K-9 Posted November 20, 2023 Report Share Posted November 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Crusader1969 said: Neither may have a complete 200 foot game at the moment that being said how many feet are Okposo, Krebs , Jost and Olofsson giving you at the moment ? They aren’t giving much at all, but I don’t agree with bringing them up just to replace fourth line forwards at the moment. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted November 20, 2023 Report Share Posted November 20, 2023 8 minutes ago, K-9 said: They aren’t giving much at all, but I don’t agree with bringing them up just to replace fourth line forwards at the moment. Unfortunately that line is playing 3rd line minutes cause the 4th line you can't put out there at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted November 20, 2023 Report Share Posted November 20, 2023 1 minute ago, Crusader1969 said: Unfortunately that line is playing 3rd line minutes cause the 4th line you can't put out there at all Either way, bottom six is not a good situation to bring these guys into. Now, if either can get a look in a top six role playing with more gifted offensive players to compliment their skills, I’m all for it, but they will be a liability defensively and we’d need to be patient with that aspect of their games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted November 20, 2023 Report Share Posted November 20, 2023 1 hour ago, K-9 said: Either way, bottom six is not a good situation to bring these guys into. Now, if either can get a look in a top six role playing with more gifted offensive players to compliment their skills, I’m all for it, but they will be a liability defensively and we’d need to be patient with that aspect of their games. Will they? I'd trust a line of Greenway - Kulich - Rosen against other 3rd lines and some 2nd. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted November 20, 2023 Report Share Posted November 20, 2023 (edited) 36 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: Will they? I'd trust a line of Greenway - Kulich - Rosen against other 3rd lines and some 2nd. Greenway would have to carry a heavy D load. Kulich and Rosen, while showing improvement in their D game, sometimes make VO look like a Selke candidate. Then again, the entire Amerks team often looks lost defensively. Edited November 20, 2023 by K-9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 They have a line of Greenway - Jost - Oloffson I hope i'm wrong but I won't be surprised if they bring absolutely nothing to tomorrow nights game. I cant imagine Greenway - Kulich - Rosen not being an improvement. worth a shot at this point for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 55 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said: I cant imagine Greenway - Kulich - Rosen not being an improvement. worth a shot at this point for sure Won't know until we try and I think both Kulich and Rosen are better players right now than VO and Jost. Jost is basically a worse version of Lazar and Krebs is following in their footsteps. All 3 were highly touted 1st rd picks (Lazar 17th overall, Jost 10th overall, and Krebs 17th overall), all had success with Canada WJ teams and in their Junior/College careers, but all seem to be lacking something in their skill set to unlock that skill in the NHL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said: Won't know until we try and I think both Kulich and Rosen are better players right now than VO and Jost. Jost is basically a worse version of Lazar and Krebs is following in their footsteps. All 3 were highly touted 1st rd picks (Lazar 17th overall, Jost 10th overall, and Krebs 17th overall), all had success with Canada WJ teams and in their Junior/College careers, but all seem to be lacking something in their skill set to unlock that skill in the NHL. Highly touted being used loosely. They were touted (🤷♂️) enough to be 1st round picks but that’s pretty much all I ever heard about any of them. Quinn, Peterka, Kulich and Rosen have been highly touted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 30 minutes ago, inkman said: Highly touted being used loosely. They were touted (🤷♂️) enough to be 1st round picks but that’s pretty much all I ever heard about any of them. Quinn, Peterka, Kulich and Rosen have been highly touted. Recency bias imo, those guys were touted a lot in their younger days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 (edited) 47 minutes ago, inkman said: Highly touted being used loosely. They were touted (🤷♂️) enough to be 1st round picks but that’s pretty much all I ever heard about any of them. Quinn, Peterka, Kulich and Rosen have been highly touted. Jost was Canada's leading scorer at the U18s with 15 points in 7 games. He had an 11th overall draft grade and was mocked as high at 7th. (McKenzie had him 11th) Lazar played on 2 U20 teams for Canada where he added 7 pts in 7 games (ahead of Reinhart and McDavid and Canada's 3rd leading scorer) and he captained the 2105 team with 9 pts in 7 games. He had a draft grade around 11 or 12 from most writers, but McKenzie had him 18th. Krebs led Canada's U18 team in scoring in 2019 with 10 pts in 7 games (DC had 9). When drafted he was a top 10 prospect who many thought would be drafted around the same spot as Cozens. (McKenzie had him 10th) These were all very highly touted prospects. They were all rated their draft years ahead of Rosen, Kulich and JJP were in theirs. In 2022 Kulich's average ranking was 21st (McKensize had him 18th), Rosen's average draft grade was 21st in 2021 (McKenzie also had him 18th), and JJP was 23rd on McKenzie's list in 2020. I noted McKenzie because he does a survey of NHL GM's and scouts to build his list and is a good reference point. Edited November 21, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said: Jost was Canada's leading scorer at the U18s with 15 points in 7 games. He had an 11th overall draft grade and was mocked as high at 7th. (McKenzie had him 11th) Lazar played on 2 U20 teams for Canada where he added 7 pts in 7 games (ahead of Reinhart and McDavid and Canada's 3rd leading scorer) and he captained the 2105 team with 9 pts in 7 games). He had a draft grade around 11 or 12 from most writers, but McKenzie has him 18th. Krebs led Canada's U18 team in scoring in 2019 with 10 pts in 7 games (DC had 9). When drafted he was a top 10 prospects who many thought would be drafted around the same spot as Cozens. (McKenzie had him 10th) These were all very highly touted prospects. They were all rated their draft years ahead of Rosen, Kulich and JJP were in theirs. In 2022 Kulich's average ranking was 21st (McKensize had him 18th), Rosen's average draft grade was 21st in 2021 (McKenzie also had him 18th), and JJP was 23rd on McKenzie's list in 2020. I noted McKenzie because he does a survey of NHL GM's and scouts to build his list and is a good reference point. Kulich and Rosen were both ranked 21 in consolidation and 18 by McKenzie? Kinda wild. How do you get the average rankings? Edited November 21, 2023 by Thorny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASabresIUFAN Posted November 21, 2023 Report Share Posted November 21, 2023 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Thorny said: Kulich and Rosen were both ranked 21 in consolidation and 18 be McKenzie? Kinda wild. How do you get the average rankings? I keep a spreadsheet every year from 15-17 sources and average them out. Elite Prospects also does a consolidated ranking as well, but they use about 10 sources. I usually publish my list on the board prior to each draft. Edited November 21, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted November 22, 2023 Report Share Posted November 22, 2023 5 hours ago, Crusader1969 said: I cant imagine Greenway - Kulich - Rosen not being an improvement. worth a shot at this point for sure How can you “imagine” that when 2/3 of the line you are proposing has not played a single second of an NHL game? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted November 22, 2023 Report Share Posted November 22, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, LabattBlue said: How can you “imagine” that when 2/3 of the line you are proposing has not played a single second of an NHL game? Ya, I don’t think it really jives with KA’s evaluation. I see it on twitter a lot that “how can this team be committed to winning if Kulich is in the AHL?” and while I think there are aspects that point to winning now not being priority 1, I don’t think this is one. I don’t think KA willingly plays guys who he think would make us better in a lower league: he just legitimately likely doesn’t believe them to be our best option right now. He’s not artificially causing the parts we have to amount to less standings points, willingly. I think he fields the best roster based on what we have. His approach is just exceptionally patient, both in timeline to find success and desire to fortify the roster, and he doesn’t lose on value in a vacuum when making deals. But I do think he maximizes what he has, once we have it, he just doesn’t maximize what we get Edited November 22, 2023 by Thorny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted November 22, 2023 Report Share Posted November 22, 2023 18 hours ago, LabattBlue said: How can you “imagine” that when 2/3 of the line you are proposing has not played a single second of an NHL game? thats what imagining is...if they had played i wouldnt have to imagine 16 hours ago, Thorny said: Ya, I don’t think it really jives with KA’s evaluation. I see it on twitter a lot that “how can this team be committed to winning if Kulich is in the AHL?” and while I think there are aspects that point to winning now not being priority 1, I don’t think this is one. I don’t think KA willingly plays guys who he think would make us better in a lower league: he just legitimately likely doesn’t believe them to be our best option right now. He’s not artificially causing the parts we have to amount to less standings points, willingly. I think he fields the best roster based on what we have. His approach is just exceptionally patient, both in timeline to find success and desire to fortify the roster, and he doesn’t lose on value in a vacuum when making deals. But I do think he maximizes what he has, once we have it, he just doesn’t maximize what we get I don't agree at all. I think he is stuck with Olofsson and doesn't want to waive him or give him away for nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted November 22, 2023 Report Share Posted November 22, 2023 2 hours ago, Crusader1969 said: thats what imagining is...if they had played i wouldnt have to imagine I don't agree at all. I think he is stuck with Olofsson and doesn't want to waive him or give him away for nothing With respect that would paint Adams in a terrible light. If he was in full awareness of the fact that we’d be better with Kulich and with VO gone, yet choosing to let the team suffer knowingly purely to ensure he breaks out well on a VO deal? Come on now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porous Five Hole Posted November 22, 2023 Report Share Posted November 22, 2023 2 hours ago, Crusader1969 said: thats what imagining is...if they had played i wouldnt have to imagine I don't agree at all. I think he is stuck with Olofsson and doesn't want to waive him or give him away for nothing Are you assuming VO has value on the open market? Because he does not. It was widely reported VO expected a trade during the offseason. The fact that he was not moved indicates he has no value at his salary. It is what it is. The Sabres are on the hook for a deal that has aged poorly. Giving him away for “nothing” was never an option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted November 22, 2023 Report Share Posted November 22, 2023 I think we are forgetting the history of this offseason. VO on the roster was a given the day Quinn was injured. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted November 22, 2023 Report Share Posted November 22, 2023 That's because Adams lacks the ruthlessness to move off guys he likes. There was no reason to keep vo even with the Quinn injury. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimlach Posted November 22, 2023 Report Share Posted November 22, 2023 (edited) On 11/21/2023 at 2:15 PM, GASabresIUFAN said: Won't know until we try and I think both Kulich and Rosen are better players right now than VO and Jost. Jost is basically a worse version of Lazar and Krebs is following in their footsteps. All 3 were highly touted 1st rd picks (Lazar 17th overall, Jost 10th overall, and Krebs 17th overall), all had success with Canada WJ teams and in their Junior/College careers, but all seem to be lacking something in their skill set to unlock that skill in the NHL. To highly tout, or not to highly tout, that is the question. Whether it is nobler in Kevyn’s heart and mind to trade for help and send Krebs down, or to suffer the slings and arrows from disgruntled fans at Sabres space. Edited November 22, 2023 by Pimlach 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted November 23, 2023 Report Share Posted November 23, 2023 Kulich wins it in Overtime.!!! Pure goal scorer Could have been the OT hero for the Sabres but will have to settle with it being for the Amerks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porous Five Hole Posted November 25, 2023 Report Share Posted November 25, 2023 With the Greenway snd Girgd injuries, he should keep his cell phone close by tonight and tomorrow morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted November 25, 2023 Report Share Posted November 25, 2023 Should call up both Rosen and Kulich 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted November 26, 2023 Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 (edited) On 11/21/2023 at 9:06 PM, Thorny said: Ya, I don’t think it really jives with KA’s evaluation. I see it on twitter a lot that “how can this team be committed to winning if Kulich is in the AHL?” and while I think there are aspects that point to winning now not being priority 1, I don’t think this is one. I don’t think KA willingly plays guys who he think would make us better in a lower league: he just legitimately likely doesn’t believe them to be our best option right now. He’s not artificially causing the parts we have to amount to less standings points, willingly. I think he fields the best roster based on what we have. His approach is just exceptionally patient, both in timeline to find success and desire to fortify the roster, and he doesn’t lose on value in a vacuum when making deals. But I do think he maximizes what he has, once we have it, he just doesn’t maximize what we get Kinda what I was getting at maybe. These guys just started but I’m sure there’s a point where you can have too much youth Edited November 26, 2023 by Thorny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerreaultForever Posted November 26, 2023 Report Share Posted November 26, 2023 answer - cause he's not even close to being ready. As we saw. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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