GDT: 9th Dec. Habs visit. CBC, MSG-B, TVAS, SN360

[bunomatic]

The lack of a servicable PP to me is mind boggling. The players are taking the heat on this but they seem to be doing the same things that have gotten them no results. This is on ellis and a lack of confidence which can be fixed with a change in coaching. The coach obviously has no answers. If we continue to do the same things and get no results I have to think KA has his eyes on another shiny toy. 

[Doohickie]

4 hours ago, Norcal said:

Looked like embellishment to me on the 5 minute penalty on Robinson. 

The guy waited for the hit then threw himself into the boards imo.

 That play changed the whole game and I'm not inclined to blame Robinson for it.

 

As much as I'd like to agree with you, there was literally blood on the ice.

[PASabreFan]

2 hours ago, SwampD said:

It’s the difference between 5 and 2, IMO.

There's a meme I would use but nah. You are not right on this one. Robinson charged, hit from behind, boarded and injured an opponent. The puck has nothing to do with it.

[PASabreFan]

3 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Come on man. He practically stopped before he hit him and #50 is allowed to hit the man with the puck.  

The Hab did everything wrong. Everything you teach a kid about playing in a checking league this guy violated.  On top of that the guy froze and just stopped playing.  You don’t posses the puck for several seconds on the boards, then turn your back on the forecheck.   You take an angle to the puck and keep moving.  

The review  should have overturned the initial 5 minutes called, you could see no intent to injure, you see the hockey stop.  Instead they made it a game misconduct.  The guy wasn’t even injured  

Trash call.  Typical. 

Of course the Sabres being weak minded gave up 2 quickies.  

No doubt that the refs changed the entire flow of the game. 

No he did not 

The fact you have to grossly exaggerate the amount of time before the player got checked is telling. Robinson is allowed to check him, but within the rules.

For stuff like this I really dislike this board. I don't come here for homer takes. I would go sit in the 300s if I want to hear boos and see outstretched arms every time a Sabre is legally checked.

[Taro T]

15 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

According to Natural Stat Trick, the Sabres had 43 scoring chances including 21 high danger chances.  Expected goals 4.38.  Actual goals - 2.  Talk about lack of finish.  

Levi stood on his head at points this game.  He was the farthest thing from an issue tonight (although I think he'd like the 2nd Montreal goal back).  

This loss is on the forwards' lack of finish, including but not limited to the sucky PP.  Please take KO off the darn PP. Please.

He wanted them both back.  His body language after the 1st show he thought he had the deflection goal and pretty sure he was still thinking on that one (which is something he hasn't been doing much of/ at all in the past) when Suzuki got his shot off.

He got his head back after that, at least until the 5 hole in the SO, but he did lose his focus briefly.  MHO.  

[Sabres Super Fan]

The Buffalo Sabres had a good pair of games getting 3 out of 4 points with Devon Levi in the nets against Boston and Montreal. The Sabres need to avoid long stretches of losing where they get no points that is potentially going to cost the Sabres at the end of the season. When the Sabres are trying to get into the playoffs in my opinion. Go Sabres! Let’s Go Buffalo 

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, bunomatic said:

The lack of a servicable PP to me is mind boggling. The players are taking the heat on this but they seem to be doing the same things that have gotten them no results. This is on ellis and a lack of confidence which can be fixed with a change in coaching. The coach obviously has no answers. If we continue to do the same things and get no results I have to think KA has his eyes on another shiny toy. 

Except for a roughly 6 week stretch last year when the PP was world class, the PP has been trash for 3 seasons now.  (It was middle of the pack 2 years ago at just over 21%, so calling it trash for 3 years (minus that 6 or so week stretch) is a bit of hyperbole but not by much.

Didn't understand keeping all the assistants over the summer and still don't understand it today.

[LGR4GM]

5 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Except for a roughly 6 week stretch last year when the PP was world class, the PP has been trash for 3 seasons now.  (It was middle of the pack 2 years ago at just over 21%, so calling it trash for 3 years (minus that 6 or so week stretch) is a bit of hyperbole but not by much.

Didn't understand keeping all the assistants over the summer and still don't understand it today.

Vibes 

[Taro T]

3 hours ago, CallawaySabres said:

I predict January 2025 is the next time these guys will win two games in a row.

With every additional loss, find myself entering your world more and more.  Wow, is this place ever depressing.

[Cityo'Rasmii]

5 minutes ago, Taro T said:

With every additional loss, find myself entering your world more and more.  Wow, is this place team and front office ever depressing.

fify

[Taro T]

3 minutes ago, Cityo'Rasmii said:

fify

Was referring to the place/mindset @CallawaySabres usually is.  So, no, you did not ftfm.  😉

And that ISN'T a swipe at him.  He wears his fandom on his sleeve and is very open about how much this futility eats at him.

[Pimlach]

37 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

The fact you have to grossly exaggerate the amount of time before the player got checked is telling. Robinson is allowed to check him, but within the rules.

For stuff like this I really dislike this board. I don't come here for homer takes. I would go sit in the 300s if I want to hear boos and see outstretched arms every time a Sabre is legally checked.

If I exaggerate the time of possession, or the time before the check, it actually hurts my case.  It was a standard 2 minutes for boarding.   And only because the Montreal  player was slow and unaware.  Checking him within the rules is impossible when he turns his back and stands square to the boards, as opposed to taking an angle to the puck.  

No one was hurt.  A game misconduct was called for nothing. The 5 minutes changed the flow of the game.  It’s on the film.  

[LGR4GM]

3 hours ago, Broken Ankles said:

That statement is true on most nights but not last night.  The heat maps show the Sabres did go to the slot, and more than Montreal did but really were not rewarded.  As I noted last night, if Kyle, Jeff and Dylan can get the puck elevated it was 3-0 after the first.  But instead they all hit pads.  That’s execution.  I’m not expecting them to see repeat this type of game plan too often.  But against a smaller and weaker opponent I thought they dominated physically, especially in first and third periods.   Lasts nights loss could be blamed on an abysmal PP, Levi shitting the bed in the shootout or failing to close the deal when up close. 

 

I'm not being clear in what I saw that bothered me. You're right, they take shots from the slot. My issue is shot assists to someone in the slot. What I saw very clear and have been seeing is that a player on the wall will get the puck. The Sabres then have 1 forward low behind the goal and the other forward typically in close support up the wall. Both defenders man a point. The system wants them to feed pucks to the point not to the middle. There were numerous times last night where the forward on the wall gets the puck and his only option is rim behind the net or back to the point. No one and I mean NO one was going to the slot for passes or deflections. That shot chart makes sense because those were rushes and occasional passes within the zone but notice the center and most of the left side is empty. 

[PASabreFan]

39 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Except for a roughly 6 week stretch last year when the PP was world class, the PP has been trash for 3 seasons now.  (It was middle of the pack 2 years ago at just over 21%, so calling it trash for 3 years (minus that 6 or so week stretch) is a bit of hyperbole but not by much.

Didn't understand keeping all the assistants over the summer and still don't understand it today.

As I understand it, two vs. five is dependent on the degree of violence of the hit. It was a sturdy shove. Maybe the Hab embellished. It didn't help Robinson's cause that he was on the verge of charging.

The officials determined there was an injury. They are a lot closer to the action than we are. That led to the game misconduct.

If you are upset that I helped Dodo with her jacket at the Aud Club, I am sorry.

[PASabreFan]

Responded to Taro accidentally.

That was for Punch.

For Taro... Maybe we should take Mike Harrington's word for it that TP has decided to not pay someone to not coach. No idea if the assistants have long term contracts.

Edited December 10, 2023 by PASabreFan

[PerreaultForever]

3 hours ago, bunomatic said:

The lack of a servicable PP to me is mind boggling. The players are taking the heat on this but they seem to be doing the same things that have gotten them no results. This is on ellis and a lack of confidence which can be fixed with a change in coaching. The coach obviously has no answers. If we continue to do the same things and get no results I have to think KA has his eyes on another shiny toy. 

I agree and think it comes down to several things.

1) you have to win the face off in the offensive zone to gain possession and not waste a chunk of time. We have improved on this but are still nowhere near good enough. When ROR was here we had a really good PP and part of it started with him winning the draw.

2) too much reliance on Dahlin and the points. We lack net front presence as we have for a really long time. Good PPs have guys in front moving around but close in obscuring the goalie's vision, tipping shots and grabbing rebounds. It also forces their D in closer trying to box out and that opens up movement outside and at the points. Right now they force us outside and the shots are not as dangerous aside from the odd Dahlin bullet. Remember Kreuger sticking Risto in front? It's been a problem for a long time. 

Team has lowest shots with net front presence in the league. That's the stat both on the PP and in the game as a whole.

3) Lastly, it's predictable and thus easier to defend. Sabres roles are very easily identified. Teams know what Thompson will do and so forth and thus again, they know how to defend it. You need more motion, rotation and shifting roles. Can't keep looking for the same thing every time. 

But ultimately, it's that net front that matters most. 

[thewookie1]

The Robinson hit shouldn’t have been a major, just look at the non-call by E. Kane or the absurdity of Cousins hit in todays game between FLA and CBJ. 
 

If you want to call a major here, you need to do the same for Kane’s play. Otherwise the hit needs to be as egregious as Cousins. 
 

Robinson stops almost entirely then shoves Barron. Boarding, sure but not a major worthy boarding.

[LGR4GM]

50 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

The Robinson hit shouldn’t have been a major, just look at the non-call by E. Kane or the absurdity of Cousins hit in todays game between FLA and CBJ. 
 

If you want to call a major here, you need to do the same for Kane’s play. Otherwise the hit needs to be as egregious as Cousins. 
 

Robinson stops almost entirely then shoves Barron. Boarding, sure but not a major worthy boarding.

Both hits are bad. They need to consistently call them. 

[Broken Ankles]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

Responded to Taro accidentally.

That was for Punch.

For Taro... Maybe we should take Mike Harrington's word for it that TP has decided to not pay someone to not coach. No idea if the assistants have long term contracts.

If the Sabres would stop hiring coaches (assistants included) and FO with absolutely no experience, they might not have to worry about paying someone not to coach.  Most contracts have ‘mitigation’ which allows the owner to recoup any money from the new team for the Coach or GM fired.  Whatever JBot made in Seattle offset what Terry was responsible for paying him.  But that only works when you actually hire qualified coaches and GM’s who can, you know get hired outside of the Sabres organization.  Just like TM couldn’t get a new gig, do you think Adams could score  a GM or even an AGM position?  Meatballs isn’t getting a head coaching gig and this League loves recycled coaches.  RFK, Ted Nolan, TM, LaFontaine, etc.  Hire quality people and you don’t have worry about paying them to not coach.

[Kristian]

8 hours ago, Broken Ankles said:

If the Sabres would stop hiring coaches (assistants included) and FO with absolutely no experience, they might not have to worry about paying someone not to coach.  Most contracts have ‘mitigation’ which allows the owner to recoup any money from the new team for the Coach or GM fired.  Whatever JBot made in Seattle offset what Terry was responsible for paying him.  But that only works when you actually hire qualified coaches and GM’s who can, you know get hired outside of the Sabres organization.  Just like TM couldn’t get a new gig, do you think Adams could score  a GM or even an AGM position?  Meatballs isn’t getting a head coaching gig and this League loves recycled coaches.  RFK, Ted Nolan, TM, LaFontaine, etc.  Hire quality people and you don’t have worry about paying them to not coach.

But quality people have opinions. Terry doesn’t like opinions.

[Pimlach]

18 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

As I understand it, two vs. five is dependent on the degree of violence of the hit. It was a sturdy shove. Maybe the Hab embellished. It didn't help Robinson's cause that he was on the verge of charging.

The officials determined there was an injury. They are a lot closer to the action than we are. That led to the game misconduct.

If you are upset that I helped Dodo with her jacket at the Aud Club, I am sorry.

Well when a Sabres player gets hit like that I’ll expect you to be consistent on this.  

There was no injury, they reviewed it and they went the wrong way with the call.  Probably because they missed a call on E Kane the night before when the player was actually hurt.  The Habs player was out a few shifts later.   No reason for a game misconduct, or even 5 minutes.   As I am saying over and over, the Hab was more at fault, send him back to Bantams.  

 

[Taro T]

5 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Well when a Sabres player gets hit like that I’ll expect you to be consistent on this.  

There was no injury, they reviewed it and they went the wrong way with the call.  Probably because they missed a call on E Kane the night before when the player was actually hurt.  The Habs player was out a few shifts later.   No reason for a game misconduct, or even 5 minutes.   As I am saying over and over, the Hab was more at fault, send him back to Bantams.  

 

Unfortunately, a 5 minute boarding call brings an automatic game misconduct when there is a corresponding head injury.  That the Hab miraculously recovered a few minutes later doesn't factor into that.

Still believe, at worst it should've been a 2 minute boarding, and even that's up for debate.

[SwampD]

6 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Well when a Sabres player gets hit like that I’ll expect you to be consistent on this.  

There was no injury, they reviewed it and they went the wrong way with the call.  Probably because they missed a call on E Kane the night before when the player was actually hurt.  The Habs player was out a few shifts later.   No reason for a game misconduct, or even 5 minutes.   As I am saying over and over, the Hab was more at fault, send him back to Bantams.  

 

Totally agree.