Is the Sabres PP too predictable?

[GASabresIUFAN]

This is something that I’ve felt has been the case since last year.  

Simply passing along the perimeter waiting for a TNT one timer is no longer a surprise.  Goalies and the PK are overplaying that move.  Time to give them something else to think about.  

I’d like to see a little less structure and more creativity.  I’d like to see faster puck movement.

 

[#freejame]

Many of the best PP are predictable. Everyone knows where shots are coming from in Boston and Washington. I think Buffalo thinks they’re at that level when YTD it hasn’t been the case. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

5 minutes ago, #freejame said:

Many of the best PP are predictable. Everyone knows where shots are coming from in Boston and Washington. I think Buffalo thinks they’re at that level when YTD it hasn’t been the case. 

I just watched a breakdown of the NJ PP.  They rarely give the PKers the same look.  I think we have the talent to try different looks but I’d like to try Mitts in the bumper on the first PP.  He is our best playmaker why don’t we give him a shot at distributing on the PP.

[msw2112]

I think it had been predictable with Thompson on the left side for one-timers and Olofsson on the right.  It appears that they've tried to mix this up and it hasn't been wildly successful, although they had at least one PP goal last night, so maybe things are starting to change.  They definitely need to get more shots on goal from the point, with traffic in front, to generate rebounds or deflections. They had a couple of deflection goals last night, although I can't recall how many were on the PP.

[Scottysabres]

They need more leg movement to the inside, forcing the 2 upper D to collapse down which would open up the lanes to the lower boards players which would allow 1 of the blueline guys to step up in to the inside just above the face off circles which would allow other players to move their legs to cycle coverage and create space which would allow the opposing net minder to go cross eyed watching all of this movement which would allow a puck in the back of the net.

Write that play up Meatballs, get'er done!

[Pimlach]

It could be better with some traffic in front of the goalie and someone in the slot to gather up rebounds. 

I think they pass when shots are there, especially in the beginning of the PP - it is as if they feel they have to go around the horn a few times. 

PP is an area that needs improvement, we have the guns.  

 

 

[dudacek]

They've actually shifted things around a lot. The set-up Tage for the left boards 1-timer 4 times a PP hasn't really been been a thing.

We are seeing lots of Tage rotating to the right side, and Skinner up high that wasn't part of the mix before. They are also giving it to Skinner down low more often, and trying to work it to the bumper, though the guys playing the bumper (really, all 4 forwards have rotated in) haven't been particularly effective.

Also, Cozens is handling the puck a lot more than he used to.

They still aren't using the back door as much as they could, or getting to the net enough for screens, tips and rebounds. And the execution from some of the other guys hasn't been there enough to make it pay off.

But they've definitely been mixing things up.

[PerreaultForever]

You are correct, they have had a tendency to move it around the outside and try for a big shot and most teams force them to the outside to deal with it. The answer isn't complicated though. We saw it in the Ottawa game. Go to the front, screen and tip. Charge the net front for rebounds. Use your size. 

We already have the speed and puck movement, our point men can shoot, you add the net front on a consistent basis and it's deadly. Once that's in place and teams have to collapse the box to deal with it it'll leave a guy like Tage free and open to snipe same way Stamkos has done for Tampa all these years. 

[Doohickie]

Mostly yes, but I think they've been trying some different tactics, using the bumper more, working on deflections, etc.

[LGR4GM]

The PP should be run from below the circles not from the point. If you run a PP from below the goal line, it forces defenders and the goalie to track a puck while they turn allowing lanes to open. Also, Buffalo has a bad habit of having their net front player stand to a side looking for a rebound instead of screening. 

[French Collection]

8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Go to the front, screen and tip. Charge the net front for rebounds. Use your size. 

If TNT, Tuch and Cozens crash the net that is some serious beef for teams to deal with. Skinner can sift in and get loose pucks.

I’m not saying they use a net front guy all of the time but once in a while to change it up.

12 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

The PP should be run from below the circles not from the point. If you run a PP from below the goal line, it forces defenders and the goalie to track a puck while they turn allowing lanes to open. Also, Buffalo has a bad habit of having their net front player stand to a side looking for a rebound instead of screening. 

They could inject this system every once in a while to screw with other teams’ PK. If it becomes successful then use it more. Mitts might be a guy to do this on PP2. Benson has some clips from the WHL where he operates well from behind the net.

Gretzky probably got a few hundred points from that location. If you install a player with the threat of a Michigan goal that adds another layer.

[matter2003]

I think they realized this towards the end of last year and they are working on some things now. Haven't got it completely figured out yet but once they do they should be in far better shape.

The PK has been a revelation tho.

[GASabresIUFAN]

4 minutes ago, French Collection said:

Benson has some clips from the WHL where he operates well from behind the net.

This is something they need to try.  It can create miss-matches in front as the D have to try to dislodge the guy behind the net. I’d also like to see some E-W passing that doesn’t first go back to the point.

 

Edited October 26, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN

[matter2003]

27 minutes ago, French Collection said:

If TNT, Tuch and Cozens crash the net that is some serious beef for teams to deal with. Skinner can sift in and get loose pucks.

I’m not saying they use a net front guy all of the time but once in a while to change it up.

They could inject this system every once in a while to screw with other teams’ PK. If it becomes successful then use it more. Mitts might be a guy to do this on PP2. Benson has some clips from the WHL where he operates well from behind the net.

Gretzky probably got a few hundred points from that location. If you install a player with the threat of a Michigan goal that adds another layer.

Another "Sneaky B" like Briere?  He was so good from back there...

[Night Train]

More point shots and crash the net. 

[Pimlach]

9 hours ago, dudacek said:

They've actually shifted things around a lot. The set-up Tage for the left boards 1-timer 4 times a PP hasn't really been been a thing.

We are seeing lots of Tage rotating to the right side, and Skinner up high that wasn't part of the mix before. They are also giving it to Skinner down low more often, and trying to work it to the bumper, though the guys playing the bumper (really, all 4 forwards have rotated in) haven't been particularly effective.

Also, Cozens is handling the puck a lot more than he used to.

They still aren't using the back door as much as they could, or getting to the net enough for screens, tips and rebounds. And the execution from some of the other guys hasn't been there enough to make it pay off.

But they've definitely been mixing things up.

They are mixing up who plays were,  sure, they did that.   But the still do essentially the same thing, perimeter passing, in the new alignment.  They pass around the perimeter  until someone thinks they have a clear shot,  usually with no screen or no one in the slot.  We have great shooters so it works sometimes, but not enough.  

The opponent PK is putting pressure on whoever has the puck, they don't wait in a defensive posture for us to set up a play.  Our guy with the puck is under pressure, hence the fast perimeter passing - our extra man joins them on the outside so that we can maintain possession but 5 on the outside is what the opponents want.   Then they keep sticks down and in the passing lanes.  They get their goalies a view clear.  We get a shot, they recover the rebound and they try to breakout or clear.  When they clear they put pressure on the us deep in our zone, quite often with 2 guys.  

Our goalies have face high danger changes with us on the PP way to much.  

The PP went sour at the end of last season after being dominant for awhile.  Perhaps teams figured it out?  It still seems like it to me. 

[nfreeman]

9 hours ago, dudacek said:

They've actually shifted things around a lot. The set-up Tage for the left boards 1-timer 4 times a PP hasn't really been been a thing.

We are seeing lots of Tage rotating to the right side, and Skinner up high that wasn't part of the mix before. They are also giving it to Skinner down low more often, and trying to work it to the bumper, though the guys playing the bumper (really, all 4 forwards have rotated in) haven't been particularly effective.

Also, Cozens is handling the puck a lot more than he used to.

They still aren't using the back door as much as they could, or getting to the net enough for screens, tips and rebounds. And the execution from some of the other guys hasn't been there enough to make it pay off.

But they've definitely been mixing things up.

I've noticed this as well.  I think Cozens is pretty good at this and that it's had a positive impact.  He's better at handling it and passing it than Skinner and VO are IMHO.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

The PP should be run from below the circles not from the point. If you run a PP from below the goal line, it forces defenders and the goalie to track a puck while they turn allowing lanes to open. Also, Buffalo has a bad habit of having their net front player stand to a side looking for a rebound instead of screening. 

This is it. They inevitably do this no matter how the players are align and who plays where.  The points are the key and the opponents pressure the points and all the other perimeter guys.  

We need to operate down low, it is easier to get a slot guy uncovered that way - then the slot guy has position to move in for a real screen at any time once the puck moves to the walls or the point.  When that happens we need a shot, not more perimeter passes, unless there is an open passing lane of course and we can get the goalie moving.  

[mjd1001]

17 hours ago, #freejame said:

Many of the best PP are predictable. Everyone knows where shots are coming from in Boston and Washington. I think Buffalo thinks they’re at that level when YTD it hasn’t been the case. 

I agree.  Sure you can 'change things up' to make it less predictable, but to me your success on the PP is mostly about your talent level and luck.  Scheme probably matters a bit, but not as much as many think.

The team could use the exact same PP strategy in the next few games and if they score 2-3 more goals, then all will be well with the world.

If the PP percentage/success rate drops to the bottom of the league and stays there for a few weeks (or longer), then sure, change things up. 

Edited October 26, 2023 by mjd1001

[PASabreFan]

Maybe you guys can call the arena and try to pass these ideas on.

[Doohickie]

The one thing that a lot of people are missing is that, yeah, you can force the PK to open up when playing with the puck behind the net, but when the puck is back there it's a limited area and easier for a defender to dislodge the puck and interrupt possession.  If it were all positive, everyone would do it that way all the time.

I agree with what others said though:  If you're going to control it behind the net, Mitts is probably the guy to do that.  If Skinner could turn off his Shoot First switch, I think he could do well back there too.