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Updated Sabres Prospect Pool 2021 and beyond


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On 11/29/2021 at 10:55 AM, Taro T said:

IMHO the biggest question about Levi will be how well will he stand up to being run by NHLers.  If he can keep from breaking when getting run over by a true NHL-sized man going at full speed, he'll end up being a steal.

He seems to have the reflexes and the mental acuity to make it.  Can he be durable at the smaller stature is the big Q.  (Fortunately for him, goalies don't get run as often as they did.  But they still get run and playing on a team that is considered (rightly or wrongly) to not be particularly tough will not help cut down on that further.)

 

On 11/29/2021 at 11:50 AM, LGR4GM said:

It's not. It's not even on the list. 

Show us where Lucic hurt your psyche

 

On 11/29/2021 at 3:47 PM, Taro T said:

Gee, what a shocker.  You misunderstanding &/or misrepresenting something.

 

On 11/29/2021 at 5:10 PM, LGR4GM said:

 

Oh goody, gaslighting. 

Worrying about Levi getting run and breaking is not on the biggest questions list. 

"Can he be durable at the smaller stature" ... the smaller statute of *checks notes* 6ft 185lbs? Yes I think he can be durable, odd you're not worried about 6ft 176lb Quinn, 5'11" 192lbs Peterka

Here, let's look at it in real time. You say the biggest problem is Levi getting run. I say it is not and not on the list (I am now "triggered" according to you). You say I misrepresented or misunderstood what you wrote (you have since quadrupled down on that very point), and I quote exactly what you said. 

Very triggered, what are you going to try and convince us of next? Tage Thompson has marfans? 

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1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

More gaslighting. You just can't help yourself can you? 

No matter how many times you misrepresent this it won't change that you are misrepresenting this.

This is dull.  Have fun continuing this discussion.  Doubt yours truly will continue because as expected, there is no point to continuing it.

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1 minute ago, Taro T said:

No, once again, you misunderstood what you read & then based upon that misunderstanding later misrepresented what was said.  That does not make what was said later in our discussion gaslighting.

lol, you went from doubling down, to tripling down, to quadrupling down. You are worried Levi's size means he might get injured because he might get run or bumped. Don't know how I am misrepresenting that but would love for you to tell me. 

Just now, Taro T said:

No matter how many times you misrepresent this it won't change that you are misrepresenting this.

This is dull.  Have fun continuing this discussion.  Doubt yours truly will continue because as expected, there is no point to continuing it.

Please don't. I am tired of being lied to and attacked personally. 

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Most triggered poster currently is the guy who said that "IMHO the biggest question about Levi will be how well will he stand up to being run by NHLers." and when someone said it wasn't a big question at all they proceeded to spend multiple posts doubling down on that and gaslighting the events to make them not look like the person who overreacted to someone disagreeing with them. 

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15 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

@Taro T explain in what way saying Levi being run isn't a big question is misrepresenting your post that starts with "IMHO the biggest question about Levi will be how well will he stand up to being run by NHLers."

I read @Taro T and your comments about Levi's ability to handle rugged play. I agree more with your take than with his take on the player. But that isn't the problem with the exchange here. In my opinion you framed your response to him in a hard challenging way that wasn't required. If you would have asked in less pugnacious/antagonistic way to elaborate as to why he felt that Levi was more vulnerable than bigger goalies the response back would have been less sharp. Very often in a dialogue the tone can drown out the point. I believe that is what happened here.    

It can't be denied that the stature of a goalie has become an important consideration when evaluating prospects. In the NHL of today most franchises prefer bigger goalies than smaller players. That's one of the main considerations when evaluating the position. The issue is more related to how the position is played in today's NHL than it is related to durability. However, it can't be denied that Levi's play has been outstanding in college. And it isn't a stretch to believe that right now he might be our best goalie prospect in the system. 

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11 hours ago, dudacek said:

Is there mid-aughts template forming here at all?

It's pretty easy to draw parallels between:

  • Mitts - Connolly
  • Quinn - Vanek
  • Asplund - Hecht
  • Okposo - Grier
  • Dahlin - Campbell
  • Power - Tallinder
  • Samuelsson - McKee
  • Levi - Miller

Squint a little harder and this might work:

  • Thompson/Cozens/Krebs/Girgensons/Jankowski - Briere/Drury/Roy/Gaustad/Mair
  • Tuch/Olofsson/Rosen/Peterka/Poltapov - Dumont/Pominville/Afinogenov/Kotalik//Pyatt
  • Johnson/Bryson/Jokiharju - Lydman/Kalinin
  • UPL/Noronen - Biron/Noronen

Toss this year's three firsts into the mix to make up for some of today's unproven kids not developing?

It's enough to make you wonder if it's at all conscious.

Fun, but no amount of squinting is making Thompson look like Briere. 

Also, I'm squinting too much and seeing double - two Noronens 

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8 hours ago, SwampD said:

Did you learn a new word or something? Voicing a concern that is unfounded (in my opinion) is hardly gaslighting.

While I truly believe that size matters in other positions and can give an advantage in certain situations on the ice, I don't believe that to be the case with goalies.

They are either good or not. Big goalies oft get hurt, too. 

It's not gaslighting. There was no need to make someone you disagree with sound crazy in order to make your point more valid.

It is inarguable that size matters for goalies. Look at the league. 

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3 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I read @Taro T and your comments about Levi's ability to handle rugged play. I agree more with your take than with his take on the player. But that isn't the problem with the exchange here. In my opinion you framed your response to him in a hard challenging way that wasn't required. If you would have asked in less pugnacious/antagonistic way to elaborate as to why he felt that Levi was more vulnerable than bigger goalies the response back would have been less sharp. Very often in a dialogue the tone can drown out the point. I believe that is what happened here.    

It can't be denied that the stature of a goalie has become an important consideration when evaluating prospects. In the NHL of today most franchises prefer bigger goalies than smaller players. That's one of the main considerations when evaluating the position. The issue is more related to how the position is played in today's NHL than it is related to durability. However, it can't be denied that Levi's play has been outstanding in college. And it isn't a stretch to believe that right now he might be our best goalie prospect in the system. 

By the time of the post you have quoted, I was told I deliberately manipulated his point (which implies I am a liar) and that I literally cannot read. So to be honest, I don't want to be nice to Taro or ask him in a nice way.

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Just now, LGR4GM said:

Well John after I was told that I was manipulating his point and that I couldn't read, I didn't honestly want to be very nice to him. Actually I think I shall block Taro because he doesn't like me and I don't like him. 

You two are a couple of the more knowledgeable hockey people here. You don't have to like the person to engage with that person. When it gets to the point where it gets personal then it is time to stand back and let things cool down. Sometimes when strong-willed and opinionated people duel it gets more heated than necessary.

Very often you learn more from people you disagree with than with people you agree with. You just have to listen harder and dig through to what is actually being said. And you know very well that on a few occasions I have been the target of your bombardments. On those occasions you pissed me off! But I stood back and let the embers cool. I'm glad I did. The point here is that you don't have to go to the wall on every point you disagree with, especially when it is with someone you have some animus toward. I appreciate @Taro T and your contributions. That is not to say that I always agree or am happy with the sharp retorts given back. The operative word for the day is: Tolerance.  

I apologize if I come off as preachy or sanctimonious. 

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8 minutes ago, JohnC said:

You two are a couple of the more knowledgeable hockey people here. You don't have to like the person to engage with that person. When it gets to the point where it gets personal then it is time to stand back and let things cool down. Sometimes when strong-willed and opinionated people duel it gets more heated than necessary.

Very often you learn more from people you disagree with than with people you agree with. You just have to listen harder and dig through to what is actually being said. And you know very well that on a few occasions I have been the target of your bombardments. On those occasions you pissed me off! But I stood back and let the embers cool. I'm glad I did. The point here is that you don't have to go to the wall on every point you disagree with, especially when it is with someone you have some animus toward. I appreciate @Taro T and your contributions. That is not to say that I always agree or am happy with the sharp retorts given back. The operative word for the day is: Tolerance.  

I apologize if I come off as preachy or sanctimonious. 

Nope it doesn't, I think you are making good points

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18 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

By the time of the post you have quoted, I was told I deliberately manipulated his point (which implies I am a liar) and that I literally cannot read. So to be honest, I don't want to be nice to Taro or ask him in a nice way.

Show us where it was said you DELIBERATELY did misunderstand & misrepresent the posts.  You can't.  You simply do what you do.  There was no malice perceived and pointing out that you do what you do was not intended maliciously either.  

 

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16 hours ago, dudacek said:

Is there mid-aughts template forming here at all?

It's pretty easy to draw parallels between:

  • Mitts - Connolly
  • Quinn - Vanek
  • Asplund - Hecht
  • Okposo - Grier
  • Dahlin - Campbell
  • Power - Tallinder
  • Samuelsson - McKee
  • Levi - Miller

Squint a little harder and this might work:

  • Thompson/Cozens/Krebs/Girgensons/Jankowski - Briere/Drury/Roy/Gaustad/Mair
  • Tuch/Olofsson/Rosen/Peterka/Poltapov - Dumont/Pominville/Afinogenov/Kotalik//Pyatt
  • Johnson/Bryson/Jokiharju - Lydman/Kalinin
  • UPL/Portillo - Biron/Noronen

Toss this year's three firsts into the mix to make up for some of today's unproven kids not developing?

It's enough to make you wonder if it's at all conscious.

When I look at the list of young players that you presented the issue becomes how long is it going to take before the critical mass of these young players become a factor with the Sabres. Next year, I see an infusion of half a dozen players (including Tuch to this group) that will reshape this roster. In my estimation it will take another year or two for those players to become more established. When I look at the sparse crowds in the arena I'm just hope that the organization does something like upgrading the netminding to accelerate the rebuilding process and give the fans something to hold on to.  

Edited by JohnC
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3 hours ago, Taro T said:

Again, really expect that he will stop the puck at the NHL level.  He's stopped NHLers in pick up settings and has stopped pretty much everybody in all actual competitive settings he's been in at every level.

And again, don't see getting injured a HUGE concern, our size triggered friend getting triggered by a concern relating to a player's smaller stature made this seem a bigger concern than it is.  The comparable used has been Price who will be a HoFer but has had multiple seasons now derailed due to injury.  As he seems to play a similar style but is a fair bit smaller, can see it being a concern though not a massive one.  That said, again, see it a bigger concern than will he be able to track plays at the quicker pace or will he be able to get a glove or shoulder on those pucks that UPL has found so elusive through much of his post-hip surgery career.

Heck, during his 1st NHL season, durability appeared to be McDavid's biggest concern as he stepped right in without losing a beat other than the broken clavicle.  

And no, don't have injury data to confirm nor deny the supposition.  It really isn't that interesting a research project IMHO.  As for smaller goalies wearing down faster, Dwight Drane put in a lot of effort on it back before he was banned.  Maybe it still exists here.

But why do you think that Levi is especially at risk of getting run, and/or being adversely affected by being run?  Do you have any examples of goalies who specifically could not make it in the NHL because they could not take being run?

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58 minutes ago, Curt said:

But why do you think that Levi is especially at risk of getting run, and/or being adversely affected by being run?  Do you have any examples of goalies who specifically could not make it in the NHL because they could not take being run?

Have already answered your question.  Apparently in a nonsatisfactory manner.  Sorry for that.

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4 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

Most triggered poster currently is the guy who said that "IMHO the biggest question about Levi will be how well will he stand up to being run by NHLers." and when someone said it wasn't a big question at all they proceeded to spend multiple posts doubling down on that and gaslighting the events to make them not look like the person who overreacted to someone disagreeing with them. 

Nobody cares, take it offline.

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9 hours ago, Thorny said:

It is inarguable that size matters for goalies. Look at the league. 

Agreed but I believe that the size is not because of durability (being able to take a hit) but more because of the amount of net they cover with being a bigger goalie.  

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1 hour ago, Flashsabre said:

It is about time we start showing some love to 7th round pick Tyson Kozak. The centre for Portland is quietly up to  19 points in 21 games.

Also, our two top prospects, Power and Quinn both wear #22. Interesting to see who will rock that number for the Sabres for years to come.

I’d like to see Quinn claim it because I visualize 22 being HOF RW Mike Bossy.

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11 hours ago, Flashsabre said:

It is about time we start showing some love to 7th round pick Tyson Kozak. The centre for Portland is quietly up to  19 points in 21 games.

Also, our two top prospects, Power and Quinn both wear #22. Interesting to see who will rock that number for the Sabres for years to come.

I’d imagine Quinn in a first-come first-serve basis. Really curious what Power wears. #25 is another number he’s worn which is also semi-taken. He wore #3 when he was much younger.

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  • GASabresIUFAN changed the title to Updated Sabres Prospect Pool 2021 and beyond
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