Better call Saul

[Taro T]

Chuck may have acted in a two-faced manner with Jimmy, but that isn't "sabotaging" Jimmy's legal career.  Jimmy was at all times free to build a legal career -- just not at Chuck's firm.

 

(OTOH, Jimmy forging documents to harm Chuck's client and cause Chuck to lose the client absolutely was "sabotage.")

 

Jimmy's working hard to get his law degree and Kim's exile have nothing to do with any alleged sabotage -- not sure how those are relevant.

 

Is Chuck a tight-ass?  Should he treat Jimmy with more kindness and familial affection?  Absolutely.  But protecting HHR from his destructive little brother, isn't the same as "sabotaging" Jimmy -- even if the effects of protecting HHR were detrimental to Jimmy.

 

We all know guys like Jimmy -- i.e. guys who are loyal and whose hearts are usually in the right place, but who continually screw things up for themselves AND for the people around them.  They are the guys who crack wise to the cop who's pulled over the car with everyone out for a night on the town, resulting in everyone getting arrested, or the guys who shoplift, also resulting in everyone getting arrested, or the guys who start a fight at a party held by a rival school, resulting in beatdowns/arrests, etc.  They're fun, and they'll get out of bed in the middle of a snowy night to pick you up if your car breaks down -- but they'll also keep taking risks with your assets, and you'll end up worse off, and they never learn.

"Sabotage" is probably (well, not probably, it is) too strong a word. But Chuck flat out doesn't want Jimmy practicing law and has taken active (though often, behind the scenes) steps to retard his progress in the field.

[PASabreFan]

nfreeman's rant seems oddly specific. :P

[nfreeman]

You should review episode 9 from last year. 

 

Chuck has sympathetic qualities, but he's a flawed person. Nothing about him makes me want to snuggle in his space blanket. I seriously doubt Gilligan seeks to portray him as a paragon of virtue. He just isn't. 

 

Definitely.  Borderline nutcase.  And I think you're right that the audience is meant to like Jimmy more than Chuck.  I just take issue with the "Jimmy's good/Chuck is bad" theme that has sprung up around here.

 

"Sabotage" is probably (well, not probably, it is) too strong a word. But Chuck flat out doesn't want Jimmy practicing law and has taken active (though often, behind the scenes) steps to retard his progress in the field.

 

I agree that Chuck doesn't think Jimmy should be practicing law, but not that he's taken steps designed to retard his progress.  Although keeping Jimmy out of HHM undoubtedly had the effect of retarding his progress, that, IMHO, was not Chuck's purpose in doing so -- his purpose was to protect HHM.

 

What other affirmative steps has Chuck taken to retard Jimmy's progress?

 

nfreeman's rant seems oddly specific. :P

 

Let's just say what happens in the NF casino...

[inkman]

Definitely. Borderline nutcase.

If chuck is borderline, I'm batshit. He wears space blankets!!

[nfreeman]

If chuck is borderline, I'm ###### batshit. He wears space blankets!!

 

We've all got our issues.

 

For example, I am no longer capable of walking anywhere alone for more than 2 minutes unless I am listening to a podcast.

[PASabreFan]

I think when the older, role model brother lawyer says, "You're not a real lawyer," that could be construed as an attempt to retard the younger brother's progress in the profession. Pretty devastating.

[K-9]

I think when the older, role model brother lawyer says, "You're not a real lawyer," that could be construed as an attempt to retard the younger brother's progress in the profession. Pretty devastating.

Absolutely. There is no denying that Jimmy, based on the early and middle episodes last year, really made a sincere attempt to leave slippin' Jimmy in the past. He worked hard, didn't cut corners, and earned it. Much of which had to do for the sole purpose of gaining Chuck's approval; there was nothing more important to Jimmy than that. Chuck's deliberate and sneaky manipulations behind the scenes with Howard to deny Jimmy the position at HHN, especially after bringing in Sandpiper, and Chuck's subsequent admission to Jimmy of that fact, was enough to convince Jimmy that no matter what he did, no matter how hard he toed the proper line of conduct, it was never gonna be enough. And even after all that, he gave Main and Davis a try. 

 

From a literary standpoint, Jimmy at least has the courage to face and accept who and what he is. That is more than I can say for Chuck and his cowardly, duplicitous attempts to continually undermine Jimmy's better efforts in the past. 

[PASabreFan]

Season one, Jimmy, pounding on Tuco Salamanca's door: "Open up, officer of the court! Open up in the name of the law!"

 

Season two, Chuck, to Lance the late night copy boy: "Son, listen carefully. I am an officer of the court, investigating a felony."

[qwksndmonster]

We've all got our issues.

 

For example, I am no longer capable of walking anywhere alone for more than 2 minutes unless I am listening to a podcast.

I'm with you.

 

Man oh man am I sad that I've been behind.  I'm finally caught up and ready to dive into this with you guys.  Excellent stuff in here.

 

I see things much more like PA than freeman.  I think that Chuck's treatment of Jimmy so far in the show has been pretty on the nose.  He's been incredibly quick to suss out every single mistake/questionable maneuver that Jimmy makes... almost like he's obsessively waiting for Jimmy to screw up.  The problem with Freeman's argument is that Chuck has been treating Jimmy like this for his entire life.  Jimmy left Marco and Cicero to try and fix his life. Chuck's wake up call from the prison flashback in season 1 worked and he set his brother on the right path.  The problem is that the gesture wasn't enough.  Chuck couldn't actually find it in his heart to help his brother succeed, he's too jealous of Jimmy's ability to make people like him. No matter how much Jimmy sacrificed his own happiness to take care of him, Chuck was only ever worried about himself.  He's a very prideful man and it still hurt to see him be humiliated in front of his peers.  But watching him squirm after Kim's smackdown?  Justice.

 

Karma is indeed a bitch, never stab your brother in the back.  Chuck deserved the legal ######ery that Jimmy unleashed upon him.  Kim, however doesn't deserve any of it.

_____________________________

 

I love the way episode 9 capitalized on locations/set pieces established in episode 8.  The ~5:30 minute teaser featuring a truck driver crossing the boarder, eating a popsicle, and picking up a gun left me puzzled. Episode 8 continued with a lot of Mike sitting in his car scenes. The much more succinct conclusion was all the payoff I could've ever asked for.  

 

Mike is a force of nature.  Watching him work is a thing of beauty. I loved the shot where the truck was in between him and his car, trapped.  Mike's ruses are always so simple: draw the eye that way, then come from this way.  There's an elegant simplicity in it all. It was extra fun hearing him tell Nacho that 'you guys aren't anywhere near as smart as you think you are.'  Of course his master plan went awry and he would've been better off killing the guy.  The first time he was able to take the beating and think of it as punishment for corrupting his son,  this time an innocent civilian (a good samaritan, even) bit it instead of the truck driver who's in the game.  I love the way they're slowly pushing Mike down the path toward becoming Gus's #2.

 

The two teasers working together reminded me of episodes 4 and 6 of season 4 of breaking bad.  The first one featured Mike waiting in the back of a Pollos Hermanos truck and easily dispatching 2 would be robbers.  The second one featured two random Gus employees getting killed by Cartel induced asphyxiation.

 

Speaking of which, I guess Gus didn't build his distribution all alone.  I think Mike takes a lesson from the cartel and gives Gus the idea to move his product in refrigerated food trucks.  Maybe, I think we'll find out either way.

 

-----------------------------------------

 

The other thing that episode 9 paid off was the dual offices.  The scene where Kim gets the call from Mesa Verde broke my heart.  Jimmy was in Kim's side painting the walls red (hah), then he had to feign excitement for Kim.  He's coloring her professional world and keeping her in the dark.  He's in her office, trying to solve her problems instead of taking care of his own career.  That said...

 

 The guy can't even celebrate earnestly with his girlfriend. He's built himself another layer of separation through yet another lie. "You and Mesa Verde were meant for one another.  All is right with the world."  He still has to sell even in their bedroom at night.  His tomfoolery has leaked out into every other part of his life.  It's so sad to see everything Jimmy and Kim go through, because we know how finite it all is.  Every time Kim accepts who Jimmy is yet again, it adds another helping of tragedy.

 

 

 

I've cried a lot of times in season 2 so far, but no emotion compares to the exhilaration I felt when Kim layed the Smackdown of Truth on Chuck.  The finale of Breaking Bad featured the completion of Walt's arc in one line:  "I did it for me.  I liked it, I was good at it.  And I was really...  I was alive." After years of watching this man lie to himself over and over and over again he finally understands his own motivation. It was a similar, yet potently different feeling to have Kim smack Chuck upside the head with the blunt truth of his motivations.  Chuck is so proud that he couldn't even believe it himself how jealous he is of Jimmy. 

 

------

 

Another thing:  The couple walking down the street holding hands in the reflection of the diner window while Mike is shrouded behind the window shades. I love that as an illustration of Mike's separation from that world.  There's no possibility for that kind of love in his life, he's just trying to provide for his DIL and granddaughter.  It reminded me of the money heist from season 1: Mike outside alone.  Spying on a family as they play games and enjoy the company of one another.

Season one, Jimmy, pounding on Tuco Salamanca's door: "Open up, officer of the court! Open up in the name of the law!"

 

Season two, Chuck, to Lance the late night copy boy: "Son, listen carefully. I am an officer of the court, investigating a felony."

Dweeeeeeeeeeebs

Edited April 15, 2016 by qwksndmonster

[jsb]

I've been staying away from this topic because I haven't watched the last episode until last night. Great show, great discussion.

Jimmy's a good guy who can't keep right, Chuck is basically a good guy who's a vindictive pr!ck to Jimmy. There was a point where Chuck could have rehabilitated Jimmy with some mentoring but he betrayed his brother because of jealousy. Which then pushed Jimmy back into his old ways.

 

Kim is torn because at heart she knows she worked from the bottom up to get where she's at and she feels allegiance to Jimmy because he appears to have done the same thing. Torn as to how this will eventually go bad.

 

Mike is a bad MFr but he's put his D-inlaw and granddaughter in harms way because the truck driver seen his car. Which will eventually lead Mike to be the chickenman's #2..... The show is a great follow up to BB. Probably the best sequel/prequel tv series since Cheers/Frasier.

[K-9]

I'm with you.

 

Man oh man am I sad that I've been behind.  I'm finally caught up and ready to dive into this with you guys.  Excellent stuff in here.

 

I see things much more like PA than freeman.  I think that Chuck's treatment of Jimmy so far in the show has been pretty on the nose.  He's been incredibly quick to suss out every single mistake/questionable maneuver that Jimmy makes... almost like he's obsessively waiting for Jimmy to screw up.  The problem with Freeman's argument is that Chuck has been treating Jimmy like this for his entire life.  Jimmy left Marco and Cicero to try and fix his life. Chuck's wake up call from the prison flashback in season 1 worked and he set his brother on the right path.  The problem is that the gesture wasn't enough.  Chuck couldn't actually find it in his heart to help his brother succeed, he's too jealous of Jimmy's ability to make people like him. No matter how much Jimmy sacrificed his own happiness to take care of him, Chuck was only ever worried about himself.  He's a very prideful man and it still hurt to see him be humiliated in front of his peers.  But watching him squirm after Kim's smackdown?  Justice.

 

Karma is indeed a bitch, never stab your brother in the back.  Chuck deserved the legal ######ery that Jimmy unleashed upon him.  Kim, however doesn't deserve any of it.

_____________________________

 

I love the way episode 9 capitalized on locations/set pieces established in episode 8.  The ~5:30 minute teaser featuring a truck driver crossing the boarder, eating a popsicle, and picking up a gun left me puzzled. Episode 8 continued with a lot of Mike sitting in his car scenes. The much more succinct conclusion was all the payoff I could've ever asked for.  

 

Mike is a force of nature.  Watching him work is a thing of beauty. I loved the shot where the truck was in between him and his car, trapped.  Mike's ruses are always so simple: draw the eye that way, then come from this way.  There's an elegant simplicity in it all. It was extra fun hearing him tell Nacho that 'you guys aren't anywhere near as smart as you think you are.'  Of course his master plan went awry and he would've been better off killing the guy.  The first time he was able to take the beating and think of it as punishment for corrupting his son,  this time an innocent civilian (a good samaritan, even) bit it instead of the truck driver who's in the game.  I love the way they're slowly pushing Mike down the path toward becoming Gus's #2.

 

The two teasers working together reminded me of episodes 4 and 6 of season 4 of breaking bad.  The first one featured Mike waiting in the back of a Pollos Hermanos truck and easily dispatching 2 would be robbers.  The second one featured two random Gus employees getting killed by Cartel induced asphyxiation.

 

Speaking of which, I guess Gus didn't build his distribution all alone.  I think Mike takes a lesson from the cartel and gives Gus the idea to move his product in refrigerated food trucks.  Maybe, I think we'll find out either way.

 

-----------------------------------------

 

The other thing that episode 9 paid off was the dual offices.  The scene where Kim gets the call from Mesa Verde broke my heart.  Jimmy was in Kim's side painting the walls red (hah), then he had to feign excitement for Kim.  He's coloring her professional world and keeping her in the dark.  He's in her office, trying to solve her problems instead of taking care of his own career.  That said...

 

 The guy can't even celebrate earnestly with his girlfriend. He's built himself another layer of separation through yet another lie. "You and Mesa Verde were meant for one another.  All is right with the world."  He still has to sell even in their bedroom at night.  His tomfoolery has leaked out into every other part of his life.  It's so sad to see everything Jimmy and Kim go through, because we know how finite it all is.  Every time Kim accepts who Jimmy is yet again, it adds another helping of tragedy.

 

 

 

I've cried a lot of times in season 2 so far, but no emotion compares to the exhilaration I felt when Kim layed the Smackdown of Truth on Chuck.  The finale of Breaking Bad featured the completion of Walt's arc in one line:  "I did it for me.  I liked it, I was good at it.  And I was really...  I was alive." After years of watching this man lie to himself over and over and over again he finally understands his own motivation. It was a similar, yet potently different feeling to have Kim smack Chuck upside the head with the blunt truth of his motivations.  Chuck is so proud that he couldn't even believe it himself how jealous he is of Jimmy. 

 

------

 

Another thing:  The couple walking down the street holding hands in the reflection of the diner window while Mike is shrouded behind the window shades. I love that as an illustration of Mike's separation from that world.  There's no possibility for that kind of love in his life, he's just trying to provide for his DIL and granddaughter.  It reminded me of the money heist from season 1: Mike outside alone.  Spying on a family as they play games and enjoy the company of one another.

Dweeeeeeeeeeebs

Great food for thought as always, qwk. What do you make of Mike buying a round for the bar? 

[qwksndmonster]

I haven't thought about it very hard, but on first watch: Mike buying a round for the bar was him wanting to connect with people, any people. He was also drinking himself, which we haven't seen him do since the season 1. "It feels like I crawled out from the bottom of a bottle and I'm working hard to stay there."

 

We just never see Mike like that. He might've even been giddy from ripping off the Cartel. I think Mike loved it, even though he later found out about the innocent casualty. Mike has something in common with Jimmy: "I just thought criminals would be smarter. It breaks my heart a little."

 

I want to see them back together. I can't wait.

Edited April 15, 2016 by qwksndmonster

[PASabreFan]

I haven't thought about it very hard, but on first watch: Mike buying a round for the bar was him wanting to connect with people, any people. He was also drinking himself, which we haven't seen him do since the season 1. "It feels like I crawled out from the bottom of a bottle and I'm working hard to stay there."

 

We just never see Mike like that. He might've even been giddy from ripping off the Cartel. I think Mike loved it, even though he later found out about the innocent casualty. Mike has something in common with Jimmy: "I just thought criminals would be smarter. It breaks my heart a little."

 

I want to see them back together. I can't wait.

Turns out Mike isn't as smart as he thought he was, to use his words to Nacho against him. Mike and Jimmy are starting to get what's coming to them, but neither will be able to realize it, or if they realize it, won't be able to extricate themselves from their situations.

 

I liked the complementary scenes of Mike letting his guard down in the bar, and Jimmy reveling in the success of his plot after Kim took the call from Mesa Verde. As sometimes happens in life, just when you think everything is hunky dory, there's something right around the corner to bring you back to earth.

[qwksndmonster]

Another thing I loved about the Smackdown of Truth was Kim's response to Jimmy asking her to ground herself.  Despite Jimmy basically engaging in open lawyer warfare, he still loves Chuck and looks up to him.  Meanwhile Kim, who has observed their sibling dynamic from a position of clarity (ie not being a part of it) has no idea why Jimmy's still so worried about Chuck.  The patronizing way she grounded herself was a perfect scene entrance.  I love Kim, I love Kim, I love Kim.

Turns out Mike isn't as smart as he thought he was, to use his words to Nacho against him. Mike and Jimmy are starting to get what's coming to them, but neither will be able to realize it, or if they realize it, won't be able to extricate themselves from their situations.

 

I liked the complementary scenes of Mike letting his guard down in the bar, and Jimmy reveling in the success of his plot after Kim took the call from Mesa Verde. As sometimes happens in life, just when you think everything is hunky dory, there's something right around the corner to bring you back to earth.

I don't know how much Mike is getting what's coming to him.  He kinda already seems beaten down by the world.  I guess his further development as a hitman is a punishment in and of itself, considering he still obviously cares for basic human life.

Great minds think alike K-9, I was actually considering changing my avatar to that exact shot.  I'll figure out some way to get Matt Moulson's useless eyebrows out of here.

[K-9]

Yeah, that picture says a ton about our gullibility as a society and everyone that preys upon it. If I could attach a syrupy Sam Elliot voice over, I would.

[Norcal]

Mike is a bad MFr but he's put his D-inlaw and granddaughter in harms way because the truck driver seen his car. Which will eventually lead Mike to be the chickenman's #2..... The show is a great follow up to BB. Probably the best sequel/prequel tv series since Cheers/Frasier.

The car wasn't Mikes, I was thinking that during the scene till they showed it up close, it's a blue beater

[qwksndmonster]

The car wasn't Mikes, I was thinking that during the scene till they showed it up close, it's a blue beater

You're absolutely right. For some reason I thought he painted his own car blue.  :doh:

[jsb]

The car wasn't Mikes, I was thinking that during the scene till they showed it up close, it's a blue beater

Well you just obliterated my theory on this. Still a great show, nice catch by the way. 

[qwksndmonster]

Everything he's ever said about his brother is completely true.  And he didn't "screw" him in season 1 -- he just didn't want him working for the law firm that he built.  Would you?  When they were younger, Jimmy literally stole from his own father's business until he had to close it.  If you built a hugely successful business from the ground up, would you want this person working with you?  Especially when they share your last name and reputation is nearly everything in law firms?

To the bolded: That's what I love about Chuck's character: no matter how screwed up his motivations may be, he always speaks the truth.

 

I believe that Chuck screwed Jimmy in season 1.  As someone else pointed out, it's not just that Chuck doesn't want Jimmy at HHM, it's that he doesn't want Jimmy practicing law PERIOD.  This is extra sad because I believe Jimmy's strongest motivation for becoming a lawyer was that he looked up to and loved his big brother.  He obviously preferred to use his talents in other ways back in Cicero, but once Chuck bailed him out Jimmy really seemed committed to becoming legit.

 

 

And he didn't screw him in season 2.  He won the Mesa Verde business back fair and square with a final pitch that was dead on accurate about what HHM could bring that a new, 1-person firm couldn't.  And he went to the copy store to clear him name after the worst humiliation of his career (thanks to Jimmy's forgery).  He wasn't trying to destroy his brother; he was trying to undo the criminal damage that was done to him.

Yep, this is also all true. That's what makes Chuck's noggin knock extra tragic.  But I think you are ignoring Chuck's motivation behind giving that amazing pitch: He didn't want Jimmy (and by extension, Kim) to succeed. He put himself in physical duress to go the extra mile on this case.  This isn't just Chuck trying to beat his illness, go back to work, and reclaim autonomy; this is Chuck dealing with his problems in the wrong way.

 

I've come to understand his affliction as a psychosomatic sensitivity to electromagnetism.  The trigger is a combination of his lack of ability to connect with other human beings, his jealousy over Jimmy's ability, his immense pride, and his lack of self awareness.  When he left the house without thinking about it in season 1 episode 8, Chuck was happy working on the Sandpiper case with Jimmy.  His little Hamlin-is-bad ruse was still in tact and he didn't have to confront his feelings about Jimmy.  As soon as Jimmy got Chuck's attention, his brain realized what was happening.  The return of the sensitivity happened to directly coincide with Jimmy returning his focus.

 

When Chuck went outside to call Hamlin and tell him not to hire Jimmy, he had to endure that pain to keep locking Jimmy out.

 

 

 

Chuck has had to bail Jimmy out his entire life (literally in some cases).  He tried to give him honest work at his company but also tried to keep him at arm's length, and it still blew up in his face.  He's not perfect by any stretch but he's a far more sympathetic character than Jimmy.

It's amazing how differently we perceive this show.  The writing is incredible.

 

 

_________________________________________________

 

So how much of Chuck's hating on Jimmy is self-loathing for not being there for his dad? He blamed Jimmy for robbing the old man blind, but Jimmy didn't start out planning to scam his dad. He just got sick of seeing others scam him. Might as well keep the money in the family - dad was going to give it to some hustler, why not him?

I never made this connection.  I knew that Jimmy grew to despise his father's naivete, but the fact that he stole 8 dollars exactly supports your observation.  

 

I think Chuck's got a lot of wolf in him too. Honestly, though, I didn't need another piece of fiction with the sheep/wolf thing.  Why not Snakes and Gerbils?

 

 

 

Was really impressed w/ the nuance Gilligan brought to that back story and the inability of Chuck to see (recognize?) that nuance.

Tom Schnauz actually wrote and directed the flashback scene (it was originally broken by all the writers: Vince, Thomas Schnauz (my favorite guy), Gordon Smith, Peter Gould, Gennifer Hudson, and Bradley Paul (no idea who this guy is)).  It was originally intended to be the teaser of episode 9 of season 1, but they had to cut it for time.  I would've loved to have seen it in that order, but I'm still happy we got it at all. 

Edited April 16, 2016 by qwksndmonster

[inkman]

He's not perfect by any stretch but he's a far more sympathetic character than Jimmy.

We must have taken distinctly different paths in life. For Christ Sakes sometimes I feel like I am jimmy.

[qwksndmonster]

If Chuck is dead, it is going to destroy Jimmy,.

[qwksndmonster]

We all know guys like Jimmy -- i.e. guys who are loyal and whose hearts are usually in the right place, but who continually screw things up for themselves AND for the people around them.  They are the guys who crack wise to the cop who's pulled over the car with everyone out for a night on the town, resulting in everyone getting arrested, or the guys who shoplift, also resulting in everyone getting arrested, or the guys who start a fight at a party held by a rival school, resulting in beatdowns/arrests, etc.  They're fun, and they'll get out of bed in the middle of a snowy night to pick you up if your car breaks down -- but they'll also keep taking risks with your assets, and you'll end up worse off, and they never learn.

This is a very hyperbolic description of Jimmy McGill. He's definitely got some self destructive tendencies and actively seeks out trouble, running scams and committing crimes. But he's not getting a bunch of unwitting participants caught in the crossfire. And Jimmy is not just loyal, he has a reflex to help anybody in a vulnerable position.

 

Jimmy might very well ruin Kim's career with his corner cutting, and that's more tragic than anything else. Kim knows who Jimmy is.  Kim even has a side to her that loves the thrill of the con.

[nfreeman]

This is a very hyperbolic description of Jimmy McGill. He's definitely got some self destructive tendencies and actively seeks out trouble, running scams and committing crimes. But he's not getting a bunch of unwitting participants caught in the crossfire. And Jimmy is not just loyal, he has a reflex to help anybody in a vulnerable position.

 

Jimmy might very well ruin Kim's career with his corner cutting, and that's more tragic than anything else. Kim knows who Jimmy is.  Kim even has a side to her that loves the thrill of the con.

 

Well, I don't see how you can call the examples I gave (minor arrest, fight, etc.) hyperbolic, especially when you consider what he actually did -- cost his dad and the rest of his family the store -- and what you and I both think is going to happen with Kim.

[qwksndmonster]

Well, I don't see how you can call the examples I gave (minor arrest, fight, etc.) hyperbolic, especially when you consider what he actually did -- cost his dad and the rest of his family the store -- and what you and I both think is going to happen with Kim.

Did he really cost his family the store?  That's Chuck's version.  Jimmy assuredly contributed to the store closing, but we don't know the whole story.  And stealing from the family store is significantly different than your examples. It might even be worse, but all of your examples sound to me like more foolhardy mistakes that a different kind of person would make.

[PASabreFan]

There must be a lot of thought put into naming these episodes. "Nailed" pretty much, uhhhh, nailed it.

 

I wonder if Mike has been leaving some big tips for the waitress? The flirty banter was quite odd. He can shovel her driveway anytime? Mike? Really? I am guessing he put down a hundred one day. (But not sure about the timeline of the road heist and his breakfast.)