Sabres starting to come off no trade lists

[Brawndo]

From the Athletic Matt Fairburn.

This is the time of year when players entering the final season of their contract might be looking to be traded if their team isn’t willing to offer a contract extension. Typically, the Sabres are a common team on no-trade lists for players. But as one agent said this week, “Buffalo is starting to come off a lot of lists.”

That’s concrete evidence of the Sabres’ progress. Buffalo isn’t a strong geographical draw the way Vegas, Florida and the California teams are, but the attitude about the team is changing. There are a few reasons. One is the trajectory the team is on with so many young players and a promising future. Another is head coach Don Granato, who has coached players like Tage Thompson, Rasmus Dahlin and Alex Tuch to career-best seasons. Kevyn Adams has also played a big part in improving the Sabres’ reputation around the league. Agents have enjoyed dealing with him because he’s straightforward and humble.

Adams noticed the tone of his conversations with agents starting to change last offseason when he was working on contract extensions for Tage Thompson and Mattias Samuelsson. Since taking over as general manager, Adams has put a priority on players who want to be in Buffalo and are proud to wear a Sabres jersey. He spent 2021 trading away players like Rasmus Ristolainen, Sam Reinhart and Jack Eichel, who didn’t fit that description for various reasons. Since, the focus has shifted to a more patient approach of drafting and developing. Adams has made a few minor free-agent additions but has tried not to block the path of young prospects who are ready for NHL roles.

Now that the Sabres are entering a window in which they can contend for the postseason, adding talent from outside the organization could become more common. That’s what makes the work Adams and Granato have done the last few seasons so valuable. No, Buffalo isn’t the flashiest market in the NHL. Players want to win, though, and the Sabres look like a team that could do plenty of that in years to come. It helps, too, to have captain Kyle Okposo back in the fold. He’s well respected around the NHL for his work with the NHLPA, and his word carries a lot of weight. His presence in the locker room is another aspect of what makes the Sabres a more attractive landing spot for veteran NHLers.

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, Brawndo said:

From the Athletic Matt Fairburn.

This is the time of year when players entering the final season of their contract might be looking to be traded if their team isn’t willing to offer a contract extension. Typically, the Sabres are a common team on no-trade lists for players. But as one agent said this week, “Buffalo is starting to come off a lot of lists.”

That’s concrete evidence of the Sabres’ progress. Buffalo isn’t a strong geographical draw the way Vegas, Florida and the California teams are, but the attitude about the team is changing. There are a few reasons. One is the trajectory the team is on with so many young players and a promising future. Another is head coach Don Granato, who has coached players like Tage Thompson, Rasmus Dahlin and Alex Tuch to career-best seasons. Kevyn Adams has also played a big part in improving the Sabres’ reputation around the league. Agents have enjoyed dealing with him because he’s straightforward and humble.

Adams noticed the tone of his conversations with agents starting to change last offseason when he was working on contract extensions for Tage Thompson and Mattias Samuelsson. Since taking over as general manager, Adams has put a priority on players who want to be in Buffalo and are proud to wear a Sabres jersey. He spent 2021 trading away players like Rasmus Ristolainen, Sam Reinhart and Jack Eichel, who didn’t fit that description for various reasons. Since, the focus has shifted to a more patient approach of drafting and developing. Adams has made a few minor free-agent additions but has tried not to block the path of young prospects who are ready for NHL roles.

Now that the Sabres are entering a window in which they can contend for the postseason, adding talent from outside the organization could become more common. That’s what makes the work Adams and Granato have done the last few seasons so valuable. No, Buffalo isn’t the flashiest market in the NHL. Players want to win, though, and the Sabres look like a team that could do plenty of that in years to come. It helps, too, to have captain Kyle Okposo back in the fold. He’s well respected around the NHL for his work with the NHLPA, and his word carries a lot of weight. His presence in the locker room is another aspect of what makes the Sabres a more attractive landing spot for veteran NHLers.

There is another reason why Buffalo should be an appealing destination for many players: It's location. The proximity to Toronto and southern Ontario where many players and their families come from. Added to now being a very competitive team should also be attractive features for players on the move. 

[PerreaultForever]

This is good to hear if true. Eichel winning the cup isn't going to do us any favors, but if we can become a desirable spot to play again it'll be good for everyone. I probably sound like a fan here, but I think a strong team in Buffalo is good for the league. 

[bg17]

6 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

This is good to hear if true. Eichel winning the cup isn't going to do us any favors, but if we can become a desirable spot to play again it'll be good for everyone. I probably sound like a fan here, but I think a strong team in Buffalo is good for the league. 

How does Eichel factor in? 

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, PerreaultForever said:

This is good to hear if true. Eichel winning the cup isn't going to do us any favors, but if we can become a desirable spot to play again it'll be good for everyone. I probably sound like a fan here, but I think a strong team in Buffalo is good for the league. 

How is Eichel a factor in other players wanting to or not wanting to play in Buffalo? Player movement for a number of reasons is a part of the landscape in the pros (all sports) and now in the college game. The biggest factor in player movements revolve around the issue of the contracts $$.

[PerreaultForever]

7 minutes ago, JohnC said:

How is Eichel a factor in other players wanting to or not wanting to play in Buffalo? Player movement for a number of reasons is a part of the landscape in the pros (all sports) and now in the college game. The biggest factor in player movements revolve around the issue of the contracts $$.

It's a perception thing (right or wrong). 

Two years ago the perception of Eichel was maybe he's a quitter, maybe he's lazy, he doesn't have McDavid's compete, maybe he's not as good as people thought, and he won't play for (a demanding) Cassidy.

A year later he's a team guy, he gets back up and has grit, he's playing two way hockey and everybody in Vegas loves him including Cassidy.

So the perception becomes, I guess it was Buffalo, not Eichel. 

(you can add in Montour and Reinhart if you want, but the perception for anybody anywhere is if a player does better in a new place it was the place and not the player. That won't impact everyone, but it won't help) 

[LGR4GM]

1 minute ago, PerreaultForever said:

It's a perception thing (right or wrong). 

Two years ago the perception of Eichel was maybe he's a quitter, maybe he's lazy, he doesn't have McDavid's compete, maybe he's not as good as people thought, and he won't play for (a demanding) Cassidy.

A year later he's a team guy, he gets back up and has grit, he's playing two way hockey and everybody in Vegas loves him including Cassidy.

So the perception becomes, I guess it was Buffalo, not Eichel. 

(you can add in Montour and Reinhart if you want, but the perception for anybody anywhere is if a player does better in a new place it was the place and not the player. That won't impact everyone, but it won't help) 

Couldn't disagree more with this mess of a Response. No one cares that 2 years ago Eichel was in Buffalo, no players do. 

15 minutes ago, bg17 said:

How does Eichel factor in? 

He doesn't. 

[PromoTheRobot]

2 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

It's a perception thing (right or wrong). 

Two years ago the perception of Eichel was maybe he's a quitter, maybe he's lazy, he doesn't have McDavid's compete, maybe he's not as good as people thought, and he won't play for (a demanding) Cassidy.

A year later he's a team guy, he gets back up and has grit, he's playing two way hockey and everybody in Vegas loves him including Cassidy.

So the perception becomes, I guess it was Buffalo, not Eichel. 

(you can add in Montour and Reinhart if you want, but the perception for anybody anywhere is if a player does better in a new place it was the place and not the player. That won't impact everyone, but it won't help) 

Your perception

[JohnC]

3 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

It's a perception thing (right or wrong). 

Two years ago the perception of Eichel was maybe he's a quitter, maybe he's lazy, he doesn't have McDavid's compete, maybe he's not as good as people thought, and he won't play for (a demanding) Cassidy.

A year later he's a team guy, he gets back up and has grit, he's playing two way hockey and everybody in Vegas loves him including Cassidy.

So the perception becomes, I guess it was Buffalo, not Eichel. 

(you can add in Montour and Reinhart if you want, but the perception for anybody anywhere is if a player does better in a new place it was the place and not the player. That won't impact everyone, but it won't help) 

The perception of Buffalo not being an attractive place had absolutely nothing to do with Eichel or any player. It wasn't a secret to the hockey world that Buffalo was a dysfunctional franchise. The organization had a long history and deserved reputation of being ineptly and chaotically run. (As you well know.) Not only did players not want to come here but also half the team here wanted out. 

It was never difficult to understand why Eichel, and many of his teammates, wanted out. Because of the constant churning of staff and revolting incompetency, this franchise was stuck in the mud with little hope of getting out of it. So it shouldn't be surprising that there was a thick cloud of negativity associated with such a  woebegone franchise. It had little to do with the players as it did with the operation. 

Since KA took over the operation that ugly and well-deserved malignant reputation has changed for the positive. It certainly wasn't a quick change in perception but without question it has been altered. Where once many players had Buffalo on their "do not play franchise list" that list has certainly shrunk. I'm not saying Buffalo is an appealing destination for everyone, but it is now a place where more players would consider coming here. Moving forward is better than moving backward or being miserably stuck. 

Edited June 11, 2023 by JohnC

[Brawndo]

2 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

This is good to hear if true. Eichel winning the cup isn't going to do us any favors, but if we can become a desirable spot to play again it'll be good for everyone. I probably sound like a fan here, but I think a strong team in Buffalo is good for the league. 

If anything Eichel winning the cup might actually help increase Adams and the Sabres reputation around the league with players. Adams stepped into an ugly situation but did right by both the player and the Sabres Organization.  He traded Eichel to a SC Contender and got very good assets in return. 
 

Look at Reinhart calling Adams back the day after the trade to thank him for moving him to a good situation.

These moves coupled with the improved play and the vibes around the organization should put the Sabres on a lot more players radar

[Zamboni]

Glass half empty fans no matter what happens. Gotta love it. 
 

 

 

Oh but the change in “loser” perception will take 4-5 years from now. So will not being on everyone’s no trade list.

Edited June 12, 2023 by Zamboni

[PerreaultForever]

7 hours ago, JohnC said:

The perception of Buffalo not being an attractive place had absolutely nothing to do with Eichel or any player. It wasn't a secret to the hockey world that Buffalo was a dysfunctional franchise. The organization had a long history and deserved reputation of being ineptly and chaotically run. (As you well know.) Not only did players not want to come here but also half the team here wanted out. 

It was never difficult to understand why Eichel, and many of his teammates, wanted out. Because of the constant churning of staff and revolting incompetency, this franchise was stuck in the mud with little hope of getting out of it. So it shouldn't be surprising that there was a thick cloud of negativity associated with such a  woebegone franchise. It had little to do with the players as it did with the operation. 

Since KA took over the operation that ugly and well-deserved malignant reputation has changed for the positive. It certainly wasn't a quick change in perception but without question it has been altered. Where once many players had Buffalo on their "do not play franchise list" that list has certainly shrunk. I'm not saying Buffalo is an appealing destination for everyone, but it is now a place where more players would consider coming here. Moving forward is better than moving backward or being miserably stuck. 

As an example, I was listening to a Bruins related podcast where they were discussing the pros and cons of a trade for Pierre Luc DuBois. The idea of him being a quitter and bad team mate came up and the rebuttal was, but look at Eichel. People were thinking the same thing about him and now that he got on a "competent franchise that actually knows what they're doing"............... etc. I don't have to fill in the rest. 

You can believe it's MY perception or MY idea, but it's not. It's out there. Like it or not. 

[PerreaultForever]

7 hours ago, Brawndo said:

If anything Eichel winning the cup might actually help increase Adams and the Sabres reputation around the league with players. Adams stepped into an ugly situation but did right by both the player and the Sabres Organization.  He traded Eichel to a SC Contender and got very good assets in return. 
 

Look at Reinhart calling Adams back the day after the trade to thank him for moving him to a good situation.

These moves coupled with the improved play and the vibes around the organization should put the Sabres on a lot more players radar

The last sentence may be true, hope it is, but I don't see how players thanking him for moving them helps in any way at all. 

[GoPuckYourself]

10 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

It's a perception thing (right or wrong). 

Two years ago the perception of Eichel was maybe he's a quitter, maybe he's lazy, he doesn't have McDavid's compete, maybe he's not as good as people thought, and he won't play for (a demanding) Cassidy.

A year later he's a team guy, he gets back up and has grit, he's playing two way hockey and everybody in Vegas loves him including Cassidy.

So the perception becomes, I guess it was Buffalo, not Eichel. 

(you can add in Montour and Reinhart if you want, but the perception for anybody anywhere is if a player does better in a new place it was the place and not the player. That won't impact everyone, but it won't help) 

I get what you're trying to say... I thought you were going to say the perception of the team after our owners wouldn't let him get the type of surgery he wanted. I do believe perception matters for sure but I think those perceptions have also changed since both sides moved on this is a different type of team clearly on the up and up.

I'm sure all of them (Eichel, Reinhart, Montour) would probably presuade other players who are FA's to go a different route. We have no clue what the actual perception is about the Sabres until FA hits though since talk is cheap, if players truly believe that then I expect some decent signings, that would tell alot imo.

[sabremike]

The reason is obvious:

[JohnC]

7 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

As an example, I was listening to a Bruins related podcast where they were discussing the pros and cons of a trade for Pierre Luc DuBois. The idea of him being a quitter and bad team mate came up and the rebuttal was, but look at Eichel. People were thinking the same thing about him and now that he got on a "competent franchise that actually knows what they're doing"............... etc. I don't have to fill in the rest. 

You can believe it's MY perception or MY idea, but it's not. It's out there. Like it or not. 

You don't have to be a hockey insider to recognize the disorder that the Sabres were immersed in. Abject organizational and ownership incompetence were known by all who were in the business or followed the sport. The knockout stench couldn't be missed. The negative perception had nothing to do with the players. That was evident by the fact that all the players who wanted out of the mess had many prospective suitors pursuing them via trade offers. 

[LGR4GM]

8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

The last sentence may be true, hope it is, but I don't see how players thanking him for moving them helps in any way at all. 

You don't see how a GM moving players when they would like to go elsewhere and sending them to places they might like helps? Of course you don't. 

The perception about the Sabres as a team is changing. Why? Because the team is actually a team now. There is a reason all those fun videos are coming out of the locker room and guys are going on vacation together etc... That is the stuff that players talk about, is the room fun. Also Don Granato is highly liked and respected by everyone who plays under him. Contrary to the narrative that comes up here repeatedly, DG isn't some novice bumbling his way around. He's got 20 years of coaching experience and players like him. 

Finally, no one gives a crap about other stuff when you start to win and the Sabres made a big statement last year. Before you toss out "they didn't make the playoffs!" this team was supposed to be a lottery team again. Almost every single national publication picked them to finish in the 5-9 range. I don't know of anyone who picked them to finish above Detroit or Ottawa. There is an entire thread on this website dedicated to Tage Thompson's sh% because everywhere you looked his new contract was highly questioned and basically everyone said "he will regress because his sh% won't be that high again". I mean I guess they were right there, it was higher. The point is, what Jack Eichel does or says doesn't matter because the teams locker room is fun, the coach is highly respected and liked, and they are starting to win. When the Sabres win a playoff round this upcoming season, no one is going to be thinking "oh man, they traded Jack Eichel 3 years ago and he won a cup so they are a bad franchise I won't go there." 

[tom webster]

8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

The last sentence may be true, hope it is, but I don't see how players thanking him for moving them helps in any way at all. 

I was going to stay out of this but this response is just ridiculous. You believe any little snippet has a negative effect but nothing has a positive effect. 

[Marvin]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

You don't see how a GM moving players when they would like to go elsewhere and sending them to places they might like helps? Of course you don't. 

The perception about the Sabres as a team is changing. Why? Because the team is actually a team now. There is a reason all those fun videos are coming out of the locker room and guys are going on vacation together etc... That is the stuff that players talk about, is the room fun. Also Don Granato is highly liked and respected by everyone who plays under him. Contrary to the narrative that comes up here repeatedly, DG isn't some novice bumbling his way around. He's got 20 years of coaching experience and players like him. 

Finally, no one gives a crap about other stuff when you start to win and the Sabres made a big statement last year. Before you toss out "they didn't make the playoffs!" this team was supposed to be a lottery team again. Almost every single national publication picked them to finish in the 5-9 range. I don't know of anyone who picked them to finish above Detroit or Ottawa. There is an entire thread on this website dedicated to Tage Thompson's sh% because everywhere you looked his new contract was highly questioned and basically everyone said "he will regress because his sh% won't be that high again". I mean I guess they were right there, it was higher. The point is, what Jack Eichel does or says doesn't matter because the teams locker room is fun, the coach is highly respected and liked, and they are starting to win. When the Sabres win a playoff round this upcoming season, no one is going to be thinking "oh man, they traded Jack Eichel 3 years ago and he won a cup so they are a bad franchise I won't go there." 

Thank you for emphasising how much Don Granato is respected in the hockey world.  I don't think that we the fans are truly aware of how much his presence and his influence matters.

[tom webster]

6 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

You don't see how a GM moving players when they would like to go elsewhere and sending them to places they might like helps? Of course you don't. 

The perception about the Sabres as a team is changing. Why? Because the team is actually a team now. There is a reason all those fun videos are coming out of the locker room and guys are going on vacation together etc... That is the stuff that players talk about, is the room fun. Also Don Granato is highly liked and respected by everyone who plays under him. Contrary to the narrative that comes up here repeatedly, DG isn't some novice bumbling his way around. He's got 20 years of coaching experience and players like him. 

Finally, no one gives a crap about other stuff when you start to win and the Sabres made a big statement last year. Before you toss out "they didn't make the playoffs!" this team was supposed to be a lottery team again. Almost every single national publication picked them to finish in the 5-9 range. I don't know of anyone who picked them to finish above Detroit or Ottawa. There is an entire thread on this website dedicated to Tage Thompson's sh% because everywhere you looked his new contract was highly questioned and basically everyone said "he will regress because his sh% won't be that high again". I mean I guess they were right there, it was higher. The point is, what Jack Eichel does or says doesn't matter because the teams locker room is fun, the coach is highly respected and liked, and they are starting to win. When the Sabres win a playoff round this upcoming season, no one is going to be thinking "oh man, they traded Jack Eichel 3 years ago and he won a cup so they are a bad franchise I won't go there." 

I’m going to make a prediction here. There will be an acquisition in the next two years where the acquired player tells the media that Eichel spoke highly of the city.

[Doohickie]

22 hours ago, Brawndo said:

It helps, too, to have captain Kyle Okposo back in the fold. He’s well respected around the NHL for his work with the NHLPA, and his word carries a lot of weight. His presence in the locker room is another aspect of what makes the Sabres a more attractive landing spot for veteran NHLers.

Interesting tidbit there.  We tend to look at situation's like Okie's and think of it in terms of value on the ice and value in the dressing room.  Apparently Okposo widely respected around the league and as captain playing with him is a potential draw for players around the league.  If that line isn't just a reporter's take and it's actually true, it brings another dimension to signing him for another contract.

[Doohickie]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

9 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

look at Eichel. People were thinking the same thing about him and now that he got on a "competent franchise that actually knows what they're doing"............... etc.

You don't have to be a hockey insider to recognize the disorder that the Sabres were immersed in. Abject organizational and ownership incompetence were known by all who were in the business or followed the sport.

The ownership hasn't changed but the organization has.  Moving Eichel when he didn't want to be part of a rebuild is a positive from a Sabres PR perspective.  The organization under Adams has been steadfast and methodical in its build.  One thing I didn't agree with regarding the tank was jettisoning talent to get that one really talented guy.  Okay, now you have him, but you need to rebuild the talent pool.  XGMTM showed you can't just cash in a bunch of draft chips and build a team quickly, especially if you don't appreciate the role that character and leadership play in the players acquired.  (The expansion teams *did* build quickly but that was because they were getting average to above-average talent all throughout the lineup and didn't have to deal with Sabotkas and the like.)  I think most people around the league would look at the state of the Sabres and say that, at this point in time, they are a competent franchise that knows what they're doing.

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

The perception about the Sabres as a team is changing. Why? Because the team is actually a team now.

This is the only reason the perception is changing.  FAs want to win and this team is a hair's breath away from being one of the strongest teams in the East.

[tom webster]

It seems appropriate in this thread to emphasize once again that everyone has their own reasons for going where they go. Some people want to be close to home, some want to be as far away as possible, some want bright lights, party atmosphere, some want rural, quiet family life. Nothing is universal but the more reasons the better. Winning, proximity to Canada, taking care of your players, a progressive front office and coaching just add to the reasons to come.

[Taro T]

4 hours ago, tom webster said:

It seems appropriate in this thread to emphasize once again that everyone has their own reasons for going where they go. Some people want to be close to home, some want to be as far away as possible, some want bright lights, party atmosphere, some want rural, quiet family life. Nothing is universal but the more reasons the better. Winning, proximity to Canada, taking care of your players, a progressive front office and coaching just add to the reasons to come.

And it needs to be remembered that for the 1st 25 years this franchise existed it was a destination players wanted to be.  Gare cried the day he was traded.  Hawerchuck and LaFontaine - 2 of the biggest stars of their day wanted to be in Buffalo.  The European players remembered 12-6 over the Soviets.  The Scandanavian players loved the Sabres because of that.  The Sabres had one of the 3 best franchise winning percentages in the entire NHL for decades.  That 3rd team would change from IIRC Filly to the Aisles to the Eulers to ??? but Moe-ray-all and Buffalo were always 1 and 2/3.  And when you're consistently near the top, even if you don't get playoff success people want to be there because they know they'll at least be in the mix.

That waned under the Criminals and didn't recover as a destination under Golisano and the team became a joke early in the Pegula Era.  But this is the last of the Pegulas teams to become relevant.  The Bills are a destination team.  The Bandits have been in the championship game 3 consecutive seasons and would be viewed as a juggernaut had an entire season and a half not been wiped out in the middle of that run.  The 3rd year Kin-ig-hit Hawks made the playoffs.  Their daughter is one of the best women tennis players in the world.  Everything else they touch sports wise shines.  The Sabres seem to be on the verge of joining the others.

It can be a destination for players again.  And once it is again, there's no reason for it to go back to laughing stock.  The owners have enough money to allow competent management to do their thing.  Buffalo will never be the place a guy that desparately wants the big city life of NYC or TO will make his 1st choice.  And the same goes for guys that really want the sunny FLA or LA weather.  But for those that like some/all of the items you mentioned above, they truly can be a destination club.