. Chz, Josie, Bio?  Others. 

I think Jo chimed in earlier in the thread, and I'm just reading for now since there's very little known for certain yet.  Only thing I know for sure is that independent of age and/or consent, the dude has a girlfriend and he's messing around with other girls in his hometown.  IMO that already makes him an idiot regardless of what exactly went down, and possibly much worse.

[Hoss]

Let's forget the age aspect.

[MattPie]

Let's forget the age aspect.

Is that for fun or you tipping us?

[That Aud Smell]

Here's a thought: What if part of the reason for the silence is not just that they're waiting on the forensics, but also the fact that Paul Cambria & Co. are working furiously to make this whole thing go away? 

 

In saying that, I'm not saying anything about the veracity, credibility of either side's version of events.

Is that for fun or you tipping us?

i'm guessing the latter.

it also occurred to me: if she were 16, a warrant may have already issued.

[nfreeman]

Here's a thought: What if part of the reason for the silence is not just that they're waiting on the forensics, but also the fact that Paul Cambria & Co. are working furiously to make this whole thing go away? 

 

In saying that, I'm not saying anything about the veracity, credibility of either side's version of events.

i'm guessing the latter.

it also occurred to me: if she were 16, a warrant may have already issued.

 

It's well past time for me to stop posting in this thread, but your theory sounds pretty plausible -- i.e. they went home, the video and physical evidence are inconclusive, he was plastered and isn't sure if he crossed the line and is accordingly willing to write a check to make this go away, and his attorneys are negotiating terms with her attorneys.

[That Aud Smell]

It's well past time for me to stop posting in this thread, but your theory sounds pretty plausible -- i.e. they went home, the video and physical evidence are inconclusive, he was plastered and isn't sure if he crossed the line and is accordingly willing to write a check to make this go away, and his attorneys are negotiating terms with her attorneys.

 

Of course, the theory also contemplates the possibility that the evidence against him could be quite substantial. In fact, the theory is probably more likely to be true if there's an indication that the charges are supported by strong evidence.

[Hoss]

It's well past time for me to stop posting in this thread, but your theory sounds pretty plausible -- i.e. they went home, the video and physical evidence are inconclusive, he was plastered and isn't sure if he crossed the line and is accordingly willing to write a check to make this go away, and his attorneys are negotiating terms with her attorneys.

The chief saying they are awaiting forensic evidence kind of pulls this theory apart, though. The delay seems that they are waiting on forensics. Investigation is ongoing.

 

This will likely go through a Grand Jury.

[JJFIVEOH]

But really, glad to see the respect, guys. There are few topics out there that rile people up quite like rape. 

 

By the way, that is a creepy picture. :blink:

[JJFIVEOH]

Didn't Drew Doughty get accused of rape by a woman who claimed she was forced back to his house after a night of drinking, followed up by heading straight to the hospital?

[That Aud Smell]

The chief saying they are awaiting forensic evidence kind of pulls this theory apart, though. The delay seems that they are waiting on forensics. Investigation is ongoing.

 

This will likely go through a Grand Jury.

Or, the two theories could be wholly consistent with each other, even if the delay, such as it is, in the investigation has nothing to do with settlement efforts and everything to do with actual forensics.

 

Anyway, it does seem like any arrest here would be based on the finding of a Grand Jury. In which event, I'm not sure how much more we'll hear in the near term.

[josie]

I would like to hear some of our female posters views on this if they care to share. Chz, Josie, Bio?  Others. 

I've said a thing or two but frankly, I strongly dislike debating this topic when it's mostly speculation and what-if theories bandied about. I will wait until there are solid facts, as each situation is grey and different and worthy of separate consideration. 

 

That being said... 

 

I tend to err more on the side of SJW when it comes to rape. I'm not close enough to these people to really feel like I know if someone's lying or not. Sorry for the personal story here, but it's a woman's experience/point of view which is what I believe you are asking for. Just one woman's, but hey, aren't too many of us uterus owners in this place. 

 

I have struggled with understanding rape/sexual assault for years, as I immaturely harbored a "yeah well she was being a dumb slut" viewpoint as a defense mechanism. Victim blaming because it was "oh thank god that's not me, I'm smart". Awful, I know. Still kinda ingrained in me. Something very much like the "it's not Kane's fault really, how was he supposed to know she was too young/She's aware she's hot and underage in a place she shouldn't be and came on to him"

 

Then happened to me again and again (starting around age 14) and it was a complete identity crisis.  It's fun to have a friend make a drink for you in college, you don't really want it, hand it to another friend, and he acts exaaactly like he's been roofied..... I'll have you know that I was fairly flirty, reasonably attractive and was always slinging dirty jokes around. Did I deserve it? Hell no I did not. And my lack of promiscuity doesn't give me a shining badge of defense that shouldn't also be extended to more sex positive people. 

 

Therefore, as a result of my own personal crap, I won't judge the alleged victim. I lean towards supporting the victim, even if there's a chance they're crying wolf. Too many men and women are unfairly dismissed for me to ignore them and side with the accused. I feel that's how "good people" like Cosby continued on- reputations. Kane is only getting the fire he is because he's got a bit of a spotty record, which makes it easier to believe he'd do this and pile on the accusations, which is of course, abhorrent as well. Put Toews in his place, we'd be having a different discussion (partly, not counting the legal discourse). Say someone accused my hockey idol Zetterberg of this- my heart would shatter into a billion pieces, but I'd still listen to the victim, shoving down those angry voices in me going "yeah right, damn golddigging !" 

 

I have experienced a lot of sexism (daily!) in my short time on this planet, and have experienced some pretty awful stuff that was then ignored/pushed away/blamed on me simply because I was expendable. And none of that was with a star athlete under a magnifying glass of media/national attention. 

 

Wait for some more solid information before judging anyone entirely. It's human to judge to some degree immediately, we are not without faults. It is also human to speculate, though it sounds to me like a lot of you have already made up your minds on the whole situation. Dial it back. Everyone. You weren't there. 

 

Also, I am terrible at arguing, so apologies if the ramble just got weird. I feel parallels to any rape case. I've got feelings, man!!! 

[I am Defecting]

I don't know what happened at Kane's house in Hamburg. I don't know what happened at the SkyBar. Can one of you guys with a strong opinion clue me in? Anybody watch the All 11?

[WildCard]

I have returned after an absence of many hours.

 

I have no idea what happened to this thread.

 

About an hour ago, Hamburg PD issued a statement that the investigation is ongoing.  I'm sure that if there is enough evidence to charge, the DA will charge.

Same here, pretty peeved I missed this discussion being at work all day, this board is very good at healthy debates.

 

That said, looks like nfreeman and Sizzle have pretty much covered my beliefs, and probably in a more eloquent manner

[drnkirishone]

I think Jo chimed in earlier in the thread, and I'm just reading for now since there's very little known for certain yet.  Only thing I know for sure is that independent of age and/or consent, the dude has a girlfriend and he's messing around with other girls in his hometown.  IMO that already makes him an idiot regardless of what exactly went down, and possibly much worse.

just to chime in on this. The girlfriend angle is the thing that is currently turning me against him (without the facts). he has a girlfriend and is bringing women home from bars?!?! if he is willing to do this I don't find it much of a stretch to think he may go farther

[Hoss]

just to chime in on this. The girlfriend angle is the thing that is currently turning me against him (without the facts). he has a girlfriend and is bringing women home from bars?!?! if he is willing to do this I don't find it much of a stretch to think he may go farther

WOOOOOOOAH NELLY. Cheating a$$hole does not translate to rapist. Let's slow that one down.

Cheating is messed up, but it's not rape. He's rich and young. His sex life isn't exclusive.

 

(Not saying he's not guilty. Just saying this is a GIGANTIC leap)

Edited August 8, 2015 by Hoss

[I am Defecting]

I don't know the situation with the gf other than what he said last February. Could somebody clue me in? Anyone have the day-by-day on his relationship status?

[drnkirishone]

WOOOOOOOAH NELLY. Cheating a$$hole does not translate to rapist. Let's slow that one down.

Cheating is messed up, but it's not rape. He's rich and young. His sex life isn't exclusive.

 

(Not saying he's not guilty. Just saying this is a GIGANTIC leap)

i know it is. but in my head i rank cheating pretty high up on the just don't care about people list. so there is no misunderstanding my "just don't care about people" listing is not a listing of people or things that can be done for me to not care about them anymore. It is things that someone can do to show how little they care about people.

 

I am not saying he is guilty because he cheated. I am only saying his cheating makes me question his innocence. not condemn him as guilty, just less likely to be not guilty

Edited August 8, 2015 by drnkirishone

[I am Defecting]

Oh, he was still with the gf? That's incredible. Where dod you get your scoop?!

[That Aud Smell]

Thanks for chiming in, Josie.

[Doohicksie]

I've said a thing or two but frankly, I strongly dislike debating this topic when it's mostly speculation and what-if theories bandied about. I will wait until there are solid facts, as each situation is grey and different and worthy of separate consideration. 

 

That being said... 

 

I tend to err more on the side of SJW when it comes to rape. I'm not close enough to these people to really feel like I know if someone's lying or not. Sorry for the personal story here, but it's a woman's experience/point of view which is what I believe you are asking for. Just one woman's, but hey, aren't too many of us uterus owners in this place. 

 

I have struggled with understanding rape/sexual assault for years, as I immaturely harbored a "yeah well she was being a dumb slut" viewpoint as a defense mechanism. Victim blaming because it was "oh thank god that's not me, I'm smart". Awful, I know. Still kinda ingrained in me. Something very much like the "it's not Kane's fault really, how was he supposed to know she was too young/She's aware she's hot and underage in a place she shouldn't be and came on to him"

 

Then ###### happened to me again and again (starting around age 14) and it was a complete identity crisis.  It's fun to have a friend make a drink for you in college, you don't really want it, hand it to another friend, and he acts exaaactly like he's been roofied..... I'll have you know that I was fairly flirty, reasonably attractive and was always slinging dirty jokes around. Did I deserve it? Hell no I did not. And my lack of promiscuity doesn't give me a shining badge of defense that shouldn't also be extended to more sex positive people. 

 

Therefore, as a result of my own personal crap, I won't judge the alleged victim. I lean towards supporting the victim, even if there's a chance they're crying wolf. Too many men and women are unfairly dismissed for me to ignore them and side with the accused. I feel that's how "good people" like Cosby continued on- reputations. Kane is only getting the fire he is because he's got a bit of a spotty record, which makes it easier to believe he'd do this and pile on the accusations, which is of course, abhorrent as well. Put Toews in his place, we'd be having a different discussion (partly, not counting the legal discourse). Say someone accused my hockey idol Zetterberg of this- my heart would shatter into a billion pieces, but I'd still listen to the victim, shoving down those angry voices in me going "yeah right, damn golddigging ######!" 

 

I have experienced a lot of sexism (daily!) in my short time on this planet, and have experienced some pretty awful stuff that was then ignored/pushed away/blamed on me simply because I was expendable. And none of that was with a star athlete under a magnifying glass of media/national attention. 

 

Wait for some more solid information before judging anyone entirely. It's human to judge to some degree immediately, we are not without faults. It is also human to speculate, though it sounds to me like a lot of you have already made up your minds on the whole situation. Dial it back. Everyone. You weren't there. 

 

Also, I am terrible at arguing, so apologies if the ramble just got weird. I feel parallels to any rape case. I've got feelings, man!!! 

 

You're just sayin' that cuz you're a girl.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you.

[thewookie1]

I've said a thing or two but frankly, I strongly dislike debating this topic when it's mostly speculation and what-if theories bandied about. I will wait until there are solid facts, as each situation is grey and different and worthy of separate consideration. 

 

That being said... 

 

I tend to err more on the side of SJW when it comes to rape. I'm not close enough to these people to really feel like I know if someone's lying or not. Sorry for the personal story here, but it's a woman's experience/point of view which is what I believe you are asking for. Just one woman's, but hey, aren't too many of us uterus owners in this place. 

 

I have struggled with understanding rape/sexual assault for years, as I immaturely harbored a "yeah well she was being a dumb slut" viewpoint as a defense mechanism. Victim blaming because it was "oh thank god that's not me, I'm smart". Awful, I know. Still kinda ingrained in me. Something very much like the "it's not Kane's fault really, how was he supposed to know she was too young/She's aware she's hot and underage in a place she shouldn't be and came on to him"

 

Then ###### happened to me again and again (starting around age 14) and it was a complete identity crisis.  It's fun to have a friend make a drink for you in college, you don't really want it, hand it to another friend, and he acts exaaactly like he's been roofied..... I'll have you know that I was fairly flirty, reasonably attractive and was always slinging dirty jokes around. Did I deserve it? Hell no I did not. And my lack of promiscuity doesn't give me a shining badge of defense that shouldn't also be extended to more sex positive people. 

 

Therefore, as a result of my own personal crap, I won't judge the alleged victim. I lean towards supporting the victim, even if there's a chance they're crying wolf. Too many men and women are unfairly dismissed for me to ignore them and side with the accused. I feel that's how "good people" like Cosby continued on- reputations. Kane is only getting the fire he is because he's got a bit of a spotty record, which makes it easier to believe he'd do this and pile on the accusations, which is of course, abhorrent as well. Put Toews in his place, we'd be having a different discussion (partly, not counting the legal discourse). Say someone accused my hockey idol Zetterberg of this- my heart would shatter into a billion pieces, but I'd still listen to the victim, shoving down those angry voices in me going "yeah right, damn golddigging ######!" 

 

I have experienced a lot of sexism (daily!) in my short time on this planet, and have experienced some pretty awful stuff that was then ignored/pushed away/blamed on me simply because I was expendable. And none of that was with a star athlete under a magnifying glass of media/national attention. 

 

Wait for some more solid information before judging anyone entirely. It's human to judge to some degree immediately, we are not without faults. It is also human to speculate, though it sounds to me like a lot of you have already made up your minds on the whole situation. Dial it back. Everyone. You weren't there. 

 

Also, I am terrible at arguing, so apologies if the ramble just got weird. I feel parallels to any rape case. I've got feelings, man!!! 

 

And this is why we all love you Josie, you give the forum art, and the other gender's viewpoint on anything.

 

Thank you for the slightly awkward yet very informed opinion :worthy:  

[Huckleberry]

Maybe it should be, Patrick Kane:  KNOWING WHAT YOU THINK YOU KNOW, BUT KNOWING THAT YOU DON'T REALLY KNOW, DO YOU STILL WANT HIM ON THE SABRES?

 

Only if he is innocent and chicago "mike richards" him before all the facts are out.

To be honest even if he settles out of court i would have a hard time believing he is not guilty, in a case like this if I was accused and didn't do this i would never settle.

[That Aud Smell]

in a case like this if I was accused and didn't do this i would never settle.

With $84M or so at stake, a person might make a business decision.

[sicknfla]

It took me awhile but I managed to read this entire thread. It was a good read and I think all of your inputs were important. We all have opinions and for the most part it was kept civalized.

 

That being said I will say one thing. If it gets me banned or chastised who cares. Everyone on here is expected to post in a certain manner and be respectful of one another. If we are not we get quickly informed by the mods. I have been guilty of pushing the line myself. However, JJ and Dark didn't deserve the comments made from SDS. We all have to play by the same rules. Whether you own this site or not doesn't give you the right to be a bully. Makes you look weak.

 

SDS owes both of them an apology and, IMO, the entire board one as well for the way he personally attacked in this thread.

[pastajoe]

WOOOOOOOAH NELLY. Cheating a$$hole does not translate to rapist. Let's slow that one down.

Cheating is messed up, but it's not rape. He's rich and young. His sex life isn't exclusive.

 

(Not saying he's not guilty. Just saying this is a GIGANTIC leap)

Agreed, but to even say he cheated is speculation. They're not married, do they live together? Perhaps they have an understanding that he can see other people given he's on the road so often. We don't know. And cheating is not a crime. He's young and rich, I'm sure lots of guys in his position are not monogamous.