GDT: Flyers @ Sabres - November 3, 2023 - 7:00PM, NHLN/MSG-B📺WGR📻

[SwampD]

11 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Well I guess I can't talk about red and black mojo any more. 

UPL fan club all go home early this time? I told you he wasn't that good last time and he was exactly the same this time but the Flyers clearly watched the video and saw the weaknesses. Shot to the corners and glove side and UPL is a disaster in that and always has been.  I would assume word will travel and other teams will figure this out too. 

imo we were simply out coached. The two games were interesting because they are a contrast in styles. First game they skated more wide open and just tried to drive the net thinking that was the weak point. We blocked shots, UPL got a little lucky, they shot wildly, we made the most of opportunities and we won. This time they tightened up, clogged the middle, and won most of the one on one battles with simple basic physicality. Easy win for them. Good coaching adjustment. Granato just did the same as always. 

Fret not, Leafs will let us play wide open and we can beat them at their own game (unless goaltending sinks us). It's not the real way to beat the Leafs, who are a fairly easy team to keep to the outside (like us) but it gives us a bounce here or there coin toss kind of chance. 

Overall though we suck again, we are the same again, and although I can't fault Cozens frustration I'm not sure why he chose the second best fighter on that team. Did he think a guy like Hathaway would just accept the cross check? Wish we'd signed Hathaway instead of Okposo like I said in free agency but whatever. 

Krebs is a liability and has to go and apparently Samuelsson is made of glass.  Won't make the playoffs AGAIN.  That is all. 

 

In the third last night I told my buddy that this would be the one good thing about this loss.😂 (not just you.)

11 hours ago, Crusader1969 said:

If they don’t bring their game tomorrow , it’s time to really think about the future of DG 

A little early.

10 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

Eichel's team is 10-0-1

Man oh man

The Tank worked.

10 hours ago, nfreeman said:

I hate to say it, because I like DM, but I am pretty close to concluding that the Sabres have an issue at coach.  The consistent failure to show up at home is 100% between the ears.  It’s the coach’s job to get them ready and focused, and it is clearly not happening.

If it’s still like this at New Year’s I think I am going to want to make a change.  

This is more my timeline.

2 hours ago, Mango said:

I thought this team was being built like the Lindy Ruff lead Devils. And by comparison they were a much faster team than us a few days ago even though we got the win.

That alone has been a big concern for me. We’re built on youth, skill, and scoring, and we just look so slow at times. It’s weird. 

Beating Philly 5-2 the other day was a mirage. That wasn’t a “we figured out how to do it ugly”. That was lucky. You can’t win NHL games with 15 SOG. 

You almost hope the problem is Donnie, because if it isn’t then it means that these players aren’t what we thought. And this patience/slow burn just means we’re another 3-5 years away. The problem has to be coaching or we have to start over.

Hate to break it to you, but the Sabres lost to the Devils.🍺

 

There were a bunch of players that played maybe their worst game as a Sabre last night. Power was awful. Cozens was awful. Dahlin was bad. I should just list who played well,…

 

 

and they gotta start playing north/south! These passes getting picked off through center of the ice are f’n maddening.

[Crusader1969]

2 hours ago, Mango said:

I thought this team was being built like the Lindy Ruff lead Devils. And by comparison they were a much faster team than us a few days ago even though we got the win.

That alone has been a big concern for me. We’re built on youth, skill, and scoring, and we just look so slow at times. It’s weird. 

Beating Philly 5-2 the other day was a mirage. That wasn’t a “we figured out how to do it ugly”. That was lucky. You can’t win NHL games with 15 SOG. 

You almost hope the problem is Donnie, because if it isn’t then it means that these players aren’t what we thought. And this patience/slow burn just means we’re another 3-5 years away. The problem has to be coaching or we have to start over.

This team is Lindy at home and Ruff on the road

[Pimlach]

2 minutes ago, Porous Five Hole said:

Please hear me out. This isn’t on the head coach so much as it is on the roster construction specific to goaltending & defense.
People don’t like to hear it, because yeah, there weren’t a lot of great options out there this summer, but Buffalo did nothing significant to address it. That does not fall on Granato. Rolling with Levi as G1 was also not his decision to make.

I’d rather see KA go out there and try to make some adjustments now before we call for Donny’s head.

I thinks it’s more than goaltending and defense.   The forward are not helping, especially the bottom 6.  We can’t roll 4 lines with tryouts still happening.   This looks more like a development year than last year.  

[Porous Five Hole]

4 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

I thinks it’s more than goaltending and defense.   The forward are not helping, especially the bottom 6.  We can’t roll 4 lines with tryouts still happening.   This looks more like a development year than last year.  

We can agree to disagree.  This team isn’t good enough at defense. Power is still developing and isn’t playing well in his own zone. Muel was playing hurt and now he’s officially hurt. Joki has been fine I guess for a 4/5. Clifton played 25 min last night! Anybody want to sign up for that again?

Dahlin and 12-15 minutes of EJ cannot do it by themselves.  
 

Also, if you don’t think we have a problem in the crease, I just don’t know what to tell you.  

[Pimlach]

11 minutes ago, Porous Five Hole said:

We can agree to disagree.  This team isn’t good enough at defense. Power is still developing and isn’t playing well in his own zone. Muel was playing hurt and now he’s officially hurt. Joki has been fine I guess for a 4/5. Clifton played 25 min last night! Anybody want to sign up for that again?

Dahlin and 12-15 minutes of EJ cannot do it by themselves.  
 

Also, if you don’t think we have a problem in the crease, I just don’t know what to tell you.  

Sure, not good enough on defense but that is not all due to defenseman.  Forwards are part of that statement.  Look at the high number of odd man  rushes against.  
 

Right now both Power and Joker are looking bad.  Clifton played 25 mins because Muel was out. EJ was the only + player until the 5th Flyer goal.  That is when even he failed to shoot with a wide open shot.   The Flyers came down and scored after we overpassed  again. 

[Norcal]

Torts had them boys ready as a ***** last night.

Kicked that *****in ass is all I can say about that one.

The boys need to find another gear when the goin gets tough. 

They get another shot tonight. 

Let's GO Boys!!!!

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Well, that sucks, eh.

[Archie Lee]

Sometimes it is hard to learn a lesson when you win. The Sabres could/should have learned a lesson on Wednesday about intensity, defence, structure, etc., but scoring on 33% of their shots and UPL saving 38/40, instead taught them that they can evidently win without being committed to those things.  The lesson will be more obvious after last night’s game.  I understand that we are well past the point for some where any excuse is acceptable. I still think though that these tend to be lessons that young teams learn the hard way. I stand by my view that if we can hover right around true .500 (NOT NHL .500) until game 60-65, we will be in it. We are a 5-6 game winning streak away from most people wondering what we were worried about.  Along the way there are going to be some distressing nights. 

[Cascade Youth]

1 hour ago, Pimlach said:

Sure, not good enough on defense but that is not all due to defenseman.  Forwards are part of that statement.  Look at the high number of odd man  rushes against.  
 

Right now both Power and Joker are looking bad.  Clifton played 25 mins because Muel was out. EJ was the only + player until the 5th Flyer goal.  That is when even he failed to shoot with a wide open shot.   The Flyers came down and scored after we overpassed  again. 

They want everything to be easy.  Easy entries, easy shots.  As soon as the other team makes them work they wilt.  Has been that way Donny’s whole tenure.  Philly has like zero stars but they work hard top to bottom and that’s enough to beat these Sabres. 
 

They are mentally soft.

[Pimlach]

7 minutes ago, Cascade Youth said:

They want everything to be easy.  Easy entries, easy shots.  As soon as the other team makes them work they wilt.  Has been that way Donny’s whole tenure.  Philly has like zero stars but they work hard top to bottom and that’s enough to beat these Sabres. 
 

They are mentally soft.

Konecney leads the league in goals with 9.   He and Farabee could make the Sabres much better, and play in the top 6.  The Flyers have more team GF than the Sabres.   They are playing as good as they can.  Credit Torts for getting a lot out of not much.  

[Crusader1969]

2 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I thinks it’s more than goaltending and defense.   The forward are not helping, especially the bottom 6.  We can’t roll 4 lines with tryouts still happening.   This looks more like a development year than last year.  

This is right.  The thing that made it exciting going into the season was that we thought the Sabres had a top 9 and a decent 4th line that would create energy

the 3rd line last night was Biro - Cozens - Rousak.  Who got absolutely run over last night.  
you can’t blame injuries either.   Though admittedly losing Quinn has sent a ripple throughout the line up 

so the team we (I) thought was deep is actually razor thin 

time for GMKA to get something done.  He has cap space , he has a plethora or prospects and he has draft capital.  
 

 

[Taro T]

5 hours ago, Sidc3000 said:

I believe this also. He has Adams believing that this team is a development team and is allowed to have teenagers on the squad to “develop” them when all other NHL teams would have sent him back. I don’t care what Adams or DG said. these player don’t have any expectations other than to continue to develop. The Sabres are suppose to be a NHL team and not a development team. That is what the AHL is for. I think it’s absolutely amazing how anyone would think that this team is a playoff ready team with an 18 yr old forward and a 21 yr old starting goalie. Tell me, in NHL history, where a NHL team with a 21 yr old rookie goaltender; in his first year starting; went to the playoffs. With another young goalie who is just starting his potential break out years.
 

last season was an anomaly. You had several players go way beyond expectations. Maybe that was a vision of a few years into the future but that wasn’t reality.  We’re seeing reality now. This is what the Sabres were expected to be last year. Now fans want last season this season and beyond. Maybe they will figure it out  soon and make the playoffs. I doubt it but it would be a pleasant surprise for me. 
 

call me a pessimist, a troll, a grumpy old man (now that I’m 50 👴😂). I just don’t have extremely high expectations for a team made up of players that probably should be developing in lower leagues and a coach who should be doing the same. Plus, the organization has routinely failed on its promises and expectations so I won’t believe it till I see it.

I am still a fan. I will still wear my gear, watch most games and will root for them to win. I just don’t expect it anymore. 
 

💙💛 🖤❤️  For life! 

1986.  That team won the Stanley Cup.  Had a whole bunch of rookies on it too.

[Thorny]

2 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I thinks it’s more than goaltending and defense.   The forward are not helping, especially the bottom 6.  We can’t roll 4 lines with tryouts still happening.   This looks more like a development year than last year.  

This has the ring of truth. It almost feels as if KA drank his own kool-aid a tad and retreated too heavily into his “improvement through only internal development” m.o. Why we’d, by design, be the “youngest team in hockey” in his FOURTH year, the one we are supposedly supposed to have playoffs hard line expectations, is beyond me. 

It’s imo just more attempt at building a Cup team in the vague, unknowable future than focus on building a playoff team, RIGHT NOW, which is the path where my bias lies and where I’d have led if given the choice 

 

[Thorny]

41 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

This is right.  The thing that made it exciting going into the season was that we thought the Sabres had a top 9 and a decent 4th line that would create energy

the 3rd line last night was Biro - Cozens - Rousak.  Who got absolutely run over last night.  
you can’t blame injuries either.   Though admittedly losing Quinn has sent a ripple throughout the line up 

so the team we (I) thought was deep is actually razor thin 

time for GMKA to get something done.  He has cap space , he has a plethora or prospects and he has draft capital.  
 

 

Absolutely. Becoming a bit of a theme, isn’t it, the ‘hindsight need not apply’ aspect:

On 6/30/2023 at 9:02 AM, Thorny said:

I kinda disagree now that Quinn starts on IR. At least with the bit as it pertains to VO. 13th man if we moved Olofsson was going to be a young guy like Rousek. Now, if we deal VO, we are already necessarily icing a Rousek/different young guy and 13th man is yet another young guy and that’s asking for trouble.

Keeping VO keeps Rousek as 13, but even that seems risky tbh. Frankly, there is room for a vet depth F add. They may not even feel VO is an adequate F replacement for Quinn, who knows 

Mentioned this all summer when someone would say the forwards were “set”. 

My bolded there is pretty much exactly what happened with the lineup yesterday, names included ^

Edited November 4, 2023 by Thorny

[phil_soisson]

17 hours ago, SDS said:

Oh no. We may not have had a match for an end of game scrum when it was 5 -1.  What are we gonna do? If we would’ve had someone to win that fight then maybe JJ Peterka wouldn’t miss that goal or throw that bad pass to the blue line or pass a puck in the someone’s skates every shift. Maybe power wouldn’t put it into the other team skates every shift. I would’ve solved a lot of hills if we could’ve just won that end of game fight.

He had an awful game.

I'm wondering if rewarding him with the big contract so early is having a detrimental effect in the locker room?

 

16 hours ago, nfreeman said:

I hate to say it, because I like DM, but I am pretty close to concluding that the Sabres have an issue at coach.  The consistent failure to show up at home is 100% between the ears.  It’s the coach’s job to get them ready and focused, and it is clearly not happening.

If it’s still like this at New Year’s I think I am going to want to make a change.  

I'm ready for Mike Peca.

[Taro T]

Really wanted Levi to get the start last night.  Knew it wouldn't happen, but still, wanted it to.  Last season, they played Anderson (their obvious #1) in 5 games against bottom feeders and they went 0-4-1 in those 5 with Anderson giving up either a bad goal to start the game (the typical scenario) or giving up a bad goal to start another period; each of which caused the bottom feeder to believe they could not just hang, but win.  Those goals also seemed to deflate the Sabres.

 Unfortunately, that script played out again last night.  (But, but, but, that 1st goal was a screen, UPL had no chance.  Well, yes, he had no chance when he decided to lean hard to his right to see around the screen leaving the glove side of the net wide open.  On the 2nd goal, yes, that would've been a very difficult save to make with Jokiharju effectively passing the puck to the Phlyer winger, but UPL didn't react until the shot had already been taken.)  Even with that, UPL had a chance to raise the energy in the building and on his team by making a stop on the breakaway.  Go off script and make that save and the game LITERALLY turns around.  But no, he was completely flat footed, not moving at all by the time of the shot and got beat to the glove hand, again.

Teams that aren't having things going right for them need the goalie to make a big stop, one that he "shouldn't be able to make" to get the momentum to shift for them.  UPL too often doesn't make that stop.

And, btw, that was the fifth consecutive game that UPL played in.  Everybody was decrying how Levi playing 4 games in 8 days caused him to break.  But UPL playing 5 straight over 11 days; hey, no biggie, he's the "hot hand."

That game wasn't all on UPL.  The skaters needed to pick it back up after getting put in a 2-0 hole.  They can't stay in a funk the entire period.  Wonder if Samuelsson going out only 6 minutes into the game on a rather innocuous play contributed to the sustained funk.  (He and the Phlyer crashed into each other but as the Phlyer went down he inadverrtenly slew footed Muel and somehow another Sabre's stick got under him as well.  He finished the shift, but was obviously laboring (only caught that on the replay, didn't notice it live).)  

This was another game that the Sabres managed to generate a lot of pressure in the 2nd with little (or in this case, nothing) to show for it.  Would really like to see them simplify when they are flying at home and take the shot when they 1st get it rather than trying to maneuver into a better shot (Thompson is excused from this criticism, that and the slapper is his bread and butter) or making 2 more passes to get the clean open net 1 timer.  They were playing a sieve; get shots from a little further out and let the goalie battle that; get guys to the net and clean up the bad rebound he's going to leave (providing he even makes the initial save.

Don't know what Granato can do for Power.  He's clearly in the "sophomore slump" and playing too much.  When Samuelsson comes back, would move him to Power's pairing (playing with Jokiharju isn't working and Clifton is too similar in style to Henri to believe he'd help with the funk either).  Wanted Owen to get a stay at home partner all off-season.  He's now at a point where he needs it.  Until Muel is back, would call Stillman back up and move Henri to Dahlin's pairing and put Stillman with Power.  (Isn't ideal, but is better than overworking Johnson on the 2nd pairing.)

Liked Peterka's effort but still don't know how he didn't score on that pass from Dahlin at the start of the 3rd.  Score that goal, and MAYBE they manage to pull the comeback off.  And will cut him slack on the bad pass that led to a goal against.  He was flying all over the ice.  

And something just isn't right with Tuch.  They keep saying he isn't injured, but that last goal likely doesn't happen if he's 100% because he couldn't go the full ice back after the turnover and that guy was the eventual goal scorer.  Before this season, he would've broken that up.

Could go on about what was wrong with last night, but no real point to it.  (Vented enough.)  The good thing is, Granato's squad doesn't dwell on the bad games and are usually ready to go after a true stinker.  The bad thing is, likely no Samuelsson, and would really like to have him against a team with this much firepower.  Hopefully, Levi is back to 100%.  He could help them steal one.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, Thorny said:

This has the ring of truth. It almost feels as if KA drank his own kool-aid a tad and retreated too heavily into his “improvement through only internal development” m.o. Why we’d, by design, be the “youngest team in hockey” in his FOURTH year, the one we are supposedly supposed to have playoffs hard line expectations, is beyond me. 

It’s imo just more attempt at building a Cup team in the vague, unknowable future than focus on building a playoff team, RIGHT NOW, which is the path where my bias lies and where I’d have led if given the choice 

 

 Replace 40 yr old Anderson with 20 year old Levi.  Swap Boosh for Clifton.  Add EJ (35) and Benson (18) and our average age is about the same as last year.  
 

Teams that are young can make the playoffs.   Then they add more vets if they want to actually win in the playoffs. 

[Thorny]

5 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

 Replace 40 yr old Anderson with 20 year old Levi.  Swap Boosh for Clifton.  Add EJ (35) and Benson (18) and our average age is about the same as last year.  
 

Teams that are young can make the playoffs.   Then they add more vets if they want to actually win in the playoffs. 

Early signs are we may have needed them just to make it 

[Carmel Corn]

2 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Konecney leads the league in goals with 9.   He and Farabee could make the Sabres much better, and play in the top 6.  The Flyers have more team GF than the Sabres.   They are playing as good as they can.  Credit Torts for getting a lot out of not much.  

Coaching matters!  I don't think the Sabres organization is willing to make tough decisions in that regard.

[PerreaultForever]

8 hours ago, Pimlach said:

With all that, what about having the final change at home?  That should be an advantage but it never is.  

Absolutely correct, because the system here is to just roll lines. We have no identity lines, we have no checking line, and the future seems to be locked on more offensive talent and no 2 way talent so the baffling plan continues. Granato is a terrible in game coach as well. He might have knowledge and he might be good developing young players but he is NOT a good head coach. 

[Crusader1969]

On 11/3/2023 at 9:11 PM, Gatorman0519 said:

This was a typical depressing boring game weve seen on endless repeats. I don’t hold out much hope against Toronto or Minny. 

Since you prognosticated losses vs both Colorado and Toronto.    I’m hopefully you are still taking Minnesota 

[Gatorman0519]

58 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Since you prognosticated losses vs both Colorado and Toronto.    I’m hopefully you are still taking Minnesota 

Seems you prognosticated by being a prognosticator, so you can prognosticate as a  prognosticated member of the board.  

[lowsabre]

Yay, we win!

[sabremike]

The Flyers have seemed to overcome the power of the goathead but I think I found the solution: