LGR4GM Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 He's not as think as you drunk he is. EXACTLY! I am evaluating players like this: Can they go to a lower league with no penalty (contract years, waivers, other)? Will they make a big enough impact now to make this team a playoff team? In an ideal world where should the player be playing? Where are they projected to be in 3 years talent wise? What is the best way for them to reach that talent ceiling and maintain it? Zadorov can go down with no penalty. He will not make us a playoff team. In an ideal world we have 6 NHL defenders on the roster so he doesn't have to be here. In 3 years if properly groomed he could be a legitimate 3/4 guy working his way up to the #1 guy if not better. The best way for him to reach his ceiling is being exposed to tons of minutes and situations which can currently only happen in Juniors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 Yup still a mistake for this team with this situation. Zadorov should be in London. What does Zadorov gain from playing against puny little babies? How does this organization begin to assess his development if he's not being measured up against the proper metric? You play Zadorov now, burn a year of his ELC, let him develop chemistry with a D corps that appears to be pretty set, and let him learn the NHL game in the only place he can. And then you sign him for eight years because you've been able to properly evaluate him. Personally, I don't want him playing any kind of sheltered minutes. Play him on the first line. Let him battle. Let him get 25 minutes a game. Evaluate him in adverse situations and see if he rises to the occasion. Sending him to London serves no purpose to him, the team, or the Sabres management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 What does Zadorov gain from playing against puny little babies? How does this organization begin to assess his development if he's not being measured up against the proper metric? You play Zadorov now, burn a year of his ELC, let him develop chemistry with a D corps that appears to be pretty set, and let him learn the NHL game in the only place he can. And then you sign him for eight years because you've been able to properly evaluate him. Personally, I don't want him playing any kind of sheltered minutes. Play him on the first line. Let him battle. Let him get 25 minutes a game. Evaluate him in adverse situations and see if he rises to the occasion. Sending him to London serves no purpose to him, the team, or the Sabres management. If they were going to do this or something close to this I would be much more amenable to him being in Buffalo all season but they won't because he isn't ready for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 EXACTLY! I am evaluating players like this: Can they go to a lower league with no penalty (contract years, waivers, other)? Will they make a big enough impact now to make this team a playoff team? In an ideal world where should the player be playing? Where are they projected to be in 3 years talent wise? What is the best way for them to reach that talent ceiling and maintain it? Zadorov can go down with no penalty. He will not make us a playoff team. In an ideal world we have 6 NHL defenders on the roster so he doesn't have to be here. In 3 years if properly groomed he could be a legitimate 3/4 guy working his way up to the #1 guy if not better. The best way for him to reach his ceiling is being exposed to tons of minutes and situations which can currently only happen in Juniors. You do realize he's now getting 20 minutes a game even strength, powerplay, and penalty killing, right?. Which situations are you concerned he won't see? He's learning in the highest level classroom and seems to be an excellent student. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 I give up. You guys can have it your way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 I give up. You guys can have it your way. LOfreakingL What do you expect? You want him to play in all situations. He is. You want him to play against top lines. He is. You want him to get plenty of minutes. He is. You want him to play late in games. He is. At some point you need to shape your argument to account for what he isn't getting if you want your argument to make sense. If at some point he stops seeing minutes and stops seeing important on ice situations then your argument holds water. But you can't make that argument until he is actually being held back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 If they were going to do this or something close to this I would be much more amenable to him being in Buffalo all season but they won't because he isn't ready for it. HE STARTED THE FRICKEN GAME LAST NIGHT. The Sabres are using him as a top tier D man. Unless he starts looking lost, he's going to stick. Because he's good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 I give up. You guys can have it your way. Why do you think he'll learn more in juniors? it makes absolutely no sense considering how well he's been playing in the NHL. And why can't somebody bring up a counter point to one of your arguments without you sniffling and whining? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HopefulFuture Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 LGR4GM's objection is duly noted. Zadorov is here to stay, and IMHO, rightfully so. 18 or not, he learns nothing else in London. He belongs in the NHL where his over all skill set can focus on progressing. This kid, at 22/23 years old is going to be a stud, and it looks like he's bringing out the aggressiveness in Ristolainen as well. He's starting to play a more aggressive game it appears to me. Funny how successful play with a positive attitude and some leadership can be contagious, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnkirishone Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 I am with LGR4GM here. I think big Z is better served playing with London this year. I have no doubt that shortly after his tryout games are done teams will start to game plan him which will impact his game. Does anyone here think Rolston is going to let him ride out the rough patch eating up 20 minutes a game? more likely he will become a healthy scratch/6th D and get 4-6 minutes a game like happened to Mikhail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 I am with LGR4GM here. I think big Z is better served playing with London this year. I have no doubt that shortly after his tryout games are done teams will start to game plan him which will impact his game. Does anyone here think Rolston is going to let him ride out the rough patch eating up 20 minutes a game? more likely he will become a healthy scratch/6th D and get 4-6 minutes a game like happened to Mikhail Zadorov and Grigorenko are completely different situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnkirishone Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 Zadorov and Grigorenko are completely different situations. no they are not. both should have been sent back to their junior team. Mikhail was woefully misused once it became clear that teams would and could completely contain him. The same will happen to Zadorov. Teams will start targeting him defensively and guess who his D partner is? yep mister lost in translation Myers. So teams will start baiting big Z which in turn will cause Myers to try and cover up/make a play which then will have the effect of goals against and next thing you know big Z is in a suit up in the press box. The only major difference between them to me is Mikhail isn't a high effort guy and Zadorov is I think Zadarov will be the glue of this teams defense within a year or 2 but his place is in juniors where he will be put in a position to have success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 no they are not. both should have been sent back to their junior team. Mikhail was woefully misused once it became clear that teams would and could completely contain him. The same will happen to Zadorov. Teams will start targeting him defensively and guess who his D partner is? yep mister lost in translation Myers. So teams will start baiting big Z which in turn will cause Myers to try and cover up/make a play which then will have the effect of goals against and next thing you know big Z is in a suit up in the press box. The only major difference between them to me is Mikhail isn't a high effort guy and Zadorov is I think Zadarov will be the glue of this teams defense within a year or 2 but his place is in juniors where he will be put in a position to have success. The same WILL happen to Zadorov? I wish I could see the future. Lest we forget that the Grigorenko situation happened under a different coach and with a player that didn't show anything during his time here last year, and really hasn't shown a whole lot this year either. This is notably different from Zadorov who hasn't looked even remotely bothered by his situation. Completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnkirishone Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 The same WILL happen to Zadorov? I wish I could see the future. Lest we forget that the Grigorenko situation happened under a different coach and with a player that didn't show anything during his time here last year, and really hasn't shown a whole lot this year either. This is notably different from Zadorov who hasn't looked even remotely bothered by his situation. Completely different. O I am sorry i didnt realize Rolston treated Mikhail differently compared to the coach he replaced. Tell me again who his linemates where under rolston last year? Mikhail didn't look bad during his 9 game tryout last year. Didn't look good either but he wasn't bad. think I even made a comment that they should keep him up and give him his shot. I don't need to see the future to safely predict that teams will watch video on Nikita and in thous video sessions they will see tendencies and weaknesses in his game and these teams will attempt to exploit them. The best defenseman the Sabres have to help cover this up is probaly Pysyk a defenseman with a whopping 1 year experience as a pro. The most likely thing to happen is by the halfway point of the season Nikita will be getting bottom pairing minutes and time in the press box. If Rolston is forgiving of mistakes and continues to supply steady minutes that is one thing and a acceptable situation for keeping him on the team. More likely you will hear how players need to earn the ice time they get and that watching the game up in the box lets them see the game better........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 O I am sorry i didnt realize Rolston treated Mikhail differently compared to the coach he replaced. Tell me again who his linemates where under rolston last year? Mikhail didn't look bad during his 9 game tryout last year. Didn't look good either but he wasn't bad. think I even made a comment that they should keep him up and give him his shot. I don't need to see the future to safely predict that teams will watch video on Nikita and in thous video sessions they will see tendencies and weaknesses in his game and these teams will attempt to exploit them. The best defenseman the Sabres have to help cover this up is probaly Pysyk a defenseman with a whopping 1 year experience as a pro. The most likely thing to happen is by the halfway point of the season Nikita will be getting bottom pairing minutes and time in the press box. If Rolston is forgiving of mistakes and continues to supply steady minutes that is one thing and a acceptable situation for keeping him on the team. More likely you will hear how players need to earn the ice time they get and that watching the game up in the box lets them see the game better........ Do you care to point out specific examples of weaknesses in his game that need "covering up"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 O I am sorry i didnt realize Rolston treated Mikhail differently compared to the coach he replaced. Tell me again who his linemates where under rolston last year? Mikhail didn't look bad during his 9 game tryout last year. Didn't look good either but he wasn't bad. think I even made a comment that they should keep him up and give him his shot. I don't need to see the future to safely predict that teams will watch video on Nikita and in thous video sessions they will see tendencies and weaknesses in his game and these teams will attempt to exploit them. The best defenseman the Sabres have to help cover this up is probaly Pysyk a defenseman with a whopping 1 year experience as a pro. The most likely thing to happen is by the halfway point of the season Nikita will be getting bottom pairing minutes and time in the press box. If Rolston is forgiving of mistakes and continues to supply steady minutes that is one thing and a acceptable situation for keeping him on the team. More likely you will hear how players need to earn the ice time they get and that watching the game up in the box lets them see the game better........ Teams are going to pick apart Zadorov on tape next year just the same as they will this year. What's the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 I am with LGR4GM here. I think big Z is better served playing with London this year. I have no doubt that shortly after his tryout games are done teams will start to game plan him which will impact his game. Does anyone here think Rolston is going to let him ride out the rough patch eating up 20 minutes a game? more likely he will become a healthy scratch/6th D and get 4-6 minutes a game like happened to Mikhail Grigorenko didn't earn his spot last year. He was here because we had no other center options, not because he was ready. Zadorov is already in our top 5 on defense and we have options that go 8 deep. He's earned it. The situations are nowhere near the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 What does Zadorov gain from playing against puny little babies? A full stomach. #nikitaeatsbabies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 He plays 20 minutes a night, lays out veterans with 10 yrs experience with crushing body checks. wish we could send myers back to junior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsrcursed Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 O I am sorry i didnt realize Rolston treated Mikhail differently compared to the coach he replaced. Tell me again who his linemates where under rolston last year? Mikhail didn't look bad during his 9 game tryout last year. Didn't look good either but he wasn't bad. think I even made a comment that they should keep him up and give him his shot. I don't need to see the future to safely predict that teams will watch video on Nikita and in thous video sessions they will see tendencies and weaknesses in his game and these teams will attempt to exploit them. The best defenseman the Sabres have to help cover this up is probaly Pysyk a defenseman with a whopping 1 year experience as a pro. The most likely thing to happen is by the halfway point of the season Nikita will be getting bottom pairing minutes and time in the press box. If Rolston is forgiving of mistakes and continues to supply steady minutes that is one thing and a acceptable situation for keeping him on the team. More likely you will hear how players need to earn the ice time they get and that watching the game up in the box lets them see the game better........ Are you basing this assumption purely on Grig's situation, or are you always this fun at parties? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 What does Zadorov gain from playing against puny little babies? How does this organization begin to assess his development if he's not being measured up against the proper metric? You play Zadorov now, burn a year of his ELC, let him develop chemistry with a D corps that appears to be pretty set, and let him learn the NHL game in the only place he can. And then you sign him for eight years because you've been able to properly evaluate him. Personally, I don't want him playing any kind of sheltered minutes. Play him on the first line. Let him battle. Let him get 25 minutes a game. Evaluate him in adverse situations and see if he rises to the occasion. Sending him to London serves no purpose to him, the team, or the Sabres management. ^This. All of this. Especially the bold text. There is only one place he can learn to take his game to the next level. And that's AT the next level. GO SABRES!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnkirishone Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 He is a young aggressive D my guess is teams are going to give him chances to go for big hits that will pull him out of position. Couple times of getting burned will either make him gun shy or make the coach reduce his ice time. If the measuring stick for being ready is you are better then 3 other D on this roster then you got a bad measuring stick. The problem is not how he is playing now. the problem is there will be a drop in his play and that his ice time will drop with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDFan Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 He is a young aggressive D my guess is teams are going to give him chances to go for big hits that will pull him out of position. Couple times of getting burned will either make him gun shy or make the coach reduce his ice time. If the measuring stick for being ready is you are better then 3 other D on this roster then you got a bad measuring stick. The problem is not how he is playing now. the problem is there will be a drop in his play and that his ice time will drop with it I doubt that any player on this team, especially the young "future of the team" players like Zadarov will see their ice time drop for making mistakes as long as they are playing hard and learning. Rolston is already giving the kid PK and PP time. Its sink or swim right now. Winning is not the objective. From what I have seen, he belongs at this level. I do not doubt there will be rough patches, and perhaps some drop off as the season drags on, but that is going to happen even if they send him back now and bring him back next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 I doubt that any player on this team, especially the young "future of the team" players like Zadarov will see their ice time drop for making mistakes as long as they are playing hard and learning. Rolston is already giving the kid PK and PP time. Its sink or swim right now. Winning is not the objective. From what I have seen, he belongs at this level. I do not doubt there will be rough patches, and perhaps some drop off as the season drags on, but that is going to happen even if they send him back now and bring him back next year. Drop offs happen to EVERY player in EVERY sport EVERY season. Especially in sports where you are playing 80 plus games a season. The key is how those players respond to slumps. The great ones make adjustments and NEVER let it effect them mentally. They also find other ways to contribute during slumps. Letting all these kids play through their struggles is a necessary and very important part of their maturation process at the professional level. If anything, they are better served by the lowered expectations of management during this time. They won't be pressed as a result. The only pressure they'll feel is the pressure that comes from within. And managing that is the sign of a good pro. GO SABRES!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 Drnkirishone, let it go. There is no point arguing. I see pretty much what you see and I think that another year of Juniors where he can learn at a slower pace and fix the holes in his game would be good. This is one argument not worth having however. People care more about the now than the 3 years from now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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