dumb_dumb88 Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 This is pretty ridiculous. Hasek wasn't a 2nd line Dman or even 1st line winger. Losing him is a little different than losing a skater. He used the threat of his retirement to make sure that the Sabres would not get an equal value in return for his trade. I'm not saying he shouldn't have done it, I'm just saying don't expect me to give him a big hug for it either. No one has stated anyone should feel differently than they do. Both my wife and myself can understand how some fans feel. It never bothered me personally, that doesn't make me a bad fan, or bad individual either. I was merely pointing out that if management and ownership had some other talent on the team at the time that could have offset Dom's departure, it wouldn't have seemed so bad to everyone. I can't blame Dom one bit on this, and I know many others that feel the way I do as well, just as those that feel the opposite know many people that feel the same as them. I can never hold it against Dom, he simply wanted the Cup and he wasn't going to get it here in Buffalo with the way management and ownership had failed to act on his pleas for help, which, quite frankly, many seem to forget. It wasn't like Dom just woke up one day and said "I'm going to screw the Sabres". He asked for offensive help and management and ownership dicked around, instead of doing their jobs to get him the help. So, he decided he was going to go, and in the process keep the organization he was going to intact to make that Cup run. Dom made sure guys like Lidstrom, Yzerman, Federov and Holmstrom stayed with Detroit and sent Kozlov over to Buffalo. I don't look at it like he engineered his own trade as much as I look at it as he engineered his own Stanley Cup Championship. Besides, Buffalo got a 1st rounder out of it which they made a further trade with Columbus to get the 20th pick and Regier squandered it on Paille. My hats off to Dom, his name is on the Stanley Cup. Good for him, he carried the burden and earned it in his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 No one has stated anyone should feel differently than they do. Both my wife and myself can understand how some fans feel. It never bothered me personally, that doesn't make me a bad fan, or bad individual either. I was merely pointing out that if management and ownership had some other talent on the team at the time that could have offset Dom's departure, it wouldn't have seemed so bad to everyone. I can't blame Dom one bit on this, and I know many others that feel the way I do as well, just as those that feel the opposite know many people that feel the same as them. I can never hold it against Dom, he simply wanted the Cup and he wasn't going to get it here in Buffalo with the way management and ownership had failed to act on his pleas for help, which, quite frankly, many seem to forget. It wasn't like Dom just woke up one day and said "I'm going to screw the Sabres". He asked for offensive help and management and ownership dicked around, instead of doing their jobs to get him the help. So, he decided he was going to go, and in the process keep the organization he was going to intact to make that Cup run. Dom made sure guys like Lidstrom, Yzerman, Federov and Holmstrom stayed with Detroit and sent Kozlov over to Buffalo. I don't look at it like he engineered his own trade as much as I look at it as he engineered his own Stanley Cup Championship. Besides, Buffalo got a 1st rounder out of it which they made a further trade with Columbus to get the 20th pick and Regier squandered it on Paille. My hats off to Dom, his name is on the Stanley Cup. Good for him, he carried the burden and earned it in his career. How is that not screwing the Sabres? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumb_dumb88 Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 How is that not screwing the Sabres? :D I know, I know, but I look at it from a competitor's point of view. He made the right moves to ensure his legacy, hey, call me a capitalist, but I love that he had the tenacity to do it. That's the true mark of a winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunomatic Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 All of the great franchises go out of their way to include past players in their present. This is a step in that direction and a step towards being one day considered a great franchise. Little steps and a longview will eventually get you there. One day everyone will look back and recognize that finally someone with vision and the gumption to carry it out stepped in and got the ball rolling towards the Buffalo sabres being taken seriously. In my view Hasek isn't the best sabre to wear the uniform but he was considered the best in the game. My favorite is and was # 11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 No way. Not ashamed to admit that I still don't like anything about how he handled his departure. This. And I'll raise you 7 Vezina trophies. No, I'm with you too. I think this is happening at a good time for Dom. I really don't expect many boos. Pegula Fever is still running high, the team is playing reasonably well, and Rick Martin just died, for crying out loud. He'll get a nice reception. I doubt it will be rip-roaring. Now, if OSP still owned the team and the Sabres were out of the playoffs and it could reasonably be considered a promotional move... all bets would be off. Only morons will boo IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 This. And I'll raise you 7 Vezina trophies. Only morons will boo IMO. I'll see your vezinas and raise you two heart trophies and a olympic gold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 I've never hid my disdain for all things Hasek but I'm ready to move on. Best. Goalie. Ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 I know, I know, but I look at it from a competitor's point of view. He made the right moves to ensure his legacy, hey, call me a capitalist, but I love that he had the tenacity to do it. That's the true mark of a winner. Frankly, I don't give a ###### about Dom's perspective in this. I'm a Sabres fan first, a Hasek fan second. He :censored: over the team by threatening to retire if he wasn't traded and then made sure we didn't get anything near equal value in return for the league's top goalie. It was an egotistical, self-centered move that was nothing more than a giant middle finger to the organization, and by extension, the fans and city. He may have thought he was sticking it to the team/owners by doing this, he may not have known how bad he was screwing the rest of the team, city and fans, but he did it. And to sugarcoat it and act like it was no big deal is ridiculous. IMO he needs to apologize and own up to what he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDS Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 Frankly, I don't give a ###### about Dom's perspective in this. I'm a Sabres fan first, a Hasek fan second. He :censored: over the team by threatening to retire if he wasn't traded and then made sure we didn't get anything near equal value in return for the league's top goalie. It was an egotistical, self-centered move that was nothing more than a giant middle finger to the organization, and by extension, the fans and city. He may have thought he was sticking it to the team/owners by doing this, he may not have known how bad he was screwing the rest of the team, city and fans, but he did it. And to sugarcoat it and act like it was no big deal is ridiculous. IMO he needs to apologize and own up to what he did. wag more, bark less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donteatyellowsnow Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 Frankly, I don't give a ###### about Dom's perspective in this. I'm a Sabres fan first, a Hasek fan second. He :censored: over the team by threatening to retire if he wasn't traded and then made sure we didn't get anything near equal value in return for the league's top goalie. It was an egotistical, self-centered move that was nothing more than a giant middle finger to the organization, and by extension, the fans and city. He may have thought he was sticking it to the team/owners by doing this, he may not have known how bad he was screwing the rest of the team, city and fans, but he did it. And to sugarcoat it and act like it was no big deal is ridiculous. IMO he needs to apologize and own up to what he did. So Carson Palmer is an ass too? He like Hasek is sick and tired of the organizations dysfunction and wants out to go to a winner. What's wrong with that? He obviously had enough and forced their hand. Soo, maybe they should have heeded his warnings and actually done something to bring in players to help win. I'll bet if the Sabres or Bengals for that matter were committed to winning and brought in the right pieces to win Hasek(Palmer too) would have been happier and wanted to stay. Works both ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 So Carson Palmer is an ass too? He like Hasek is sick and tired of the organizations dysfunction and wants out to go to a winner. What's wrong with that? He obviously had enough and forced their hand. Soo, maybe they should have heeded his warnings and actually done something to bring in players to help win. I'll bet if the Sabres or Bengals for that matter were committed to winning and brought in the right pieces to win Hasek(Palmer too) would have been happier and wanted to stay. Works both ways. If he wanted out he could have just demanded a trade. Maybe even make it a short list of teams. But he did more. And it was way over the line. Notice that almost noone has any ill will towards Michael Peca. Why do you think that is? Because he didn't manage to screw the team and its fans on his way out like Hasek did. It was way out of line for Hasek to orchestrate the deal that he did. He deserves whatever ill will he gets for strong arming the team into a trade that was guaranteed to see the Sabres flounder. And we haven't even touched the phantom injury in the playoffs yet..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FogBat Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 If he wanted out he could have just demanded a trade. Maybe even make it a short list of teams. But he did more. And it was way over the line. Notice that almost noone has any ill will towards Michael Peca. Why do you think that is? Because he didn't manage to screw the team and its fans on his way out like Hasek did. It was way out of line for Hasek to orchestrate the deal that he did. He deserves whatever ill will he gets for strong arming the team into a trade that was guaranteed to see the Sabres flounder. And we haven't even touched the phantom injury in the playoffs yet..... I forgot about that. It's interesting how he got away with malingering - to an extent. The late, great Jim Kelley called him to the carpet for it, and got assaulted by Hasek himself (although the circumstances behind it are a bit bizarre in and of themselves, given that Ted Nolan was the coach at that time and IIRC Hasek and Nolan didn't get along. Not sure what the story was behind that, but I don't think there's any disputing that Hasek carried his weight around within the organization and why Nolan was gone when Darcy took over as GM). The fact that he malingered is upsetting. If we do that in the private (or even public) sector, we can get in serious trouble. I remember seeing a sign at a hearing clinic when I was in the Army that warned us of the consequences of malingering by such means as faking a hearing loss. I certainly didn't want to see a year in prison, let along a day. At the end of the day, we either love or hate Hasek, and I don't think anyone is going to dispute that with serious acrimony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverPowerYou Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 I bet u Hasek comes out of retirement to be Millers backup. Jk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 If he wanted out he could have just demanded a trade. Maybe even make it a short list of teams. But he did more. And it was way over the line. Notice that almost noone has any ill will towards Michael Peca. Why do you think that is? Because he didn't manage to screw the team and its fans on his way out like Hasek did. It was way out of line for Hasek to orchestrate the deal that he did. He deserves whatever ill will he gets for strong arming the team into a trade that was guaranteed to see the Sabres flounder. And we haven't even touched the phantom injury in the playoffs yet..... I have ill will towards Peca. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 wag more, bark less. Maybe because it's the end of a long week but I don't follow. So Carson Palmer is an ass too? He like Hasek is sick and tired of the organizations dysfunction and wants out to go to a winner. What's wrong with that? He obviously had enough and forced their hand. Soo, maybe they should have heeded his warnings and actually done something to bring in players to help win. I'll bet if the Sabres or Bengals for that matter were committed to winning and brought in the right pieces to win Hasek(Palmer too) would have been happier and wanted to stay. Works both ways. Again, it's not about wanting out. Players get fed up with management all the time, star players get traded. It's the way he went about it that pisses me off. Don't get me wrong, I don't hold the Sabres blameless in this. Ownership never "gave them the tools to finish the job" and all that BS. And if I were the GM I would have taken a package of picks and prospects instead of someone off the roster. I forgot about that. It's interesting how he got away with malingering - to an extent. The late, great Jim Kelley called him to the carpet for it, and got assaulted by Hasek himself (although the circumstances behind it are a bit bizarre in and of themselves, given that Ted Nolan was the coach at that time and IIRC Hasek and Nolan didn't get along. Not sure what the story was behind that, but I don't think there's any disputing that Hasek carried his weight around within the organization and why Nolan was gone when Darcy took over as GM). The fact that he malingered is upsetting. If we do that in the private (or even public) sector, we can get in serious trouble. I remember seeing a sign at a hearing clinic when I was in the Army that warned us of the consequences of malingering by such means as faking a hearing loss. I certainly didn't want to see a year in prison, let along a day. At the end of the day, we either love or hate Hasek, and I don't think anyone is going to dispute that with serious acrimony. I don't hate Dom. I hate the way he acted. I'm still looking forward to telling my son (and hopefully someday my grandkids) about how lucky we were to watch one of the greatest goalies in NHL history go through an amazing run in Buffalo, and carried a team of average talent for more than a few years. I do want to bury the hatchet and move on. But for me to fully let go I am going to need to see or hear something that indicates he understands how the fans got screwed over as much as the team in his solo quest for the Cup. I have ill will towards Peca. Me too, but not as much as Dom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 I've never hid my disdain for all things Hasek but I'm ready to move on. Best. Goalie. Ever. this. i have healthy respect for wolf and weave, but, as inkie said, it is time to move on. it really is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patty16 Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 If he wanted out he could have just demanded a trade. Maybe even make it a short list of teams. But he did more. And it was way over the line. Notice that almost noone has any ill will towards Michael Peca. Why do you think that is? Because he didn't manage to screw the team and its fans on his way out like Hasek did. It was way out of line for Hasek to orchestrate the deal that he did. He deserves whatever ill will he gets for strong arming the team into a trade that was guaranteed to see the Sabres flounder. And we haven't even touched the phantom injury in the playoffs yet..... And you dont think other star players have done this? really? You take a hard line on so many positions. News: many star players seek a trade to a contender but wont waive their NTC or NMC if the team they are going to is emptying its roster. They want to win. Hasek did a lot of things wrong and left on a sour note. I have a bad taste in my mouth from it but he wanted to win. It wasnt going to happen in buffalo, they werent committed. Its the same reason Ruff was holding off on signing a contract. Hasek knew he wasnt gonna win in Detroit if they traded the farm for him. Why do you think he picked detroit?? they win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 I have ill will towards Peca. OK, now THAT you gotta let go. :P To me, Peca's situation was just a salary dispute. And that happens all the time. I thought he was foolish for holding out and going the trade route, but I don't dislike him for it. Instead of getting angry, I laughed at his poor decision instead. Hasek, on the other hand, went out of his way to burn bridges. He's got to set the first stone before I'll recognize him as worthy of honor among Sabres alum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 this. i have healthy respect for wolf and weave, but, as inkie said, it is time to move on. it really is. One aspect to this discussion has become very clear to me. We Sabres fans have been dealt a really $#!tty hand in regards to ownership this past decade. With the handling of Dom/Peca/Drury/Briere/.., the internal budget constraints that have recently come to light and everything else, I'm starting to think that the only reason the Sabres still have any fans at all is Lindy Ruff. (Wait,.. What?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 And you dont think other star players have done this? really? You take a hard line on so many positions. News: many star players seek a trade to a contender but wont waive their NTC or NMC if the team they are going to is emptying its roster. They want to win. Hasek did a lot of things wrong and left on a sour note. I have a bad taste in my mouth from it but he wanted to win. It wasnt going to happen in buffalo, they werent committed. Its the same reason Ruff was holding off on signing a contract. Hasek knew he wasnt gonna win in Detroit if they traded the farm for him. Why do you think he picked detroit?? they win. Name one. To the best of my knowledge no player after Dom has ever scuttled a trade after they found out what the return is going to be. they've scuttled trades because of the destination team, but not because of the return. If Dom had said, "here's a list of one team I'll accept a trade to or retire" and left it at that I might be OK with it. But he hand picked who came back knowing it would be bad for the team he's leaving. He burned the bridge. He needs to be the first to extend the olive branch. I'm OK with the team saying, "hey Dom, you wanna make this right?". But he's needs to be the one to show some remorse, not the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 this. i have healthy respect for wolf and weave, but, as inkie said, it is time to move on. it really is. To be honest, the only time I even consider Hasek at all is when it is brought up in a thread here. I don't spend any time other than that thinking about that situation so I have moved on. But that doesn't mean I'm OK seeing #39 honored as a Sabre. IMO to be worthy of honor you need be 4 things. 1. Among the very best to play for the blue and gold. 2. Been a member of the team for a good part of the best years of your career. 3. Contributed in some meaningful way to team success. 4. Been a loyal member of the team, a good teammate. Most of the Sabres alum automatically fail at point #3 because team success has been fleeting at best. And Hasek fails miserably at #4, both for the way he left and the way he used phantom injury when he was most needed. He was an awesom goalie. He was also a lousy teammate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunomatic Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 How many other players in league history orchestrated a trade like the one Hasek did? NONE. To the best of my knowledge no player after Dom has ever scuttled a trade after they found out what the return is going to be. they've scuttled trades because of the destination team, but not because of the return. If Dom had said, "here's a list of one team I'll accept a trade to or retire" and left it at that I might be OK with it. But he hand picked who came back knowing it would be bad for the team he's leaving. He burned the bridge. He needs to be the first to extend the olive branch. I'm OK with the team saying, "hey Dom, you wanna make this right?". But he's needs to be the one to show some remorse, not the team. If the sabres organization allowed Dom that kind of power on a trade then shame on them. The entire management team deserved to be fired on the spot. No one player should ever be bigger then the team. Ever. Its unfathomable to me that Dom would get to hand pick who came back in the trade much less be involved in any part of the negotiation between trading partners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 OK, now THAT you gotta let go. :P To me, Peca's situation was just a salary dispute. And that happens all the time. I thought he was foolish for holding out and going the trade route, but I don't dislike him for it. Instead of getting angry, I laughed at his poor decision instead. Hasek, on the other hand, went out of his way to burn bridges. He's got to set the first stone before I'll recognize him as worthy of honor among Sabres alum. No way, and I contend that Peca refusing to honor his contract (and that's what he did) may even have led Dom leaving. If Peca had played poorly the year before would he have tried to renegotiate? No way. Not eva. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 If the sabres organization allowed Dom that kind of power on a trade then shame on them. The entire management team deserved to be fired on the spot. No one player should ever be bigger then the team. Ever. Its unfathomable to me that Dom would get to hand pick who came back in the trade much less be involved in any part of the negotiation between trading partners. And yet he was. and he used the threat of retirement to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 19, 2011 Report Share Posted March 19, 2011 No way, and I contend that Peca refusing to honor his contract (and that's what he did) may even have led Dom leaving. If Peca had played poorly the year before would he have tried to renegotiate? No way. Not eva. I'm cool with that line of thought. I was just yankin yer chain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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