Hoss Posted July 4, 2015 Report Share Posted July 4, 2015 Do you think the Sabres are deep enough? Here on July 4th when everyone is healthy the roster looks fine, it may look a lot different once the season rolls around. They've got a ton of forwards. You can't expect top-six quality players (not that Chris Stewart is that) to be your healthy scratches waiting in the wings for injury reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted July 4, 2015 Report Share Posted July 4, 2015 I agree with all of this except that I think the jury is very much still out on Larsson. But Stewart is very much a concept. Or put Larsson at wing, guy can skate, digs in corners and shows he can set up guys 3rd or fourth line, see where he fits. IMO, he improves the overall quality of the bottom six. Much like the top six, just because we have numbers and players we can feel comfortable with it doesn't mean there isn't room for improvement or a need for additional depth. I am looking for the Sabres to be a playoff team this season, I would hate for the Sabres to be caught shorthanded. There are also some serious questions to be answered. Does Reinhart make the Sabres out of training camp? At 34, does Legwand even make the final roster. The same can be said for Jamie McGinn and McCormick, do they even make the roster. Gionta is 36, how many games can we reasonably expect him to play? 82? 69? 50? Less? There are also injuries and the specter of a trade for a d-man that may have to include a forward off the roster. For these reasons, I can't get behind the idea of there not being room for Chris Stewart on this roster, especially if the commitment needed is a reasonable price for a short term. Which, IMO, is possible. All true but nice to have all these forwards during a long season, gives some room to overcome injuries and spell guys, havent looked at how many back to back games sabres have but this might work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 (edited) Do you think the Sabres are deep enough? Here on July 4th when everyone is healthy the roster looks fine, it may look a lot different once the season rolls around. Of course some will get hurt and others will disappoint. And yes I am projecting Eichel and Reinhart. But I think we have 14 legitimate NHL forwards and we are as deep as we have been in years. We have a legitimate first line: Kane/O'Reilly/Ennis — Moulson can fill there, Zemgus and Eichel might. Moulson is a legitimate 2nd liner. Zemgus and Eichel should be OK there. Larsson, Reinhart and Gionta might be able to fill in. McGinn, Gionta, Foligno, Legwand, Reinhart and Larsson are realistic NHL 3rd line options McCormick and Deslauriers are good NHL 4th liners. Varone, Cal O'Reilly, Akenson, Carrier, Bailey and Baptiste as emergency call-ups. The math doesn't work adding a 15th NHLer. Signing Stewart (or any similar-level forward) forces you to put Reinhart in the minors and means a pair of veteran NHL forwards will be sitting out. No cap-era NHL team has 3rd-liners in the press box. If we sign another NHL forward it will be because McCormick is injured, or to free up an asset to trade for a defence man. Edited July 5, 2015 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Of course some will get hurt and others will disappoint. And yes I am projecting Eichel and Reinhart. But I think we have 14 legitimate NHL forwards and we are as deep as we have been in years. We have a legitimate first line: Kane/O'Reilly/Ennis — Moulson can fill there, Zemgus and Eichel might. Moulson is a legitimate 2nd liner. Zemgus and Eichel should be OK there. Larsson, Reinhart and Gionta might be able to fill in. McGinn, Gionta, Foligno, Legwand, Reinhart and Larsson are realistic NHL 3rd line options McCormick and Deslauriers are good NHL 4th liners. Varone, Cal O'Reilly, Akenson, Carrier, Bailey and Baptiste as emergency call-ups. The math doesn't work adding a 15th NHLer. Signing Stewart (or any similar-level forward) forces you to put Reinhart in the minors and means a pair of veteran NHL forwards will be sitting out. No cap-era NHL team has 3rd-liners in the press box. If we sign another NHL forward it will be because McCormick is injured, or to free up an asset to trade for a defence man. Where you see "good" I see "not good enough" and I don't want to see any of the "emergency call-ups" in a Sabres uniform this season. That would be a disaster. I look at the pool of 3rd and 4th liners and see a need to add talent there. Gionta and Legwand are older players and not likely to give you full seasons, McGinn is on the NHL bubble, Reinhart and Larson are question marks and McCormick and Delauriers are true fourth-liners. The only player you listed I see playing top six minutes is Foligno. The Sabres will need more than that to make the playoffs. I agree the Sabres have a much better pool of forwards than have had in years. It's time to look to this season and look at these forwards and gauge how far they can take the Sabres. As I said, the roster looks good on July 4th, as soon as players start to drop the lack of quality depth will be apparent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Where you see "good" I see "not good enough" and I don't want to see any of the "emergency call-ups" in a Sabres uniform this season. That would be a disaster. I look at the pool of 3rd and 4th liners and see a need to add talent there. Gionta and Legwand are older players and not likely to give you full seasons, McGinn is on the NHL bubble, Reinhart and Larson are question marks and McCormick and Delauriers are true fourth-liners. The only player you listed I see playing top six minutes is Foligno. The Sabres will need more than that to make the playoffs. I agree the Sabres have a much better pool of forwards than have had in years. It's time to look to this season and look at these forwards and gauge how far they can take the Sabres. As I said, the roster looks good on July 4th, as soon as players start to drop the lack of quality depth will be apparent. All teams have emergency call ups. You can't sign a guy like Stewart as an injury replacement. As captain, Gionta has to play third line winger and his play and leadership last year makes him deserving. The only forward this team needs is someone that would improve the top six and allow them more patience with Samson if he doesn't earn a spot. Stewart is not that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 I would like to say the Sabres were a much more competitive team when Gionta was in the line up. Not sure what it is he does but something about him in the lineup changed how we played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Where you see "good" I see "not good enough" and I don't want to see any of the "emergency call-ups" in a Sabres uniform this season. That would be a disaster. I look at the pool of 3rd and 4th liners and see a need to add talent there. Gionta and Legwand are older players and not likely to give you full seasons, McGinn is on the NHL bubble, Reinhart and Larson are question marks and McCormick and Delauriers are true fourth-liners. The only player you listed I see playing top six minutes is Foligno. The Sabres will need more than that to make the playoffs. I agree the Sabres have a much better pool of forwards than have had in years. It's time to look to this season and look at these forwards and gauge how far they can take the Sabres. As I said, the roster looks good on July 4th, as soon as players start to drop the lack of quality depth will be apparent. I think you are underestimating McGinn. McGinn, if healthy again, brings an edgy game. He's not the heavyweight Stewart is, but probably a better two way player. If he's on his game, Buffalo will love him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Where you see "good" I see "not good enough" and I don't want to see any of the "emergency call-ups" in a Sabres uniform this season. That would be a disaster. I look at the pool of 3rd and 4th liners and see a need to add talent there. Gionta and Legwand are older players and not likely to give you full seasons, McGinn is on the NHL bubble, Reinhart and Larson are question marks and McCormick and Delauriers are true fourth-liners. The only player you listed I see playing top six minutes is Foligno. The Sabres will need more than that to make the playoffs. I agree the Sabres have a much better pool of forwards than have had in years. It's time to look to this season and look at these forwards and gauge how far they can take the Sabres. As I said, the roster looks good on July 4th, as soon as players start to drop the lack of quality depth will be apparent. You see a need to add talent on the third or fourth line, but Stewart has no place there. He doesn't play defensively so he can't fit on checking line and he's not actually physical, despite his size, so the 4th is out too. And everybody in our top-6 is better than this. He has no place in this team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 You see a need to add talent on the third or fourth line, but Stewart has no place there. He doesn't play defensively so he can't fit on checking line and he's not actually physical, despite his size, so the 4th is out too. And everybody in our top-6 is better than this. He has no place in this team. You have to keep in mind what is available. Stewart is unsigned still for a reason. I look over the remaining fee agents and don't much as far as alternative options. Stewart should be cheap, had for a short term deal and is familiar with the franchise. IMO, the dreams of Stewart being a top six power forward are gone. That said, I think many are underestimating his game, especially compared to some of the names currently on the Sabers roster or thought to be on the roster at the start of the upcoming season. If not Stewart, who? Am I the only one looking at this bottom six and thinking this won't be good enough to make the playoffs with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 (edited) You have to keep in mind what is available. Stewart is unsigned still for a reason. I look over the remaining fee agents and don't much as far as alternative options. Stewart should be cheap, had for a short term deal and is familiar with the franchise. IMO, the dreams of Stewart being a top six power forward are gone. That said, I think many are underestimating his game, especially compared to some of the names currently on the Sabers roster or thought to be on the roster at the start of the upcoming season. If not Stewart, who? Am I the only one looking at this bottom six and thinking this won't be good enough to make the playoffs with? Larsson, Foligno, Girgensons, Gionta, McGinn, Deslauriers, McCormick and Reinhart (calm down Liger, I mean as a rookie) are all quality players in a bottom six role. Even with injuries there's parts to spare there. The bottom 6 is absolutely not going to prevent a playoff birth--those are driven by the top-6 forwards, top-4 defenseman, and goaltending. We have serious question marks at 2/3 of those key areas...if we miss the playoffs, it won't be because we didn't add Chris Stewart or equivalent to our bottom-6. Edit: oh hey I forgot Legwand. There's another bottom-6 guy. Edited July 5, 2015 by TrueBluePhD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Larsson, Foligno, Girgensons, Gionta, McGinn, Deslauriers, McCormick and Reinhart (calm down Liger, I mean as a rookie) are all quality players in a bottom six role. Even with injuries there's parts to spare there. The bottom 6 is absolutely not going to prevent a playoff birth--those are driven by the top-6 forwards, top-4 defenseman, and goaltending. We have serious question marks at 2/3 of those key areas...if we miss the playoffs, it won't be because we didn't add Chris Stewart or equivalent to our bottom-6. Edit: oh hey I forgot Legwand. There's another bottom-6 guy. I'm seeing a lot of names listed, I have serious concerns about the quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny DangerFace Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 I would definitly want to add a bottom 6 player if we want to be a contender, but the price/contract has to be right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 I'm seeing a lot of names listed, I have serious concerns about the quality. I think you're either seriously underestimating who we have or overrating the depth players on a contender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 I think you're either seriously underestimating who we have or overrating the depth players on a contender. I agree. Not only do I believe the bottom six quality is good enough, I believe it could end up being one of the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 (edited) I'm seeing a lot of names listed, I have serious concerns about the quality. True, but adding top 6 guys is the key and the current group of bottom six played top six minutes for Sabres last year, so this is an improvement. Not saying Sabres are contenders yet, you? Or just tired of bottom six finishes? Maybe some of them, especially young guys step up, maybe some are trade bait for picks that Murray uses to overspend but get a top six guy, either way accumulating all these guys is good thing imo till further notice. Edited July 5, 2015 by North Buffalo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 I don't think we are adding anymore forwards to the bottom 6 unless we ship someone else out. We already have the necessary numbers. As for Chris Stewart, I would rather have Gionta on the 3rd line that Stewart in all honesty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 All I know is our bottom six were our top six a few months ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 @reporterchris: Nazem Kadri's one-year extension with #leafs is worth $4.1M. @LeafsPR: The @MapleLeafs announced today that the club has signed forward Nazem Kadri to a one-year contract extension. #TMLTalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 I don't think we are adding anymore forwards to the bottom 6 unless we ship someone else out. We already have the necessary numbers. As for Chris Stewart, I would rather have Gionta on the 3rd line that Stewart in all honesty. Chris Stewart would do one thing, however. He would keep things polite out there with rookies on the ice. But right now I think Defense is a much higher priority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 Chris Stewart would do one thing, however. He would keep things polite out there with rookies on the ice. But right now I think Defense is a much higher priority. In our bottom six there is enough sandpaper that whatever toughness Stewart brings is superfluous. Also the kids need to learn to fend for themselves, they won't be protected every step of the way no matter what we do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 @pham1717: The Sabres' Phil Varone has elected to go to salary arbitration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoPre Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 @pham1717: The Sabres' Phil Varone has elected to go to salary arbitration. And Murray shrugs his shoulders and says I don't give a f***. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 (edited) Isn't it great that we're not looking for a one dimensional policeman to add grit and toughness? I like John Scott. He's a good man who made a living playing a role several teams needed to fill. With 14 forwards, though, his one dimension left us short in so many ways when he had to dress. Bylsma will have the luxury of team toughness without having to forfeit ability. I don't hear "they're soft" when mentally eavesdropping on opponents game planning. I also don't hear "don't let Scott be a factor and there's not enough skill to hurt us" coming from other teams. Our dialogue is around the bottom six and skills. Two steps forward. All of this from a "we want Ray" chanter for years. The game's changed, and so have I. GMTM > DR. 14 > 13+1. Edited July 5, 2015 by Neo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 @reporterchris: Nazem Kadri's one-year extension with #leafs is worth $4.1M. @LeafsPR: The @MapleLeafs announced today that the club has signed forward Nazem Kadri to a one-year contract extension. #TMLTalk I like Kadri, figured they'd want him inked for longer than one year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnRobertEichel Posted July 5, 2015 Report Share Posted July 5, 2015 I agree. Not only do I believe the bottom six quality is good enough, I believe it could end up being one of the best. I think Girgensons, for one, is being underestimated here. His ceiling is as a top 6 forward, and I believe he has the work ethic and hockey smarts to reach that ceiling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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